Football 101 - Some words about behavior

by Steve Nichols on Mar 19, 2008 4:14 PM MDT in News Comment 17 comments

Hi all!

I just wanted to take a chance to thank everyone for their patience during the recent troll attack. I want apologize for the many comments made by a guest on the recent "MHR University" story about zone blocking which may have buried some questions and comments that deserved to get an audience. Please know that the editors at MHR have discussed the matter, and we pledge to take a quicker and firmer response to posters who clog up the site with insults and personal remarks. Guru has directed to the editors that this site is ok with debate and friendly trash talk, but not to the excess we saw over the past couple of days.

I should have contacted Guru sooner, or temporarily banned the offender, or started deleting comments to keep the article's comment section on a more respectful level, but I failed to do so. I felt that since the comments were mostly directed at me, I should have given the offending poster more slack since I had a conflict of interest. By allowing things to go on as long as they did some of our members may have been offended by what they were reading on an otherwise family friendly site. For that I apologize and pledge to do a better job of policing our site to ensure that a story or diary's comments thread doesn't get that offensive again.

MHR is a safe place to come and to learn about the game of football and the Broncos, as well as sharing your thoughts and comments. Being a Broncos fan isn't a requirment. We welcome the fans of all teams, and even welcome disagreements. Please know that each of us appreciates questions, and no question is too simple or "dumb". We're here to help. If someone attacks you (or, as in this case, one of the editors) on a personal level, it will not be tolerated. All banning decisions made by an editor will be reviewed by Guru to make sure it was proper, and complaints or appeals can be directed to Guru.

Also, please don't take the recent attacks on myself or other MHR members personaly. I know some folks wanted to go to the opposing site to speak up over there. Guys, we want to have class and integrity in everything that we do. If you visit another site do it in a friendly and respectful way, because it reflects on all of us. The leader of the oakland site is a decent guy, and he was made aware of our recent situation with one of his members. He and his site don't deserve the same treatment we got because of one mixed up individual. The behavior of our recent problem poster should in no way reflect on Saint or his site. Trash talk the raiders all you want, but please keep it in house.

And remember the language. We are all a part of the MHR family, but some of our members are younger and we want to keep ourselves a "family friendly" site. We take a lot of pride in our high school and younger members who come here and show a great amount of knowledge and team pride.

So for those of you who have any questions about the zone block scheme and the associative blocks used in the system, this post is the place to post your questions. As always, any other football related questions are welcomed. We are blessed to have experts on everything from legal issues to the salary cap, from Xs and Os to team history, from news research to players and the positions that they play. If one of us doesn't know the answer, we will work to find it for you.

Thanks for coming to MHR. We're glad you're here, and we'll do a better job of protecting our members from personal attacks in the future. I also want to thank our members that were able to keep their class during the episode. You guys rock!

Best,
Hoosierteacher

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Comments

As always HT, you are the conscience

many of us forget we have. I too was guilty of taking it to the extreme, but stuff like that tends to snowball before you realize you've stepped over that invisible line.

In any case, I hope everyone here will consider posing any questions about Zone Blocking to you on this thread, since many might have been missed in the 155 comment onslaught on your original post. ;)

Saint is fun to talk smack with and I am sure some controversy will pop up that will cause MHR and S&BP to clash again in the future. That's what the blogosphere is for, right?

Disillusioned Rants

by Tim Lynch on Mar 19, 2008 4:35 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Thanks Zap

But I really want to emphasize that the conflict was with an individual, and not with S&BP. What happened with the individual we had problems with reflects on him alone.

Controversy is ok, just not the personal stuff.

Many of us allowed ourselves to get a little worked up. The best thing to do is to try to learn from it, and be prepared for stuff like that in the future. It may be hard to do, but we should really feel sorry for the guy. He sounds like a young college student who probably has a lot of issues he needs help with, and I hope he finds a better way of solving his problems.

"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe

by Steve Nichols on Mar 19, 2008 5:16 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I know the type of guy he is,

having been his age long before he thought about being his age...

I used to be like him in a way...I used to argue for the sake of arguing. Winning an argument was more important to me than being right or even making sense. lol

In any case, S&BP is only targetted by me for friendly banter. I do not go there on a daily basis and "troll", but on occassion I will go over there and stir the pot a little. I think Saint knows its all in good fun. ;)

My hope is that they understand that it is somewhat of a compliment to them and their team that I spent some time over there talking smack. I won't even waste my time with Charger or Chief blogs. :P

Disillusioned Rants

by Tim Lynch on Mar 19, 2008 5:41 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Actually, me too.

I missed most of the bally hoo. Sounds like I didn't miss much. I remember being quite a bit like Zapparulez discribes, albeit a long, long time ago. "...[W]inning an arguement was more important than being right or even making sense." Very well said. What a self centered boor I was. Waste of time, waste of breath, waste of skin.

Of course now I am very wise, lol.

by Trinidad Jack on Mar 20, 2008 8:30 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

heheheh

Yea, know we have the advantage of age and KNOWING we are right all the time. heheheheh When you are older that is called wisdom, when you are young it is called youthful stupidity. heheheh I am laughing my arse off right now. :)

I think when you get older you just learn how to outwit the youngins or just plain out-reason them. If that makes sense.

OOMPA LOOMPA DOOMPADEE DOO
OOMPA LOOMPA, DOOMPADAH DEE
It's JaMakus Fail, RRRRRUUUUNNNN!!!!!

by Tim Lynch on Mar 21, 2008 9:32 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Or maybe you realize...

...that most of it doesn't even matter a diddly squat (are there 3 d's in diddly?). lol.

by Trinidad Jack on Mar 24, 2008 11:50 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Don't let Bob Costas

see the last Football 101 entry; that's an example of why he dislikes blogs to a great extent.

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Mar 19, 2008 4:47 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Obviously

that should say "MHR University" instead of "Football 101." ZB is a bit more advanced.

Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!

by Russ on Mar 19, 2008 4:48 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I am still laughing my arse off at the first

comment at the bottom of that article. lolol I would hope he found perspective before getting in the situation described by the comment giver. :)

Disillusioned Rants

by Tim Lynch on Mar 19, 2008 4:53 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Two wrongs don't make a right

HT is right, we all should be classy and respectful of other fans' blogs. A lot of them can't help it if they have issues that cause them to root for teams other than the Broncos. We need to treat their concerns and their enthusiasm for their team with kindness and maturity.

by Arctic Bronco on Mar 19, 2008 8:09 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

And where necessary,

sympathy... ;)

I wish my sig was as cool as mdierks!

by Jeremy Bolander on Mar 19, 2008 8:15 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

How about a piece

rating each of the running backs in the draft on the qualities relevant to the Broncos' system? Say a paragraph on each one, describing his patience, decisiveness, ability to anticipate where the hole will be, etc. The same could be done for receivers. One of the categories relevant to the Broncos' version of the WCO, for instance, which isn't normally taken into account in ratings, would be blocking. A more usual one, which in this case would complement Marshall, would be flat-out speed.

by spock on Mar 19, 2008 11:52 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Spock

A weakness I have is an ignorance of college players and players in the draft. I could provide someone with a list of qualities needed at each position to fit our systems, and based on that someone with more knowledge of individual players could prepare a list of:

Who fits our system and would do well regardless of how "good" or "poor" of a player they are,
Who doesn't fit our systems, but is a terrific enough player to do well for us,
Who doesn't fit, and shouldn't even be considered regardless of how good they are.

"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe

by Steve Nichols on Mar 20, 2008 7:42 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Spock

touches on an interesting point. What is the breakdown on a good WR in the ZB scheme? What are the qualities they should exhibit, especially the slot? When I think of McCaffrey and Smith, they both seemed like possession receivers, yet our passing offense was lethal.

Knowing the qualitites to look for at WR make it a lot easier for me to separate the wheat from the chaffe in the later rounds, since their is an overflow of unknowns who only have a piece or two of the puzzle, but who might be able to do something well enough to warrant being brought in and brought up in ZB.

I wish my sig was as cool as mdierks!

by Jeremy Bolander on Mar 20, 2008 12:37 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

The thing

I noticed about Smith was that when he caught the ball he IMMEDIATELY turned straight upfield. That seems to me almost the essence of Shanahanism. Go north-south young man! No doubt he trained it into Smith and I suspect he'll train it into Marshall. There were times when he danced around, fought off tackles, retreated five or ten yards and eventually fought his way back to the line of scrimmage. They were impressive performances, but I can't help thinking that if he had just gone north-south originally he would have picked up three or four yards. Young players so often think they can give ground and get to the outside for a big gain, but it doesn't happen (except for Desmond #$%;& Howard that time). It wouldn't surprise me if Shanahan thought the same thing and said so. I'll be interested to see how much dancing Marshall does this year, if he shows some sign of having learned not to give ground. And I suspect that's one of the things they'll look for in a receiver, either that he does that naturally or can be coached to do it. There are of course subtleties having to do with a receiver's role in the ZB scheme that you've thought of that I haven't, but this is just something that occurred to me.

by spock on Mar 20, 2008 2:04 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Good stuff Spock

I agree 100% on the importance of running north south, and the importance of having receivers who can block. Marshall seems to be an excellent blocker, has great hands, and the power to break tackles and run over or straight arm away from defenders. He is a great fit.

My big concern is our #2 receiver position. We need to keep pressure off of Marshall, and we can go about it by having a clone on the weak side or having a speed demon. This is my OPINION, not fact, but I prefer a speed man to stretch the field.

I like the speed receiver at weakside because teams will close in their zones to account for Marshall, Scheffler, and even Stokely, who are all not speed demons but great in heavy coverage. One guy to do a "go route" can pull his CB as well as a SAF away from the rest of the crew who will work in midrange. Also, the speedster pulls back SAF coverage enough to help our RB crew as well.

There are excellent points to having another possession guy as well. It's a matter of taste. Another possession guy can keep jacking his CB with run blocks, until that magic moment that he pivots and takes a pass (while the rest of the defense is worried about our strongside runs and our TE). The biggest plus to a possession guy is that he is a greater asset for Cutler on our signature bootleg plays.

"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe

by Steve Nichols on Mar 20, 2008 7:56 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Couple things

First, I'm in your camp as far as a #2 guy being the deep threat, speed guy. While he still needs to be able to block to make it in Denver, Cutler needs a guy who can stretch the field (not a big fan of that term, but it applies here).

Second, as far as Marshall's blocking skills go, one of my favorite things about him is it looks like he really loves to block. I can recall a few specific instances last season where he laid out some defender, McCaffrey-style, and then was on the sideline with a grin like he'd just scored the game-winner or something. That's a man after my own heart.

Or so I'm told.

by MN Bronco on Mar 21, 2008 7:12 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs