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Around SBN: Notre Dame's Turnaround: How Have The Irish Done It?

Bruce Smith, Rod Woodson, Randall McDaniel, Bob Hayes, Derrick Thomas, and Ralph Wilson are named to the Hall of Fame. Let the rationalizations begin.

about 3 years ago 3fa41be255066640_tiny Ted Bartlett 52 comments 0 recs  | 

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Good class....but no Sharpe and no Carter..

I’m glad Randall McDaniel was elected, even though it surprised many. He was the best at his position for a decade, and never got the credit he deserved.

Also Chris Carter not even making the final five…wow.

I will leave the Sharpe rants for everyone else, he will get in eventually.

"Some guys got drafted and they ain't played football in 15 years and I'm still waiting to get drafted. I'm still waiting to hear my name." -Rod Smith

by The Heat on Jan 31, 2009 1:33 PM MST reply actions  

Frankly Im not surprised

This was a pretty deep class and the bullshit about considering Sharpe as a WR made me pretty sure he wasnt going to make it in this year. Whos eligible for next year that Sharpe will have to compete against? I am glad that Thomas made it in. He has deserved it for a long time now

by purplesocks on Jan 31, 2009 1:34 PM MST reply actions  

I think the highlights are:

Emmit Smith, Jerry Rice and Primetime.. And of course Carter again… Tough competition. You’ll have a tough time arguing for SS over either one of the three.

Random quotes about the raiders:
They really shouldn’t play — Chris Collinsworth (12/5/08)
This is an utter disaster — Chris Collinsworth (12/5/08)
/The great Dane - formerly known as Claaaaas!

by Claus Vestergaard on Jan 31, 2009 4:36 PM MST up reply actions  

Yeah, they need to expand the classes to eight.

With 32 teams now, I don’t think we’re diluting the Hall by expanding the class ceiling. I mean, really, Sharpe and Cris Carter are clear Hall of Famers. Randall McDaniel should never have had to wait as long as he did. I suspect that some voters are holding Carter’s early career drug issue against him in the room.

And next year, Carter’s not getting in because Rice and Tim Brown are on the ballot. Rice is unanimous and Brown will chip off enough of Carter’s vote so neither gets in.

I will say that Bullet Bob Hayes was a huge surprise for me.

And Sharpe’s a TE, a receiving TE but a TE. I’ll always remember that big catch he made in Baltimore in the AFC Championship game from Dilfer. What a great play.

by Danno11 on Feb 1, 2009 12:56 PM MST up reply actions  

As a Chiefs fan,

I’m glad that DT finally got the recognition he deserved, but I was surprised to not see Sharpe’s name. We can all probably agree that he was, at the least, one of the top 2 TEs. He’ll definitely get in, but the queue of players waiting to be voted in is getting fairly large and talent-filled at this point.

Also, NFL.com’s live broadcast of this featured comments from the NFL.com writers, who said that Carter did make the top 10 – no mention of anyone else though.

by Seth_C on Jan 31, 2009 1:38 PM MST reply actions  

Sharpe

I am fine with the fact that Sharpe did not get in, because he will get in! I am happy to see Derrick Thomas get in his numbers alone should have got him in many years ago, I think this is great for his family. Also I like Bruce Smith and Rod Woodson getting in I grew up watching the both of them and both were amazing and terrors against the Broncos. I would hope that someday soon more Broncos will get in and there are deserving candidates from the Broncos. Shannon Sharpe will get in!

by Tomeboy58801 on Jan 31, 2009 1:59 PM MST reply actions  

I think Ralph Wilson getting in is pretty much BS...

And Rod Woodson is more of an eventual HOFer in a lean year, than a first-ballot guy, to me. He was very good, and durable over a long period of time, but not elite. He’s sort of like Jerome Bettis in that way, although he was a better player than the Bus. Both definitely get helped a lot by the Stiller hype machine. Playing for Pittburgh or any team in the NFC East is sort of like playing basketball for Duke or North Carolina. It’s really hard to tell what is true, and what is all just a bunch of hype.

Beyond that, I can’t quibble wirth Smith, McDaniel, Hayes, or Thomas. All deserved it. But Sharpe definitely deserved it, and so did Cris Carter.

"I am not one of those who think that coming in second or third is winning." -- Robert F. Kennedy

by Ted Bartlett on Jan 31, 2009 2:36 PM MST reply actions  

I cant believe it

The guys that i see in definitely deserve it , minus Ralph Wilson maybe, but Shannon helped revolutionize the position of TE and was on 3 Superbowl winning teams and was just overall worthy.

Go Broncos!

by dbroncos78087 on Jan 31, 2009 2:44 PM MST reply actions  

No, this is BS

Shannon was better at his position than anyone else for nearly the entire 90’s. He was a 4-Time All-Pro selection, but should have made it in 2003, 1994, and arguably 1995 or 2001. He was a nine-time pro-bowler and should have been one in 2003 and 2000. He has 3 Rings, took the position to the next level and finished his career 11th all time in receptions, 19th all time in recieving yardage, and with 62 TDs, all tops for a TE. He’s the reason people utilize the TE the way that they do.

I never really believed in the HOF bias against Denver, but this makes me think twice about that. He should have been a first-ballot guy.

by denver_sc on Jan 31, 2009 2:57 PM MST reply actions  

I have a hard time using Pro Bowl selections as a major criteria.

Nothing against Sharpe but we all know the Pro Bowl selection is a little f’d up. Brett Favre this year? Chad Pennington got the shaft. Sharpe helped change the position and revitalize it at a time it was going out of style. Also, he’s got great numbers and a number of big plays under his belt. Also, he’s in the NFL Films Hall of Fame already for the “Send the National Guard!! We’re killing the Patriots” phone call.

by Danno11 on Feb 1, 2009 1:03 PM MST up reply actions  

Hell. Is. Being. Raised.

This is a slap in the face to every Bronco and Bronco fan ever. I will be out in full force emailing every last one of the “election committee” with my entire fleet of available Yahoo email accounts. I’ll be polite, don’t worry, but trust me, they will know how I feel about this. It’s going down. Every one of these aloof apes that vote for this is held accountable, and the Broncos need to speak out about it. John Elway, please come out from wherever you are and tell the world how much Shannon and Terrell Davis helped you win your two Super Bowls. Pat Bowlen, please do the same. And any and every Bronco fan out there, please let the world know how you think about this. As it is, the hall of fame is a joke. An absolute joke, and a travesty.

OK, here’s the list of tight ends in the hall:
-Dave Casper
-Mike Ditka
-John Mackey
-Ozzie Newsome
-Charlie Sanders
-Jackie Smith
-Kellen Winslow

You know how many of those guys have better stats than Shannon? NONE.
You know how many have more rings? I don’t, and I’m too pissed off to look it up. I will when I start my email army. But in all likelihood not many have more than 3.

This is BS. Absolute BS and a complete joke. My list of alternative names for the hall of fame (which should NEVER deserve to be capitalized):
-hall of shame
-hall of fail
-hall of s—t
-bowl of s—t
-hall of San Fransisco, Dallas, Oakland, and New York

Average Bronco Fan's IQ: 120!
Average MHR Mod's IQ: 145!
Average raider IQ: 17!
Click here to beat their scores!!!

by papigrande on Jan 31, 2009 3:01 PM MST reply actions  

You know,

it’s not like Shannon doesn’t have 14 more years of eligibility to make the Hall. There’s a good argument to be made that he should have been a first-ballot inductee, but there’s very little doubt that he’ll make it in.

by Seth_C on Jan 31, 2009 3:15 PM MST up reply actions  

Still, he should be in NOW.

I don’t want to hear this crap about how Kellen Winslow invented the position of tight end and how Shannon Sharpe leeched off his success. Without Shannon, the receiving TE would have been passed off as a one-time wonder and would have never come into vogue. This is just so frustrating because I can’t DO anything about this.

I need someone to yell at.

Average Bronco Fan's IQ: 120!
Average MHR Mod's IQ: 145!
Average raider IQ: 17!
Click here to beat their scores!!!

by papigrande on Jan 31, 2009 3:18 PM MST up reply actions  

I bet that's what they said about Floyd Little the first time he didn't get in

"I am not one of those who think that coming in second or third is winning." -- Robert F. Kennedy

by Ted Bartlett on Jan 31, 2009 3:19 PM MST up reply actions  

Possibly.

There’s probably a long list of players who aren’t in the Hall for whom that was said after their first year of eligibility. The point still stands.

by Seth_C on Jan 31, 2009 3:24 PM MST up reply actions  

Exactly.

And Randy Gradishar, Karl Mecklenberg, Louis Wright, Lionel Taylor…

The fact of the matter us, every year Tony pretty boy Gonzalez augments his stats, the less appealing Sharpe looks. I don’t want to see him give his acceptance speech when he’s 80 years old and having to kiss the Senior’s Committee’s arse for finally giving a crap about him.

Average Bronco Fan's IQ: 120!
Average MHR Mod's IQ: 145!
Average raider IQ: 17!
Click here to beat their scores!!!

by papigrande on Jan 31, 2009 3:25 PM MST up reply actions  

Honestly

Out of the guys you just named, I think Gradishar is the only deserving one. The others were just really, really good. Gradishar was more than that.

I am Jack's unbridled optimism.

by A.J. Haefele on Jan 31, 2009 3:41 PM MST up reply actions  

Fair enough.

I can definitely see where you are coming from, but I still believe that we are severely underrepresented. Or everyone else is overrepresented. Look at the Cowboys. They have like 79 hall of failers and one of them is Michael Irvin. You know whose stats compare favorably to Michael Irvin’s? Shannon Sharpe’s. And he was a freaking tight end!! And Shannon never got busted for running a cocaine syndicate or whatever the hell Irvin got arrested for. I’m not sure about the details, my daddy turns off the TV when reports like that come on. :P

Average Bronco Fan's IQ: 120!
Average MHR Mod's IQ: 145!
Average raider IQ: 17!
Click here to beat their scores!!!

by papigrande on Jan 31, 2009 3:50 PM MST up reply actions  

Oh

I completely agree that we aren’t represented enough in the HoF and that the teams with all the glory and media love are over-represented, just that of the guys you listed I only thought Gradishar was deserving of the Hall.

I am Jack's unbridled optimism.

by A.J. Haefele on Feb 1, 2009 1:25 PM MST up reply actions  

Rings for HOF TEs (as a player, only)

Casper – 2
Ditka – 1
Makey – 1
Newsome – 0
Sanders – 0
Smith – 0 (and he lost the game by dropping a TD pass in the only one in which he ever got near)
WInslow – 0

So, yeah. They comine to have one more than Sharpe’s 3. Sweet, guys.

"I am not one of those who think that coming in second or third is winning." -- Robert F. Kennedy

by Ted Bartlett on Jan 31, 2009 3:27 PM MST up reply actions  

Thank you.

And add everyone’s favorite little (fill in the blank), Tony Gonzalez, and you have….. wait, still four.

This is bullcrap. BULLCRAP!?!? This is DENVER!!!!!!

Average Bronco Fan's IQ: 120!
Average MHR Mod's IQ: 145!
Average raider IQ: 17!
Click here to beat their scores!!!

by papigrande on Jan 31, 2009 3:29 PM MST up reply actions  

Ditka?

A ring as a player??

Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. When the fear has gone past, I will turn to see fear’s path. Where the fear has gone, there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

Bene Gesserit saying. (From Dune, by Frank Herbert)

by bradley on Jan 31, 2009 3:37 PM MST up reply actions  

Ditka got one on the Cowboys

He and Tom Flores are the only people to get rings as a player, assistant coach, and head coach. See here.

"I am not one of those who think that coming in second or third is winning." -- Robert F. Kennedy

by Ted Bartlett on Jan 31, 2009 5:18 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

Thanks

Coulda sworn Ditka spent all his playing years as a Bear. Old age equals bad memory. That’s a good link.

Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. When the fear has gone past, I will turn to see fear’s path. Where the fear has gone, there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

Bene Gesserit saying. (From Dune, by Frank Herbert)

by bradley on Jan 31, 2009 7:24 PM MST up reply actions  

The best (eligible, at least) TE in the game, ever, doesn’t get in? The guy wen’t from playing for Savannah State to winning three rings – a pad on the back seems fair…

Is this even a surprice? I don’t know, but having P. King deciding on things like players’ legacy makes me want to go back to watching soccer…

Must… resist… playing… east-coast-bias-card…

Random quotes about the raiders:
They really shouldn’t play — Chris Collinsworth (12/5/08)
This is an utter disaster — Chris Collinsworth (12/5/08)
/The great Dane - formerly known as Claaaaas!

by Claus Vestergaard on Jan 31, 2009 4:32 PM MST reply actions  

Also

“President, we need the national guard, we need as many men as you can spare, ’cause we are killing the Patriots” – Classic!

Random quotes about the raiders:
They really shouldn’t play — Chris Collinsworth (12/5/08)
This is an utter disaster — Chris Collinsworth (12/5/08)
/The great Dane - formerly known as Claaaaas!

by Claus Vestergaard on Jan 31, 2009 4:32 PM MST up reply actions  

doesnt surprise me

thats why i will never go there. Its called the hall of shame for reason (well to me anyways)

somethings wrong, Trying to conquer these fears i thought were gone. And it's been so long, I'm dying to live in a world i don't belong

by broncfanstuckinsd on Jan 31, 2009 5:27 PM MST reply actions  

I have lost all respect for the HOF and its induction process.

……and they won’t get it back until there are several more Broncos in the HOF.

"It doesn't dissipate" ~ Mike Shanahan

Cutler's 4th qtr/OT game winning drives: 9

by weazel on Jan 31, 2009 7:14 PM MST up reply actions  

Papigrande

I agree with Papigrande. You have the right to be like Veruca Salt on this and want his election NOW!!!! When I heard about his “let’s judge him as a WR instead of a TE” crap, I started to get worried. Before this, my belief in the Bronco HOF bias was solid, but now it is ironclad after this fiasco. These “hacks” who vote for this need to have their voting privileges revoked. There needs to be different people to vote for this, or they need to get certain HOFers who are trustworthy(and not biased) in this process to keep these idiots in line and say “you are making a mistake by snubbing this guy. He belongs in here”. I know that with people, you are going to have bias in some form, but something must change.

by PABroncofan on Jan 31, 2009 5:46 PM MST reply actions  

I guess we're lucky ...

That John Elway was inducted his first year. I guess that’s what you have to be to be elected in as Denver Bronco: Only one of the best players to ever play the position. Wait … No… Shannon was that. I am stumped!

Couldn’t be a bias because no mediocre players from Dallas, Pittsgurgh or Oakland get in. Only the crem del la crem! Michael Irvin definitely would be a HOFer if he were a Bronco. Right?

by vincerelli on Jan 31, 2009 6:17 PM MST reply actions  

If Michael Irvin was a Bronco he still would out of the HOF.

"It doesn't dissipate" ~ Mike Shanahan

Cutler's 4th qtr/OT game winning drives: 9

by weazel on Jan 31, 2009 7:11 PM MST up reply actions  

p.s.

I guess this also means Rod Smith and TD have no chance in hell!

by vincerelli on Jan 31, 2009 6:18 PM MST reply actions  

Two words . . .

Bull. Shit.

OK, that’s one word split. But you get where I’m coming from.

I WILL admit that this is a solid induction class (i.e. Derrick Thomas should’ve been in several years back). But to have the best pass-catching tight end of his era NOT get in on the first ballot (and just because he didn’t block well doesn’t mean he wasn’t a tight end) is just incorrigible to standards I’m not sure I want to go down to.

Alright. That’s all from me.

"Leaders are made, they are not born. They are made by hard effort, which is the price which all of us must pay to achieve any goal that is worthwhile." -- Vince Lombardi

(No, I'm not a Packers fan)

by Donut King on Jan 31, 2009 6:32 PM MST reply actions  

Add to the firestorm, the fact that...

there was still one available spot for a player to make the maximum of 7 players to be enshrined.

Meaning… there were enough naysayers in the room to make Shannon get less than the 80% required for his enshrinement. I really have to question our Denver media representatives. Are they representing our players adequately??

Also, I’ve read elsewhere more conspiracy theories, dun dun dun… saying that the voters are viewing Sharpe as a receiving TE and they want Jerry to be the first first-ballot receiver to make it into the hall.

Lastly, looking at the lineup for next year… it looks even harder for Shannon to make it in! =/

by tunga77 on Jan 31, 2009 6:37 PM MST reply actions  

I thought that the max was seven...

your right, that makes it totally unacceptable. They already have a backlog of names that need to get in, so they need to not only be maxing out the list every year, they need to be adding more slots to it.

Concision in style, precision in thought, decision in life.

by Jeremy Bolander on Feb 1, 2009 9:26 AM MST up reply actions  

minimum of 4 and a max of 7

somethings wrong, Trying to conquer these fears i thought were gone. And it's been so long, I'm dying to live in a world i don't belong

by broncfanstuckinsd on Feb 1, 2009 2:13 PM MST up reply actions  

A max of 7 and only 6 are going.

I guess it is too hard to add Sharpe to make it 7.

"It doesn't dissipate" ~ Mike Shanahan

Cutler's 4th qtr/OT game winning drives: 9

by weazel on Feb 1, 2009 4:14 PM MST up reply actions  

The Max of 7 assumes...

That both Veteran’s Committee candidates make it. Sharpe couldn’t have held that spot this year.

by studbucket on Feb 3, 2009 10:29 PM MST up reply actions  

I am not surprised one bit.

Wow, a Bronco gets denied once again. I know Shannon Sharpe will get in eventually, however there is no excuse. The only thing I don’t understand is how can a player not get in the HOF one year and then make it the next year or so? A player is either HOF material or he isn’t. One morre thing I’ve got to say is that Tony Gonzalez better not get in the first year either.

"It doesn't dissipate" ~ Mike Shanahan

Cutler's 4th qtr/OT game winning drives: 9

by weazel on Jan 31, 2009 7:09 PM MST reply actions  

This is a bunch of Horse S%@*

Once again proves the HOF voters care not about the merit of the person, only their own political agenda. HOF voters are jokes, freaking jokes, as angry as the MHR report was against these clowns, it’s now time to start kicking these doors down, the stupid arguement, oh he will get in don’t worry about it, just assures that deserving guys such as Gradishar, Little, Wright, Mecklenberg, Davis, Atwater, and the rest will not get in because there is no way in hell that the HOF would every vote two Broncos in at the same time, and Sharpe will take away from any votes any of the other guys will have. I know the voters will not tell their reasoning and hide behind the veil of confidentiality, but face it, very few of them if any are qualified to be voting, this proves it. I suggest a protest at the HOF induction ceremony may be something worth considering, might be nice to have people yelling BS at the top of their lungs on national TV, especially when they indcut Ralph Wilson, his claim to fame, being old and owning the team for a long time, what did he do to advance the game? In all honesty, Pat Bowlen has done more for the NFL in the last ten years than Wilson has done his entire life.

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum
"Duffman is thrusting in the direction of the problem" - Duffman

by Broncoman on Jan 31, 2009 7:21 PM MST reply actions  

What gets you into HOF

Total career recieving yards 4,817, 31 TD, blocked for one 1,000 yd back, team winning percentage during your time there 0.500, no championships, noSB appearances, no
championship appearance – welcome to the Hall of Fame

Total career recieving yards 10,060, 61 D, blocked for thirteen 1,000 yd backs, one 2,000 yd back, team winning percentage during time there 0.594, 3 NFL championships, multiple playoffs – go to hell

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum
"Duffman is thrusting in the direction of the problem" - Duffman

by Broncoman on Jan 31, 2009 7:56 PM MST reply actions  

Who is the unnamed TE you are referring to?

I would like to use him in my flaming email. About 3 hours in the making, it is turning into a masterpiece.

Average Bronco Fan's IQ: 120!
Average MHR Mod's IQ: 145!
Average raider IQ: 17!
Click here to beat their scores!!!

by papigrande on Jan 31, 2009 10:23 PM MST up reply actions  

Yep, Charlie Sanders, Detroit Lions 68-77

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum
"Duffman is thrusting in the direction of the problem" - Duffman

by Broncoman on Feb 1, 2009 2:08 PM MST up reply actions  

The hall of fame Is Dead To Me.

This is my GAP, there are many like it but this one is mine. Without my GAP I am useless, without me, they will run through my GAP. I will protect my GAP and have my brothers back on his. I will not be moved from my GAP, I am a crazed dog that patrols this area and will defeat all who entire it. I own this GAP, it is mine. I bought it with blood and sweat. I will not be pushed. I will not be moved. This Sunday I will make a stand and a statement.

by Tim Lynch on Feb 1, 2009 12:08 AM MST reply actions  

+1

somethings wrong, Trying to conquer these fears i thought were gone. And it's been so long, I'm dying to live in a world i don't belong

by broncfanstuckinsd on Feb 1, 2009 2:15 PM MST up reply actions  

+2

"It doesn't dissipate" ~ Mike Shanahan

Cutler's 4th qtr/OT game winning drives: 9

by weazel on Feb 1, 2009 4:13 PM MST up reply actions  

I'll just be laughing in about January, 2013...

when these hacks are trying to get JohnnyB, and others like him, to hire them to write for the SBNation blogs. We’ll work cheap, and we have great name recognition!!!!

MHR should have about 5 million unique visitors per month by then, at the rate we’re going (that is actually a pretty conservative estimate.) SI will likely be a monthly magazine by then, like the Sporting News, and ESPN will have bowed out of the magazine business. The only important printed newspapers left will be the New York Times, The Washington Post, the LA Times, and USA Today.

Brave. New. World.

"I am not one of those who think that coming in second or third is winning." -- Robert F. Kennedy

by Ted Bartlett on Feb 1, 2009 12:36 AM MST reply actions  

WSJ will still probably print

but they and IBD would do well to go internet newsletter format exclusively….

Concision in style, precision in thought, decision in life.

by Jeremy Bolander on Feb 1, 2009 9:30 AM MST up reply actions  

Agreed, and agreed

If they were smart, one of them would look to partner with USA Today, which has a definite niche as the official newspaper of the one-hour flight. If IBD or WSJ provided printed content to them, they’d still hit a key segment of their market in print, without having to really print, themselves.

"I am not one of those who think that coming in second or third is winning." -- Robert F. Kennedy

by Ted Bartlett on Feb 1, 2009 9:37 AM MST up reply actions  

This IS the best football blog on SN

Hands down. There are other good blogs but this is clearly the best.

by Danno11 on Feb 1, 2009 1:08 PM MST up reply actions  

+1

This is my GAP, there are many like it but this one is mine. Without my GAP I am useless, without me, they will run through my GAP. I will protect my GAP and have my brothers back on his. I will not be moved from my GAP, I am a crazed dog that patrols this area and will defeat all who enter it. I own this GAP, it is mine. I bought it with blood and sweat. I will not be pushed. I will not be moved. This Sunday I will make a stand and a statement.

by Tim Lynch on Feb 2, 2009 11:49 AM MST up reply actions  

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