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Larsen's greatest contribution

Spencer Larsen's incredible performance in Atlanta has gotten everyone talking.  From the talking heads on the networks, to the common fan on MHR, everyone has been talking about the job he did, and wondering how long he can keep it up.  What if this kid is as good as we all have hoped?  What if, in the words of the great orator Dennis Green, "They are who we thought they were"?  This got me wondering, let's say he plays lights out for the rest of the year, and secures the starting middle linebacker position.  What does this mean for our rebuilding process on the defensive side of the ball? 

 

Most people could agree that the Broncos were going to have to spend an early pick in next years draft on a middle linebacker, to shore up the defense.  A pick in the first or second round on a stud MLB would have been welcomed by most.  What if we already have that stud on the team in the form of a sixth rounder from last year?  A pick who we originally drafted to be a FB, and becomes our starting MLB.  Wouldn't that make Larsen's greatest contribution to this team a sort of 'free' first round pick?  Maybe that pick is packaged with another to move up and get the franchise RB some people around here want.  (Beanie Wells, Knowshon Moreno?)  Or a shot at getting the stud saftey that has been missing from the Bronco defense since a certain other #27 roamed the backfield.  I understand this is all contingent on Larsen becoming the everyday starter, which is yet to be seen when Nate Webster returns from injury.  But if so, and we have a luxury pick to use on first round talent in another position of need, where would you like to see that pick go? 

 

This is my first post, and I usually keep the comments to a minimum, but this scenario was exciting to me, and just wanted to get the thoughts from the rest of you guys on this.

This is a Fan-Created Comment on MileHighReport.com. The opinion here is not necessarily shared by the editorial staff of MHR

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Knowshown Mareno would be really nice in Bronco blue and orange next year.

I think I am going to go by HT’s theory though, that it is too early to tell. My sense is that I will be disappointed, others will be happy and DT will be taken off the board first. Larsen and Woodyard are impressive indeed.

by Steve O' on Nov 17, 2008 4:19 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

He's a possibility

Bonzi will go earlier but Moreno may come up and force us to choose. And I can’t say it would be a bad choice, necessarily.

by Colinski on Nov 19, 2008 9:27 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Bonzi??

Are you referring to Chris “Beanie” Wells? I’m not familiar with a Bonzi in this years class.

by donbok1 on Nov 21, 2008 10:12 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Good to see the post donbok. Thanks

I’m with Steve. Let’s cross that bridge when we get there. I am just thankful we have a guy that can contribute at this level consistently.

It all starts in the trenches HT 11/11/08

by firstfan on Nov 17, 2008 4:23 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

If Larsen turns out to be starter quality over the last part of the season then right now I would have to say DT followed by SAF. As was previously stated, it’s too early to tell. Marcus Thomas is starting to show signs of development which might push SAF up to the top position for me.

While I think RB is the top offensive need I wouldn’t use a first round pick there unless there was no other position of need with value there. Too many very good backs come out of the later rounds to invest that much cap space in a ball carrier.

by jaffe28 on Nov 17, 2008 4:48 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

I agree.

DT, than SAF. Maybe a guy like Peria Jerry in the first round, and then Patrick Chung in the second. Jerry is projected as a mid-20’s pick, right where we’ll be sitting to nab him up. And we’d likely have to move up in the second round to get Chung, but it would be worth it. The dude’s a ballplayer.

I wouldn’t mind a trade-up to get Will Moore of Mizzou, either. He’s the absolute best safety in the draft on paper, and has the size, speed, and instincts to be a top tier NFL safety.

I don’t want to try and get Moreno or Wells. We have Ryan Torain, he’ll be fine, his injuries were not the result of poor conditioning. He’ll just have to not run so upright. It’s not a hard transition to make; I did it midseason last year, and didn’t fumble for the rest of the year. He can do it. If he does get hurt again, Michael Pittman, Peyton Hillis, and Tatum Bell (our last 1000 yard back, BTW) will be more than happy to carry the load.

I think our needs are DT and SAF first and foremost. I would also like to pick up Auston English in the third or fourth round. He plays with a two-sizes-too-big-heart, and is always around the ball. Believe me, I know. I’m a Mizzou fan. The things he does to Chase Daniel… unspeakable.

Another thing I think would be wise is to pick up a quarterback in the sixth round. Whoever’s out there that’s smart and a good game manager, and could be a capable backup should Cutler go down. I want another Kubiak. I wanted to get Trent Edwards for that a couple of years ago; maybe there’s someone like him that we can nab. I can’t seem to find the projections for 5th-7th round players, can anyone do some research for me and find some names of QB’s who will be available?

His Highness, The Duke of Juke, Fast Easy Eddie Casino Crown Royale With Cheese!

by papigrande on Nov 17, 2008 8:46 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Jerry is a name...

I haven’t seen on alot of people’s first round. He’s intresting with his speed but I wonder about his value as most boards I’ve seen have him between the second and fourth. He also had some injury problems, and I hope that Shanahan and Co emphasise durability along with character in this upcoming draft. After the year we’ve had, I think we’ve learned our lesson on taking a line on players with a history of injuries.

You know I’m with you on the Chung pick. This kid is never injured, and is always looking to put someone to sleep. Huge hitter and decent hands. As an added bonus he has experience at both kick and punt return. SS who reminds me of Bob Sanders.

Love the idea to trade up in the first to get Moore. Probably the best ballhawk saftey coming out this year. How nice to get both Moore and Chung.? That would be a tandem we haven’t had since Smith/Atwater.

English has great potential too, but I think he is dealing with a knee injury this season. I’d be nervous picking anyone with recent injuries, but if that was the rule we’d have never picked TD.
Thanks for the input Papi.

by donbok1 on Nov 17, 2008 9:24 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Actually

Switch Jerry for Sen’derrick Marks. A link on Colinski’s post had me all confused and I got them mixed up. Jerry may be faster, but Marks has gotten it done year in and year out. One of the most productive DT’s in the nation for Auburn, and he has excellent athleticism and quickess. He is very well suited to play both the run and the pass.

But Chung all the way in the second. I ant to be able to say, “Dwayne Boew just got CHUNGED!”

His Highness, The Duke of Juke, Fast Easy Eddie Casino Crown Royale With Cheese!

by papigrande on Nov 17, 2008 9:50 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Dwayne Beow, Boew, Boo....

Whatever his name is.

His Highness, The Duke of Juke, Fast Easy Eddie Casino Crown Royale With Cheese!

by papigrande on Nov 17, 2008 9:51 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree...

Marks is a stud, and reminds me of Marcus Thomas. Between the two of them and Carlton Powell we’d be in good shape.

by donbok1 on Nov 17, 2008 9:55 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Great post....

and recommended.
Larsen WILL be that guy.
We can go after 2 safetys…..or better yet take one of the better DE/DT and still get one in free agency.
I really want Cushing as he could be a beast DE rusher for us, aswell as soime great packages in the LB corps.
Trust me, SHanny will find a way to play Winborn, WW and Cushing.
I am excited too!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Nov 17, 2008 4:48 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

thanx boydy...

Cushing is an animal, and jumps off the screen when you watch SC games. Just hope he can stay healthy and have a long career.

by donbok1 on Nov 17, 2008 4:55 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Two safteys...

would be a great luxury. Just think, Taylor Mays, Patrick Chung, and Barrett. We’d be set for years to come, with safteys that can lay the wood!! Then also pick up Moala and we’d have some great pac 10 reps!

by donbok1 on Nov 17, 2008 5:12 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I want to see if Larsen has what it takes for the rest of the season...anyone can have one great game.

Look at Timmy Smith in Super Bowl 22. :) Or Desmond Howard in Super Bowl 31….

I want to see Larsen play 6 more weeks of solid MLB play, then I’ll pass judgment. I must say though, I’m excited at the prospect of him becoming our starting MLB.

The thing I like the most from our current starting roster is the lack of chest thumping celebration after every tackle…even when it’s a tackle for a 20 yard gain. lol

If God is not a Bronco fan, then WHY are sunsets Blue and Orange? - Jon Tollerud 5/22/08

by Tim Lynch on Nov 17, 2008 4:49 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

I'm with you...

on the celebrations after a routine tackle. I’m all for enthusiastic players, but come on. I’d rather see the Barry Sanders celebration, and have them act like they’ve been there before.

by donbok1 on Nov 17, 2008 4:53 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

You can't blame Webster & Co. for all the celebrating...

he finally hit his gap and actually wrapped up the ball carrier. That’s a rare occurrence. Like your birthday which only comes once a year is rare. And you celebrate that. Same kind of thing.

;-)

Check out the website listed below...

Rivers light in the loafers?

by EastCoastBronco on Nov 18, 2008 9:44 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

lmao!

"It's all over Fat Man" - Tom Jackson to John Madden 1977 AFC Championship Game

"I love your analysis of our team. Its kinda like watching a spider monkey trying to figure out a jar of peanuts.. you know whats going on.. you know whats in there, but to actually figure it out, is just a bit beyond your mental skills..."
- Bronco Dano

by DesertBroncoFan on Nov 18, 2008 12:39 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

classic!

If God is not a Bronco fan, then WHY are sunsets Blue and Orange? - Jon Tollerud 5/22/08

by Tim Lynch on Nov 18, 2008 1:08 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

One thing it may allow is trading up for somone or trading out

If Larsen fills the need, then maybe we look at trading up to take a shot at that DT out of Bama or a true impact player, or we trade out of the first round and pick up some solid picks for 2010. Again, I really have a hard time thinking we will land a top DT where we will likely pick in the 1st round, and DT in the 1st round are high risk, so I would say that would lead to us drafting a safety or trading up or back.

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum

by Broncoman on Nov 17, 2008 4:54 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

The DT out of Bama

isn’t he a Nose Tackle?

What would it take to convert him to a 4-3 DT? Is that an easy transition? We already know that Robertson wasn’t able to make the transition in the opposite direction, but I don’t know about going from NT to a DT.

"It's all over Fat Man" - Tom Jackson to John Madden 1977 AFC Championship Game

"I love your analysis of our team. Its kinda like watching a spider monkey trying to figure out a jar of peanuts.. you know whats going on.. you know whats in there, but to actually figure it out, is just a bit beyond your mental skills..."
- Bronco Dano

by DesertBroncoFan on Nov 18, 2008 12:40 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

With all the guys who are stepping up

if they pan out we might even have the luxury of drafting a strongside linebacker. I don’t think Boss, with his (continuing) injury history, is a longterm solution. I’d like to see us get back to having one of the best linebacking crews in the league.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Nov 18, 2008 1:07 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think it would be that hard to convert him

The only difference is gap responsibility, but look at the Ravens, they use two monster DT to basically keep their LB clean and if they get some pass rush out of them, so much the better. But he is a guy that will demand a double or triple team no matter where he lines up.

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum

by Broncoman on Nov 18, 2008 3:40 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

You can play with a NT in a 4-3

and also an Under-Tackle (usually playing a 3-Technique.) Tampa-2 schemes do it, and the most effective deployment of it can be seen in Minnesota, where Pat Williams plays the nose, and Kevin Williams plays the 3-technique.

"I am not one of those who think that coming in second or third is winning." -- Robert F. Kennedy

by Ted Bartlett on Nov 20, 2008 2:53 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Ted is correct.

The conversion from NT to DT is really no big deal. In fact, a solid NT is a great catch for a 4-3 team in most cases.

DRob isn’t a “great catch”, but mostly because he was never a two-gap style NT (he played in the Jet’s Phillips System). The true 2 gap NT is a rare find, and can either set you up for a fantastic Fairbanks type 3-4 (allowing 4 athletic LBs on the field at a time), or give you a dominating 4-3 defensive line with a 3 technique DT in the mix.

On the other hand, the move from DT to NT is much, much less likely to work.

"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe

by Steve Nichols on Nov 21, 2008 6:02 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Thats exactly what I was thinking...

maybe since we sort of landed a bonus mlb when drafting a fb, the front office will be that much more inclined to pull the trigger on a trade that brings in a difference maker. My hopes are for the stud saftey, but a Moreno who can pound the ball 25 times a game would be nice too. Or, like Colinski has said, there is real value in the second round for safteys, so maybe we could trade out of the first entirely and pickup an extra pick in 2010. Not having to worry about the MLB position opens up alot of possibilities.

by donbok1 on Nov 17, 2008 5:04 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Although I hope Larsen becomes a fulltime quality MLB

it was my understanding that we drafted him as a linebacker and that Shanahan subsequently decided to try him out at FB, perhaps because they thought he was too slow for MLB. But Combine foot speed doesn’t tell the whole story, as we found out at Atlanta. So we didn’t draft a fullback who turned out to be a linebacker. We drafted a linebacker who turned out to be better than we anticipated, because measurables don’t tell the whole story on a player’s NFL potential.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Nov 17, 2008 7:01 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I've read more than one report...

saying Shanahan called Larsen before the draft and asked him if he would be willing to play FB for the Broncos. Larsen said he would do whatever it takes to make a team. I’ll look for a link, but I’m pretty sure I’ve seen in more than one source and didn’t just dream it up in my head, but I’ve been wrong before.

by donbok1 on Nov 17, 2008 7:06 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I stand corrected, then

Either way, your point is well taken that if he continues to play well at Mike he will give us what amounts a free first-round pick next year, one that we won’t have to use for a Mike. I have to admit that earlier in the year, when posters were making a case for Woodyard and Larsen, I thought they were a little overenthusiastic. Now it’s beginning to look like they were prescient. Looks like we really hit some home runs in this year’s draft. It’s looking like it might be almost as good as 2006, and even 2007 is looking better and better. Harris is solid, Thomas is doing well, and Moss is beginning to contribute. Crowder is the only question mark. This series of drafts may well set the Broncos up as an elite team for years to come, especially if we can fill our remaining holes (fewer and fewer) in next year’s draft.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Nov 18, 2008 1:16 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

From what I've seen of Crowder...

Crowder is still a good player, and a nice balance of run / pass. He isn’t looking good this year, but I think this is more of a slump than a loss of any kind of ability.

I hope to see how he performs with some upgrades around him. While we have some players on defense I’m ready to toss (they just never did anything for us), we have some guys who are worth holding onto because we know they can play. (Moss is a good example of a player I think deserves to be looked at longer. This is really only his first year playing, given his injury history. Webster, not so much).

"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe

by Steve Nichols on Nov 21, 2008 6:10 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Go to SHanny's interview today at...

www.denverbroncos.com and Shanny tells the story.
He was asked if he would play FB BEFORE he was drafted.
This is an awesome interview and leads me to believe that if Larsen keeps performing he will keep the job.
As always, Shanny is very vailed in his answers, but he is effusive in his comments on Larsen and says the best will play REGARDLESS of injury.
Keep playing hard the Stormin’ Mormon!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Nov 17, 2008 7:13 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I liked what Shanahan said

about him being the kind of guy you’d want to go to war with. Quite a compliment.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Nov 18, 2008 1:34 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Just throwing this out there

since I have no interest in debating draft strategy at this early date (though I enjoy reading you guys doing it):

Why has no one brought up a high round strong side LB? They are harder to find than MLBs, and Winborn could easily be upgraded… I am of course talking about a combination of size and speed that rules out certain matchups just by a player being present in the lineup….

Mountains, forest, sea: these render man fierce, but yet do not destroy the man.

by Jeremy Bolander on Nov 17, 2008 5:33 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

I was thinking the same thing

and commented along those lines in another thread before seeing this remark. Like I said there, I don’t think Boss is a longterm answer.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Nov 18, 2008 1:38 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

My two cents

I agree that LOLB is much harder to find than MLB. On the other hand, we have such a need at both positions if we’re going to field a respectable defense for deep playoff runs over the next decade.

I also agree that Boss just isn’t the answer. Too many injury issues unfortunately. On the other hand, Champ’s contract is coming up soon. I would rather negotiate with Champ and have his brother living in the Denver area too. Tough call. It might be a sticky issue behind the scenes (or maybe everyone is professional and business-like about the whole thing).

"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe

by Steve Nichols on Nov 21, 2008 6:19 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

STYG...

Agreed….thats why I am for Cushing.
Thats where he plays at USC, and he can cover at MLB in a pinch. He is a great rusher as well.

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Nov 17, 2008 5:36 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

I think Cushing will be available latter in the 1st round

Granted Strong side LB are harder to find, there is also less of a premium put on them, so I would anticipate that both Cushing and mays from USC will be available somewhere from 15-30, so I think that we could trade up or back and get one of them.

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum

by Broncoman on Nov 17, 2008 5:53 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I think Mays, if what some are saying here is true, will be a workout wonder at the combine

and jump up in the Michael Huff area, 8-14.

Win or lose, it's always it a great day to be a Bronco fan!

by Steve O' on Nov 23, 2008 9:09 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Here's Cushing's bio from USC....

http://usctrojans.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/cushing_brian00.html

Enjoy the read and tell me waht you guys think!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Nov 17, 2008 5:39 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

I could imagine

Cushing on the Sam, Larsen in the middle and DJ on the Will. That’s a heck of a LB team. Winborn is doing a great job, so is Woodyard, but they aren’t as good as DJ and Cushing could be.

He doesn’t know anything but 100 percent
- Shanahan on Larsen

by Emmett Smith on Nov 21, 2008 10:30 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree...

if Larsen can keep Webster on the bench, and Cushing is available when we pick, we’d be set at LB! He is always around the ball, and you don’t see him miss tackles. Only concern would be injuries.

by donbok1 on Nov 21, 2008 10:46 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Larsen is just more proof that our young team

is really starting to come together. Game planning for one position is a lot of work, yet he doubled that when playing both sides. Oh, and ST as well. This guy is a stud…..Job well done.

"It doesn't dissipate" ~ Mike Shanahan

Cutler's 4th qtr/OT game winning drives: 6

by weazel on Nov 17, 2008 7:08 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Great first post donbok!

If Larsen turns out to be an answer to middle linebacker—I would still take a ML if something very special dropped in our laps. Other wise I’m kinda in the defensive tackle camp, although I haven’t given up on Carlton—after that I would go safety.

Despite our problems this year at running back—I think we will be in phenominal shape next year—Aldrige and Torain will be special.

After DT and Safety—I would look for another Corner Back—both Champ and Bly are getting old.

The best defense is a good defense!
And last week's young players. Yes!

by Mike Clark on Nov 17, 2008 7:14 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Thanks Mike...

I too am excited to see what kind of player we’ll have in Carlton Powell. His college stats were pretty incredible!

Thanks for reminding me about Aldrige, I’d almost forgotten about him. How fun was he to watch this spring?! I’m also hoping we can bring both him and Ryan back next year, and keep them healthy. It was good to see Torain is keeping his head up regarding the injuries, and his attitude in his blog on the team site. Both injuries this year seemed more like freak injuries than anything else. It looked like he was pulled back and twisted his knee akwardly in the bottom of the pile when his knee was injured.

by donbok1 on Nov 17, 2008 7:39 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Torain's going thru what Rod Smith (in college) went through--bad injury--and trying to bounce back. Aldridge should never have been given every carry

in that last pre-season game. They will make a great compliment to each other.

The best defense is a good defense!
And last week's young players. Yes!

by Mike Clark on Nov 17, 2008 8:01 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I'd treat Powell as our DT pick for next year

and go for a safety first, maybe even two safeties, since we need to upgrade both positions.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Nov 18, 2008 1:42 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Cushing

Interesting that he played some DE – at 255 he has the size for it, seems tough enough to fight the run. Still, a strong, fast SAM with his metrics and the ability to play other roles would be great. I notice that I’m thinking that Boss is done.

I noticed Shanahan said that they are looking at Niko for Will. Interesting. I have liked Woodyard a lot, DJ will be back, hmm….lotta good guys, not all can play at the same time, unfortunately. Assuming styg is right (as usual, fella, but don’t get a swelled cranium…) and we’re done with the 3-4 for this year, it’s going to be even harder to get some guys on the field.

He doesn’t know anything but 100 percent
- Shanahan on Larsen

by Emmett Smith on Nov 17, 2008 8:41 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Bear....

I am one of the guys pushing that we look at WW at safety.
He is small by LB standards.
I am doing a thread on WW now…just found out some info on him!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Nov 17, 2008 8:53 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Isn't WW the same size as all of our LB's?

Or are we talking about smaller than the avg. NFL LB?

by donbok1 on Nov 17, 2008 9:38 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Bok,

Hes about the same size as John Lynch.
The classic tweener….but very quick!
Hes playing at his heaviest weight of his career at 230. Thats the same weight as Winborn. But they are the smallest. Hagans is the biggest at 263lbs.
He came out of the combine at 219lbs.

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Nov 17, 2008 9:43 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

the scouting report said he might be a good "in-the-box safety".

So very much like Lynch…although Lynch’s football inticts were one in a million.

GO BRONCOS!!!

by UnarmingMermaid on Nov 17, 2008 11:36 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Damn...

Haggan is at 263? Wow. That makes him pretty close to Maualuga’s size. 6’3" 230. I agree we should find a way to keep DubW on the field.

by donbok1 on Nov 17, 2008 9:50 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

donbok1

sorry, I don’t like DubW as Woodyard’s nickname. Too close to Dubya (W), the nickname of our current president.

Check out the website listed below...

Rivers light in the loafers?

by EastCoastBronco on Nov 18, 2008 9:51 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I like Woody

"It's all over Fat Man" - Tom Jackson to John Madden 1977 AFC Championship Game

"I love your analysis of our team. Its kinda like watching a spider monkey trying to figure out a jar of peanuts.. you know whats going on.. you know whats in there, but to actually figure it out, is just a bit beyond your mental skills..."
- Bronco Dano

by DesertBroncoFan on Nov 18, 2008 12:45 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

How about W squared?

Touchdowns win championships?

by 53guys on Nov 18, 2008 12:46 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

w2?

How bout Timbaland? Lil’ Will? Humperdink?

Check out the website listed below...

Rivers light in the loafers?

by EastCoastBronco on Nov 18, 2008 1:08 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Dub Dub?

Check out the website listed below...

Rivers light in the loafers?

by EastCoastBronco on Nov 18, 2008 1:10 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Double Dub

Rub a dub dub.

Mountains, forest, sea: these render man fierce, but yet do not destroy the man.

by Jeremy Bolander on Nov 18, 2008 2:39 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

The Woodshed

"Russel drops back in the pocket, he’s got a receiver crossing the middle, he throws…

Oh my God! Did you see that hit? The Oakland trainers are already heading out on the field. I’m not seeing any movement. It likes like he met ‘the woodshed’ on that crossing pattern. This doesn’t look good folks. Now the Denver medical staff is running out to help the fallen Oakland player. Woodyard looks really worried…"

Yeah! I like Woodshed!

"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe

by Steve Nichols on Nov 21, 2008 6:28 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

One problem

It doesn’t lessen the length of the name. Pretty much same amount of effort to say and type woodyard as it is woodshed.

Check out the website listed below...

Rivers light in the loafers?

by EastCoastBronco on Nov 21, 2008 12:09 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

The thing I like about Larsen...

is this… If Larsen ends up being not cut out to be a MLB it will not be because he didnt try hard enough it will be because of the biggest concern for most people which is that he is too slow. I dont think he is too slow. I think he is smart quick and knows how to tackle. I also think he has a heart of gold and plays with such intensity that he can be a role model for the rest of the defense at the MLB position. If he wins the job then I picture him as being the future leader of that defense.

by AZBroncosFan on Nov 17, 2008 11:02 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Well said...

I hope he is a fixture in our D for years to come. His passion and work ethic will rub off on the entire team.

by donbok1 on Nov 17, 2008 11:07 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Larsen is faster than his Combine stats

He just has terrible form on the track. What is fortunate is that he wasn’t brought here to run track.

If Larsen makes it in the middle, it won’t be any surprise to me. He dropped jaws for some time at the UA. Are you from Tucson? If so, then you know exactly what I’m talking about. He was an absolute beast in college, and he made a habit of arriving at a location about the same time as the ball. He just loved it in the other team’s backfield. He is one 240 pounder who you don’t want any bigger because he might kill somebody.

Never argue with a fool, lest you take on his appearance. - my daddy

by AZDynamics on Nov 17, 2008 11:24 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

HaHa.... Classic!

My image is the Circa 1960-’61 Broncos home uniform sock. Some what folk lore to me ... but referred to as the clown sock by my Dad.

by YellowStoneBronco on Nov 18, 2008 8:40 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

ROTF!! Had to rec you on that one . . .

Never argue with a fool, lest you take on his appearance. - my daddy

by AZDynamics on Nov 18, 2008 2:07 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

LMAO!!

+2 in the recs

His Highness, The Duke of Juke, Fast Easy Eddie Casino Crown Royale With Cheese!

by papigrande on Nov 18, 2008 2:26 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Not from Tucson...

but watch alot of pac 10 football now that I live in Sacramento. Grew up in the mid west so I was raised on big 12 ball, and I watch both confrences pretty closely.

by donbok1 on Nov 18, 2008 6:49 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

So...

Larsen = Zach Thomas 2.0?

by SlamDunkTheFunk on Nov 17, 2008 11:35 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

I think he is Zach Thomas 2.0....

In his combine 40 yard he slipped at the start, which effected his time.
He gets around alright. I am a pac 10 fan, and he never looked slow to me. He just looked like a player that always around the ball and who could bring the big hit!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Nov 18, 2008 6:30 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Draft/FA Strategy...

As of right now, I’d still like to see the team draft two safetys, two LBs, and two RBs in the first five rounds. Safety and RB are the two most glaring needs right now. Our current Safeties are non-existant and each RB on the roster has a MAJOR flaw. If Larsen is a STUD over the next six weeks, then we probably don’t need the two LB picks. Let’s wait and see how it turns out.

As for FA, I say spend the cap room and locking-down a few of the 2006 draft class to long term contracts, and signing one stud defensive lineman. Our DLine has been the most consistent unit on the defense, maybe second on the team behind the O-Line. The reason Larsen and Winborn had such a great day Sunday was due to Thomas, DRob, Kenny, and Shaw eating blocks.

I’m not sure a high draft pick on the DL will make a huge impact next year, but a FA tackle like Haynsworth or an end like Peppers would. I say spend some big money on a guy that isn’t an injury risk and is a known producer. The current defensive front, plus Powell, plus a BEAST, would be dominate. Add some young talent at LB and SAF, and the Defense would be great.

by ButteBronco on Nov 18, 2008 11:53 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

I like the idea of

picking up a stud DL through free agency versus drafting a DL and waiting a couple of years to “get it”. If we can get someone that already has the experience and understands the game, I think that’s a much better use of money than to pay a 1st rounder who hasn’t done anything and could take years to see any results. And, if Powell is everything that people here are expecting and is able to learn under a veteran he should be set for some time.

My biggest fear is that Haynesworth and Peppers may be too expensive.

"It's all over Fat Man" - Tom Jackson to John Madden 1977 AFC Championship Game

"I love your analysis of our team. Its kinda like watching a spider monkey trying to figure out a jar of peanuts.. you know whats going on.. you know whats in there, but to actually figure it out, is just a bit beyond your mental skills..."
- Bronco Dano

by DesertBroncoFan on Nov 18, 2008 12:52 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think running back is a need

except at the moment, due to injuries. The way it looks right now we’re going to have a crowd of prospects at next year’s training camp even if we don’t draft a single RB. I agree about two safeties. Right now I think that’s our most glaring need.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Nov 18, 2008 1:48 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I would love to draft a RB

and separate the wheat from the chaffe in next years training camp. This team is quickly closing in on the kinds of rosters where what we cut is sought after by the lesser rosters in the league. If we were in a position to cut Hall, Young and others, that would say a lot about who we ARE fielding!

Darn it. I’m starting to get caught up in all this draft talk… :)

Mountains, forest, sea: these render man fierce, but yet do not destroy the man.

by Jeremy Bolander on Nov 18, 2008 2:42 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

styg

“separate the wheat from the chaffe” , that is awesome, I love this site!

by Steve O' on Nov 18, 2008 5:43 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

But can we afford the luxury

of cutting running backs other teams might covet when we’ve still got holes to fill? Of course, if people keep stepping up and filling those holes from this year’s draft, we might actually have that luxury. And the way we’re accumulating draft choices — how many are we up to now? — we might have another bonanza next year, especially if we keep drafting like we have been.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Nov 18, 2008 5:55 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

That's a pretty big hypothetical

but sure, I’d be okay with it.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Nov 18, 2008 8:14 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

This is exactly the response

that the question of taking a running back requires. And the only response that I can think of for it, is that it is never to early to divest yourself of average or below average players, if you have an opportunity to replace them specifically with a better player.

Blancing the two ideas is the beauty of the offseason, and after our Colbert, Niko, Manuel, MCCree, DRob, Boss signings in free agency last year, I think the front office still has a ways to go in evaluating offseason acquisitions. Not sure if that is the heart of our free agent signings right there (not counting PS fodder and such) but if it is, we are hitting around 16-30%.

Ugh.

Mountains, forest, sea: these render man fierce, but yet do not destroy the man.

by Jeremy Bolander on Nov 18, 2008 9:49 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think those were bad signings

All personnel actions are relative. Colbert got us a draft choice, K-2 is a solid ST guy (please don’t remind me of last year’s Chuckfest in Chicago), Manuel and McCree validated my multi-year concern for drafting effective Safetys, DRob is serviceable and Boss didn’t cost much (other than driving up the team’s health insurance policy).

Basically they were FAs that were worth a look, nobody expected to build the team around them. Due to bad drafting by Denver 4-6 years ago when these players were drafted by their original teams, we had vacancies that needed to be filled by “placeholders.”

The future looks so bright that we're going to need blue and orange sunglasses!

by Arctic Bronco on Nov 18, 2008 11:07 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

They weren't bad signings they were the bar

If the kids pass the bar great, if not, they stay till they do. WW and Larsen have passed the bar set by K2. So I think he will be gone, especially at his cost.

I think Styg may be trying to raise the bar again. He see’s they are passing the current mustard and now whats to ramp up a few positions. Like a home run hitter, all in one back, wouldn’t be too bad at all.

by Steve O' on Nov 19, 2008 8:44 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Arctic and Steve make some good points.

We brought these guys in to fill in, not to be stars. We didn’t go after high priced FAs. The risk was low, and we filled positions. Perhaps we got ahead of ourselves hoping that some of these guys were being brought in because we saw something that other teams didn’t.

"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe

by Steve Nichols on Nov 21, 2008 6:41 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

The Problem With Our Current RBs Is...

most of these guys are injury prone. We have a whole slew of small, injury-prone speed backs— Young, Hall, Aldridge (okay, maybe Aldridge’s injury was a fluke, but do you think he can take a pounding?). Then you have Torrian who has never been able to stay healthy. Pittman is entering his 12th year in 2009 I beleive. Tatum Bell is not a long term soluiton.

Bottom line is, we need a dependable stud to build around at RB. Much like Larsen, Hillis and Pope will have the chance to drastically alter draft strategy. If these guys continue to impress and stay healthy, maybe they can be that stud. If it’s not Hillis or Pope, then a first day draft pick would be in order. Once you have this stud in place, keep two of the speed backs for change of pace and hope Torrain can stay healthy to complement the focal back.

by ButteBronco on Nov 18, 2008 3:47 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Looking at that stable...

I’m with you and Styg. It would be very nice to get a first round running back a la Adrian Peterson, but we have more pressing needs on defense to consider it this year. 2010 draft? Sure, go RB all the way. Right now I say we stick with what we’ve got, at least until we’ve filled up all the holes at SAF (poor performance), DT (can never have enough), SAM (Unless Woodyard gets bigger, and we can improve from Winborn), and CB (everyone will be a free agent in a couple of years).

Next year I think we will start Torain and see what he’s got. Following him will be Pittman, and changing the pace will be Selvin and Alridge. If we keep a 5th RB, it will be Pope or Bell. I think Hall, Haynes, Tatum/Pope, and Boyd will be cut. Boyd or Pope may return to the practice squad. Hillis should return to his natural; position at FB. If that group can’t get it done or stay healthy, I say go RB on the first day in 2010 all the way.

His Highness, The Duke of Juke, Fast Easy Eddie Casino Crown Royale With Cheese!

by papigrande on Nov 18, 2008 4:22 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm curious myself

if Hillis can establish himself as our go-to power back. We already know he has great hands, and he’s pretty agile for a power back. That dance along the sidelines was a thing of beauty. If he
can continue to be effective then, yes, it’ll alter our draft strategy just as Larsen’s continued effectiveness at Mike would. I’m going to be very interested in seeing how Hillis and Larsen do this Sunday and in the weeks to come. I’m also wondering if Larsen’s two-way stint was a one-week affair or if Shanahan will extend the experiment. Both Bell and Pope did well as the scatback complementing Hillis’ power. In Atlanta Shanahan conjured a ground game seemingly out of nothing.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Nov 18, 2008 5:47 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I am NO for running back....

I honestly think that Selvin Ypoung will struggle to see any time in the back field.
I liked the look of our 3 headed monster on the weekend. Tatum, Hillis and Pope all looked very dangerous….Bell and Pope look like they could break a big one at any time, and Hillis is like Bettis….he just drags guys with him, always falls forward and picks up an extra 2 or 3 yards. Remember, this was essentially all these guys FIRST week and they did good.
Ryan Torain will be good, and so will Anthony Alridge…..Hillis as power back and FB next season. Dont write off Pope or Bell…..they looked good to me!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Nov 18, 2008 7:26 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

a leader

is what this d seems to lack. i have read somewhere that DJ never warmed to the idea of being the vocal guy when lynch left. somewhere here i also read that super larsen was a vocal, respected leader on his college team. being the guy who gets his mates pumped and focused means so much, ie romo, lynch, etc., and the ability to knock some pixels is a healthy bonus. on top of all that he is a class act, not a liability for the org. he seems to have all the makeup for a franchise guy. maybe shan’ saw something in him and wanted to see if what he saw was real, that drive to be the best, against all adversity. like, if we take this kid, tell him we’ll put him in a non-natural position, see if he works his way into being a starter, let him earn the respect of his mates.

either way, it makes the next 6 games prime time, no?

by denver_diaspora on Nov 18, 2008 9:56 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

A guy who's not a regular starter at his position

is going to feel presumptuous at being the take charge hollar guy, but if Larsen establishes himself at MLB I could see him becoming the inspirational leader we’ve lacked since Al Wilson went down.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Nov 19, 2008 4:14 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Did anyone notice

Larsen directing traffic and pointing at players and spots?

He wasn’t acting like a rookie or a backup out there. I saw a lot of him in college, so I shouldn’t be this amazed. But I am.

Never argue with a fool, lest you take on his appearance. - my daddy

by AZDynamics on Nov 19, 2008 3:12 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

exactly.

i think he has an opportunity to earn his teammates ears. hopefully. i miss mr. wilson.

by denver_diaspora on Nov 19, 2008 8:20 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

Nice to see Mr. Wilson remembered here.

I think a lot of us miss him. Earn his respect. Let’s hope Larsen can fill those big shoes.

My image is the Circa 1960-’61 Broncos home uniform sock. Some what folk lore to me ... but referred to as the clown sock by my Dad.

by YellowStoneBronco on Nov 19, 2008 2:35 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Winborn

With due respect to our other players, I think that Winborn is taking over the D. He’s very vocal, he’s turned into a heck of a steal, especially given the sad facts of Boss’ situation, and he’s passionate. Larsen is also vocal, and between the two they kept things solid against Atlanta. I’m optomistic.

He doesn’t know anything but 100 percent
- Shanahan on Larsen

by Emmett Smith on Nov 19, 2008 1:16 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

looking forward to this weekend.

shanahan will have some special stuff this week for the faders. he always does. which is neat.

by denver_diaspora on Nov 19, 2008 7:38 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

RB

Noticed this week how many of the top RBs in the last draft are injured/out. When we talk about using a top pick for one, we imagine/assume that they will stay healthy. A lot don’t, although this year we were snake-bit. I like Shanahan’s ability to find quality in later rounds, and I’d be fine with them sticking to that policy.

We need those safeties, a LB and of course, the DTs of our dreams.

He doesn’t know anything but 100 percent
- Shanahan on Larsen

by Emmett Smith on Nov 21, 2008 10:34 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

+1 bear...

no team wants to miss on their first round pick. But when that first rounder you missed on is a RB, the sting is a little greater, IMO. You would hope that your #1 guy will come in and contribute for 8 – 10 years, and it is difficult to expect that kind of production out of a RB.

Any team can get lucky and pick a J Bettis who will carry the ball between the tackles, and average a 1000 yds for 13 years. But just as easily, that team could also pick a can’t miss, sure thing like Ki-Jana Carter, and get a steady 11 or so yards a year, for 10 years. Hard to recover from that. I would much rather stick to our formula for aquiring our RB’s in the latter rounds like you said.

I think the LB and saftey positions will have alot of talent available to us, no matter where we pick in the first and second rounds. If it were up to me, I’d find that saftey that owned the middle, and every receiver that ran a crossing route would go back to the huddle with some piss in his shoes, in fear of his general well being.

by donbok1 on Nov 22, 2008 6:13 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

First for a 2nd, 3rd, and 4th

I agree, especially with signing problems coming up – Cutler and Marshall are in their 3rd year already.

Epimenides to Buddha: What is the best question that can be asked, and what is the best answer that can be given?
Replied Buddha: The best question that can be asked is the question you have just asked me; and the best answer that can be given is the answer I am giving you.

by bradley on Nov 22, 2008 11:29 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree as well.

We could use our new second rounder on LeSean McCoy. Get Chung, Peria Jerry, the safety from Wyoming, Brock Christopher if he’s available to help with SAM. Of course, this is only if someone will agree to trade a 2, 3, and 4.

If Mike Shanahan were a hotdog, would you eat him? I know I would. Hell, I'd eat him twice.

by papigrande on Nov 22, 2008 12:01 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Well, get what you can for the first

Too much money is invested in first round picks, and too many are flat out busts, maybe because they have all that money.

Epimenides to Buddha: What is the best question that can be asked, and what is the best answer that can be given?
Replied Buddha: The best question that can be asked is the question you have just asked me; and the best answer that can be given is the answer I am giving you.

by bradley on Nov 22, 2008 12:18 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

If we're talking trades

I don’t see Selvin Young having any value. The only chips we have in the trade game is additional draft picks. The only players on our roster that other teams will covet I don’t want to get rid of. DJ, Champ, Thomas, Doom and on offense, Cutler, Marshall, Royal, Scheff, Clady, Ryan…well maybe Hamilton if K. Licht. is ready to step in. My sense is though is that if Weigmann starts turning the age corner than Hamilton will move to center. That is where he played at Minn. and I think the reason we drafted him was to eventually replace Nalen, that tough SOB Nalen just stayed on longer than expected.

Metalman, I think Denver has enough depth at this point to try and trade up to add an impact player, like a playmaker at DT, or RB, rather than trade down and build depth.

Win or lose, it's always it a great day to be a Bronco fan!

by Steve O' on Nov 22, 2008 8:47 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

Licks Ten Tigers

would look good at Guard lined up between Clady at LT and Hamilton at C. Then when Hamilton is ready to hang up the cleats Licks Ten Tigers can move into the center and anchor for 10 years fo oline dominance!!!

Mountains, forest, sea: these render man fierce, but yet do not destroy the man.

by Jeremy Bolander on Nov 22, 2008 4:18 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

This was meant as a reply to Steve...

whoops

Mountains, forest, sea: these render man fierce, but yet do not destroy the man.

by Jeremy Bolander on Nov 22, 2008 4:18 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

With that nickname you created I was trying to figure out what the heck you where talking about.

I agree with you however. Doesn’t it seem odd how long O line man can play for considering all the pounding they take. Guys like Munoz, Mathews, Nalen, Roaf, Larry Allen…doing it for years. Incredible.

Win or lose, it's always it a great day to be a Bronco fan!

by Steve O' on Nov 22, 2008 6:13 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

It's odd.

I first noticed that in Madden. It seems like every year the only linemen above a 95 are 32 years old. I can’t wait to see what they rate Clady next year.

If Mike Shanahan were a hotdog, would you eat him? I know I would. Hell, I'd eat him twice.

by papigrande on Nov 22, 2008 7:41 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

O-linemen are durable because,

the consequences of their failures are critical, i.e. seeing the franchise QB get creamed. For this reason they usually sit on the bench for a couple of years and spend lots of time perfecting their technique and pumping lots of iron,

Another reason for their durability is that they are usually bigger than the defensive players they are battling with. Besides being taller and heavier they are usually stouter, their thicker bones and muscles provide more protection. Plus they don’t absorb very many high impact hits to relatively unprotected parts of the body, such as the type of hits that LBs make on RBs. The goal of defensive players is to get by the O-linemen, not to take them down.

The future looks so bright that we're going to need blue and orange sunglasses!

by Arctic Bronco on Nov 22, 2008 7:51 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Very nicely put Artic, thanks

Win or lose, it's always it a great day to be a Bronco fan!

by Steve O' on Nov 22, 2008 8:10 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Good points

also consider, in the vein of taking hits, how amny offesnive linemen are consistently striking eachother?

I swear that some of the worst hits I have seen have been two defensive players colliding….

Mountains, forest, sea: these render man fierce, but yet do not destroy the man.

by Jeremy Bolander on Nov 22, 2008 8:33 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

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