MHR Chalk Talk - Game Prep for Denver Broncos at Arizona Cardinals

For thoughts on the game from a Cardinals perspective, visit Revenge of the Birds!! ![]()
The final game of the preseason is upon us, and it's the toughest game to prep for MHR's defensive coordinator in residence. Why?
- Chalk Talk likes to analyze teams systems, not so much player match-ups. This is because player match-ups appear all over sports media (both on and off line). Arizona has performed so badly over the years, that information about their offensive and defensive systems are very difficult to find.
- Being a preseason game, teams play very vanilla. For this reason, preseason Chalk Talks are abbreviated, and treat the game as if starters where playing and systems are in effect. But game four in a preseason is the toughest of all. Starters may be rested entirely, and no hint of offensive or defensive styles will be showcased.
What's a game prep writer to do? Serve his fellow Broncos fans. After all, the preseason is a "preseason" for Chalk Talk too. Chalk Talk (like the fans and the players) is gearing up, practicing, and shaking off the cob webs too. The '08 season is days away, as is the hated raiders (sic). Which reminds me,
A very special WELL DONE to our Cardinal friends in Arizona. All of us at MHR send you a Mile High Salute for your blow out of the raiders (sic). When it comes to beating the raiders (sic), we're ALL Americans.

First off, the Cardinals are a team with a lot of problems. Mike Florio (over at The Sporting News) writes the following:
The Cardinals snuck into the playoffs 10 years ago and won their only postseason game since the Truman administration. Since then, nothing. They've been competitive at times, and they've been a trendy pick the past two years to turn things around. But they haven't.
Part of the problem is the Cardinals are too quick to blame the team's fate on the head coach, creating a regular state of turmoil that makes it hard for the successor to be successful. At a deeper level, the Cardinals have yet to use the current system as a way to maximize their talent while properly managing the spending limits.
The Anquan Boldin situation is a prime example of the flaws that prevent this team from succeeding. With two high-end receivers on the roster, they've paid one of them (Larry Fitzgerald) a contract worth $10 million per year. But the other (Boldin) is making a fraction of that, and the two players are comparable in terms of skill and production.
Now they have to choose between keeping an angry Boldin, trading him or paying him. The Cardinals seemingly want to squat on Boldin, even though a T.O.-style situation could soon unfold.
Of course, none of this would have happened if Fitzgerald's rookie deal hadn't included escalators that backed the team into a cap crunch, forcing it to give him that $40 million deal.
Then there's Matt Leinart, the franchise quarterback the team drafted in 2006. He'll open the season riding the pine while the next player drafted behind him, Broncos quarterback Jay Cutler, seems poised to become a star.
First, I'm going to confess that I'm not familiar with the Cardinals defensive system. I know very little about defensive coordinator Clancy Pendergast. He runs a base 4-3 formation on defense, and has some players of note, but nothing that generates any write-ups. Researching the defensive system of the Cardinals might be like getting a look at North Korea's or Iran's nuclear program, except that no one seems to be interested. (At press time, the Arizona Cardinals deny any intentions of develping a nuclear program).
The Denver offense (on the other hand) runs a West Coast Offense paired with a one cut running Zone Block system. The team features an up and coming QB, depth at WR, depth at TE, and a stable of runners that always seem to crack 1000 yards a season (no matter who starts). With Ryan Torain on the PUP list, and Pittman a question mark, Denver may be in danger of having speed without power though. Denver had serious problems in the redzone last year, so if they hope to overcome that problem (and also be a threat on third and short downs), they may need to keep Pittman and pray for a speedy recovery for Torain.
The only other concern for Denver is a major changing of the guard on the vaunted offensive line. Lepsis retired last year, and Nalen / Hamilton are wrapping up careers. Denver has brougt in some new players including first round pick Clady), and moved forward players waiting in the wings. In the preseason thus far, the OL looks like it will be fine.
The real test for the teams though isn't Denver's offense versus Arizona's defense.
Denver's defense is expected to run (former defensive coordinator) Coyer's version of the Man / Show Blitz. While not set in stone, many factors point to this system. The most recent factor is the reluctance of the Broncos to blitz, and the lack of hard core pass rushing by the DL. I believe that Denver is holding back the scheme until the start of the season, but that everything (down to one gap DTs and statements about returning to roots) indicates the Show.
However, Denver's biggest question marks are on the defense. The DTs were the weak link of the team last year in the Run Contain system, and Denver has little to show for improvement. Denver's lone draft pick for addressing the position is on IR for the season, and the other pick-up is FA DeWayne Robertson. Robertson is likely a major key to Denver's season.
Robertson is a very powerful one gap DT who was (wrongly) used in the NY Jets Fairbanks - Bullough system. He may do well paired with upcoming Marcus Thomas (DT), but he has three strikes that may or may not come into play.
- According to doctors, his knees look like Hell. On the other hand, he's hardly missed any games in his career.
- We haven't seen anything yet (regular season) from a guy who was used incorrectly in another team's system.
- The more he plays for Denver, the higher the draft pick compensation goes. (This bothers me very little though. If he plays great and often, he's worth it).
The question marks deepen at LB. DJ Williams at WLB is considered solid, and should have a great season. But the MLB position has (so far) looked like a battle between mediocre talents. This may change radicaly in the regular season, but for now Denver fans may have some concerns. Over at SLB, Boss Bailey is (once again) injured, so the jury has to be out on his performance. However, some LBs waiting in the wings (Woodyard chief among them) have shown some surprising flashes, and may jump in.
Denver is at once both elite and deep at CB. The safeties this year seem to be an improvement over last year. Denver has a pro bowl, pass rush talent at DE (Dumervil), and several good run stopping and balanced players too. So the area of unknowns falls squarly on the front seven.
Which brings us to Arizona. Arizona's offense is built to exploit the front seven. During an MHR staff meeting, I brought up the difficulties of researching the Cardinals. Guru (The Wise) advised me to consider how much Arizona looks like Pittsburgh on offense. Once again, Guru was right.
Head Coach Whisenhut and Offensive Coordinator Todd Haley (who share a birthday) share ties to the Steelers.
While Arizona has two outstanding WRs, they have a decent running game with both Edge James and Tim Hightower. While not a true zone block team, they are experimenting with it. (Note: While Edge is a one cut runner, I wouldn't consider Indy's OL to be a true ZB system as referenced in the link. My opinion is that the author takes the Coach's comments to mean play by the Indy OL, instead of the running style used by James).
If this were the regular season I would expect Arizona to run a Pittsburgh-like smash mouth offense (Erhardt - Perkins) that would force Denver to face the run. While Arizona will use several ZB plays, I don't see them running the system the plays are predicated on. At any rate, If Denver can't stop the run, they may get much the same shock that the raiders (sic) just suffered.
In the passing game, Arizona has a struggling QB but solid receivers. Now that the promotion of Warner has proven to be a false rumor, the only danger to the Cardinals' passing game is the public dispute taking place between Anquan Boldin and his team. That, and the elite Denver secondary.
Where does this put the game (if it were regular season)?
KEYS TO THE GAME -
Denver
- Play mistake free on STs
- Stop the run / force the pass
- Because the Cards have a better Off than Def, win the time of possession battle
Arizona
- Establish the run
- Establish the run (yes, it's that important)
- Limit turnovers (this should be a tough game for Ariz, and TOs would only make matters worse).
The Cardinals have been popular dark horse picks the last couple of years. Folks keep waiting for the team to take off. (Did you know the Cardinals are the oldest professional football club, dating back to the 1800s in their days in Chicago?) Somehow, they just never get over the top. If this were a regular season game, the pick would be easy. But in a vanilla mix of systems, and playing with 3rd and 4th stringers, there's just no way to predict this game.
You know what's next folks. MNF against Oakland. We can be forgiven if we overlook preseason game four just a little.
Read Related
Comments
I've been over to the Cardinal site a couple of times now.
Maybe it’s just me but I can’t seem to find anything on the the Denver game. What does this say about Arizona fans?
Of course MHR is exactly the opposite, with numerous stories gleaned from the web, fan posts and a couple of great insightful pieces placed by MHR’s own starting line up.
If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!
by Trinidad Jack on Aug 28, 2008 3:33 PM MDT 0 recs
In fairness to the Card's site...
My understanding is that there were some issues with the previous site director, and he was chasing off the members. The new guy is trying to rebuild the site, and Guru seems to think highly of him. I wish the Card’s site all the best.
But yes. We are some butt kickers over here, huh? : )
"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe
by hoosierteacher on
Aug 28, 2008 3:43 PM MDT
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O.K. HT...
…I’m easy. I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt and I do wish the new director all the best..
I know it’s only a pre-season game but I still think the next game with the Broncos warrants a little coverage on their site. Or am I just an ass who missed all the stories over there?
If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!
by Trinidad Jack on
Aug 28, 2008 4:36 PM MDT
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Not at all (an ass)
It would seem reasonable to put something up. But as hard as it was for me to find much to prep in the most meaningless preseason game of any year (game 4), and as hard as it is to run a site with little to no help (he’s still in the stage of writing stuff to folks about how to use the site, since may of his members are new), and add in that he has no staff…
It does look odd not to cover the game, but the guy is working with nothing and starting from scratch. Once he gets some members up and going, and once the regular season starts up, he’ll be fine.
"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe
by hoosierteacher on
Aug 28, 2008 4:57 PM MDT
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Then More power to him and I hope it works out
If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!
by Trinidad Jack on
Aug 28, 2008 6:01 PM MDT
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I know! I know!
All 15 Cardinals fans are at work right now, right? 
Never pass up the opportunity to keep your mouth shut. - my daddy
by AZDynamics on
Aug 28, 2008 3:51 PM MDT
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ROTB's lack of game coverage and the Cardinals in general
First off, good write up. That’s a pretty objective view of the team as a whole. We’ve shown some promise but until we put it together on the field for an entire season, no one will (or should frankly) believe that the Cardinals are anything more than preseason dark horses. The only minor correction that I would add is that Clancy Pendergast’s defense isn’t really a 4-3. It’s not really a 3-4 though either and I’ve seen depth charts list them both ways. You’ll probably see them line up in both defenses tonight but the only time that they truly have four defensive linemen is in passing situations.
As for the lack of game preview content, I think I’ve been pretty consistent in ignoring the opponents in the preseason and I chose to do it that way for several reasons. The biggest of which, is that the Cardinals have plenty of story lines that are bigger than a preseason opponent. Let’s face it, these teams aren’t game planning for each other and both teams are already looking forward to week one. The main objective is to get out of these games without sustaining a major injury. Also as someone pointed out, if we had more than one writer then we’d probably do some kind of game previews but with myself as the only front-page writer the QB competition and Boldin situation takes a higher priority. Another reason that I didn’t even mention the Broncos this week is because after checking MHR, it was pretty clear that we’d be facing the Broncos second string players. While I’m sure some of my readers would be interested in reading about Jay Cutler (b/c of his draft status w/ Leinart) or another player of note, I’m not sure that Patrick Ramsey or Darrell Hackney would generate the same interest.
ROTB’s community is small right now but please remember that four months ago the site was completely dead. The previous writer left the site right after the Super Bowl and he did quite a poor job during last season so we’re pretty much starting from the ground floor. Anyways, thanks guys and I look forward to seeing how both teams look tonight, even if the Broncos B-team takes the field. I think you guys are poised to surprise some people this year with SD already getting injury concerns.
by cgolden on
Aug 29, 2008 8:57 AM MDT
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We have heard about the previous owners problems.
Feel free to let us know if you would like any assistance this year. I am a Bronco fan first, but I support all of the SB Nation sites.
I think the Cards are a talented team, but it takes a long time to get rid of the culture of defeat that has surrounded this organization for so many decades. I actually have the Cards going 6-10 this year, due to toughness of schedule and the fact that they are ruining first round draft pick Matt Leinart. The win now mentality will end up causing this team to lose now. Your coach is unwilling to bite the bullet and let Matt Leinart have his growing pains. Shanny bit the bullet last season with a 7-9 record, but now Cutler is poised to have a breakout year. It seems absurd to me that your team is unwilling to give their #1 draft pick from 2006 a chance to start all season long…win or lose. That, to me, is why the Cards go 6-10 and will not break the cycle of losing this year. I genuinely feel sorry for the fans…
If God is not a Bronco fan, then WHY are sunsets Blue and Orange? - Jon Tollerud 5/22/08
I got a high ankle sprain in college and it still hurts! ~ TSG 8/13/08
by Zappa on
Aug 29, 2008 10:09 AM MDT
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Thanks for the kind words
And all the best to you and ROTB. We at MHR are pulling for you todo well with the site, and hoping (as well) for good things for the Cards.
Your point on the hybrid defense is well taken. Here’s what I’ve dug up since the Chalk Talk. (And you’re right. I found more and more differening depth chart variations in terms of 3-4 vs 4-3 for the Cards). The link does a better job than I, and mentions the Cards as well.
"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe
by hoosierteacher on
Aug 29, 2008 3:17 PM MDT
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Hey greasyqtip
I know we had this conversation going on another thread but I asked my friends dad about where they get off the buses and he told me that its by the south entrance near where they roll out the field. He also informed me that it’s off limits to the fans but he’s trying to find out what hotel they’re staying at. Sweet! Haha
Jules: Tell 'em, Vincent.
Vincent: A (Eddie) Royale with cheese.
Jules: A (Eddie) Royale with cheese! You know why they call it that?
Brett: Because of the metric system?
Jules: Check out the big brain on Brett! You're a smart mother******. That's right. The metric system.
by Elway4Prez on Aug 28, 2008 4:15 PM MDT 0 recs
Any word if Leinart will start this game
I know he lost his starting QB position to Warner, but I was curious if he was slated to start tonight? Brings up some interesting comparisions to Jay Cutler, I remember how everyone in the 2005 draft was saying Leinart or Young and ohh yeah there is this other guy called Cutler, I am wondering if Cardinal fans and soon Titan fans are kicking themselves for passing on Cutler (I must give a special thanks to Cardinals and Titans for allowing us to draft Cutler), I am sure the Cardinals brass are kicking themselves right now.
Broncoman
by Broncoman on Aug 28, 2008 4:25 PM MDT 0 recs
Warner is the starter.
Also, the rumors about Leinart losing the starting job for the Cards were, well, just a rumor.
"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe
by hoosierteacher on
Aug 28, 2008 5:22 PM MDT
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This game is torture!!!
In fact…the whole preseason is like that Chinese water drip torture. I can’t take another drop. I’m going crazy.
by UnarmingMermaid on Aug 28, 2008 4:31 PM MDT 0 recs
Well then you have the right avatar.
lol.
If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!
by Trinidad Jack on
Aug 28, 2008 4:37 PM MDT
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Boy oh Boy, HT, you are in championship form today....
This series is gonna kick some ass during the regular season!! I was basically ignoring this preseason game and now I know more about this matchup than I ever wanted to know! lol Great job man…
I voted for a star to emerge. Wesley Woodyard baby!
If God is not a Bronco fan, then WHY are sunsets Blue and Orange? - Jon Tollerud 5/22/08
I got a high ankle sprain in college and it still hurts! ~ TSG 8/13/08
by Zappa on Aug 28, 2008 5:29 PM MDT 0 recs
I can't wait for MNF either.
I’ve got a ton of info on oakland, a ton of material to fall back on for plays and game planning, and we’ll actually know what to watch for (starters, systems, etc).
I’m ready to go darn it!
"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe
by hoosierteacher on
Aug 28, 2008 5:46 PM MDT
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I'll be posting all sorts of crap after that game...pictures, video...
hopefully I’ll be happy about the outcome as well. I want to be the one talking crap to my brother during the hour and half trip back to my house after the game…I’ll drive off a bridge if I have to listen to his azz talk smack to me all night if the Broncos lose..
If God is not a Bronco fan, then WHY are sunsets Blue and Orange? - Jon Tollerud 5/22/08
I got a high ankle sprain in college and it still hurts! ~ TSG 8/13/08
by Zappa on
Aug 28, 2008 6:01 PM MDT
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BEHOLD!
Yet another reason to hope for a Broncos victory! Our MHR brother Zappa’s very life!
"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe
by hoosierteacher on
Aug 28, 2008 8:06 PM MDT
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Well sir
you have not prepared yourself for it. If I recall you predicted Denver to lose this game a long while back. I personally think you should revise your predictions and make Denver 14-2
by broncfanstuckinsd on
Aug 28, 2008 8:29 PM MDT
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no no no
I said those things while I was off my crazy medication. In my 2008 NFL predictions you will find that the Broncos are 13-3, but they end up getting FAVRED instead of losing to the faders.
If God is not a Bronco fan, then WHY are sunsets Blue and Orange? - Jon Tollerud 5/22/08
I got a high ankle sprain in college and it still hurts! ~ TSG 8/13/08
by Zappa on
Aug 29, 2008 8:43 AM MDT
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ok
i could begrudgling accept that loss, but losing to the faders IMO cant ever happen if this team expects to be playing in January
by broncfanstuckinsd on
Aug 29, 2008 11:27 AM MDT
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i am a liar. we WILL beat the raiders on opening day.
If God is not a Bronco fan, then WHY are sunsets Blue and Orange? - Jon Tollerud 5/22/08
I got a high ankle sprain in college and it still hurts! ~ TSG 8/13/08
by Zappa on
Aug 29, 2008 1:35 PM MDT
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just think all the crap you will have to endure if they lose
BTW do you wear Bronco gear at the game?
by broncfanstuckinsd on
Aug 29, 2008 2:15 PM MDT
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I will be wearing an Elway jersey all day at the tailgate party,
but its been advised by several sources that it might be a good idea not to wear orange and blue. I probably wouldn’t get beat up or anything, but I’d rather avoid anonymous food and beverages being thrown at me from behind. I have a temper and I’d hate to find myself picking a fight with 50-100 nearby fader fans. I’m there to enjoy the game with my little brother, that’s it.
If God is not a Bronco fan, then WHY are sunsets Blue and Orange? - Jon Tollerud 5/22/08
I got a high ankle sprain in college and it still hurts! ~ TSG 8/13/08
by Zappa on
Aug 29, 2008 2:29 PM MDT
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Just watch out for knives
faders fans have been known to stab other fans (especially in San Diego)!
"It's all over Fat Man" - Tom Jackson to John Madden 1977 AFC Championship Game
"I wouldn't say he's nowhere near T.O." - Pacman Jones on Brandon Marshall
"I love your analysis of our team. Its kinda like watching a spider monkey trying to figure out a jar of peanuts.. you know whats going on.. you know whats in there, but to actually figure it out, is just a bit beyond your mental skills..."
- Bronco Dano from DP Comments
by DesertBroncoFan on
Aug 29, 2008 2:35 PM MDT
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Well, outside of the stadium at the tailgate parties
I will be with my brother who happens to have a CCW permit. They won’t let him carry into the stadium, but I know him well enough to know he will be armed out in the parking lot. I’d like to see someone try to stab me…even if I were, at least I know the dude would get a .45 slug in the heart.
I’ve talked to Saint over at S&BP and he told me where to go to hang out with the Black Hole guys…they’ll be cool he said. It’ll be all good. I’m not worried. ;)
If God is not a Bronco fan, then WHY are sunsets Blue and Orange? - Jon Tollerud 5/22/08
I got a high ankle sprain in college and it still hurts! ~ TSG 8/13/08
by Zappa on
Aug 29, 2008 2:41 PM MDT
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Ok, that's the angry American part of my coming out...
I bet money nothing bad happens. I’ll be with a raider fan, so in a way I’ll be accepted because of that.
If God is not a Bronco fan, then WHY are sunsets Blue and Orange? - Jon Tollerud 5/22/08
I got a high ankle sprain in college and it still hurts! ~ TSG 8/13/08
by Zappa on
Aug 29, 2008 5:08 PM MDT
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I remember that
what a loser, well what do you expect.fader fans cant take the truth or logic. so they do what they do best stab someone and go to jail where all their brethren are
by broncfanstuckinsd on
Aug 30, 2008 12:27 PM MDT
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Marshall suspension reduced to 1 game
Entirely off topic, I know.
by Colinski on Aug 28, 2008 6:28 PM MDT 0 recs
I'll have to miss this one...
What’s with all these games landing on Fridays? That’s when I have my games, NFL Preseason Scheduling Commitee! I have an obligation to myself and to MHR to kick Zappa’s arse in the game thread, dagnabbit!!
by papigrande on Aug 28, 2008 6:44 PM MDT 0 recs
Potential Surprises after Friday's game.
Potential stars to arise: Larsen, Alridge, Hillis, Erickson, Russell, Clemons, Harrington, Beck, Rodgers, Hackney, Pierce, Woodyard, Barrett
Potential surprise cuts afterwards: Pittman, Ekuban, Lictenstieger, Pears, Colbert, Martinez, Mustard, Sapp, Ramsey, Mckinely
by The Gun Young on Aug 28, 2008 6:54 PM MDT 0 recs
I disagree on one
I think Ramsey makes it, just based on the experience factor.
by broncfanstuckinsd on
Aug 28, 2008 7:23 PM MDT
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NONONO
Please dont keep Ramsey!
" He goes against Champ everyday." -Jay Cutler
Davis to the Hall!
by Jon Tollerud on
Aug 28, 2008 9:29 PM MDT
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I am with you on that
point, but Ramsey has played in the regular seasion and read a defense. I dont think Shanny would ever have a 2nd string QB with zero regular season experience
by broncfanstuckinsd on
Aug 29, 2008 11:28 AM MDT
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Unforunately, I think you're right
As much as we hate Ramsey, he does have real game experience. We’ll just have to hope that he isn’t as big a failure in the unlikely event that he has to come in (knock on wood).
"It's all over Fat Man" - Tom Jackson to John Madden 1977 AFC Championship Game
"I wouldn't say he's nowhere near T.O." - Pacman Jones on Brandon Marshall
"I love your analysis of our team. Its kinda like watching a spider monkey trying to figure out a jar of peanuts.. you know whats going on.. you know whats in there, but to actually figure it out, is just a bit beyond your mental skills..."
- Bronco Dano from DP Comments
by DesertBroncoFan on
Aug 29, 2008 11:44 AM MDT
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If he has to play for an extended amount of time
The Broncos are @#$%ed. Its not like having Kubiak behind Elway. Its JC or nothing.
by broncfanstuckinsd on
Aug 29, 2008 11:48 AM MDT
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Out of your list T.G.Y
K-Lict, Pears, Sapp, and Ramsey make it. I think McKinely has to make it will no Powell
Jules: Tell 'em, Vincent.
Vincent: A (Eddie) Royale with cheese.
Jules: A (Eddie) Royale with cheese! You know why they call it that?
Brett: Because of the metric system?
Jules: Check out the big brain on Brett! You're a smart mother******. That's right. The metric system.
by Elway4Prez on Aug 28, 2008 7:33 PM MDT 0 recs
Quick Question...
During one of the earlier preseasons games (I think it was the Dallas game) Reggie Rivers was talking about how Shanahan gets irked when people say he runs a West Coast offense because that doesn’t really describe what the Broncos do anymore.
Any idea what he meant by that?
I thought it might have to do with the Broncos getting away from the quick short passes and moving more towards an emphasis on down field throws…but I wasn’t sure.
by UnarmingMermaid on Aug 28, 2008 7:41 PM MDT 0 recs
My thinking.
Mike has moved well beyond the system he managed in San Francisco during the 49ers heyday. Mike has taken the WCO, and melded it into a system that is truly his own (plus he has blended it with another system). However, it still looks WCO to me.
We have gotten away from some of the short, high percentage passes. But we still use them a lot, emphasizing TEs more than most teams, and using misdirection to the edges of the field (especialy the vaunted bootleg) to set up runs in the middle (which is where the one cut runners end up). It is definately Shanhan’s own version, and different from what he ran in SF. It still meets the definition to me.
"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe
by hoosierteacher on
Aug 28, 2008 8:25 PM MDT
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maybe
He just wants to separate the WCO from his version of it. He has probably tweaked the offense to add his own staples and maybe wants to get away from the 49er/Bill Walsh versions
by broncfanstuckinsd on
Aug 28, 2008 8:31 PM MDT
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I agree.
"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe
by hoosierteacher on
Aug 28, 2008 9:44 PM MDT
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YUP U R RIGHT!
We can skip this one but it will be fun to see the back ups try to make an impression!
by metalman5050 on Aug 28, 2008 9:33 PM MDT 0 recs

















