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Where Do We Go From Here?

I never thought we'd be in this position at this point in time, but the Broncos are now in the position of having to find a Head Coach and a General Manager.  I expect that those jobs will be filled by two men, and I think that they should be.  Also, the Head Coach will have a staff to select.  I have some thoughts on each of these topics to share with the community.  Let me preface all of this by saying that I think that Pat Bowlen has earned our trust, regardless of what he does.  He is a truly outstanding owner.

General Manager

Personally, I like the work that Jim Goodman has done, and would like to see him retained.  Whether or not he is the GM is another question, and really, that comes down to front office structure.  I'm not really interested in weighing in on how a front office should be structured, because many models have worked over the years.    I just think Jim Goodman should be part of the mix, because finding the best rookie class (by a country mile) in the NFL should have a reward to it.

I don't think that big name flashy GM hires are necessary.  I have lived in Cleveland throughout the Phil "I want to be famous" Savage era, and it's been a mess.  I prefer a good football man who knows that his role is to stay in the background during the season.

Star-divide

Head Coach

Things get interesting here.  Every NFL writer out there, from Mike Lombardi to Bill Williamson has deemed the Broncos job to be easily the best one available.  There is a franchise QB and a franchise LT in place.  There is also a great owner and a terrific fan base, and a long history of success.

The key young talent that we have is clearly on the offensive side of the ball.  It kind of reminds me of the situation that the Colts were in about 7 years ago, when Jim Mora got fired.  It worked for them at that time to hire the defensive-minded Tony Dungy as Head Coach, and I am thinking along those lines right now too.  Constantly coach up the side of the ball that will always be less talented, by design.

The three names I like at this moment are Steve Spagnuolo, Jim Schwartz, and Raheem Morris. 

Spagnuolo is a long-time assistant, and a disciple of the Jim Johnson blitz-happy 4-3 scheme which is employed by the Eagles.  His Giants defenses have been outstanding for his two years as their Defensive Coordinator.  A potential downside is that he has never been a Head Coach and is already 49 years old, so you probably couldn't consider him a young up-and-comer that you envision in the chair for 20 years.

Schwartz is 42 years old, and has been the DC in Tennessee since 2001.  He has an excellent predigree and track record of success.  He got his start in Cleveland as a researcher for Bill Belichick, and has worked under Jeff Fisher and Gregg Williams.  He's also known as a stats guy, who does work with Football Prospectus and Football Outsiders, which is kind of unique among coaches.  He also has coached Albert Haynesworth for his whole NFL career, and there may be a relationship to leverage there.

Morris is actually probably my favorite at this point.  He's 32 years old, and save for 1 year at Kansas State in 2006, has not even been a coordinator.  He was Assistant DBs Coach for the Bucs in 2004-05 under Mike Tomlin, then DC at K-State for 1 year, followed by spending 2007-08 as DBs coach for the Bucs.  He has been named as Monte Kiffin's successor as DC in Tampa.  I like the Tampa-2 scheme alongside an explosive offense, and Morris is known to be a really bright young coach.  A benefit of the Tampa-2 is that you want undersized, fast guys that not everybody wants to play in it.  That allows you to field a good defense on the relative cheap, and continually replenish it through the draft, when a great deal of your salary structure is locked into offensive players.  Hiring Morris might be a case of grabbing a guy a year too early, but when you're looking for a 20 year hire, sometimes that's the best move to make.

I'm not that interested in Cowher or Schottenheimer, and don't consider either to be very likely hires.  I would be really focused on the three defense guys above at this point, if it were my decision to make.

Coaching Staff

Some people on here have been saying that they understand the whole staff to have been fired.  I don't have the same understanding.  From the DP,

"We haven't been told anything," said Scott O'Brien, the Broncos' special-teams coordinator. "We're all under contract. We'll keep working. I'm sure they'll get it figured out."

League sources say that Bowlen already has decided that he'd like to keep several assistants in place, but that he plans to allow the new Head Coach to hire his own staff.  I would almost guarantee that Jeremy Bates stays, given his strong performance this year, and the contract extension he recently signed.  I would also expect that Bobby Turner and Rick Dennison would be asked to stick around, unless they tried to force their way out of town to join Mike Shanahan.  I've also been impressed with the work done by Jedd Fisch, the receivers coach, with Brandon Marshall and Eddie Royal.  I think a desire for some continuity for the league's second-ranked offense is appropriate.

If I worked on defense or special teams, I'd be getting my resume in order.  I supported keeping Bob Slowik, if Shanny were staying, because I think Slowik did a credible job with bad cards this season.  In this post-Shanny scenario, I obviously no longer want to keep Slowik.  I'd like to see a new emphasis on defense and physicality, and new coaches are the best way to achieve a new attitude there.  Obviously, the new Head Coach will determine this direction.

A Note About How To Feel

First thing, in my opinion it is not alright, and it will never be alright, to denigrate Mike Shanahan with idiotic names like Shanarat.  I've already seen that once or twice on MHR, and it's extremely inappropriate.  As the song goes, when you diss Mike, you diss yourself.  If you think Mike is inherently a bad coach, you fail the "Do I know anything about football?" test.  Thinking he had ceased to be a good fit for this job is a defensible position, and there is probably some amount of merit to it, but he is not a bad football coach, or a traitor, or a bad man.

Mike has handled himself with the utmost class throughout this situation, and he should be commended for that.  That is on top of 14 years that any team except the Patriots would be proud to have in their history books, rather than their own history during that time.

Mike should be thought of as distinguished Broncos alumni, the way we thought of Shannon Sharpe when he played in Baltimore.  You root for your alumni, unless they're playing the Broncos.

I'm taking kind of a cautious approach to evaluating the next moves.  As I said, it is pretty clear that Pat Bowlen has earned some trust with us, and I'll be curious to see what direction he wants to take the team in.  I also wish Mike Shanahan the best, and thank him for 14 outstanding years.

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Good post!

I just found this site, and as a lifelong Bronco fan, I am extremely pleased with the content. This post is just excellent.

As I consider the coaching candidates, Spagnuolo is the most interesting to me. I would also like to at least consider Gary Kubiak, who I think is doing a good job with the Texans and was considered to be Shanahan’s successor back when MS was thinking of taking other jobs.

As for the fall of Shanahan, it is sad. I think he is a great coach, a hall of fame coach, but in the NFL (much more so than in college), eventually unless you KEEP winning, which is very hard to do, things get stale. We’ve basically been in purgatory for the last 10 years — never bad, never good — and it was getting old.

I predict Shanahan ends up in New York or Detroit.

by BroncoFaninKC on Dec 31, 2008 2:36 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Thanks for the kind words...

and welcome to MHR. Your comment is outstanding, and we’re happy to have you as part of our community.

"I am not one of those who think that coming in second or third is winning." -- Robert F. Kennedy

by TedBartlett905 on Dec 31, 2008 2:41 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Nice post Ted

It will be very interesting to see how it all shakes out.

IM NOT THE ONLY ONE when everything is lost that doesn't surrender

by Steve O' on Dec 31, 2008 2:46 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Great post ted!!!

what do you think about Jeremy Bates? If we cant get Cowher, why not stick a young team with a young head coach?

"You play to win the game!"- Herm Edwards

by broncoboy on Dec 31, 2008 2:52 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Great post Ted.

I really want to see Spagnuolo as our HC. For one, he has NFL experience while the two other coaches you have in mind are college. Plus Spags is a tough coach that makes the team work hard. He would be great for this team. I want someone to get in there and be tough. Make this defense spectacular and bring back the old Orange Crush Defense. GO BRONCOS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)

by broncoholic on Dec 31, 2008 2:53 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Schwartz isnt college

Hes been Tenessees DC since 2001. And if we bring him in then we have an inside track for Haynesworth

by purplesocks on Dec 31, 2008 3:45 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Definitely want Spags...

I think some of the guys on D fit in very well with what he wants to do. As far as I know, the players love him too. As well as that, he’d probably keep the O very much intact, and I think that keeping Bates/Dennison/Turner/Fischer is important for this team.

by Muse_Cubed on Jan 1, 2009 7:08 AM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Thanks for the post Ted....

Heres what i got from the Press Conference:
Bowlen said he was letting go of all the staff. Shanahan said Bowlen would try and keep the offensive staff in tact as much as possible. Bowlen said quality is the biggest issue, and not money.
A couple of things stand out like dog bollocks to me:
By the majority of the staff being fired, it means to me that Bowlen will need to bring in a “team” and a system and not just a HC.
This will include a GM as well.
I think the Goodmans stay and take over all scouting and evaluation.
My gut is that Bowlen will go after a Pioli led team with McDaniells and a DC familiar with both of them. A possibility of Marty as a GM and Cowher as HC is intriguing, and you know that they will have access to great coaches and co-ordianators. What I also like about this is that Cowher was a ST Co-Ordinator, and PItts ST was great when he was there.
Cowher brings a system that will suit our offense, and attitude on defense.
That would be my choice.
I like Jim Johnson from Philly as well.
If we want to go young, look at a heavy hitter at GM. I would almost be Ok with Gruden as HC, bring in Morris as DC, make Bates OC officially, keep Dennison. Gruden loves QB’s and would do a good job with Cutler. He knows the AFC West too.
I really like Pioli as GM.

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Dec 31, 2008 2:54 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Goodman

Bowlen was emphatic that Goodman will stay.

To bear up under loss, to fight the bitterness of defeat and the weakness of grief, to be victor over anger, to smile when tears are close, to resist evil men and base instincts, to hate evil and to love love, to go on when it would seem good to die, to seek after the glory and the dream, to look up with unquenchable faith in something evermore about to be, that is what any man can do, and so be great.

Zane Grey

by bradley on Dec 31, 2008 3:05 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

firing staff

I couldn’t listen to the press conference, just read the transcript, but nowhere did I see Bowlin say anyone was fired (other than Shanny). In response to a specific question he said he didn’t anticipate keeping anyone. That’s not the same thing.

My impression is that he will hire a HC and let the new HC decide who stays and who goes. That makes sense. Part of Indie’s success is that Dungie had the good sense to keep Tom Moore. Hopefully the new HC will have the good sense not to tamper with a successful offense while rebuiling a defense.

by SlowWhiteGuy on Dec 31, 2008 3:13 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That's my impression

That Bowlen will let the new HC decide who he wants as assistants, while lobbying for Bobby Turner and others (Bates, Dennison). Another reason to be looking for a D guy as HC – who on the D side do you want to keep?

To bear up under loss, to fight the bitterness of defeat and the weakness of grief, to be victor over anger, to smile when tears are close, to resist evil men and base instincts, to hate evil and to love love, to go on when it would seem good to die, to seek after the glory and the dream, to look up with unquenchable faith in something evermore about to be, that is what any man can do, and so be great.

Zane Grey

by bradley on Dec 31, 2008 3:16 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He said the staff would not be retained, the front office would

But I think he meant that the new HC could decide what to do as far as keeping coaches or staff.

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum
"Duffman is thrusting in the direction of the problem" - Duffman

by Broncoman on Dec 31, 2008 3:20 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

reading between the lines...

I think he was also saying that, if anyone wanted to follow Shanahan they would be released from their contracts. We shall see.

by SlowWhiteGuy on Dec 31, 2008 3:23 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Hey guys, just a quote from Bowlen in the DP:

" He said he didn’t anticipate any members of the coaching staff staying in Shanahan’s absence, but later acknowledged that some could stay, with quarterbacks coach Jeremy Bates all but assured to be retained."

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Dec 31, 2008 3:37 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Interesting that Bowlen in the press conference...

…said that his primary goal was to get a HC (as opposed to a GM). I’d think it would be the other way around. Maybe he has Goodman penciled in as GM?
Anyway, I’m with you, Ted, on hiring a sharp young DC as the next head coach. I like Spagnuolo just from what I know about him and his demeanor on the sidelines. I don’t know the other two, but I’ll take your word for them. Bottom line is I don’t want a retread (Cowher, Marty, or the like). this is a young team – let’s get a new, fresh HC.
Also, thanks for your statement about not saying crummy things about Shanahan or anyone. Frankly, I think the world is too small (and beautiful) to say negative things about anyone (I include the terms Fader, Dolts, etc.) except Osama bin Laden, for whom I have more than negative comments. Great post.

To bear up under loss, to fight the bitterness of defeat and the weakness of grief, to be victor over anger, to smile when tears are close, to resist evil men and base instincts, to hate evil and to love love, to go on when it would seem good to die, to seek after the glory and the dream, to look up with unquenchable faith in something evermore about to be, that is what any man can do, and so be great.

Zane Grey

by bradley on Dec 31, 2008 3:00 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Lets not get too politically correct...

I take no offense to being called the donkeys, the dolts, the faiders etc…..thats all part of fandom. I draw the line when it becomes personal like Shanarat…where it meant to be hurtful.
Lets not confuse banter between fans with outright insulting.

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Dec 31, 2008 3:03 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

oh contraire

I hate the donks, and any negative name towads Mike. Now I am a hypocrite because I dont mind calling that team in Oakland the faders. SD is the whiners but outside of that I dont call other team names. I live here in Sd and am tired of the crap names that get thrown around the broncos. I realize this is a classless town so its expected

somethings wrong, Trying to conquer these fears i thought were gone. And it's been so long, I'm dying to live in a world i don't belong

by broncfanstuckinsd on Dec 31, 2008 4:21 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Great work as always Ted,

I disagree on hiring a defensive coach, however. Sure, Dungy has worked out great for Indy, but Manning was already running the offense when he arrived and all the pieces were in place. Look at Baltimore hiring Billik, and TB hiring Gruden. Granted these examples are idiotic because both of those guys won SBs early, but in the long run, the offenses never improved and the SBs were won in spite of the offenses. Besides Dungy, can you think of any other examples of defensive coaches taking over for offense-first teams. Was Linihan a defensive guy? If so, that didn’t work out so well.

If I owned a business where one segment was the bread and butter and constantly outperformed the other and I was hiring a President to oversee the operations of both units, I would hire a guy that was sure to take care of my bread and butter. When I took MBA courses during my accounting masters program, they called it the hedgehog principle, find out what you do best and do it relentlessly and never lose sight of it. That principle works here, focus on the offense make sure it’s okay first, and hire a good DC and get some talent on that side of the ball during FA and the draft.

Furthermore, this is a young team on offense and needs a top-notch offensive staff to mentor those guys. The only way I think it’s feasible to bring in a defensive HC is if Bobby, Rick, and Jeremy stick around. If those guys go, I think guys like Bates, Urban Meyer and Josh McDanials become serious contenders. Urban scares me because of his nontraditional, non-NFL style offense, but by all accounts he’s an excellent football coach. You’re an offensive guy Ted, what do you think of Urban.

If we do go defensive, I hope we go with one of the three guys you mentioned and keep our offensive staff. No thanks to Cower. I think any of the three you mentioned would go along with such an arraignment to get this job. Morris does sound awesome, and I think we’d all agree Tomlin worked out well for Pitt.

"Choose the sword, and you will join me. Choose the ball and you join your mother, in death. You don’t understand my words, but you must choose. So… come boy, choose life or death."

by ButteBronco on Dec 31, 2008 3:02 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

HEDGEHOG

I agree with you on being relentless in what you do best, but hireing within in this instance seems to me would leave some anamosity and I think a whole new staff is in order. Nothing against Dennison, Turner, O’Brian ….. but whoever the new Coach is needs his own staff.

Tactics without Strategy is the noise you hear before Defeat!

by monodono on Dec 31, 2008 3:19 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I would agree...

thus, we should hire an offensive-minded coach and let him bring in a staff.

"Choose the sword, and you will join me. Choose the ball and you join your mother, in death. You don’t understand my words, but you must choose. So… come boy, choose life or death."

by ButteBronco on Dec 31, 2008 3:31 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Billick

was actually an offensive guy his entire career. Played TE at BYU. Was TE Coach then OC at Minnesota under Denny Green.

The DC for the Ravens was Marvin Lewis, now with the Bungles.

by SlowWhiteGuy on Dec 31, 2008 3:19 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah,

I knew Billick was an offensive guy, which is the point I was trying to make. I should have been more clear (sometimes I type too fast and wish I would proofread once in a while). The Ravens had a strong D but horrible O and brought in Billick to turn the O around presumably. Same with Gruden with TB, an offensive guy brought to a defensive team. These situations are similar to the situation we’re in now, but the opposite side of the ball.

I was just trying to think of other examples where a defensive coach was brought in to fix the defense of an offensive-minded team. I came up with Linihan, although the “Greatest Show” had seen it’s last act early in the Martz era. I suppose you can look at the Marvin Lewis and Rod Merinelli hirings this way, but I don’t think either CIN or DET were offensive juggernauts when those guys came on board.

"Choose the sword, and you will join me. Choose the ball and you join your mother, in death. You don’t understand my words, but you must choose. So… come boy, choose life or death."

by ButteBronco on Dec 31, 2008 3:40 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That would be very cool with me.

Although the change from carrying two QBs on the 53 man roster to carrying twelve would be tough to handle!

"Choose the sword, and you will join me. Choose the ball and you join your mother, in death. You don’t understand my words, but you must choose. So… come boy, choose life or death."

by ButteBronco on Dec 31, 2008 3:55 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Haha good one.....

Gruden does love his QBs. He’s not going to be available though.

"I am not one of those who think that coming in second or third is winning." -- Robert F. Kennedy

by TedBartlett905 on Dec 31, 2008 3:56 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Urban Meyer is a true Head Coach...

as he actually coaches the UF special teams, and pays more attention to that than any other area. I love Urban Meyer, but find it unlikely that he’d want to leave what is maybe the best college job in the country. I generally don’t favor college coaches making the leap to the NFL, and I cringe when I hear names like Bob Stoops bandied about. Coaches like Kirk Ferentz and Pat Hill are one thing, as they were NFL assistants in the past, but guys who have never worked in the NFL have bad success rates making the leap.

"I am not one of those who think that coming in second or third is winning." -- Robert F. Kennedy

by TedBartlett905 on Dec 31, 2008 3:59 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Right on...

For some reason I thought Urban had NFL experience because when he took the job at UF, there was a lot of talk about the strength of his early coaching resume. After looking it up, my mind was probably making some sort of association with his days at ND. But yeah, no NFL experience would be a tough pill to swallow, as those guys never work out. Although, I’m sure someone will give Urban a shot at the next level and I’ll bet his ego will require him to take the job (people that function that highly always have something to prove).

"Choose the sword, and you will join me. Choose the ball and you join your mother, in death. You don’t understand my words, but you must choose. So… come boy, choose life or death."

by ButteBronco on Dec 31, 2008 4:08 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Well you know my thoughts

I will say this, the three guys you mentioned all have great personnel departments that got them players, and while I think last years draft is exceptional, history generally dictates that we aren’t going to hit that mark again for awhile. So I am concrened that if we stay with Goodman as a GM and a young coach or 1st year guy, that there may be somewhat of a power vacuum. Looking at Atlanta and Miami, they both got dynamic front office guys to go with the young HC.

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum
"Duffman is thrusting in the direction of the problem" - Duffman

by Broncoman on Dec 31, 2008 3:09 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

too soon to tell...

but based on last year our personnel people seem just fine (Goodmans, Xander).

by SlowWhiteGuy on Dec 31, 2008 3:25 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

GM

Would a young GM want to come in here, with our offense pretty much set? Wouldn’t he want to build a team from scratch so he can call it his own? Obviously, it depends on the GM, but I see Pioli wanting the Cleveland job, so he can construct (or de-construct) at will. So I think it might be HC that Bowlen goes after first (especially, as others have said, after last year’s incredible draft) and either Goodmans/Xander stay, or Bowlen and the new HC decide the matter.

by GaryP on Dec 31, 2008 3:34 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

HC before GM

When Bowlen said his priority was to hire a HC, that spoke volumes. I thought he’d hire a Pioli type for GM and let that person find and name the coach. Since that doesn’t seem the case, I would speculate that the new GM will come from within (Goodman). Spags would be a great fit for HC. He runs a pressure type defense with a players coach style. Being a new HC, he wouldn’t try to “fix” what isn’t broken (the offense). I advocate the “Hedgehog” principle approach in ButteBronco’s post. Facilitate the continuity and direction of the offense and focus on defense and STs.
Great thread, TedBartlet905! Agree that slurs against individuals cross the line.

by BroncoConvert on Dec 31, 2008 3:40 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I have an idea on who would be a good man for the GM job in Denver

Chris Polian, our Vice President of Football Operations. Only problem is, I want him to stay and succeed our current GM. Bill Polian

by metal_militia on Dec 31, 2008 4:18 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I dunno

I am still pissed so it will take me a while to calm down. But I do like Spagnulo. What about Rex Ryan of B-more? All I know is Denver has 2 full months before the start of Free agency to get a HC in place. Bowlen made his bed, now he better make sure whomever he gets can continue the legacy of success in Denver. I am willing to support any HC that comes here, cuz first and foremost I root for the Broncos. But I dont want to become average. I want to battle for the division every year and wins multiple Super Bowls.

somethings wrong, Trying to conquer these fears i thought were gone. And it's been so long, I'm dying to live in a world i don't belong

by broncfanstuckinsd on Dec 31, 2008 4:24 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Agreed 100%

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Dec 31, 2008 4:26 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I believe though

That denver should try to acquire a GM/Coach combo package. Bring someone in who is familiar with the GM and vice versa so that both men fully understand what kind of team they want. This will limit conflicts in the draft war room and limit the amount of poor FA/Draft decisions because both parties will select players that fit the system, rather than pick up “name” Players. I think the best fit for the Broncos would be trying to pick up Josh McDaniels and Scott Pioli from the Patriots.

by metal_militia on Dec 31, 2008 4:33 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

+1

I definitely think that would be a good move. I don’t think it is the best we could do, but I wouldn’t be negative about it at all.

I don’t want breakaway speed. I want break-some-poor-fool-as-I-bowl-you-over power getting 6 yards off a play that should have been stopped for 2 at most.

by sadaraine on Dec 31, 2008 4:41 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Here guys ill refer you to this fanpost BBS posted on Arrowhead pride

this was intended for a rebuilding team, but it provides what a team should look for in a GM and Coach.

Guide

Its a great read and could probably help you guys formulate a better idea of who you would want for both the GM and Head Coach

by metal_militia on Dec 31, 2008 5:06 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think the first point he makes

Finding an Identity should be heavily emphasized, since that was one problem the Broncos had. They couldnt figure out what they wanted to do or be on defense.

by metal_militia on Dec 31, 2008 5:07 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Thanks for the link. Awesome post and very detailed.

An identity is what we really need. I really hope we can get a solid defensive mind in here to get things in order on that side fo the ball.

"It doesn't dissipate" ~ Mike Shanahan

Cutler's 4th qtr/OT game winning drives: 9

by weazel on Dec 31, 2008 5:18 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Good post TB

You pretty much said it all. Sometimes a change is good even though I am not fond of the firing of Shanahan. I have been proven wrong before and I hope this is one of those times. Bowlen has taken over control of the team as he should.

I agree with most that many of our offensive coaches should stay, they have earned it. I am also along the lines of getting a defensive minded coach because that is what we need right now.

"It doesn't dissipate" ~ Mike Shanahan

Cutler's 4th qtr/OT game winning drives: 9

by weazel on Dec 31, 2008 5:08 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Great stuff Ted

I absolutely agree about the Shanar.. stuff. Lame.

I am also in agreement with the D-minded coach and think your analogy with the Colts is dead on.

I’ve been racking my brain trying to figure out why Bowlen made this move and the one thing I come up with is Shanny’s motivational ability. What I mean is this: when he first came to Denver as HC, ha had a veteran-laden team, self-motivated and eager to finally win one themselves. He brought in a few more vets. Now, the Broncos are a young team and the young guys just naturally don’t have that sense of urgency that a vet does. Plus, many of the vets already have SB rings of their own. How many times did we see not only the obvious “playing down to their opponents” but the whole team seem just FLAT. I have felt a number of times over the past few years that these guys thought they just had to show up and the other team woud simply lay down before their awesomeness. It’s been frustrating. So, because of that, I think a guy like Spags or even Cowher (thought I don’t see him and would be less than thrilled by that move) may be what Bowlen is looking for. I’ve never been big on hype or whatever, but I can see where it would be valuable from a defensive-minded coach. Spags’ age doesn’t faze me at all and I think as a first-time HC, he’d be more amenable to keeping Bates on hand.

Or so I'm told.

by MN Bronco on Dec 31, 2008 5:18 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Jeremy Bates

I’ve seen a couple of comments on JB being a must keep coach. After watching that debacle last Sunday and screaming at the television when Jay threw the pick after the 3rd time we tried the screen pass at the line of scrimmage was smoked out I would have to disagree. Why did he keep calling it? Yes the yards are good almost every game but what about red zone. How many times did we sputter inside the ten?

by SoCalBronco on Dec 31, 2008 5:19 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I see what you are saying

I was surprised to see us keep trying the screens when they repeatedly didn’t work. However I want Bates to stay.

Another thing that had be baffled was that Jackson was returning kickoffs and not Royal. I mean the amount of times SD scored, you would think Royal may have had been able to take one all the way or get us in better field position.

"It doesn't dissipate" ~ Mike Shanahan

Cutler's 4th qtr/OT game winning drives: 9

by weazel on Dec 31, 2008 5:22 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Well if he stays

he will definitely be on a short leash with the new head coach. As far as the Royal thing the only thing I can think of is they were trying to conserve him for punts that never came. At least we know ST is going to be a place of immediate reconstruction.

by SoCalBronco on Dec 31, 2008 5:25 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

agreed

I just posted something similar in a different thread. Not only has his play calling been extremely questionable at times, but I’m concerned about Cutlers progression. He still seems to lock into receivers and throws too many red-zone interceptions.

by SlowWhiteGuy on Dec 31, 2008 5:35 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

IMO

I think it comes down to a complete lack of running game. They didn’t trust Bell or Boyd to carry the rock and it was obvious. The fact people are talking about how well Tatum did is more because the SD defense had absolutely no fear of the run than anything else.

Or so I'm told.

by MN Bronco on Dec 31, 2008 6:06 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I would agree SWG and MH Bronco

that losing this many running backs is an issue but … when you have a Pro Bowl Quarterback ,#1 and #3 receiver a future PB #2 and one of the most dinamic TE’s in the leage in Scheffler any offense should be able to run the ball when the game is within reach. But the idea that we got stumped as many times as we did inside the red zone is not the sign of a great OC. Another question is who was responsible for listing Peyton Hillis as the number 5 or 6 RB when he appeared to brink a spark that I never saw from Young, Pittman or Hall.

by SoCalBronco on Dec 31, 2008 6:18 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Broncos

I don’t think I’ve adjusted to the Broncos w/out Elway. W/out Shanahan, I’m not too sure it’s the Denver Broncos anymore. We’ll see. This is not like hiring another frickin’ sales manager. Whoever they hire, it’s not going to feel right.

"Be not like dumb-driven cattle...."

by jcps on Dec 31, 2008 5:19 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree

And that’s why I want a new guy, like Spagnuolo, not a retread like Cowher.

To bear up under loss, to fight the bitterness of defeat and the weakness of grief, to be victor over anger, to smile when tears are close, to resist evil men and base instincts, to hate evil and to love love, to go on when it would seem good to die, to seek after the glory and the dream, to look up with unquenchable faith in something evermore about to be, that is what any man can do, and so be great.

Zane Grey

by bradley on Dec 31, 2008 5:38 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'm frustrated with this whole move.........

but I guess it really dosen’t matter at this point. What is done, is done.

I thought that the continuity of what was being put together with the current staff was on the right road! Instead, now the continuity is gone.

Now, we have to start over completely! Mike, after this year would have, (with the astute placement of the Goodmans) hired through FA, and drafted a great class of defensive players this year, that would have us on the way to GREATNESS!

The promotion of the Goodmans last year was no FLUKE! Why would Pat want to keep them? They are tallented, work hard, and assess tallent extreamly well. But, wasn’t that just annother one of Mike’s calls, to place them in that important position?

As you can see, I am not happy with this decision! I truly believe that it was grossly premature. That having been said, I want to thank Ted B for an excellent article that is helping all of us to “think to the future.”

What direction do we want Pat to go in?

Some say a defensive HC. Some go the other way. I could really care less at this point, because it does not matter which side of the ball a man has been coaching on! What does matter, is his ability to handle the resposibilities that come with the HC position!

The HC position, is all about choosing coaching tallent and organizing it, so that the end result is a Super Bowl WIN! It’s not good enough to just get there!

The tallent of the candidate, must be his FIRE, Organizational Skills, And, his ability to pick the right staff, and then to keep THEM on track!

I hate to have to admit this, but, I didn’t think that Mike, kept up with that, over the last 4 or 5 years…………….However, I do think that Mike was on the right track, and was actually moving toward the changes that He needed to make and that, is why, I think that Pat, JUMPED THE GUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

Just My Oppinion.

by metalman5050 on Dec 31, 2008 5:24 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Hey

Guess Bowlen could always bring in some CFL HC.

"Be not like dumb-driven cattle...."

by jcps on Dec 31, 2008 5:41 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Sending a message

I think Bowlin needed to send a message throughout the entire organization, “Complacency will not be tolerated; no one is untouchable; nothing less than the SB is sufficient.”

How else could he send that message?

by SlowWhiteGuy on Dec 31, 2008 5:38 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Christmas Card? Sky Writting? Smoke Signals?

Gotta agree though.

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum
"Duffman is thrusting in the direction of the problem" - Duffman

by Broncoman on Dec 31, 2008 5:46 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I didn't like the mediocrity either...

and I bitched about Shanahan sometimes. But, hey, I bitch about my wife sometimes – doesn’t mean I want a divorce! Better find someone at least close to Shanahan’s stature, and I would hate to have that assignment.

"Be not like dumb-driven cattle...."

by jcps on Dec 31, 2008 5:48 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

As for a head coach

i think maybe Ron Rivera from San Diego. look at what he did with the bears and then taking over a d cordinator midway through the season with the chargers. I think he could do wonders with the little talent we have. i think going with a defensive minded hc instead of offense is the way to go. Especially since bowlen wants to keep as much of the offensive staff in place. what do yall think?

by newby on Dec 31, 2008 5:50 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Maybe

"Be not like dumb-driven cattle...."

by jcps on Dec 31, 2008 5:58 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You might be right..

He should know what SD is doing.

by metalman5050 on Dec 31, 2008 5:54 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah

he’s probably sick of that psuedo-HC in SD by now. What the hell’s his name, Norb, Orb… something like that.

"Be not like dumb-driven cattle...."

by jcps on Dec 31, 2008 6:01 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Great Post Ted

After the shock and awe of yesterday I am starting to feel a bit more at ease or at least the beginning stages of accepting the new situation, like I have a choice. One area that I am very excited to see and that is what is going to be done for our defense. Could be a great thing since I am now in my optimistic zen mode after yesterdays breakdown. I am very much looking forward to next draft and next season. So onward and upward. This team has always been a team of class, no matter if it was a bad or good season. Love my Bronco’s.
I also am in total agreement with you on anyone disrespecting our players and coach.
Mike Shanahan has been nothing but class and a pure professional to our team and the NFL. God speed Mike, sure am going to miss you, even when I was throwing everything at my tv these past few years. But the Broncos are my team and always will be, and Mike, You will always be a Bronco in my eyes, till they can no longer see. Good Luck where ever you go Mike and thank you for all the great years as my coach…… Great Post Ted and Happy New year to all the Bronco fans…….Great year a comin in 2009…….

by pwsbronco on Dec 31, 2008 6:02 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes

Thanks for the post. And pwsbronco, thanks for your insightful comments. Mike, I’ll hate to see you on the opponent’s sideline. I think I’ll stay right here and drink.

"Be not like dumb-driven cattle...."

by jcps on Dec 31, 2008 6:15 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Bowlen is the best owner.

The one thing that shows he is the best owner in the NFL, is that (and Shanahan stated this in his conference) Bowlen takes care of some of the staff should something happen and they need to find a job

"It doesn't dissipate" ~ Mike Shanahan

Cutler's 4th qtr/OT game winning drives: 9

by weazel on Dec 31, 2008 6:11 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Too bad it's not a democratic process

Then WE could ELECT the coach! Who do you think we’d choose? Maybe we should hold an election and forward the results to Bowlen, not that he’d give a %@&*!

"Be not like dumb-driven cattle...."

by jcps on Dec 31, 2008 6:28 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think that, after the shock I am able to actually think about the future,

that JElway would be the perfect OC, and that the QBC, should stay in tact! That would leave the OC job exclusively that, and it would alow JE, to call plays that he knows should be called, based upon “HIS” tallent level at the position, also knowing how important the run game was to him!

Any oppinions?

by metalman5050 on Dec 31, 2008 7:01 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

given the mouth on Cutler

I think those two could possibly strangle each other by week 5 or so ;)

Plus think of all the time wasted on arm strength competitions…

"Don't be an ass!" --Bill King

by batgirl on Jan 1, 2009 3:07 PM MST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Too bad it's not a democratic process

Then WE could ELECT the coach! Who do you think we’d choose? Maybe we should hold an election and forward the results to Bowlen, not that he’d give a %@&*!

"Be not like dumb-driven cattle...."

by jcps on Jan 1, 2009 6:13 PM MST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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