Horse Tracks 10/11/09 - Broncos host Patriots and celebrate AFL's 50th Anniversary

by Douglas A. Lee on Oct 11, 2009 8:45 AM MDT in Horse Tracks Comment 40 comments

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Fun fact of the day: The 2009 Broncos have allowed 26 points through 4 games. The 2008 Broncos gave up 28 points in the second half of their season finale in San Diego.

DB - Matchup: Broncos vs. Patriots - Broncos TV
Video footage from Friday's drumline is a CANNOT MISS.

LTC - Broncos celebrating their past - Brian Howell

DPP - A pivotal player in Wiegmann's life - Lindsay Jones

DPP - Kiszla: Time to embrace Orton as one of us
"After managing to win the four games he has started for Denver, Orton owns a higher passer rating than Philip Rivers or Tony Romo, yet Orton still gets bashed on fan websites dedicated to the team, such as milehighreport.com, where a review fresh off Denver's win against Dallas griped: "Right now, I feel like I'm watching a time bomb. No picks yet, but a five-interception game is right around the corner. . . . Bottom line is I don't trust him."

CSG - Some words from your 50th anniversary Broncos - Frank Schwab

DPP - Patriots-Broncos game will provide a fascinating study - Mike Klis
"But I was always into what Bill was doing, what he had to take care of, as much as I could see. There was plenty I couldn't see. But the things I could watch him do — how he handled the staff meeting, how he planned practice, how he ran training camp, how he handled the players, what he did at halftime, what he did on a Monday after a loss, how he handled a win, all of those things, if you pay attention and note them in your head and take notes, they can teach you an extraordinary amount of what it's about to be a head coach."

FOX - Broncos' McDaniels is more than a Belichick disciple - Alex Marvez

DP - Busy day ahead for the fans of Denver teams - John Ingold

DP - RTD adds services for games - Jeffrey Leib

DB - A Closer Look: New England Patriots - Gray Caldwell

DPP - Klis: Great record beats great offense any day - Mike Klis

CSG - Patriot at Broncos: 3 things to watch; anniversary Top 10 - Frank Schwab

DPP - Ex-Bronco transforming the game plan - Terry Frei
Former Broncos LT Matt Lepsis is working toward a master's in theology down in the Dallas area.

SN - McDaniels undefeated but now gets mentor Belichick - Clifton Brown

SN - Can McDaniels, Broncos, make Pats next victims?

NFLTA - Patriots-Broncos matchup - Video

Patriots News

BG - Air of confidence - Theresa Smith

BG - Thrill of the chase recalled by Patriots tight end Watson - Michael Vega

BG - Bronco bustin' - Jim McBride

BG - On defense, things stacking up much better for Denver - Michael Vega

BH - In high-stakes game, Bill Belichick, Josh McDaniels loathe to reveal hands - Karen Guregian

BH - Jerod Mayo back in mix - Ian Rapoport

BH - The five biggest determining factors today - Ian Rapoport

BH - The sack exchange - Nate Dow

AFC West News

Y! - Hanson: My life was threatened by Cable - Mike Silver

NYT - Raiders - Committed to Excellence, Doomed to Losing - Joe LaPointe

SFC - Offensive line has new problem - David White

SFC - Denver's McDaniels might be a better version of Belichick - David White

OT - Oakland Raiders assistant Hanson says Cable could have killed him

KCS - Chiefs’ losing ways rival the ’70s Buccaneers - Kent Babb

KCS - Scouting report | Dallas at Kansas City - Adam Teicher

SDUT - A disappearing defensive act - Kevin Acee

SDUT - Attorney leads pursuit in Escondido - Matthew Hall

NFL News

NFL - Cowboys won't have injured WR Williams, RB Jones vs. Chiefs

NFL - Jets called 49ers about possibly trading for Crabtree

NFL Opinion

NFP - Sunday at the Post - Mike Lombardi
"Broncos wide receiver Brandon Marshall is a one-man wrecking crew. Who covers him is important, but they better be able to tackle him as well."

ESPN - 10 Spot: Manning better than ever - Adam Schefter
"I tell you what, just being under Josh McDaniels for a few months now, I mean he's a guy that is going to have you as prepared as you can be for a game, and that's something that throughout my 11 years I haven't had a lot of," Broncos cornerback Champ Bailey said. "I've had some great coaches, including [Mike] Shanahan, but [McDaniels] is definitely one-of-a-kind in the way that he approaches the game."

SI - Week 5 Viewer's Guide: What to watch in Falcons-Niners, more - Ross Tucker

SN - Week 5: Ten Bold Predictions - RealScouts
"Look for Tom Brady to beat the blitz package with plenty of quick reads to Welker and tight end Benjamin Watson."

NFP - Weekend Notes: Bailey vs. Moss - Matt Bowen

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Comments

Thanks NYC!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.

by boydy2669 on Oct 11, 2009 8:51 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

If the Cowboys

don’t have Roy Williams and Felix Jones and the Chiefs beat them, they will say the Broncos win was a fluke.
Thanks Nyc.

"You give 100 percent in the first half of the game, and if that isn't enough, in the second half you give what's left." – Yogi Berra
"We don't stop playing because we grow old; We grow old because we stop playing." -- George Bernard Shaw
Breaking jaws or the NFL in Oakland who cares? Fall on your pirate’s sword - Ponderosa

by KaptainKirk on Oct 11, 2009 8:51 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

If the Chiefs beat the Cowboys, it's goodbye Wade Phillips.

by bfree2bronc on Oct 11, 2009 9:51 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hey All...

Here’s another story at fox sports that I did not see:
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/10195798/Broncos’-McDaniels-is-more-than-a-Belichick-disciple
Hope it helps!

by boydy2669 on Oct 11, 2009 8:55 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Oops!

Thanks, Boydy – I’ll add it

by Douglas A. Lee on Oct 11, 2009 9:38 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wow.

Milehighreport is now the official home of the Orton bashers?

Who knew?

by JeffG on Oct 11, 2009 9:11 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Wha...

I assume that was a quote from a fan/commenter here? It’s fine for someone to post that as a comment here but for the DP to misleadingly requote that as if written by the bloggers who run this site is just wrong. Buzz Bissinger would be proud.

The commenter formerly known as "Dashiell".

by underdog on Oct 11, 2009 9:30 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Apparently the DP needs to do something to trash MHR

maybe because MHR is 50 times better than the garbage they produce and they know it.

John Clayton is the head Dean at Fail University (known as F.U. in short)

by Joe Medina on Oct 11, 2009 9:17 AM MDT reply actions 2 recs

+1 Cali

by KaptainKirk on Oct 11, 2009 9:46 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Comment Rec'd

Joe – I love the signature, too

"I am not one of those who think that coming in second or third is winning." -- Robert F. Kennedy

by Ted Bartlett on Oct 11, 2009 9:59 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Thanks Ted.

I hate when “professional” journalists resort to trashing “amateur” blogs to get more hits on their own sh*t. Forgive my language everyone, but this downright pisses me off.

John Clayton is the head Dean at Fail University (known as F.U. in short)

by Joe Medina on Oct 11, 2009 10:05 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

On Kiszla's article

Just so folks know -

Kiszla was deliberately posting the MHR link to support our site because he and I had talked earlier in the week about the situation with Kyle Orton. I’d sent him a thank you for an article that he’s written that I’d enjoyed and included a question regarding why Orton has been doing so well and yet the fan base continues to refuse to support him. He and I exchanged a few emails and that was part of the emergence of his article.

Which, I thought, was well done, well thought-out and nicely balanced. I think that we’ve gotten to the point where an attempt to support our site (with the link) and a reasonable question regarding the comment that one of the members did post, which illustrates a prejudice against Orton that’s unreasonable and derogatory gets Kiszla attacked and his writing insulted as ‘garbage’.

Joe, this isn’t aimed at you, so please don’t take it that way. I’m just making a general point – some of the members are so wrapped up in bashing ‘the media’ that they don’t quite recognize when we’re getting supported by them. It might behoove us to step back a bit and let them do the type of reporting that they are paid to do and to enjoy the other kinds of material that MHR can offer without making it into a contest of good vs. evil. If there is an article that attacks the Broncos or MHR, fine – have at it. But in this case, Kiszla is being attacked for supporting us, and we should probably take a look at that as well. No offense is meant to any single member – it’s just part of a pattern that seems to have taken root.

Hillis/Moreno in '09

by Emmett Smith on Oct 11, 2009 10:56 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Like me?

Verbose in style, dispersion of thought, procrastination in life.

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2009 11:58 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

wrapped up in media bashing? :)

Verbose in style, dispersion of thought, procrastination in life.

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2009 11:58 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

No, Zappa, not like you :-)

It’s just a general thing. There is so much anger going on about ‘the media’ that it’s gotten to the point that when a writer makes a point -that folks should support Orton more – and uses an example of a comment that is a fair quote from a MHR poster, giving us credit (and link), that we shouldn’t attack him as if he’d insulted our mothers.

I’ve been seeing a bit of a tendency to over-react and even to exaggerate. I could be wrong, too – it’s just my opinion. But for what it’s worth, I don’t see anything wrong with a writer starting to support the team. In fact, I’d like to encourage it. The level of bitterness just seems very heightened. Why not support him when he points out that folks are too hard on our QB?

Hillis/Moreno in '09

by Emmett Smith on Oct 11, 2009 12:56 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't recognize the quote

I wonder how far back in the archives you have to go to find it.

Wherever you go, there you are.

by YosemiteSam on Oct 11, 2009 9:20 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

It was a reply I think by McGeorge

I don’t ever remember seeing that in a FanPost Article.

Forgive me if I’m wrong about that McG. You have to admit, though, that you had at least that kind of attitude.

by Endzone on Oct 11, 2009 9:37 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

It was not McGeorge,.

by boydy2669 on Oct 11, 2009 9:38 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Vaguely familiar

The quote sounded vaguely familiar. As noted, I was not positive who said it. If not McG, do you know who did say it boydy?

Bottom line. ONE QUOTE OUT OF HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS? Yellow journalism.

by Endzone on Oct 11, 2009 9:41 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think I do...between 3 posters...but the thing is..

It was only a sentence out of the post anyway. The rest of the post was reasonable and pretty positive. Subjective journalism at its best!
I swore I would NEVER post at the DP again, but I just had to on this one. I was not the only MHR member either…..bit of a firestorm happening!

by boydy2669 on Oct 11, 2009 9:56 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I hear what you are saying Boydy, but,

to take ‘one’ statement out of thousands and make it sound like the fans are ‘not’ on board with Kyle ridiculous, not a very smart statement by a professional journalist.

by bfree2bronc on Oct 11, 2009 10:48 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I am agreeing mate...I just dont want to bash our member who commented...

As it was one "negative"comment in a post that primarily positive.
Please DONT take this as sticking up for Kiszla….it was lame.
I am sticking up for the poster who I believe brings lots to the table and should not be bashed for it!

by boydy2669 on Oct 11, 2009 10:53 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I didn't mean to identify the poster

I’m not really interested in who said it. Most of us at one point or another have had doubts about what Orton could or could not do, and a few of us voiced those concerns. As we all know, respectful disagreement on this site is not only tolerated, it is encouraged. How else can we determine if what we believe stands up to scrutiny?

What I was trying to discern was how far back in the archives is a quote like this. Most of the recent comments, certainly the last few weeks, have been overwhelmingly positive. How far back did Kiszla need to go to find something like this?

Wherever you go, there you are.

by YosemiteSam on Oct 11, 2009 10:59 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

You're right, boydy

One of the things that people are forgetting is this – the quote was chosen because MHR is generally a very positive and supportive site, and yet that kind of perspective is pretty common here. If you don’t believe me, go back to last Sunday night and Monday. You’d think that Orton had only played the first quarter and stunk up the game, instead of rebounding and having great numbers for the overall game.

Actually, Kiszla considers MHR to be doing good work and has expressed nothing up positives to me about the site, with the exception of his (to me, understandable) reaction to the way he’s getting slammed today. He was asking, in the article, why that kind of negative perspective on Orton continues, not attacking MHR. I know that some, even many, folks disagree with me, but I have to admit, I’m seeing a lot of how folks see what their prejudices tell them to see.

I’ve reread the article and I just don’t see the kind of negativity that he’s being accused of. The tendency to slam everyone in the media who disagrees with you is pretty common and it’s no problem – do what you like. But this time, the writer is getting slammed for supporting the team. That, I don’t get at all.

Hillis/Moreno in '09

by Emmett Smith on Oct 11, 2009 2:22 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

It doesn't really matter who wrote it..

.. the problem is that that kind of sentiment is in the minority here and it was used as an example of the ‘regular’ Orton bashing that goes on here….

You have to look pretty hard on this site to find much Orton bashing.. Where as you don’t have to look very far at all to find the inherent Orton bashing in Kizsla’s own writing.. maybe he should be using himself as an example.. but of course that require him to take responsibility for what he has written in the past.. and that just isn’t going to happen!

by HorseStance on Oct 11, 2009 9:47 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

hope he doesnt mind my reposting it...

but i loved this from our very own tsg on that kizschgrla article:

This is a joke, right? I mean, you are going to find a random comment on my site, one of 500K comments, and use THAT as an example that the members of MHR don’t support Orton? Maybe you could have reached out to me and asked my thoughts on Orton – maybe you could have looked through any of the archives on the site – and see the numerous columns on our support for McDaniels and Orton while you were killing him.

No, sorry, don’t change your tune now that the Broncos are winning. ‘Professionals’ like you crushed this team for firing Shanny, for hiring McD, for trading Cutler, while ‘Amateurs’ like me were left to pick up the peices of the fanbase we love. Now that we have some vindication you are going to use US as the example?

Sorry. No way. It is selective journalism like this that is killing print media and why sites like mine are successful.

-John Bena
http://www.milehighreport.com

classic case of class vs ass.

"What other people thought about our team, what other people who are less educated than the ones inside the building thought about our team...doesn't really matter." McD

by denver_diaspora on Oct 11, 2009 9:33 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

hmmm. more of that was supposed to be in the blockquote.

"What other people thought about our team, what other people who are less educated than the ones inside the building thought about our team...doesn't really matter." McD

by denver_diaspora on Oct 11, 2009 9:34 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

John's Reply to Kizla

Stole this from DPP:

MileHighReport wrote:This is a joke, right? I mean, you are going to find a random comment on my site, one of 500K comments, and use THAT as an example that the members of MHR don’t support Orton? Maybe you could have reached out to me and asked my thoughts on Orton – maybe you could have looked through any of the archives on the site – and see the numerous columns on our support for McDaniels and Orton while you were killing him.

No, sorry, don’t change your tune now that the Broncos are winning. ‘Professionals’ like you crushed this team for firing Shanny, for hiring McD, for trading Cutler, while ‘Amateurs’ like me were left to pick up the peices of the fanbase we love. Now that we have some vindication you are going to use US as the example?

Sorry. No way. It is selective journalism like this that is killing print media and why sites like mine are successful.

-John Bena
http://www.milehighreport.com

by Endzone on Oct 11, 2009 9:33 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

ah. good work on the formatting. i saw that too.

sometimes a gem is found among the moronic chest pounding.

"What other people thought about our team, what other people who are less educated than the ones inside the building thought about our team...doesn't really matter." McD

by denver_diaspora on Oct 11, 2009 9:35 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Kizla is a stir-up want-a-be opinonator, that's all. Washed up punk!

Take that and put it in your column fool.

by bfree2bronc on Oct 11, 2009 10:01 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

He will never get over the time

Shanny humiliated him by refusing to answer a question unless he came up, kneeled, and requested forgiveness for the previous week’s diatribe. Can’t remember the details — only that Shanahan thoroughly enjoyed it, and Kis put extra venom in his pen for a long time after that. I was just amused that he actually did what Shanny told him to do. LOL

Conversation nonstarters: hoping McDaniels fails, comparing Bears to Broncos, Cutler to Orton, apples to oranges, and casual drinkers to Raiders fans.

by broncosmontana on Oct 11, 2009 10:05 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I can't believe this dude

How could he write something like that when the majority of us have been Orton and McD supporters from day 1. We defend him against noodle arm attacks and this clown opens with a noodle arm reference. He attacks us as critics when we are overwhelmingly positive. I mean shit even McG will probably agree with us on this one. (I’m just messing with you McG)

by T.Dot_Bronco on Oct 11, 2009 9:46 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

You know what?

that article, even though it was negative, will shoot him in the foot and inadvertently drive faithful readers of his, over to this site. They will find out the truth, and that this place is “Miles Higher,” and never return to his lies.

by KaptainKirk on Oct 11, 2009 9:53 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

KK...exactly...

In my comment at DP I thanked Kiszla for sending readers our way with his crap journalism!

by boydy2669 on Oct 11, 2009 9:57 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Did anyone hear on the "NFL Gameday Morning" show about Shanahan?

Daniel Snyder has been reaching out to Mike Shanahan to become their head coach. Daniel isn’t happy with the way Jim Zorn is not getting it done. Would be nice to see Shanny go back into coaching, just not in our conference.

by bfree2bronc on Oct 11, 2009 9:56 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Not to distract from all the lovely controversy mentioned above

but MAN NYC, you were SO RIGHT about the drum line! That was freakin’ HYSTERICAL!!!

Conversation nonstarters: hoping McDaniels fails, comparing Bears to Broncos, Cutler to Orton, apples to oranges, and casual drinkers to Raiders fans.

by broncosmontana on Oct 11, 2009 10:01 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Proud of MHR and give Kizla some credit

Regardless of WHO said it I am proud of MHR that anyone CAN say it without being a troll. 99% of the time we present a fact-based argument to address their opinion, and those who reply do so with respect and fact-based support or counter-argument. But Kizla IMPLIES that Orton gets regularly bashed here by the majority, which is clearly not the case, by selectively picking out one opinion and presenting it as if it was an official approved review and opinion by the site. That is not fair journalism. It is like taking a little quote from a comment made to Kizla’s article and saying that the Denver Post officially stands behind that comment.

Give Kizla some credit. He goes on to restate that we should embrace Orton. His words:

But in a football city as sophisticated as Denver, isn’t it about time we stop judging quarterbacks on style points?

by Endzone on Oct 11, 2009 10:03 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I've got a quote for Kiz to use in his next column:

and I’ll even put it in a nice quotation block for you Kiz.

Mile High Report has been supportive of Kyle Orton since DAY 1. Yes, there is concerns, but nothing that would make the members here not support him. Oh yeah, and the readers and writers at Mile High Report may not have the press credentials you do, but that does not make us ignorant to the facts.

John Clayton is the head Dean at Fail University (known as F.U. in short)

by Joe Medina on Oct 11, 2009 10:08 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

MHR has been a medium for many different opinions - positive and negative

Folks, I’d like to ask you to step back and take a deep breath. Mark Kiszla was making a point – and he was right. There have been no shortage of people on this site who have questioned and even insulted McD, denigrated Orton and had little but bad to say about the owner, head coach and team. We need to be willing to take a look at that.

There is no monolithic MHR opinion. There shouldn’t be. We are a forum for rational, civil discourse and debate. There’s been a lot of that (and a little too many dogmatic attacks on those who believe differently from both sides) and many points of view are experssed. We have posters on all sides of the issues and that has long been a strength of the site.

I love our writers – members and staff alike. I think that we fulfill a role that is missing from most of the media. If writers like Mark Kiszla wrote articles the length of a Tales or a Chalk Talk, they couldn’t get it published. The editors wouldn’t sign off, because that’s not in the job description. But that’s not a bad thing – it’s just a fact. I thought that this article was fair, balanced and accurate and I’m kind of embarrassed by the degree of rancor that is being exhibited. Are we now going to attack anyone who points out that the fan base has included people who aren’t positive about the Broncos? It is a fact, neither good nor bad, and reporting it is part of MK’s job.

The personal insults and attacks that are coming out of the woodwork are NOT in the best interests of MHR, nor are they a measured or even reasonable response to this article. MHR wasn’t spoken of badly – MK was supporting the site by adding the link (and it’s unlikely that he will again, due to the way people are acting). If he chose a quote that illustrated a point he was making – so what? It’s a good quote. It’s a decent example of the feelings that many posted after a win, last week, during which Orton posted a 117.5 QB rating and an over 68% completion rate. I felt at the time like there were a lot of members who were talking about Orton as if he’d single-handedly lost the game. I’m at a loss to understand why MK noting this attitude gets him insulted, slammed and attacked. He’s right – that perspective exists. He calls for it to end. So did I.

I think that a lot of folks this morning really do need to take a deep breath.

Hillis/Moreno in '09

by Emmett Smith on Oct 11, 2009 11:34 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

White-Out

In the days of using paper, there was this stuff they called “White-Out” It was useful for all kinds of cools things. Touch-up holes in the drywall, paint your fingernails, restore your typewriter keys, etc. But one of the coolest was to cover over mistakes you had typed on a piece of paper. Imagine that!

Why don’t we “white-out” the reference to milehighreport.com and re-read the article? I still think it’s bad writing, but it’s not as libelous as I first thought.

by Endzone on Oct 11, 2009 12:28 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs