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Is there a QB controversy in Denver? Should there be?

I was reading Tim Lynch's perspective and started writing a reply and thought I would make a post of it. To be honest I have slowly but surely found myself becoming a fan of Orton and to be even more honest this game put a wee bit of a set-back in the progression of that process. SO here is the question "Should there be a QB controversy in Denver? I know, I know, McD has proven that he has the ability to coach a team and has a good eye when it comes to talent. I am not doubting that but by the same token there are a few things I don't understand and here they are...

 

 


Star-divide

To put it lightly I too am not feeling 100% confident in Orton...

This is why, if your going to be a "non gun-slinging control the ball nothing fancy" kind of QB then be it!!! Then I won't expect you to put the team on your back and win the game like Phylis Rivers does for his team... but I do expect you to protect the ball!!! and not throw a game away by giving the other team 21 points...

 If on the other hand you are a "gunslinger take chances make spectacular plays put the team on your back and win games" kind of QB I will forgive the occasional game that you have a meltdown.  I can't forgive what Cutty has been doing in Chicago this year just to be on the record for that one.

I just want.. well I guess I want is what is being promised, that's all... I think that Orton is a great back-up, the kind of guy that can come into a game and could give you a chance to win!!!! Kind of like Kubiak was for us, brainy, skilled but not amazingly athletic...

My question is why isn't Chris Simms even in the picture??? In pre-season the guy could just FLICK the ball 40 yards, he has excellent mobility, a pedigree, and is tough as nails!!! and can he really be that much dumber than Orton so that he doesn't or can't pick up this complicated offense, apparently Bmarsh did it in a few games... I dunno, I mean why are they paying him 2+ million to just sit on the bench???

Could McD be worried about people thinking that he is giving up on the QB that he traded for Cutty and that he is tacitly admitting he made a mistake??? I hope not cuz after everything that has transpired it is obvious the trade was a good one for the Broncos if not Genius!!!

Look I know it is way too early for Tommy B. but why not give Chris a try after say INT number 3??? He could give the team a boost, you know the guy has leadership capability which is exactly what Griese lacked.

I mean isn't this team about the team and not about any one player? Could Chris suck so bad in practice that he doesn't deserve even a chance in a game that is at the very least "un-winnable" ( I'm talking about late in the 4th) I'm just saying that there are "practice players and then there are "game" players... Chris seems to me to be both but at the very least the latter...

I don't know if there is a motivation problem with Orton as there is with J. Russel in Oaktown but if coach McD pulled Orton on the last few drives of Monday night I'll tell you there for sure wouldn't be one in the future.

I don't know for sure but I say give the guy who can stretch the field a chance!!!! You stretch the field on Baltimore and Pittsburg and you completely change the outcome of the game... look at the losses both of those teams have this year!!! Just sayin'... I'm not saying the Broncos win both of those games but IMHO you put a guy back there that has the ability to flick the ball 40 or 50 yards consistently and all of a sudden no more 8 in the box and the run games improves and so does the dink and dunk stuff underneath. Then the O-line starts to look like the O-line of years past...

For those that say Orton hasn't had the time I feel that could be fixed by someone with fleet feet like Chris... the guy has some wheels and could get the edge once in a while on LB's that pin their ears back and come straight for the QB... a couple of 12-15 yard runs after a juke move and all of a sudden those rushers are second guessing and staying home a little longer... Bootleg anyone? I remember a QB in Denver that bought himself a lot of time that way...

At any rate I don't pretend to know a fraction of other poster's here at MHR but I sure have learned a lot hangin' out here and respect the opinion of all who tread these waters... so what do y'all think should there be a QB controversy or not???

Poll
Which QB option makes sense to you?
Give a "Neckbeard" a break, it isn't all his fault!!! Keep him in there!!!
87 votes
Bring in a fresh face with a proven track record, Give me Chris Simms
30 votes
Give the Rookie a chance Tommy B. has what it takes...
10 votes
We're desperate jump into the free market and hope to get a Mikey Vick
1 votes

128 votes | Poll has closed

This is a Fan-Created Comment on MileHighReport.com. The opinion here is not necessarily shared by the editorial staff of MHR

Comment 69 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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One two pick game and this is happening...

Orton won six in a row and this was nowhere to be found. lighten up a bit. I have seen games where Peyton Manning has thrown six INTs same with Brady. Besides those two picks he has been great about keeping the ball with the offense.
I am not giving up on Orton. against the pats and chargers he was great! He is smart and he learns from his mistakes I think he will be fine.

Embrace the other side, become the animal.

by mbudde33 on Nov 10, 2009 7:54 PM MST reply actions  

I agree that is why I said I was slowly becoming his fan...

But in all fairness I have not felt confident in K.O. he has had so many balls that should have been picked, right in the DB’s hands and they drop it, and so many balls that he telegraphed and so many balls where he led his team mates into horrible tackles. I agree the Broncos are 6-2 but I don’t think I would lay all of the credit on Orton’s doorstep…

Either way who ever in behind center I am rootin’ for the Broncs

"even a stopped clock is right twice a day" Yosemite Sam

by lovewatchinthegame on Nov 10, 2009 8:04 PM MST up reply actions  

So has every other frickin QB.....how many INTS were dropped wth Cutler, Elway, Manning, Brady....you guys are really hard to please.

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.

by boydy2669 on Nov 10, 2009 8:11 PM MST up reply actions  

I like him...

and actually I liked Plummer a lot too. They both win games

Embrace the other side, become the animal.

by mbudde33 on Nov 10, 2009 8:15 PM MST up reply actions  

I'm not that hard to please...

But please you got to be honest, from a purely objective point of view Orton did not live up to his billing last night, under any kind of light he lost the game, an int here or there every QB has em but last night Orton did not manage the game like the game manager he is supposed to be. You could blame it on the O-line but I’m here to tell you that from now on every game from here on out until Orton proves different you are gonna see every team line up 8-9 in the box and your gonna see rushes right up the middle. A couple of long bombs complete to Bmarsh would cure that in a heart beat. Then the run game and the dink and dunk underneath stuff has a chance too. Just an opinion my Aussie Friend
I was just saying that the Broncos are paying Chris 2+ mil this year I would just like to see what he has in the tank, I am sure that you care more about Bronco wins than you do about who is actually playing be it Orton or Simms I am just shocked with what I have seen from Simms in years past why he isn’t at least given a chance to get some game time when the score is out of reach… it’s not like it would hurt anything unless Orton really is a prima dona QB and he has so skillfully hid it from us.

Anyway love your passion!!!

"even a stopped clock is right twice a day" Yosemite Sam

by lovewatchinthegame on Nov 10, 2009 8:31 PM MST up reply actions  

See Bshrout's "To throw or not to throw" post

It gives some great insight on the long ball stats for the year NFL wide.

by bchiper on Nov 11, 2009 11:47 AM MST up reply actions  

thanks

"even a stopped clock is right twice a day" Yosemite Sam

by lovewatchinthegame on Nov 11, 2009 5:46 PM MST up reply actions  

I couldn't vote

I would say Orton deserves a chance to continue and see if he can improve, but I can’t say he has no fault in his play. He still has a tendecy to stare down WR, underthrow balls, and take bad sacks. That being said, I think he competes and generally plays up to his abilities. That being said, Chris Simms has never impressed me, I don’t know what upgrade he gives you, he may be a better athlete, but I don’t think he is better athlete. And a rookie is just that, and will probably struggle and not help us win games right now, especially if he does not have a run game to rely on.

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum
"Duffman is thrusting in the direction of the problem" - Duffman
"Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun" - Ash from Army of Darkness
"H.I., you're young and you got your health, what you want with a job?" - Evelle from Raising Arizona
"It happens sometimes. People just explode. Natural causes." - Agent Rogersz from Repoman

by Broncoman on Nov 10, 2009 8:34 PM MST reply actions  

Don't Count Orton out yet

Give the guy a break. The last two weeks we were beaten by a better team. If we loose to KC or the Faiders then I would start to worry. We have some issues and we made some mistakes, but we played them tough last night and that is all I ask. We are transitioning the team and yes it will have ups and downs. Our interior line play has been horrible on offense. Yes we need to address this next year in the draft, but those defenses are the best in the league. They do that to just about every team they play. Young Jedi will make adjustments and we will beat the Skins and have a record of 7-2! I will take that record any day.

"3 and Out Baby" I ride the short bus!

by scottwchicago on Nov 10, 2009 9:09 PM MST reply actions  

DIdn't Cutler lose to KC and the Raiders?

BENCH HIM AND BRING IN PATRICK RAMSEY!

by JeffG on Nov 11, 2009 1:10 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

LOL!!!

+1

" Life is what happens while you're making other plans "

by hairybear on Nov 11, 2009 4:00 PM MST up reply actions  

HAHA

Embrace the other side, become the animal.

by mbudde33 on Nov 11, 2009 4:53 PM MST up reply actions  

We do not quit this year

and i really like that. We folded like a cheap tent the last 3 years!

I would hope you would support who we are. Not, who we are not. Coach Norman Dale "Hoosiers"

by dmitchell624 on Nov 11, 2009 6:45 PM MST up reply actions  

In short, no

Simms is a good QB, when he’s “on.” When he’s not…well, he’s off.

Orton’s a good QB, as long as he has protection. Currently, he isn’t getting it.

Brandstater needs to keep holding that clipboard this year. He’ll need all of the next offseason to keep learning this complex system, perhaps make some appearances in some games, and then maybe in 2011 he’ll be our starting QB.

We’ll just have to cool our jets for now and see how things play out the rest of the year.

"All credibility, all good conscience, all evidence of truth come only from the senses." Friedrich Nietzsche

by Horsepower on Nov 10, 2009 9:19 PM MST reply actions  

Good points HP

Simms has been wildly inconsistent since college – tearing up the league one game and wrecking his own the next. If he’s not playing, there’s a reason.

Brandstater is what we all love – a blank slate upon which to write our dreams. When he eventually plays, we’ll find out what his own weaknesses (as well as his strengths) are. If this continues, we will then demand his head over – whoever is next after him. Patience has not been and extant virtue recently ;-)

I keep hearing how Orton should be able to put the team on his back. Simply put, that’s not the system that McD is trying to instill. Getting quality play for the O line is essential to success in this approach – we’re not getting that, and it shows.

Moreno/Buckhalter in '09

by Doc Bear on Nov 11, 2009 12:35 AM MST up reply actions  

What are you talking about!?!?!?!?

Why tell me why you would bring in Chris when your team is 6-2

by crazybroncofan on Nov 10, 2009 11:29 PM MST reply actions  

actually that's not really what I was saying...

I am really in the camp to keep Orton in until he shows over a long period that he can’t get the job done… with that said it would be kind of cool to see what Chris could do when the game is out of control… at least that’s what I thought I was saying….

"even a stopped clock is right twice a day" Yosemite Sam

by lovewatchinthegame on Nov 11, 2009 8:39 AM MST up reply actions  

That is exactly what Kyle never had in Chicago...

…Was the faith to keep him in as the starter…

Kinda reminds me of Shanny pullin’ Jake prematurely, ta be even thinking of pulling Kyle

- though honestly, before the season started, I had notions of bringing in Chris as QB on second downs and otherwise, ‘randomly’ to confuse Defenses further – almost akin to a QBBC, but more like the Wild Horse, just occasionally…..

But yeah I think it’d be madness to pull Kyle.

I grew a (familiar) fondness for him before and throughout preseason- (especially against the Cardinals!) and obviously every game since -and can’t wait to see the next half of the season with him at the helm, good or bad (and I’m sure it will be the former, at least into the playoffs) – Enjoy! Talk to you later. ( =

First team to three consecutive SB wins!!!! and then some, right? I think four and someone else oughtta have a 'fair' shot : )

by PearlJamBroncoGFunk on Nov 11, 2009 1:49 AM MST reply actions   1 recs

this ^^ - rec'd

Kyle never had the faith of the fans or the coaches in Chicago. Can we please give him a chance here? For crying out loud, he just won offensive AFC player of the week a couple weeks ago for his fantastic play against the Pats. Every QB has some bad games – especially when the rest of your O is having a bad game, too.

"Take what you can. Give nothing back!"

by Colorado_Kitten on Nov 11, 2009 10:31 AM MST up reply actions  

I agree. If people felt like this all along they should have said so

But because he throws 3 picks once this year in a game we were manhandled at the line of scrimmage and couldn’t run for 2 yards, it is really really unfair to blame this game on Orton. Why isn’t any here asking to bench Champ Bailey, he got burned more than 3 times in that game? Hamilton got beat numerous times as did Weigmann, should we bench them too?

Why are we throwing the towel in on a guy that is 2 wins away from what we did last year with wonder boy (Jugs machine interception boy) ? If we only beat the Redskins, Chiefs twice and the Raiders, we will be 10-6. We would all have signed off on that and felt we showed the world.

We have a darn good chance of beating the Eagles, Giants and the Chargers again. If we do that we are vacationing in Mike Clark’s La-la land and regardless we will be in the playoffs.

Lets ask a simple question: Orton is playing because A: Mcdaniels thinks he is the best QB we have. or B: McDaniels is too stubborn to admit Woody Paige and the antsy others are right and Simms should start.

The answer is obvious to me. Woody knows little to nothing about football compared to McDaniels and honestly maybe we don’t either. We need to fix some things, thats all.

Lets watch as we do it.

I would hope you would support who we are. Not, who we are not. Coach Norman Dale "Hoosiers"

by dmitchell624 on Nov 11, 2009 6:38 PM MST up reply actions  

Mikey Vick? Please, child

Oh give me a break. The guy can’t even work his way up to the No. 2 QB in Philly and you’re whining for his arse?

Chris Simms is more up and down than the stock market, and when pressured is worse than Cuttles. A good No. 2 option for now. Also, he is fragile. How much did he play in preseason before he was shelved by an ankle?

Make those miracles happen - Jon Keyworth

by IgorBStrange on Nov 11, 2009 1:52 AM MST reply actions  

Actually I just threw that one on the poll as an afterthought

No I still think that Orton should be the starter but when he is struggling why not let Chris earn some of his 2 mil and throw a curveball at the defenses that just pin their ears back and practically blitz every down? Just a thought

"even a stopped clock is right twice a day" Yosemite Sam

by lovewatchinthegame on Nov 11, 2009 8:42 AM MST up reply actions  

why?

Honestly, lwtg, I think its because its about what kind of message you want to send. You put in Simms after your QB (who has helped lead you to a 6-1 record at that point) throws a couple picks against the defending SB champions -what is that saying to the team?
Ah heck, lets just get some reps in for our back-up. Forget this game. Its over.
or to Orton – one of the Captains:
Gee Orton, you’ve been great so far…thanks but its time we look at the backup because you and the entire offense are having a down day. You should be used to that kind of attitude – that was your MO in Chicago.

I mean, what about those last three games last year where Cutler was struggling and threw more INTs than TD and contributed to the team missing the playoffs? Nobody was speculating that maybe Ramsey earn his salary at any time during that stretch. Why does Orton?

"Take what you can. Give nothing back!"

by Colorado_Kitten on Nov 11, 2009 10:41 AM MST up reply actions  

I wrote this rediculously long reply to your post and it's gone???

Maybe I forgot to hit " post" anyway good points all… It all comes down to I just get a pit in my stomach every time he drops back to pass… He just seems so pedestrian week after week… I have slowly been moving over to the Orton camp but after this week I have put the move on hold… maybe this was a hiccup but what if it wasn’t… I will not be a Orton apologist as I was with Cutler… I do see now that we are a better team after the “trade” but is Orton the long term answer???? Well we’ll see at the end of the year, at any rate I will enjoy watching the game either way…thanks for your input!!!

"even a stopped clock is right twice a day" Yosemite Sam

by lovewatchinthegame on Nov 11, 2009 7:29 PM MST up reply actions  

You might want to ...

Change your game-time snacks (pit in your stomach) rather than the QB. I think one of the reasons Orton is looking pedestrian is because the last two games have not had a running game to take the pressure off. This is the NFL. When a defense (and Baltimore and Pittsburgh are not your normal NFL defenses) only has to focus on one aspect of your game they will look a whole lot better and you will look a whole lot worse. I think Orton has the potential to be more than a short term answer but not without help. I think Cutler is finding that out in Chicago as well.

by Hank44 on Nov 11, 2009 7:44 PM MST up reply actions  

I feel that too...

I keep waiting for that break-out game when he already had one in the N.E. game but then he goes and has these two last games and I am back to wondering…. kind of like with Griese… I was so excited to get him here in Denver and I was a Griese apologist forever but then he never really went anywhere then I was sooooo excited about Jake the snake but was on the fence when he was replaced by the Cutler dude and then I fell for him too and then was pissed when he was traded and now I am so glad he is gone so where does that leave me… head spinning and a little hesitant to buy into the next QB until he does what he says he’s gonna do…

"even a stopped clock is right twice a day" Yosemite Sam

by lovewatchinthegame on Nov 11, 2009 7:53 PM MST up reply actions  

Rest easy LWTG....

I am feeling for you. You are passionate my friend. I think that cerebrally KO has it in spades over Griese….hes a natural leader and one team mates follow.
Griese was a loner and always struggled in Denver.
I really like Griese…how could not you…..hes a good man and does a lot for the community, but KO is a lot tougher player than Brian!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.

by boydy2669 on Nov 11, 2009 8:03 PM MST up reply actions  

Spot ON!!!

If only Griese could have been a leader a likable guy in the locker room Like Brister or Jake… Why was he such a loner??? Anyway spilt milk… Let me tell you I SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO want Orton to do really well and I mean really well, and when he has a game like Monday night I feel so bad for him… I so want him to end up outplaying Cutty in every way but when he isn’t I start to flinch and get that buyers remorse thing Hank44 referred too… But I am better now… bring on the Skins..

"even a stopped clock is right twice a day" Yosemite Sam

by lovewatchinthegame on Nov 11, 2009 8:27 PM MST up reply actions  

Strategy.

We play 3 teams that we might have to face in the playoffs, why show your whole hand until you have to. Pittsburg, Baltimore and Indy. If we can scheme around these teams and then belt them when it really counts that’s what it’s all about. We don’t really know what’s going on under the surface of this team.

by bfree2bronc on Nov 11, 2009 8:38 AM MST reply actions  

I am totally in agreement with that one

especially when you have a 6-2 record and are in control of your own destiny!!!

"even a stopped clock is right twice a day" Yosemite Sam

by lovewatchinthegame on Nov 11, 2009 8:40 AM MST up reply actions  

Sheer Madness

Talking about replacing Orton? You must be mad. He has been OUTSTANDING when he has had protection, the running game is working, and his receivers get open.

by Endzone on Nov 11, 2009 9:53 AM MST reply actions  

Outstanding?

Let me start by saying Orton should remain the starter but we have some differing standards among fans here. Denver has the lowest scoring offense in the NFL of winning teams. As pointed out today in the Denver Post, Denver has not scored more than 20 against any team with a winning record this season. Even if you include the 2 special teams td’s and defensive td Denver is 22nd in scoring offense in the company of teams with far less offensive talent. Remove those td’s scored by special teams and D and Denver is in the company of the Lions and Chiefs. Currently Denver is on pace for their worst offensive output since Reeves was coach.
Deserving of remaining the starter? Yes. Outstanding? No.

by AKfan on Nov 11, 2009 12:05 PM MST up reply actions  

Yes

ORTON has been outstanding, the Oline, receiving corps and RB’s have not.

by Endzone on Nov 11, 2009 12:14 PM MST up reply actions  

OK

Sorry there is no factual basis for your claim. Outstanding based on what? He has not moved the team consistently, he has not put points on the board.
“He has been OUTSTANDING when he has had protection, the running game is working, and his receivers get open”. Wow, every single qb in the league is outstanding under those circumstance. Cody Hawkins would dominate under those circumstances.
There is a reason why 2 Bronco qb’s are under contract next year and Orton is not one of them at this time. He has yet shown the Bronco’s front office that he is capable of being the man. Hopefully by the end of the year he has.

by AKfan on Nov 11, 2009 12:30 PM MST up reply actions  

Check the Stats

Before you make a stupid comment, check his stats. And no, not every QB is outstanding given the same conditions and yet that is precisely part of the argument. Review the game tapes and see how our Oline and receivers and RB’s have done in the redzone. I am not going to take the time necessary to show you the stats because I expect you to do your own research. Just me telling you won’t change your mind.

Your argument that 2 QB’s are under contract and therefore Orton is not good is one of the most ridiculous I have ever heard. Doom, Marshall, etc., etc. are not under contract either.

So-called “fans” like you irritate me to no end. Your knee-jerk blame the QB lazy thinking Woody Paige’isms are understandable emotional responses that do not hold up in the light of facts and reason. Put the blame where it really belongs!

by Endzone on Nov 11, 2009 12:52 PM MST up reply actions  

Stats

I listed them above, you failed to retort. You have not mentioned one single stat. You responded with emotion, no facts, no stats, nothing to back up your statement that Orton is “outstanding”. Your stat-less, fact-less, retort is making a compelling case against Orton. I give him far more credit than you do. I think Orton is capable of making plays in a a typical situation and not just when the the running game is dominating, the receivers are running free and he has enough time to read a book.
I am now a ‘so-called’ fan because I am pointing out stats that show this offense as being below average? Stay classy endzone, attack your fellow fans that are discussing the team they like, rather than making an intelligent argument.

by AKfan on Nov 11, 2009 1:06 PM MST up reply actions  

Team Stats do not equal QB stats

Why should I “retort” when you are using team stats? You might as well be using Palomalu stats to compare with Knowshon Moreno. Or saying that because Doom isn’t under contract that he is a bad OLB.

You are being lazy and I don’t have the time or patience to educate you. There are a lot of good sites out there and many articles written here at MHR. Read them. Orton IS statistically outstanding this year. As I said above, it is the Oline, receiving corps and RB’s that have not been performing.

by Endzone on Nov 11, 2009 1:37 PM MST up reply actions  

Not surprised

You could not defend yourself. Not surprised you were not able to follow your own advise to use stats to make an argument. Not surprised you resort to personal attacks when someone tries to engage in a debate with you.
While you are breaking down your film and scouting the college ranks you might want to peruse a dictionary and familiarize yourself with the definition of outstanding. If Orton is outstanding I am curious what Manning, Brees, & Roethlisberger are? You may be the only human being in cyberspace that describes Orton as outstanding.

by AKfan on Nov 11, 2009 3:44 PM MST up reply actions  

Stats?

Here

Moreno/Buckhalter in '09

by Doc Bear on Nov 11, 2009 3:44 PM MST up reply actions  

Read that, several times and the only word that kept popping up:

Average.

You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say will be misquoted and then used against you.

by improv88 on Nov 11, 2009 8:15 PM MST up reply actions  

He points out the coldest, hardest facts there are, and this is your response?

22nd in scoring, worst among winning teams. And yet the QB is doing OUTSTANDING?! Fans like you piss me off to no end – completely intolerant of anyone who doesn’t fawn over everything follow rookie head coaches like sheep. The blame either all belongs on Orton, or none of the credit does. You can’t have it both ways.

You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say will be misquoted and then used against you.

by improv88 on Nov 11, 2009 8:13 PM MST up reply actions  

improv the troll

“The blame either all belongs on Orton, or none of the credit does.”

Honestly. I cannot believe how stupid that statement is.

by Endzone on Nov 11, 2009 8:22 PM MST up reply actions  

And I cannot believe how narcessistic you are

It’s like arguing with my 6-year old niece. She doesn’t have the background or language skills to compose a convincing argument, so she resorts to childish lashings as thought they were concrete arguments. Hopefully I can avoid your posts and comments from here on. It’s tiresome. Being called a troll by someone who doesn’t even understand the definition.

You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say will be misquoted and then used against you.

by improv88 on Nov 11, 2009 8:36 PM MST up reply actions  

No better response than a spelling error. What a shock.

You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say will be misquoted and then used against you.

by improv88 on Nov 11, 2009 8:54 PM MST up reply actions  

Improv - ease down a little, OK?

You’ve started lashing out and everyone. You’ve always hated Orton – we get it. You still do – fine. He screws up your 20 years of charts – Ok. We get it. But if you claim that you read my article and that Orton’s average, you didn’t read it very well or you had already decided what to think before you read it.

Seriously – calm down. Folks can disagree

Moreno/Buckhalter in '09

by Doc Bear on Nov 12, 2009 11:07 AM MST up reply actions  

I am upset with Orton.

But he is only half way through his first season with a difficult Offense. I think he he needs more time to get complete confidence in the system. I hope Josh stays with him through the rest of the season and see how he developes.

Each week that brings us closer to the ultimate prize,

by Punkin Head on Nov 11, 2009 9:57 AM MST reply actions  

QB controversy? Ummmm, NO!

Orton has showed through the first 6 games of the year that he can perform in this system, so it’s not fair to want to change another QB already after two losses. Come on people, talk about jumping ship. I’ll wait for my thoughts on Orton after the season at least.

2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant

by weazel on Nov 11, 2009 10:22 AM MST reply actions  

My reaction

My reaction to this is we’re not the Cleveland Browns. We have a starting QB who is in the top 12 of QB’s right now. He’s 6-2. He’s thrown 4 INT over 8 games. Cutler has thrown 12. I don’t even think this is a topic for conversation. I mean, everybody has an opinion. But this is premature at best. Our backs ran for a total of 66yds. against Balt. and 27 against Pit. McDaniels said it best, we became one-dimensional in both instances. Our O-line needs to open gaps and our backs need to be hitting them relentlessly. We should be rushing for >100yds/game. When we achieve that, and we give Orton pass protection we’re brilliant. In addition, our defense needs to step it up. We’re letting too many big plays occur. Against Pit, Mendenhall had that huge run in the 3rd qtr. that lead to them going up. I venture to say that play probably took alot of momentum from our game.

I’m sticking with Orton all season long. The guy knows what he’s doing and has shown amazing grasp of the offense. He’ll be fine. We definitely don’t need to pull a Mangini and start thinking about putting in a different QB.

Romans 5:8

by BronconNC on Nov 11, 2009 11:37 AM MST reply actions   1 recs

I'm for sticking with what you know

too many teams play QB roulette and lose. Every QB will have a bad game, some more than others. When an individual is being threatened, they will not always step up and move past that threat, more often than not they succumb to it. Let’s not do that to Orton, at least not yet.

by bchiper on Nov 11, 2009 11:55 AM MST reply actions  

Orton has become a liability

For the record, I despise Jay Cutler. I don’t blame McDaniels for “running Cutler out of town” because it is well known that Jay threw a tantrum when his coaches were let go. I do not want Cutler back.

With that being said, Orton is not getting it done. He misses open receivers whenever he tries to throw more than 10 yards downfield. Worse, he has no ability to roll out or scramble. He cannot throw on the run at all. When he is forced out of the pocket he struggles to get the ball over the line of scrimmage.

If Orton is capable of hitting the seam route to Scheffler and the deep post or fly routes to Marshall then he better demonstrate that ability soon. Right now, defenses are bringing pressure and jumping all the short routes. We can’t run because the defense can stack the line knowing Orton won’t try to beat the safeties deep. Polamalu was playing within 10 yards of the line all night.

I think that McDaniels should have put Simms in late in the Baltimore game. Remember when McNabb got benched last year? Are you afraid that Simms might play better than Orton, and then we’d have the dreaded “quarterback controversy”? I’d rather have a controversy than stick with a QB that has no chance of winning against the best teams out there.

If we were 3-5 and trying to salvage some dignity for the season I’d say stick with Orton no matter what. But we were thinking AFC Championship three weeks ago. The games against the Steelers and Ravens have made it clear that Orton cannot compete against the best defenses in the league. If you want to go 10-6, make the playoffs and get beat 42-10 by the Colts in the first round yet again, then by all means let’s stick with Orton. Personally, I’d rather take a chance and see if Simms is more effective. He has the ability to scramble and throw on the run. These are two things that Orton just can’t do.

I know that McDaniels won’t try Simms because he doesn’t want to revive the whole discussion about The Trade. But if we are trying to win now, we should give Simms a shot.

All work and no play makes Homer something something.

by GrizBronc on Nov 11, 2009 12:12 PM MST reply actions  

I don't agree

Orton is not a liability. He’s a regular pro NFL quarterback. His 2009 completion % is 63.2. To put that in perspective, Peyton Manning has a 70.6%. Not to mention, PM has been in the league now for 10yrs. Orton’s strength is in the short passing game. You can’t fault him for that. He averages 1.8yds/rush if he has to run. He’s got one of the best lines in the NFL. He doesn’t have to rush. As I said earlier, Polamalu was all over the short passing game because we had no run attack. They knew we’d throw 3 of 4 downs. Anybody will tell you the game is won at the line of scrimmage. Our O-line did not control the line and we suffered for it.

Let’s look at Orton’s performance against three of the better teams in the NFL, Dallas, NE, and SD. Against Dallas, he completed 69% for 243yds. and 0 INTs. Against NE, he completed 72% of his passes for 330yds and 1 INTs. And against SD, he completed 69% of his passes for 229yds and again 0 INTs. These stats don’t lie. Against three playoff level teams, he played great. I’ll be the first to admit, he didn’t play that great against two smashmouth football teams. That’s football though.

Should we go into panic mode and start Simms or even better put in our rookie. No, you stick with the guy getting the job done. That’s Orton. We’re halfway through the season, still 100% in control of the AFC West, and totally in control of our destiny.

Romans 5:8

by BronconNC on Nov 11, 2009 1:10 PM MST up reply actions  

wow

I would hope you would support who we are. Not, who we are not. Coach Norman Dale "Hoosiers"

by dmitchell624 on Nov 11, 2009 6:41 PM MST up reply actions  

It's fun for folks to argue about

But since McD isn’t going to bench him, it isn’t of any real purpose.

Moreno/Buckhalter in '09

by Doc Bear on Nov 11, 2009 3:45 PM MST reply actions  

lol , hank, I have to rec this

"Wait, let me explain something to you...I'm the Dude. So, that's what you call me. You know, that, or 'His Dudeness,' or 'Duder,' or 'El Duderino,' if you're not into the whole brevity thing."

by TJ Johnson on Nov 11, 2009 3:51 PM MST up reply actions  

I made it five recs

Funny as heck

Moreno/Buckhalter in '09

by Doc Bear on Nov 11, 2009 8:06 PM MST up reply actions  

lol

If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.

by Troy Hufford on Nov 11, 2009 3:57 PM MST up reply actions  

excellent and very funny!!!

"even a stopped clock is right twice a day" Yosemite Sam

by lovewatchinthegame on Nov 11, 2009 6:11 PM MST up reply actions  

Very true

But I do love the new car smell ;-)

I would hope you would support who we are. Not, who we are not. Coach Norman Dale "Hoosiers"

by dmitchell624 on Nov 11, 2009 6:42 PM MST up reply actions  

It is funny how some people panic and jump ship quickly

I wonder what the reaction would be if our losses were spread out instead of after 6 straight wins? With that said we do need to get our offense rolling though and hopefully our running game can get some momentum going against the Skins.

2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant

by weazel on Nov 11, 2009 7:00 PM MST reply actions  

Thats a great thought weazel...

What if we had of lost to the Pats and beaten Baltimore…..what would the calls be then?
The Pats are better than Baltimore…or at least the same….very interesting thought my friend!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.

by boydy2669 on Nov 11, 2009 7:43 PM MST up reply actions  

And thanks to Cincinnatti

beating NE is actually better for our playoff positioning than beating Baltimore.

by Dwhite on Nov 11, 2009 9:19 PM MST up reply actions  

Good Point

One I had not thought of! Great analysis Dwhite!

by Endzone on Nov 11, 2009 9:21 PM MST up reply actions  

Yeah, I hope PIT wins that division.

2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant

by weazel on Nov 11, 2009 10:21 PM MST up reply actions  

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