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Jack Williams... My opinion

Write it down, I am not a sycophant! The Broncos made a move I am a little confused about. Signing Ty Law is not a bad move. Law will bring some added knowledge to the defensive secondary. The move I question is releasing Jack Williams. I have a few reasons for this...

Star-divide

No matter who the Veteran is, signing a veteran towards the end of his career and releasing a young talented player screams either "we're desperate" or "We are one player away" neither mantra is what I feel about the 2009 Denver Broncos. I am not saying Jack Williams is the next Tyrone Braxton, nor am I saying he is the next Deltha O'Neal. I think he is a player who has a lot of pure talent. He reminds me a lot of Darrent Williams. Raw around the edges but with coaching could be a great player.

On the other side of that coin is Jack may not be very coachable. there are many more knowledgeable than me who have said as much. I am guessing they are closer to the truth than I but time will be the telling factor there.

The otehr question is WHY Jack?

guys who are weekly inactives are in my opinion more of a candidate to be cut than a guy who is weekly on the active roster. Guy who dont make the starting 43 week in and out need to be looked at first. Brandon Lloyd, Brandon Gorin these guys are depth at deep positions and are consistently inactive.

I am just a guy who has a few smart remarks but I am genuinely confused by this and may need more time and fact to process this which is where YOU come in. below this....

Poll
Is it ok to let Jack Williams go? (nothing to do with Ty)
Yes
42 votes
No
103 votes
Undecided
73 votes
Coach did it therefore it must be
100 votes

318 votes | Poll has closed

This is a Fan-Created Comment on MileHighReport.com. The opinion here is not necessarily shared by the editorial staff of MHR

0 recs  |  Comment 45 comments

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I think JMFW lack of production on ST is the REAL reason for the waiving...

I love the pick up of Ty Law. Just his interview on www.denverbroncos.com makes me believe this…what a professional.
I think many are making a storm in a teacup out of this.
Really, how talented is he? We have 2 young corners on PS that are equally as talented. This was a no brainer in my mind!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.

by boydy2669 on Nov 7, 2009 4:29 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

ultimately Coach knows more than me!

Davis and Sharpe to the Hall!

"Teamwork divides the task and double the success."
- Unknown

by Jon Tollerud on Nov 7, 2009 4:34 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly JT...I can go with that mate!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.

by boydy2669 on Nov 7, 2009 4:46 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Jack's Best Interest maybe?

Consider…letting Jack go now allows him maybe to play for another team this year. If a player being “developed” is let go, that may not happen. To me, the bottom line is that we upgraded the position with 5-time pro-bowler, 3-SB ring Ty Law. For roughly the same money. For the same position. I think you may feel that Jack got the shaft. I do not.

Also consider..Jack was inconsistent and therefore a team liability, as demonstrated in more than one game since he was drafted. He was getting playing time while the weekly inactives are not. His inconsistency was therefore a much greater threat to the organization. He’s had a couple of years here to improve. IMO, I did not see him improve. Hard hitter, good instincts, but often missed the play. Maybe another team and another coach can help him.

It most assuredly does not scream either “we’re desperate” or “We are one player away” Instead it states we were not satisfied with his play (or maybe personality) yet wish him well in his career and giving him a fair chance to catch on with another team.

by Endzone on Nov 7, 2009 4:58 PM MST reply actions   1 recs

EZ love your style as normal. Great take on the situation!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.

by boydy2669 on Nov 7, 2009 5:13 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

possibly

I agree wholeheartedly with the majority of this and it might be my knee jerk reaction that gives me the quote feelings. I dunno time will tell though

Davis and Sharpe to the Hall!

"Teamwork divides the task and double the success."
- Unknown

by Jon Tollerud on Nov 7, 2009 5:16 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

You are talking up a player based on his play from his time

as a pro bowler and when he was on those SB teams. He is not the same player. People seem to look past his current skill set and look at his veteran leadership, pro bowls and SB rings. Last time i checked Pro Bowls don’t mean shit because it is a popularity contest.

by gnarlybroncodude on Nov 7, 2009 5:21 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed...

But he is playing NICKEL and no as a starter SO the experience he brings and mentoring he brings SUPER SEEDS anything Jack brings. Did you really see Jack as a starter with the Broncos in the future? He is a nice player and kid, but for our team NOW I take Ty Law over him. Just my opinion. I think had you have asked many Ty Law vs Jack ….one of the other…would have made it easier.
Thanks Gnarly!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.

by boydy2669 on Nov 7, 2009 5:34 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

except I would have taken Jack

I can’t quite explain it but he has something.

Davis and Sharpe to the Hall!

"Teamwork divides the task and double the success."
- Unknown

by Jon Tollerud on Nov 7, 2009 5:50 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Totally cool man...lets hope they both do well!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.

by boydy2669 on Nov 7, 2009 6:04 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

flagged

for foul language.

by Endzone on Nov 7, 2009 6:46 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Who did you flag?

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.

by boydy2669 on Nov 7, 2009 6:52 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

gnarly

“don’t mean…

by Endzone on Nov 7, 2009 6:53 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

me too

"I only know as much about myself as my mind can work out under its current conditions. And its current conditions are not good." -- Zaphod Beeblebrox

by Sharpe as a Tack on Nov 7, 2009 8:26 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

What cave?

gnarly. What cave do you live in where that word is not foul language?

by Endzone on Nov 8, 2009 10:02 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I do not consider it foul language

Just because you think it is does not mean everyone else does. You are so full of yourself. I really could give a damn if you flag me for something so small.

by gnarlybroncodude on Nov 8, 2009 1:10 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

While you might not consider it foul, you have to be aware that a very large majority of people would, right?

Owning the Patriots since September 9, 1960

by Darin H on Nov 8, 2009 3:10 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Are you purposely acting like you don't know which words are foul?

Personally I don’t care about swearing. My wife swears. I tolerate my teenage sons swearing on occasion if they do it sparingly and not around people who will be offended. I wouldn’t care myself if the site had a large amount of cussing it. This is however a family site and has certain rules. To not know when you are swearing is odd. And to cuss again (more mildly) when responding is also odd. Foul language is a complete social construct so it is what it is other people care about not what one person cares about. Kind of like nudists aren’t exempt from indecent exposure laws.

by Dwhite on Nov 8, 2009 3:50 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Doesn't matter what you think

What matters are the Rules of Conduct here, those that you agreed to when you created an account.

Unlike many, many other sites, that kind of language isn’t allowed here. Period, end of story. Yes, that word is considered “foul language” here, and thus is out of bounds. If you don’t like that, go elsewhere.

It’s as simple as that. Follow the rules, or go elsewhere.

by AllBroncsallday on Nov 9, 2009 9:14 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

Ty Law's a GREAT "Nickel CB" addition ....?

Yes! Because McDaniel’s has more football intellect and acumen than all of us here in MHR. It’s not b/c JW was a bad guy, or a lockeroom cancer…it’s because McDaniels simply concluded that he needed 1 mentor and 1 student at the nickel. to serve this team’s needs both now and in the future. JMFW was neither the best student, and surely not a mentor. Some should wonder how other teams forgot about Ty…. Bet they remember NOW. I wish JMFW all the best, and hope he gets picked up soon and assumes the same role on another team that Alphonzo Smith now has for us…. Goodluck JMFW!

"Attitude reflects Leadership" Hogblog...aka KSM

by Hogblog on Nov 7, 2009 5:50 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Maybe a little of everything you said?

I will respectfully disagree with your notion that you cut loose an “inactive” guy to bring in someone who will play a significant role. That would be counter-productive, in my opinion. If you cut one of those guys loose, then you’re going to have to make someone else inactive. It wouldn’t do anything except make one guy (Williams, in this case) upset.

Jack Williams was not going to be happy whether he was released or relegated to simple “Dime” or ST duty. I’d rather have the unhappy guy away from the facility than on the inside.

"I intend to kick your ass today." - Denver Broncos legend Tom Jackson

by wtnelson on Nov 7, 2009 6:37 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Also...

By waiving him, it all but assures that he’s not going to come back and hurt you this year. Some team at the top of the waiver order will pick him up with “the future” in mind. If you cut loose a perpetually inactive player, that wouldn’t happen. He’d likely clear waivers and be free to sign anywhere, meaning that he would have a much, much greater chance of coming back to hurt your team by signing on as a bit player for another team (Dominik Hixon, anyone?).

"I intend to kick your ass today." - Denver Broncos legend Tom Jackson

by wtnelson on Nov 7, 2009 6:39 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

One thing I have learned

this year is that I don’t know anything. I don’t know what goes on in the locker room. I don’t know what is in the coaches head and I cerntainly don’t know how to assess talent.

The only thing I know is Jack Williams is no longer on the team therefore I no longer support Jack Williams.

Ty Law is on the team I will root for Ty Law until he is not on the team.

Nuff said.

by papasteven on Nov 7, 2009 6:42 PM MST reply actions   2 recs

Well Jon, I too am confused

Time will tell if this was a good move, it concerens me mainly because of depth at CB, I have nothing against signing Law, I hope he perfroms and does well, but I worry about the ability of our +30 secondary staying healthy through the course of the season and not having someone ready to step in. I would feel much better with Williams and Smith on the bench getting mentoring from the likes of Bailey, Law, and Goodman, and hopefully they would be ready to step up if one of them goes down. I just question why not get rid of a guy like Lloyd who really isn’t as critical and would likely be available if there was a rash of injuries at the WR position.

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum
"Duffman is thrusting in the direction of the problem" - Duffman
"Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun" - Ash from Army of Darkness
"H.I., you're young and you got your health, what you want with a job?" - Evelle from Raising Arizona
"It happens sometimes. People just explode. Natural causes." - Agent Rogersz from Repoman

by Broncoman on Nov 7, 2009 6:59 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

McDaniels has his reasons

Until the end of his coaching in Denver I never really second guessed Shanahan since I was proven wrong several times. This applies to McDaniels too, even though it is only 7 games in. His decisions have panned out so far, so I am going to go with him on this.

Ty Law and Champ Bailey…..YEAH! This will make teams throw to one of the Pro Bowlers.

2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant

by weazel on Nov 7, 2009 10:12 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

I think

the fact that the Williams was released shows why this roster move was made. If we were bolstering our CB depth, perhaps we would have released one of the weekly inactives (although you can’t release Gorin now that Harris is injured IMO). However, this move is simple: McD felt that he can improve the CB position. Williams wasn’t cutting it, there was someone available who he feels will cut it.

I’m really not at all upset by this move, so long as Law can play. I’m fairly certain that this move wouldn’t have been made if Law doesn’t have SOME of his mad skillz left, we shall see I suppose.

by poorboywilly on Nov 7, 2009 11:31 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

Legwold's take before the Williams waiver

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_13730277

Several personnel directors around the league contacted Friday believe Law can still be an effective spot player in a team’s specialty packages, such as the nickel (five defensive backs) or dime (six defensive backs) scheme. His arrival probably means reduced roles for cornerbacks Alphonso Smith, a rookie, and Jack Williams.

Two of the last three opposing quarterbacks – New England’s Tom Brady and Baltimore’s Joe Flacco – zeroed in on the Broncos’ third cornerback in some passing situations and found plenty of success. Patriots’ receivers who predominantly lined up against the Broncos’ third cornerback caught 11 passes for just over 100 yards combined in the Oct. 11 game. That total included four catches for 46 yards for Wes Welker against the Broncos nickel package.

And this past Sunday, Flacco was 12-of-15 passing against the Broncos nickel package and four of those completions went for at least 17 yards. Ravens’ wide receiver Kelley Washington had third-down catches of 18 and 21 yards late in the third quarter – both with Williams giving chase – on a scoring drive that turned a 16-7 Ravens lead to a 23-7 bulge as the fourth quarter opened.

It seems that teams have found a weakness to exploit. And it also seems that McDaniels and staff have noted that fact.

There have been questions regarding Alphonso Smith’s progress, too, but it’s also a little too early to make a determination there.

IMO, we’re going to be continuing to look for ‘the future’ at CB until we’re certain we have the answer. And I haven’t given up on the ‘phonz’ yet, I think it’s a question of whether he eventually becomes an important contributor rather than where he is now. The 2010 draft has a number of interesting CBs who are possible picks, and many of them also are KRs. We’re still in the process of rebuilding, it’s not a finished project.

Here’s some CBs (among many) that I’ve been pondering.

Ras-I Dowling
Perrish Cox

And also, from my other post:

Donovan Warren

They’re all big, which doesn’t fit McDaniels’ preference, but I have a hunch.

no goats, no glory.

by Colinski on Nov 7, 2009 11:42 PM MST reply actions   2 recs

The Phonz

Like you, I am not ready to give up on him. In fact, the only question I have is why anyone is even thinking about giving up on him. Did anyone seriously think he would take Champ’s place this year? Maybe take Andre Goodman’s spot, but even that is a huge stretch for any first year player. I give him an above-average passing grade thus far given his early season ankle injury.

Super-star players often start their rookie seasons. If anything, I think it fair to say that the Phonz is not a super-star.

by Endzone on Nov 8, 2009 7:47 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm going to withhold all judgment

until I see him play a game. I’d suggest you all do the same. Maybe Ty Law has the same attitude Dawkins does? Maybe he wants to show a few teams why they should have picked him up sooner. Maybe that fiery attitude is what helps teams win games. Maybe Jack MF Williams just wasn’t in the plans long term. Either way, I’m not going make any judgment in any direction until I see Law play at least a game.

John Clayton is the head Dean at Fail University (known as F.U. in short)

Formerly known as Calijoefornia

by Joe Medina on Nov 7, 2009 11:43 PM MST reply actions   0 recs

ummmm...i voted for jedi

he has done a totally awesome job….winning 6 games already…and he knows his team…and he has THE plan…and…im not like you guys at all…i got no clue about football…so im just gonna trust him…done ok so far :)

MHR...and proud of it!

by MHRsGirl on Nov 7, 2009 11:47 PM MST reply actions   1 recs

We should all accept that McD has great personnel insight

that doesn’t make this decision right though. I’m a little skeptical, but have faith galore, so I’ll just wait and see. I guess I’m more concerned about KC picking up JMFW and playing him twice with a chip on his shoulder. That isn’t a good thing considering his talent has proven close to respectable.

The recent Belichick interview with Cole on Yahoo! is great for insight into judging personnel in the NFL. This quote from Belichick:

“So where they are now and where they are going to be, as they grow into it and the coaches figure out who they are, sometimes the only way you find out is to actually let them do it……but you never really know until you get them in there. Yeah, this guy can read this and he can do that, he can handle this type of situation and play. Then you get them out there and you find out that he may not do that, but he’s pretty good at this other stuff and you do more of that.”

It just confirms that in most cases, you never really know. McD clearly evaluates talent on a weekly basis and shows no fear of pulling the trigger. His comment during the Cutler saga was something along the lines of….this is what coaches get paid to do.

This makes me confident about our PS players. I feel like we must have guys that are demonstrating comparable talent to the point where McD thinks, “if we give them a chance, they could put it together in a game or two”. I think if you think that, Law is less of a gamble and more potential.

by BideshiBronco on Nov 8, 2009 12:49 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

If KC picks him up, watch McD force them into nickel and dime situations and prove his point. Just saying =)

A truth can only be expressed and enveloped in words if it is one-sided. Everything that is thought and expressed in words is one-sided, only half the truth; it all lacks totality, completeness, unity.

by Todd Jewell on Nov 8, 2009 8:05 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I dont get the move at all. Why relase someone young who plays. Why not release someone older who doesnt (brandon Lloyd). At least Jack could help us after this year.

by StillHateTheGiants on Nov 8, 2009 9:55 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

I agree. Even if JWill never becomes more than a #3 CB, that is still a valid need for every team
  1. and #4 CBs don’t just fall like manna from the heavens (although it does look like we are getting Ty Law at a bargain rate). Due to the 30+ age of the CBs this pretty much mandates drafting another CB and limits our options during the next draft.

I am assuming that JWill is coachable and has more upside, if so it seems strange to squander a 4th round draft pick who is only in his second year. Oh well, I will trust that the staff made the right short term and long term decision and I wish Jack Williams good luck with the rest of his career and I thank him for his contributions to the Broncos.

I agree, Larsen shouldn’t get any bigger. I am getting tired of his bone crushing hits knocking the pixels off my TV, once they fall to the floor they are very hard to find.

by Arctic Bronco on Nov 8, 2009 2:18 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

I believe the assumption is the problem — if he was that promising and coachable, I don’t think our coach would let him go — every team needs a #3, true. We currently have bailey and goodman, along with alphonso. We also have two PS CB’s. We brought in a multi-ring veteran … I think that is what makes him even more expendable. We have future depth that the team likes enough that they have stayed on PS [and haven’t liked enough to remove them instead of getting the experienced Law].

A truth can only be expressed and enveloped in words if it is one-sided. Everything that is thought and expressed in words is one-sided, only half the truth; it all lacks totality, completeness, unity.

by Todd Jewell on Nov 9, 2009 10:14 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

agreed, assuming doesn't feed the bulldogs

The fact that he wasn’t ‘snatched up’ points to him being a less valuable property than we believed.

Winning the first six games shut down much of the criticism that would have been directed at McDaniels when a arguable roster decision was made. And there have been so few arguable decisions besides the obvious ones, i.e., Cutler & Leach, so we haven’t had much to argue about.

There are many fans who will criticize a team’s decisions, so it’s hardly unusual, and there are many who could revert to prior Cutlergate form if the team fortunes take a downturn, but this coaching staff his proven themselves far more knowledgeable than we fans. Being of a logical bent, my take on the Williams waiver is that the value of a nickel CB so high that nobody in their right mind would waive a player who showed potential. Ergo — something was wrong (i.e., with his talent or ability). Many people ASSUME that Williams was valuable and drew conclusions based on on the dis-logic that cutting a valuable project is dumb and therefore so is the coaching staff. I have ‘logical problems’ with this line of thinking.

no goats, no glory.

by Colinski on Nov 9, 2009 4:21 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

JT Good Post to get the discussion going

I will reserve judgement until I see how Law looks in Nickel coverage and go back and look at Williams, who I featured one week in my spotlight, but did not look that bad to me.

"Wait, let me explain something to you...I'm the Dude. So, that's what you call me. You know, that, or 'His Dudeness,' or 'Duder,' or 'El Duderino,' if you're not into the whole brevity thing."

by TJ Johnson on Nov 8, 2009 10:45 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

thats what it is for

Davis and Sharpe to the Hall!

"Teamwork divides the task and double the success."
- Unknown

by Jon Tollerud on Nov 9, 2009 9:42 AM MST up reply actions   0 recs

if they determined that Jack will never be better than a nickel corner and teams keep putting either big TE’s or 6’3 WR’s in the slot on him, he is a liability.

A truth can only be expressed and enveloped in words if it is one-sided. Everything that is thought and expressed in words is one-sided, only half the truth; it all lacks totality, completeness, unity.

by Todd Jewell on Nov 9, 2009 7:59 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

I'll trust the 6-1 coach

Me, I think McD’s proven he knows what he’s doing. Hopefully Law can help the team more than Williams.

by AllBroncsallday on Nov 9, 2009 9:24 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

Interesting that no one claimed him off waivers

He’s got a 4th round contract so it’s not that big. Last I checked (earlier this morning) he was still unsigned.

He felt like the man that drew the first circle. Simple, and perfect.

From The Big Law, by Chuck Logan

by bradley on Nov 9, 2009 11:53 AM MST reply actions   0 recs

a sure sign that

…teams don’t consider him a value under his current contract. He may re-emerge given the need at the position, as the visiting Colt fans here indicated, but nobody ignores talent unless there’s a problem with that talent, i.e., it isn’t talent. I don’t think Williams is un-talented but there are some problems with his play that others noted before his waiver.

no goats, no glory.

by Colinski on Nov 9, 2009 3:07 PM MST up reply actions   0 recs

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