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Peyton Hillis: The Hammer in 2009?

There has been a lot of buzz on MHR recently about the RB situation and particularly regarding a central question going into next year: Who will be our RBs? Should we use a high draft pick on the famed ‘Home Run Hitter' running back, or is a different approach a better option? It's a great discussion, and there is a lot to be said on all sides.

The Broncos nearly didn't have the pick that brought Hillis to them. They received it from Tampa Bay in the Jake Plummer trade. While Plummer is happy sticking to handball, the 7th round pick they sent us has produced an exciting and solid performer. Hillis has raised the bar for our RB group. He's going to be hard to stop and hard to top.

There's no doubt in my mind that Hillis should be our primary back going into the 2009 season. I have several reasons - body type, injury history, power, versatility and skills. Most members would agree that our back has to fit the system. I want to quantify what the system is likely to be and exactly how Hillis does or doesn't fit in to what we might expect. I'd also like to address the issue of how we might get the maximum production from him and from the position in general.

Star-divide

Body type: Coming from the healthcare perspective, I tend to start my analysis of the player by looking at his body type. Hillis is a 6'2", 250 lb. running back. He is in excellent shape with no obvious faults. He is timed at 2.69 in the 40, but several scouting reports have mentioned that this metric is misleading. He often ‘plays' faster than that metric, being more quick than fast and doing surprisingly well in the open field. His physiology permits him to have a bruising, punishing style and it usually takes more than one tackler to bring him down. When he falls, he usually falls forward.

Hillis put on 8 lbs. of muscle between the combine and opening day. He is a tiger in the weight room and places a high emphasis on personal conditioning, as his love of pulling his pickup truck to train while in high school demonstrates. It's also good to note that the muscles trained in that endeavor are those that will get you short yardage and break tackles, so his production should be no surprise.

Quarterback Jay Cutler said. "Peyton is a hard runner and he hits the holes hard. He breaks his share of tackles as well. It's going to be interesting to see what's going to happen..."

One aspect of the healthcare perspective is that I also look at the known psychology of the player - intelligence, work ethic and attitude. Hillis is known to be as tireless in the film room as in the weight room. He has openly stated that he had learned well and gotten better at each level and intends to continue in that during his NFL career. We have already seen his willingness to do anything at any position he is given.

Hillis was benched early in the 2008 season. We later learned from Cutler that there was a perception that Hillis had a concentration problem at first and it was seen as lacking a ‘keep your head in the game' approach. Hillis returned from it and was productive, effective and showed great promise. There was no public pouting nor any sign of anything but a willingness to mature and do better.

Obviously, as styg recently pointed out, his take-no-prisoners style has a downside. Running backs are the only players who can expect to be on the receiving end of 10 - 25 high impact tackling experiences per game. They have a high rate of injury and a relatively short professional life expectancy as a result. Hillis has a tough, bruising style - he invites, even welcomes contact. How will that affect his production and outlook?

Injury history: Hillis has a relatively short injury history, but it is probably a good example of what we might expect, given his running style. He had a tackle break the transverse processes of his 1st, 2nd and 3rd lumbar vertebrae in 2004. That's an unusual injury, but strangely, it's less of a concern that you might think. He was expected to miss 6-8 weeks, but was back on the field after sitting out only the Auburn game (10/16/04). The connective tissue in that area holds the processes (the little bones that stick out from the main body of the vertebra) in place. It was safe for him to return, but he had to play through the pain. He did, which tells us a little about what to expect in the future.

His only other listed injuries were a deep thigh bruise on the opening kickoff vs. Alabama (9/23/06) and did not return to the game. He sat out the team's final four games vs. Mississippi State (11/18), Louisiana State (11/24), Florida (12/02) and the Capital One Bowl vs. Wisconsin (1/01/07) with calcification to the bone in his right thigh. This was also a response to his high-knee driving style of running and his apparent pleasure at the competition of contact. His injury in 2008 was a freak situation and probably does not bear on his long term status.

We can probably expect Hillis to have a certain number of these types of injuries, but to miss relatively few games due to his apparent attitude and pain tolerance. He seems to have the same disdain of physical pain as he does of opposing safeties. This will get him hurt at times. However, most of us have seen the way that injuries haunt a player who shies from contact. That won't be a problem with Peyton.

 Power: This is one area we can agree on - Hillis is a powerful, bruising, punishing runner with the body type, weight and injury history to consistently deliver in both the short and medium yard gain situations. Although nfl.com dryly noted that he won't win any footraces, you don't want to catch him, either. Why does he seem so powerful? His physiology is one reason, but there is a lot more to it than that.

Hillis has good balance and body control, which leads to his excellent numbers for yards after initial contact. He has good first-step agility out of his stance and shows urgency getting to the line of scrimmage. His vision seems unusually good, and since he doesn't hesitate once he makes his decision, he is often hitting defenders before they are ready to tackle. This is a quick note from his scouting reports:

"Shows good body mechanics when building his acceleration through the hole...Has good plant-and-drive agility out of his breaks and while he is mostly a one-cut runner, he has the vision and instincts to adjust in his stride...Gets most of his initial yardage by running at a good pad level and pushing the pile with adequate power, as he can break arm tackles, especially when utilized in short-yardage carries...Has the body lean to gain additional yardage falling forward and shows good balance and determination to finish...When he drops his pads, he gets good movement and can move the chains...Uncoils and explodes on contact taking the ball up the middle and has a compact finishing style..."

That explosiveness is tough for defenders to set up for and hard to tackle. This also will bear on his injury status - he hits the defender before they hit him. Look for thigh issues from time to time. Walter Peyton adopted that unusual, high, straight legged stride with a trainer, a coach, and exercise physiologist and an orthopedic doctor to prevent knee injuries. Hillis uses a pickup and a hammering approach.

Versatility and skills: The right player for a system can improve both the system and the player's outcomes. Peyton is a multi-talented player, a fact that has led some, including Mike Shanahan, to consider him for an H-Back type of role. While I disagree, feeling that it wastes several of his strengths, I do understand. Hillis has the talent for several roles.

The first consideration is his soft and capable hands. It's more than that - He is a good route-runner, disciplined and effective. He knows when to come back to the QB if there is pocket pressure. He doesn't have the speed for the vertical routes, which would limit his role as an H back, but is excellent in the underneath game. He has shown that he knows how to slip a defender for a clean release into his routes and has both good hand-eye coordination and concentration for off-target throws. His injury was partly Cutler's fault for leaving him up too high, but he made that tough catch. It's been typical of his skill-set.

Rivals.com said: Hillis is the best athlete at this position this year with an interesting combination of size, speed, hands and intangibles.

I think that summed it up well. Even as a pure fullback, he was the second rated in the draft and some scouts had him going in the 2nd round. Scout.com had him as the 78th ranked player in the draft, and we got him at 227. If you consider all that he can do from the RB slot, he may end up being the steal of the draft.

Oddly, blocking isn't his best skill, and that may have also impacted why he was benched for a while. He needs work on his hand placement, which was at times inconsistent. One area that didn't need work was his enthusiasm, being quick to look for someone to block in the second level. He has been too quick to cut block over his career. He also has had a problem at times with getting into a ‘funk' after a bad play, but he seems to be overcoming it.

The System:  I'm not prescient, and I don't know what McD is going to do. I do know a little about the NE system. They like a receiving back to take the short pass. They don't tend to look for the home run, but use the run effectively and in good balance, although the pass has dominated their offensive thinking. Hillis fits well into what we've seen from NE in the past.

As far as the Broncos history, Turner and Dennison being retained obviously bodes well for continuity in the line scheme and concept of how our backs will run. Hillis did exceptionally well in his time at the position. I look for more of the same, but for McD to delight in what Peyton brings to the offensive table.

Some have suggested a 1st round RB pick to pair with Hillis. I think that it's important to point out that very few 1st round RBs make in through their rookie years successfully, in terms of injury. The position tends to be well-paid in that round, but is second only to the WR position in terms of poor outcome over a three year period. In other words - it's a major crap-shoot, and we should probably not use a 1st round pick on it until our other needs are met.

Production versus Risk: But how do we use him? My theory is that we should permit him 12 - 15 carries a game. More than that will increase his injury history and decrease his game-times, perhaps even shorten his career. He will probably need a ‘clean-out' type arthroscopic procedure on his knees around his 5th year. It's to be expected, and should lengthen, not shorten his career.

But in addition to his carries, he should get at least 2-4 receptions per game. He's a saber in the short yardage passing game. Since he gets a clean release from the defenders and runs good routes, I think that McD will connect him with Cutler on a regular, but not overly consistent basis. You won't know if he's running or receiving and that can lead to a defender's momentary hesitation that produces solid yardage for him or another player.

We should rotate him with Pittman for another 5-10 carries a game. Pittman doesn't seem to hold up to more than that, but he's also an effective punisher in the run game.

We have additional backs for the change of pace downs, and can obtain more in the mid to later rounds if need be. It's true that the injury histories on Young and perhaps Hall have to concern us while A.Aldrige is an unproven if interesting quantity. Any back additional we look for should be able to run good routes and catch well as well as juking well. Pope did well in his limitied role last season.

Conclusion: This group forms the platform for a powerful and consistent running attack with substantial additional yardage via the short passing game. Once that is considered, using an early pick on a low-probability player doesn't seem our best use of funds.

The argument for a Moreno is that he is a rare find, and I agree. I believe that San Diego will be taking one of the top backs - Moreno or Wells - in the 1st round unless LDT agrees to restructure his contract at a substantial loss to him. However - the fastest way to lose a matchup is to try to play to your opponent's game rather than making him play to yours. We should have excellent production at minimal additional cost from our RB position. While Moreno can be a game changer and that should never be overlooked, I don't see the total production from that position to be substantially different whichever back is in place.

The odds on any 1st year back - including Moreno - finishing the season uninjured is poor. We can look at McFadden, Jones, Steward and Mendenhall, to name a few, as backs who were supposed to tear up the league before the league tore them up. With the quality of our tight end production being high now, and our receivers being one piece away from an elite unit in terms of depth, Hillis is the best bang for the buck we could ask for. IMHO, it's quite a bang.

Poll
Should Hillis be our primary back in 2009?
Absolutely. He proved it in 2008
581 votes
I'm not sure. Maybe a running back by committee approach?
223 votes
No. He's not the home run hitter we need to be dominant
70 votes
Give me Moreno, dang it!
38 votes

912 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 105 comments  |  14 recs  | 

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Great post!

And I agree, I don’t think we should use a 1st round pick on a rb.

by stedtfeld on Feb 4, 2009 6:33 AM MST reply actions  

Awesome post Bear!

But I am biased (see sig). Hillis has everything you could possibly want in a running back, except for top flight speed. But, as you said, he plays faster than his 40 time (which is still great when you consider he is 6’2" 250). Personally, I think speed is an overrated attribute for a running back. Does he need to be fast? Sure, but not necessarily the fastest guy on the field. In fact, those running backs that are known for speed more than anything tend to get injured frequently also. See Reggie Bush and Darren McFadden.

Completely agree that Hillis should be the starter at RB, not H-back. His talents running the ball would be wasted.

Again, great post and thanks!

Thanks to Mike Shanahan, a great coach who will be dearly missed. But...
Let's all get on the Mac Daddy Express!
Hillis for starter next year. He wears special thigh pads so his solid brass balls don't give him repeated thigh contusions.

by 53guys on Feb 4, 2009 7:11 AM MST reply actions  

Great post, but you forgot to mention one name...Ryan Torain.

This guy has to be used sometime. He did really well in the Cleveland game until he was injured. This is what I say, use Hillis as a primary back. Then use Torain for a 3rd down RB. Finally use Pittman for a goaline RB. That is a tough combo…Torain, Pittman, and Hillis.

by broncoholic on Feb 4, 2009 7:11 AM MST reply actions  

Hillis is a much better receiver

He would have to be in on 3rd down rather than Torain.

I would say spell Hillis with Torain or Pittman (whoever shows the most in camp) every 3rd or 4th drive.

Thanks to Mike Shanahan, a great coach who will be dearly missed. But...
Let's all get on the Mac Daddy Express!
Hillis for starter next year. He wears special thigh pads so his solid brass balls don't give him repeated thigh contusions.

by 53guys on Feb 4, 2009 7:13 AM MST up reply actions  

I voted no

and I’m sticking to it.

I am Jack's unbridled optimism.

by A.J. Haefele on Feb 4, 2009 7:19 AM MST reply actions  

Awesome Bear...

Hillis, Torain and Alridge is who I would go with!
Rec’d!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Feb 4, 2009 7:51 AM MST reply actions  

It makes me nervous going with three guys that were all on the IR the pevious season.

Alridge showed a tendency to fumble in preseason play. Torain may never be healthy again (he hasn’t been for a significant period of time in a looooong time). Who knows if Hillis will be able to make a full recovery and be back to his former self.

Nevertheless, I’m all for Hillis being the premiere RB this season…the rest of them I’m not so sure about.

I am the eggman...they are the eggman...I am the Mermaid...Goo Goo Gajoob!!!

by PosterNutbag on Feb 4, 2009 11:34 AM MST up reply actions  

The surgery was routine

I can understand your feelings. If this was a knee that was having an extensive microfracture procedure I’d be worried. This is minor, believe it or not. He’s been pounding the weights in rehab, putting full pounds on it and having no issues. There isn’t a reason to believe that he would be anything but full strength and speed by OTAs – much sooner, most likely. By now they’d be considering playing him in a real season.

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 11:53 AM MST up reply actions  

By he, do you mean Hillis or Torain?

I admit my ignorance. I don’t know who had micro fracture surgery.

If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!

by Trinidad Jack on Feb 4, 2009 3:21 PM MST up reply actions  

Hillis

I don’t know anything about Torain’s surgery, other than his mention of doing fine on his blog. Hillis had a separation of the hamstring and, essentially, had it sewn back together. It’s a simple procedure, and he should be fine. I haven’t heard anything concrete about Torain’s situation.

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 3:59 PM MST up reply actions  

Thanks Bear.

Sometimes I can’t get to the sight and it’s so easy to fall behind.

If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!

by Trinidad Jack on Feb 4, 2009 4:15 PM MST up reply actions  

My thoughts on Hillis

1) That two of the assistents we kept were the OL coach (Dennison) and RB Coach (Turner) indicates to me we will keep the zone block and the one cut. A good coach doesn’t come in and change what’s been working. We also remain with the same OL players, and they are built for the zone. Good news for Hillis.

2) Even if Hillis isn’t the RB, he’s safe as our FB. His versatility is a selling point.

3) As our own doctor points out, Hillis passes the injury test.

4) I agree with Hillis as a starter, or at the very least as our short down back. He didn’t play many games, but the one where he tore up a team was against a great rush defense in inclement weather (where the run is expected) on the other team’s field (NYJs).

Great work Bear, and Rec’d!

"Greater is an army of sheep led by a lion, than an army of lions led by a sheep" Defoe

by Steve Nichols on Feb 4, 2009 8:43 AM MST reply actions  

I especially like #4

I keep wondering how he was holding on to the ball. He just shrugged alter and said that it didn’t affect him. Kind of like Jay throwing better in the rain. If the weather is lousy on the road, double your bets on the Broncos!

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 5, 2009 2:37 PM MST up reply actions  

Totally agree

Especially with the point about drafting a RB in the first round. I’ve tried to make the same points (but not nearly as well) in those threads that are calling for that.

I would dearly love to see Maualuga bring his intensity to the defence with the #12 pick. Most mock’s currently have him going to us at 12 and I sincerely hope that it plays out that way.

by CalgaryFan on Feb 4, 2009 8:59 AM MST reply actions  

I think Raji is overrated

It’s been discussed on this board many times that he did not do much in College, had a couple of good practices during the senior bowl week and was then invisible during the actual game. Plus, a lot of mocks have Green Bay taking him at 9 (or where ever they are picking)

by CalgaryFan on Feb 4, 2009 10:35 AM MST up reply actions  

+1

Is there such a thing as a Playstation 3 Anonymous? I can't seem to stop thinking about or playing COD 4 and COD 5. I hear this is quite normal for a teenager, but I haven't been a teenager since Bill Clinton was frolicking with interns.

by Tim Lynch on Feb 4, 2009 10:36 AM MST up reply actions  

+2

Plus, character issues. Raji: just say no.

Average Bronco Fan's IQ: 120!
Average MHR Mod's IQ: 145!
John Madden's IQ: Fried Chicken!
Click here to beat these scores!!

by papigrande on Feb 4, 2009 10:39 AM MST up reply actions  

NT is the most pressing position for the Broncos to fill in the draft or free agency.

Who would rather have at NT?

I am the eggman...they are the eggman...I am the Mermaid...Goo Goo Gajoob!!!

by PosterNutbag on Feb 4, 2009 11:35 AM MST up reply actions  

Someone who isn't going to underachieve and cost us $11 million a year.

So, Terrance Taylor in the 4th round. He can rotate with Powell and Robertson and we will have a serviceable DT rotation. Then we can focus on DT next year.

Or Evander Hood, who will be there in the second round, though he would fit better as a 3-4 end.

Average Bronco Fan's IQ: 120!
Average MHR Mod's IQ: 145!
John Madden's IQ: Fried Chicken!
Click here to beat these scores!!

by papigrande on Feb 4, 2009 12:03 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

Hillis

Hillis appeared in just 6 games last year. He had a total of 68 carries and gained 343 yards, a 5.0 per carry average. He also had 14 receptions for 179 yards. Over 16 games, that projects to 914 yards on 176 carries, and 480 yards on 37 receptions. But I would expect even better results if he’s named the primary back and is allowed to work solely at that position.

Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. When the fear has gone past, I will turn to see fear’s path. Where the fear has gone, there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

Bene Gesserit saying. (From Dune, by Frank Herbert)

by bradley on Feb 4, 2009 9:39 AM MST reply actions  

Did he start all of those games?

I seem to recall that in his “first” game he was thrown in late when another RB went down… Maybe we should project based on 5 or 5.5 games…?

Win or lose, do it fairly. -- Knute Rockne

by broncosmontana on Feb 4, 2009 11:13 AM MST up reply actions  

Don't recall when he started

but in Week One at Oakland, he had 3 carries for 14 yards. Then in week 10 at Cleveland, 8 for 24. Week 11 at Atlanta, 10/44. Week 12 (Raiders) 17/74. Week 13 at Jets, 22/129. Week 14 (Chiefs) 8 for 58, then the injury.

Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. When the fear has gone past, I will turn to see fear’s path. Where the fear has gone, there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

Bene Gesserit saying. (From Dune, by Frank Herbert)

by bradley on Feb 4, 2009 11:51 AM MST up reply actions  

So throw out week 1 and half of weeks 10 and 14.

You get 65 carries for 329 yards in 4 full games. Over a full season, that projects to 260 carries for 1316 yards and a 5.06 average.

Average Bronco Fan's IQ: 120!
Average MHR Mod's IQ: 145!
John Madden's IQ: Fried Chicken!
Click here to beat these scores!!

by papigrande on Feb 4, 2009 12:07 PM MST up reply actions  

Fun Game.

This is like all those jokes after opening day in baseball when the Sport Center guys say that the dude that knocked three balls out of the park in that first game is projected to hit 486 HR in the season!

by ejruiz on Feb 4, 2009 1:57 PM MST up reply actions  

What's baseball?

Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. When the fear has gone past, I will turn to see fear’s path. Where the fear has gone, there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

Bene Gesserit saying. (From Dune, by Frank Herbert)

by bradley on Feb 4, 2009 2:00 PM MST up reply actions  

Thank You, Wikipedia!

Baseball is a bat-and-ball sport played between two teams of nine players each. The goal of baseball is to score runs by hitting a thrown ball with a bat and touching a series of four markers called bases arranged at the corners of a ninety-foot square, or diamond. Players on one team (the batting team) take turns hitting against the pitcher on the other team (the fielding team), which tries to stop them from scoring runs by getting hitters out in any of several ways. A player on the batting team can stop at any of the bases and hope to score on a teammate’s hit. The teams switch between batting and fielding whenever the fielding team gets three outs. One turn at bat for each team constitutes an inning; nine innings make up a professional game. The team with the most runs at the end of the game wins.

by ejruiz on Feb 4, 2009 2:15 PM MST up reply actions  

What's a bat?

Truly the light is sweet, and a pleasant thing it is for my eyes to behold the sun.

Ecclesiastes

by bradley on Feb 4, 2009 2:22 PM MST up reply actions  

A mouse with wings that eats 7,000 mosquitos a night.

It all starts in the trenches HT 11/11/08
Hillis=Cowbell. You can’t have too much. styg 01/29/09

by firstfan on Feb 4, 2009 2:25 PM MST up reply actions  

Once had one of them in the house.

It flew round and round the room, while my roommate and I swatted at it with a broom and some other object. Result was the bat made the same circle of the room, up at the north end, low to the fllor at the south. After about seven circuits, the cat jumped it on the south side. Cat was more flipped out than the rest of us, and I managed to get a can over the bat and escort it out.
Love what they do to mosquitos, but not in the house, please.

Truly the light is sweet, and a pleasant thing it is for my eyes to behold the sun.

Ecclesiastes

by bradley on Feb 4, 2009 2:30 PM MST up reply actions  

+1

Is there such a thing as a Playstation 3 Anonymous? I can't seem to stop thinking about or playing COD 4 and COD 5. I hear this is quite normal for a teenager, but I haven't been a teenager since Bill Clinton was frolicking with interns.

by Tim Lynch on Feb 4, 2009 3:33 PM MST up reply actions  

Sorry

Just being a dicchead. That’s a nice description of my second favorite game.

Truly the light is sweet, and a pleasant thing it is for my eyes to behold the sun.

Ecclesiastes

by bradley on Feb 4, 2009 2:26 PM MST up reply actions  

Love the game!

You gotta be smart and think fast to play it well.

If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!

by Trinidad Jack on Feb 4, 2009 3:26 PM MST up reply actions  

Hillis

I think Hillis should move back to FB. He is an amazing talent as a reciever out of the backfield. That adds a deminsion to the offense that is very hard to account for by opposing defenses. Hillis is a great check down option for cutler. I wouldnt mind seeing him get a good dose of short yardage carries also. He seemed to have a knack for getting a couple yards out of plays that seemed to be going nowhere.

by BroncoOhio on Feb 4, 2009 9:58 AM MST reply actions  

Agreed.

He’s a great FB as well. That’s where I’d like to see him. Don’t get me wrong though, I love him as a half back. If that’s our last resort, I’m fine with it. Let’s at least make sure once we find his position that we keep him there. No DJ Williams “move arounds” in the backfield please.

by phantom818 on Feb 4, 2009 10:21 AM MST up reply actions  

Well

I agree with your points, but I don’t see those as being a good reason to move him to fullback. It would limit his carries to short yardage situations and reduce the number of times he comes out of the backfield as a receiver.

Your point as to our needing a fullback is well taken, though. Perhaps Pinnock can step up, perhaps they will leave Larsen there. If Neither of those, there will be some available in the late rounds of the draft

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 10:45 AM MST up reply actions  

I've been offline a couple of days

so am just now joining in. Excellent piece, and I agree that Hillis shouldn’t be at fullback. For one thing, unless I’m mistaken he’s not as good a lead blocker as a pass blocker, which makes him more suited to running back. And as you say, fullback limits his carries. About limiting him to 15 carries per game, there’s another good reason for that which wasn’t mentioned. Notice how strongly Edgerrin James came on at the end of the season, how fresh his legs were, after sitting for awhile. I don’t advocate sitting Hillis, but if we keep his per-game carries down it might pay dividends at the end of the season.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Feb 5, 2009 12:30 PM MST up reply actions  

The edit function is currently on the fritz

However, I tried to add this before it was published

“I am open to Torain being the additional back that we require. However, he will have to show that he is capable of getting through at least most of a season without being lost to injury. That will require a high level of conditioning to overcome what seems to be a habitual problem with injury. If he is able to achieve that, it makes the use of an additional high draft pick even less reasonable. Since we do not know the outcome of his situation at this time, I would only note that we have the tools for a productive and effective corps just as we stand, although using a less vital draft pick on a quality candidate is always an option – we discovered last year, much to our dismay, they you can’t have too many quality backs, although the cost should certainly be considered.”

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 10:12 AM MST reply actions  

Torrain

If I am following your reasoning correctly, by using Torrain as a “spell” back for Hillis with no more than 5-10 plays per game, we could concieveably extend the careers of both players. Aldridge is not only fast, but quick as well. If he can eliminate fumbles and stay healthy he will be an excellent “change-of-pace” RB to be used late in 2nd quarter and in the fourth quarter, particularly at mile high.

It all starts in the trenches HT 11/11/08
Hillis=Cowbell. You can’t have too much. styg 01/29/09

by firstfan on Feb 4, 2009 2:32 PM MST up reply actions  

That's it, firstfan

Of course, if Torain shows that he can handle a greater load, that’s fine too. I’m not attached to Hillis being the only RB – quite the opposite. But the point remains – careers can be lengthened by setting limits on the amounts of wear and tear each game and each season. True for each back. Pittman can take some carries if he can stay off the IR, Aldrige can be a change of pace, nd even Young, whose health I begin to despair of, has nice hands out of the backfield and can carry part of the load when healthy.

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 2:42 PM MST up reply actions  

Lets not forget

TD was considered “slow”, thus his drop to the late rounds in the draft, and he did nothing but set records and win 2 SB for us.

Perhaps it was Peyton’s less than stellar blocking that prompted Shanny to put Larsen in at FB. With a full year of training and experience, Peyton should be better.

Consider what NE does with it’s offense; it often uses the short passing game as an extension of it’s running game. That being said, any Bronco RB/FB MUST have good hands to be effective and productive. I voted for a back-by-committee approach, at least to start out with, until someone steps up and dominates. Also, I think it’s good to make sure your backs have fresh legs for the post-season run.

Frack, frackin' fracker!

by BornOrange on Feb 4, 2009 10:22 AM MST reply actions  

I voted for a committee type of running back, but I think he should be on the field on every play.

He should be our RB in single back formations and our FB in two back sets. The dude is a football player, simple as that.

Is there such a thing as a Playstation 3 Anonymous? I can't seem to stop thinking about or playing COD 4 and COD 5. I hear this is quite normal for a teenager, but I haven't been a teenager since Bill Clinton was frolicking with interns.

by Tim Lynch on Feb 4, 2009 10:35 AM MST reply actions  

What I love about Hillis

is his tenacity. He seemed to have that infectious, scrappy, tough-guy, how-the-hell-did-he-manage-that-one presence that made Eddie Mac such a stud back in the day. IMHO, the “team play” seemed to pick up noticeably when he was in the game. Guys seemed to be energized by what he was doing and eager to back it up with plays of their own.

This is admittedly a bit of an intangible that one can only hope will sustain itself next year, but when you add that dynamic to his style and skill, it bodes good things for the Broncos having fun on the field.

Anyway, I’m not marking my calendar for a Superbowl or championship game just yet, but I sure am excited to see how the Broncos running game will mesh with the Pats-style passing attack.

Win or lose, do it fairly. -- Knute Rockne

by broncosmontana on Feb 4, 2009 10:44 AM MST reply actions  

Good points

On a team that needs that energy and presence, I’d like them to have it on every possible play. Intangibles matter. If your team flatout knows that it will pick up 4th and 1 (or third and 4), it is far more likely to do so.

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 10:47 AM MST up reply actions  

Make Hillis the feature back

We have a home run threat in our passing game with B-Marsh and Eddie. Force Teams to either try to stop the big passing play and leave themselves exposed to the up-the-middle, punishing running of Hillis. Or load up to stop Hillis and expose themselves to the passing game.

I think having a “home run” hitting back would actually be a bad thing. We need somebody who requires the defense to respect the down hill run by adding 8 in the box so we can open up the true strength of our offense in the pass.

by laser rocket arm on Feb 4, 2009 10:54 AM MST reply actions   1 recs

You're speakin' my language laser!

It all starts in the trenches HT 11/11/08
Hillis=Cowbell. You can’t have too much. styg 01/29/09

by firstfan on Feb 4, 2009 3:05 PM MST up reply actions  

+1 Great Post Doc,

Great Debate…
Rec’d

I see said the Blind man to the Deaf man who was near.
What is it you hear when I speak in your ear.

by UB3 on Feb 4, 2009 6:23 PM MST up reply actions  

Thanks, UB3

Yes, nothing like a good debate!

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 8:20 PM MST up reply actions  

Agreed.

And didn’t the broncos run out of a spread formation when Hillis was in last year? The formation didn’t allow the defense to clog up the middle, where Hillis did his damage.

If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!

by Trinidad Jack on Feb 4, 2009 3:32 PM MST up reply actions  

Quan Cosby.

Is it crazy that a probable late round pick has now captivated my attention? Seriously, I’m posting something about this guy some time soon because I like him that much. He’s my new Knowshon. Oh, and I still want Moerno in the first. Sorry.

by ejruiz on Feb 4, 2009 11:03 AM MST reply actions  

Varying opinions make the site better!

Sometimes there is a player who is worth breaking the rules. I don’t see it, but I respect those who do.

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 11:07 AM MST reply actions  

What Hillis Has

Being from Arkansas I was not surprised, in fact fully expected Hillis to contribute the way he did last year. He is a very talented, blue collar spark-plug that NFL teams dream about. With that said I see him as an ingredient, not an answer. His gift is bringing flexibility and deceptiveness to an offensive game plan – without him Mcfadden and Jones would never have had the college careers they had. I don’t see him as our primary back, though there will be times he will be asked to carry a game on his shoulders, but as a complimentary force opening the door for those around him to play at a higher level. And I think that fits in perfectly with the philosophy our new coach brings to the field. Flexibility, deceptiveness and power.

by cuprite on Feb 4, 2009 11:41 AM MST reply actions  

Hillis also makes Pittman expendable.

Is there such a thing as a Playstation 3 Anonymous? I can't seem to stop thinking about or playing COD 4 and COD 5. I hear this is quite normal for a teenager, but I haven't been a teenager since Bill Clinton was frolicking with interns.

by Tim Lynch on Feb 4, 2009 11:52 AM MST up reply actions  

Holy Crap!

A 250 LB running back who runs a 2.69 40? Everyone, prepare to witness the greatest running back of all time!

Sarcasm aside, good article.

by denver_sc on Feb 4, 2009 11:56 AM MST reply actions  

Game speed and vision are not tangible items that can be measured.

I agree though that Hillis must be paired with a more traditional runner.

Is there such a thing as a Playstation 3 Anonymous? I can't seem to stop thinking about or playing COD 4 and COD 5. I hear this is quite normal for a teenager, but I haven't been a teenager since Bill Clinton was frolicking with interns.

by Tim Lynch on Feb 4, 2009 12:11 PM MST up reply actions  

I wish...

…for a really healthy Ryan Torain to rotate with Hillis. and both of them in the backfield at times.

Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. When the fear has gone past, I will turn to see fear’s path. Where the fear has gone, there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

Bene Gesserit saying. (From Dune, by Frank Herbert)

by bradley on Feb 4, 2009 12:15 PM MST up reply actions  

I'm not sold on the Torain Train....

I want to see him go through 16 games without getting hurt. I just don’t believe he can do it…prove me wrong please!!

Is there such a thing as a Playstation 3 Anonymous? I can't seem to stop thinking about or playing COD 4 and COD 5. I hear this is quite normal for a teenager, but I haven't been a teenager since Bill Clinton was frolicking with interns.

by Tim Lynch on Feb 4, 2009 12:19 PM MST up reply actions  

Yep, pretty slow

Of course, it’s nearly the exact time the TD ran it in, but that’s not important….

Just kidding you, but the time part is probably accurate. If anyone has the exact time that TD ran in the combine, I’d love to have it on file. Polling several memories, it was between 4.6+ and 4.7 to the best recollection. And thanks – glad you enjoyed it.

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 12:42 PM MST up reply actions  

I'm not sold either

Just wishing.

Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. When the fear has gone past, I will turn to see fear’s path. Where the fear has gone, there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

Bene Gesserit saying. (From Dune, by Frank Herbert)

by bradley on Feb 4, 2009 12:34 PM MST reply actions  

Point to consider

When we talk about using a high draft pick for a RB, it’s always a toss-up. Is it your biggest need? If you do, and he’s injured, do you have a second option? Can you afford to take that pick away from another position? There’s a lot to consider.

I thought that this bit, from M Lombardi who is not always popular, showed a very interesting perspective:

The Cards averaged 2.8 yards per rush; the Steelers averaged 2.2 per rush. This proves that the passing game wins in the NFL, not the ability to run.

The Broncos saw how important the run also is. You need both, but those stats helped to put it in perspective. There was a 1st round pick RB on the Steelers – R. Mendenhall. . Like a lot of them, he was injured and on the bench. They had the depth and that fall back option, so it didn’t hurt them as badly. You might also consider how they could have played with another 1st round talent on the O line.

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 1:20 PM MST reply actions  

Really?

Lombardi should be embarassed by that “argument”. That stat shows that rushing offense did not win the Super Bowl and nothing more. The specific phrasing of my statement is significant. First, if the rushing game is not the defining statistic in victory, that does not mean that the passing game is so by default because it could just as easily have been the play of the defense or special teams that determined the outcome of the game. Second, the Super Bowl represents roughly 0.002% of the NFL season, therefore to apply any findings from that game to the entirety of pro football played is wrong.

by ejruiz on Feb 4, 2009 2:12 PM MST up reply actions  

Oops.

That’s 0.2%, I believe.

by ejruiz on Feb 4, 2009 2:12 PM MST up reply actions  

Hey...

You got linked up to the draft blog on draft daddy. Nice work.

by jaffe28 on Feb 4, 2009 1:33 PM MST reply actions  

Thanks jaffe28

I didn’t know that – it’s great. MHR is growing by the minute!

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 2:44 PM MST up reply actions  

Think Riggins

Hillis makes me think of a John Riggins. I can be happy with that.

by BroncoBilly on Feb 4, 2009 2:33 PM MST reply actions  

Riggins

Yes. I’ve thought of Hillis and Riggins at the same time also. But I think Hillis has more speed.

Truly the light is sweet, and a pleasant thing it is for my eyes to behold the sun.

Ecclesiastes

by bradley on Feb 4, 2009 2:34 PM MST up reply actions  

Riggins + = Hillis

I think they are similar, Hillis has more skills. We have to see if Hillis can match or exceed Riggins durability. However, Riggins did have several shortened seasons.

by BroncoBilly on Feb 4, 2009 2:39 PM MST up reply actions  

Great Post Bear, Thanks

It all starts in the trenches HT 11/11/08
Hillis=Cowbell. You can’t have too much. styg 01/29/09

by firstfan on Feb 4, 2009 3:08 PM MST reply actions  

Highly recommended and buzzed!

It all starts in the trenches HT 11/11/08
Hillis=Cowbell. You can’t have too much. styg 01/29/09

by firstfan on Feb 4, 2009 3:17 PM MST up reply actions  

can some explain the difference between H-Back and RB?

I see mention that we could use Hillis as an H-Back. Well what are the differences between the two?

by purplesocks on Feb 4, 2009 4:17 PM MST reply actions  

H back/RB

I’m not the one to do this, but: H back is basically a tight end who goes in motion a lot, and blocks for the RB, or maybe swings out into the flat or somewhere to catch a pass on a play action. While the RB lines up behind the QB and mostly takes handoffs on running plays.

Truly the light is sweet, and a pleasant thing it is for my eyes to behold the sun.

Ecclesiastes

by bradley on Feb 4, 2009 5:55 PM MST up reply actions  

I true beleved

payten hammer hillis went down and so to the play off was gone for bronco guy. he loosed was huge awful loose to broncop. he was great hope he runned with the powreful smash. explosion. I seen it guy. he have has more explosive than any body out there guy. all year. all day even,.I was happy to see he run over through player as run back. he hitted hole like powreful run smash. shanhan say he prove he is capability run back positional starter in leegue. shanhan say this.

I is fan of the Denver

by Horvil Tiki on Feb 4, 2009 5:42 PM MST reply actions  

some one

just tell the hammer hillis not to break leg when go after ball,. if the jay cutpser throw corny pass to high or some thing not to break leg after ball. He want to catched ball so bad he break leg guy, dont do this.

I is fan of the Denver

by Horvil Tiki on Feb 4, 2009 5:44 PM MST reply actions  

He will play for 2 quarters and pop his achille's on the first play in the third on opening day.

Oh…you mean right now?

Is there such a thing as a Playstation 3 Anonymous? I can't seem to stop thinking about or playing COD 4 and COD 5. I hear this is quite normal for a teenager, but I haven't been a teenager since Bill Clinton was frolicking with interns.

by Tim Lynch on Feb 4, 2009 5:56 PM MST up reply actions  

The ACL repairs vary

From what he has said in his own blog, it was a fairly routine ACL repair and it went well. He’s been sticking with his rehab program and is making what he describes as good progress. If he stays on track, he will be ready for OTAs and training camp. There’s no current reason for him to miss the start of the season.

An ACL repair will take time to smooth out at playing speed. Adhesions, a word that I use a lot with surgeries, form little bonds and sticking places. They will break; that’s normal, if uncomfortable. There may be swelling when he gets back on the field – that’s normal too.

Will he be able to go full speed? Probably, yes. The second season after the repair, he may not notice any issues at all. Next season, he will. They may not hold him back – they probably will not. But when you talk about full speed, the leg just has to go through a normal process to really feel great. Surgeries vary, though. Some really don’t notice it the 1st year, but they are in the minority. Generally, the scar tissue has to loosen, the adhesions get broken and the player to gain confidence in the surgically repaired leg. At that point, he’s fully back.

Just thinking as I type, it’s probalby best to have a second back such as Hillis do the heaviest lifting this next season. If the leg goes well for Torain, he will benefit from not overworking it during the 1st season post-surgery.

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 6:18 PM MST reply actions  

My concern with Torain...

…is that he’s had so many injuries the last couple years that he’s not been able to work out fully.

Truly the light is sweet, and a pleasant thing it is for my eyes to behold the sun.

Ecclesiastes

by bradley on Feb 4, 2009 7:11 PM MST up reply actions  

Doc...great thought provoking post

Thanks for the info…Rec’d!

"I am not trying to start anything I am just saying that i think if you take Knowshon and draft D later you guys will be hella good next year" ...IamtheGreatest - The smartest Chiefs fan I ever had the priviledge of reading!

by Steve O' on Feb 4, 2009 7:09 PM MST reply actions  

Great post, Bear!

I was thrilled when he replaced Torain in the Cleveland game. I love a RB who can break tackles. He does this and more. Rotating him with another big back is a great idea – keeps the physical punishment down.

by Blackknigh on Feb 4, 2009 8:14 PM MST reply actions  

Thanks folks

Lots to say on all sides

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 4, 2009 8:21 PM MST reply actions  

2.69 40!

That has to be some sort of record

by theflanman86 on Feb 4, 2009 9:51 PM MST reply actions  

great post, bear.

yes, hillis. power running, baby

taste my blintzkrieg!
2009-year of the defense.

by davecheffy on Feb 4, 2009 10:38 PM MST reply actions  

Holy awesome format, batman!!

I like the layout (and the content is, of course, excellent!) I think I may have to go witha similar layout when I do my guys…

The injury section may be a weakspot for me though, so to speak. I may have to stick with “dings” and “boo-boos”.

Concision in style, precision in thought, decision in life.

by Jeremy Bolander on Feb 4, 2009 11:07 PM MST reply actions  

Peyton Hillis ran a 4.55 40 yard dash at the combine which is official, not around 4.7 which what this writer said. 4.55 is pretty damn good for a power back, (Brandon Jacobs ran a 4.56). Especially for a guy his size, he shows so much agility at 250 pounds! just imagine if he lost like 10 pounds, he would still be a power back and would be even faster.

by dwid on Feb 6, 2009 9:04 PM MST reply actions  

nfl.com

I asked several good people, as I noted, and gave their estimate. After reading you comment, I looked it up = NFL.com lists his combine time @ 4.69. They could be wrong, but that’sd ther published stat. If you have a different source, I’d be glad to know it.

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 6, 2009 9:12 PM MST reply actions  

4.58 which is what his 2 times average out to be, i watched the combine and saw the times live
http://warroomreport.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=248&Itemid=1
Height: 6-1, Weight: 240, 40 Yard Dash: 4.58

the most official listings http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profile_display.cfm?Prospect_ID=1376
NFL Combine Results
40-Yard Dash 4.58
Bench press 26
Vertical jump 30

all combine results http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/2008/nfl_combine_results.cfm
Hillis, Peyton Arkansas 4.58
Torain, Ryan Arizona State 4.64

http://www.topherkris.com/2008/11/wonderlic-40-yard-dash-bench-press-squat-vertical-jump-a-collection-of-nfl-combine-ness-for-2008/
Peyton Hillis FB 4.56

http://www.mynfldraft.com/2008-Scouting-Combine-Results-Full-Backs/134/
peyton Hillis Arkansas
6’0 3/4
240
4.58

Peyton Hillis, Arkansas
Height: 6-0. Weight: 240.
Projected 40 Time: 4.78.
Combine 40: 4.58.
 so it was projected but he proved everyone wrong
on hillis
http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profile_display.cfm?Prospect_ID=1376
Hillis is more athletic than most fullbacks, as well as faster. He runs a 4.55 in the 40-yard dash. He has tremendous receiving skills and understands the game. Scouts love his motor. His combination of speed and size makes him valuable in a number of roles, with him having the potential to be a force on special teams.

http://cdsdraft.com/profile.php?id=638

 Peyton Hillis
Last Updated: April 17th, 2008
Managed By: Craig Strachan

School

Arkansas
Height

6 ’ 0.6 "
Weight 240 lbs.
Speed 4.58 ( Combine )

“Peyton Hillis could start at RB for many D1 teams and be a very successful featured back, but with Darren McFadden and Felix Jones sharing the backfield, Hillis is learning additional skills like blocking and returning kicks. And he can still run the ball and catch a pass with the best of them.”
“Peyton Hillis wasn’t able to grab the spotlight much the past couple years with McFadden and Jones getting all the press, but Hillis jumped to center stage at the end of the season in the win against LSU when he had 151 all-purpose yards and scored 4 TDs including a long 65 yard TD run where he showed off his speed.”

http://www.raiderfans.net/forum/draft-room/128956-arkansas-pro-day-results.html
RB Peyton Hillis (6-1, 237): Ran the 40 in 4.57 and 4.58, had a 35-inch vertical jump, 4.24 short shuttle, ran position drills and kept his numbers from the combine for everything else.

http://www.sportznutz.com/nfl/draft/2008/combine/running_backs.htm

Peyton Hillis Arkansas 6’0 3/4 240 4.58

http://www.listafterlist.com/tabid/57/listid/11682/Sports++Recreation/Fastest+40+Times+at+the+2008+NFL+Combine.aspx

138. Hillis, Peyton – 4.58

http://www.footballforum.com/nfl-draft/89561-handing-out-draft-grades-afc-teams.html

 FB Peyton Hillis is regarded by all draft analysts to be the very best fullback prospect this year. Hillis ran a 4.58 (Combine) at 6’1, 240lbs, also turning out 26 reps of 225lbs. He was a very significant part of the success of Arkansas’ all-star runningbacks, Darren McFadden and Felix Jones. So his blocking abilities have definitely been displayed for several years now. However, one of Hillis’ best attributes would have to be his outstanding hands as he has led the Razorbacks in receiving production at the end of two different seasons.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000d5d807755c4&template=with-video&confirm=true

RB Peyton Hillis (6-1, 237): Ran the 40 in 4.57 and 4.58, had a 35-inch vertical jump, 4.24 short shuttle, ran position drills and kept his numbers from the combine for everything else.

like i said I watched the combine live and it was timed at an average of 4.58, you can find the footage somewhere if youd like to verify it

by dwid on Feb 7, 2009 1:55 AM MST reply actions  

is that enough sources? or do i have to dig for footage of last years combine to show you?

by dwid on Feb 7, 2009 2:11 AM MST reply actions  

Glad to have the sources

We’ve had lots of discussions on this – the sources out there often don’t agree. Sure, pull up some footage – we’d enjoy it. Don’t get testy if someone posts an accurate point, though. The people I spoke to were right as far as the sites we checked.

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 7, 2009 8:56 AM MST reply actions  

In addition

NFLdraftscout.com lists him combine times as 4.54, 4.72 and and average of 4.64. I don’t know what the accurate time is – but can we agree that there are multiple number listed, and that he’s between 4.58 and 4.64? That’s a .06 second of difference, which isn’t that much. Sadly, some sites list off of each other and there are discrepancies.

He’s not listed as a burner in any of them. Since the earlier point was that he plays faster than his time, I appreciate both the list, and your comments, but I’ll stick to the point – despite his listed speed not being world class, he’s a monster of a power back.

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 7, 2009 9:08 AM MST reply actions  

By the way

This is Brondon Marshall’sd pre-draft analysis from SI.com. It lists his time in the 40 @ 4.57 and no one has complained about him being too slow recently.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/2006/draft/players/2846.html

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 7, 2009 11:28 AM MST reply actions  

well here is some expert analysis

“Hillis’s top end speed isn’t all that great, but he has a good burst, great vision, is very agile "for a bull of a man” and displays great power to always fall forward! He can beat the 1st level of the defense real well. And he has just enough speed to get those crucial medium range 15-30 yard runs often.

He ran a 4.58 at the NFL combine; with a 4.55 low time; but somehow in the last couple weeks NFLdraftscout changed his time to 4.64. I do not understand this at all (electronically edited?). If they did electronically edit his time; why did they only do his in the last few weeks and no one else’s?

Fantasyfootballtoolbox, Walterfootball, NFLdraftblitz.com etc. etc. all still have Hillis’s original time listed at 4.58.

I still believe the original time listed on all the sites I looked at including NFLdraftscout.com and that was 4.58.

But you have to remember Hillis weighs about 20-30 lbs. more than a typical tailback his height. I believe he could shave off 0.05-0.08 off his 40 time by losing weight and speed training; so he’s really a low 4.5 guy."
 
"It is rare to find a tailback that is good with 4.69 speed, but there are lots of guys in that low 4.6/ high 4.5 range and that is where Hillis is also.

As I had mentioned before the slowest guy in the NFL to get carries for as long as I can remember is FB Le’ron McClain from this past season for the Ravens. McClain only ran a 4.88 at the NFL combine. Surprisingly he actually played solid with such awful top end speed.

Elite top-end speed for tailbacks is indeed overrated. It’s nice to have it, but not essential at all when you have the other skills."

by dwid on Feb 7, 2009 3:48 PM MST reply actions  

Quite agree

Regardless of which site(s) we agree on, he’s slower than a lot of tailbacks. Does that really matter for Hillis? No. He is mostly a through the tackles player, but even on other runs he doesn’t so much make people miss as make them bounce off. If you get him clear to the safety, he’s likely to get very long yardage as few safeties (much less CBs) could stop him.

Personally, I love this type of player. I liked the above quote – his “size, speed hands and intangibles” is interesting to downright exciting. Welcome to the conversation!

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 7, 2009 11:13 PM MST reply actions  

I agree with everything except that he is slower than most backs, if you average out all the backs in the league it would come to around 4.54 to 4.58, so he has average 40 yard speed for a RB, but like i said, his initial burst is what is fast, which is most important. Hitting the hole fast is crucial, 10 to 20 yards is where the speed matters, home run threats are very rare, do you know the record for rushes 30+ yards in one season is? 7! the record set in 1958 by Hall of Famer Jim Brown of the Cleveland Browns. Since 1958 their hasnt been a RB to break more than 7 big yardage rushes. I think DeAngelo Williams got close to it with 6. Most backs dont break off as many as people think, maybe 2-4 a season, which i think Hillis is totally capable of doing.

by dwid on Feb 8, 2009 4:43 AM MST reply actions  

it is better to have speed on the intitial burst than speed that takes a few steps to build up to if you are a RB

by dwid on Feb 8, 2009 4:44 AM MST reply actions  

dwid, welcome man and thanks for all the great facts!!!

This has been a great post Doc, and thanks to everyone for their input.
I think the thing with Hillis, which was one of the great things with TD, and which you also see with Adrian Peterson is the ability to cut and move WITHOUT a loss of speed.
dwid hit it on the head when he said “…but like i said, his initial burst is what is fast, which is most important. Hitting the hole fast is crucial, 10 to 20 yards is where the speed matters….”. Hillis reaches top speed quickly, and when he cuts, maintains that speed.
I guess this is what they mean when they say he plays quicker than his times.
You cant really teach this, and it is an ability that Hillis has that many RB’s dont. They can hit holes, and they can accelerate if given room, but Peyton goes from nuetral to 6th gear fast, and maintains that speed and power even when cutting.
I want Hillis as our feature, with Torain and Alridge. I like the fact they ar 3 young guys, and beleive in my heart that Torain has had the last of his injuries….he has to be due, right?

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Feb 8, 2009 9:01 AM MST reply actions  

You're both right

But bradley, I believe, pointed out that his initial burst is particularly important because his vision is so good and his decision making so fast. He sees the hole forming, choses it and hits it with such speed. He has no hesitation, and with his fearlessness regarding contact I think that he’s proving to be a wonderful weapon.

I think that the entire discussion of long runs came up in great part due to the desire many have to see a ‘home run’ type runner. I’d agree, and dwid’s numbers bear it out, that those runs are too small in number to make much of a difference. Give me a guy who can get me 5 yards 50% of the time, as RiG’s numbers show us with the Hammer.

Hillis provides a new twist on the old adage that if all you have is a hammer, sooner or later everything looks like a nail. If you add his reception skills to his running, you have a heck of a weapon.

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 8, 2009 2:45 PM MST reply actions  

Great post Bear and 100% great description!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Feb 8, 2009 3:58 PM MST up reply actions  

Hillis' decisiveness

I think I mentioned that, too. In my mind it’s what sets him apart, and he’ll probably be even better this year. He hits the hole like a jackhammer and is surprisingly agile for a power back. I am surprised that there are so few 30+ runs, so we really give up very little in exchange for all the good things he brings to the table. And I suspect McDaniels will do a superior job of taking advantage of his receiving skills, which include not just his wonderfully soft hands. Remember that remarkable dance along the sideline to barely get that first down? That’s his agility. He’s gold.

"In the empty spaces - lacunae, vacuums, pauses, voids, black holes - new things begin. We are born anew from the unexplored space, the badlands, the outlaw territory." - Sam Keen

by spock on Feb 9, 2009 10:04 AM MST up reply actions  

Excellent comments Spock!

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.

by boydy2669 on Feb 9, 2009 8:59 PM MST up reply actions  

Thanks for your input spock

I always enjoy your insights

In Goodman We Trust

by Doc Bear on Feb 9, 2009 11:49 AM MST reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


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1st Round Mock-Don't Read It If You Don't Like Mocks
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Needs based FA and Draft by position
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It Might Be Time to go Poaching
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I Hate This!
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The Question Of Leadership!
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Vanity, Vanity! All, is Vanity!
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Only my opinion

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General Manager/Head Coach

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Asst. Head Coach

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