Rookie Signings?
I'm not too sure on protocal for rookie signings; do the Broncos need to sign players prior to Training Camp? I see other teams active in signing their rookie draft picks, I even see news of players already looking to avoid holdout, or in some cases, where holdouts are expected. I've heard nothing from the Broncos FO, nothing from player agents representing Bronco draftees...
Can someone please share any insight or news they may have pertaining to our '09 draft signings. I wanna know Knowshon is signed and sealed, Ayers and Smith, Quinn, McBath, Bruton etc.
Furthermore, what are the rules regarding UFA's heading into Training Camp? Mount Baker is lookin the part thus far, and numerous DL acquisitions came via UFA's.
Anyways, jus hungry for news, updates, football, wins and hardware.
Hala at me
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26 comments
Comments
Usually
The top 3-5 picks have to sign, in order to sort out the rest of the draftees. Especially for the signing bonuses and guaranteed money. Nowadays, the teams seem to figure the cost ratings on the previous years draft. Then they add a “cost of living” percentage,say 8-10% on top of what the player in last years spot received. That is typically the format they follow, then the negotiating commences.
I really wouldn’t worry too much about our picks. The Broncos are notorious for getting everyone signed going into camp, and you should also factor in the fact that McX drafted high character people, so there should be no problems.
I haven’t heard anything on our draftees signing, other than Shlueter.
I’m not understanding your question about the UFA’s. Could you elaborate?
"You give 100 percent in the first half of the game, and if that isn't enough, in the second half you give what's left." – Yogi Berra
"No, I'm from Iowa, I only work in outer space."
by KaptainKirk on Jul 18, 2009 9:32 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
thanks for the knowledge bro
with regards to the UFA’s(I should clarify, rookie UFA’s), I was wondering if the protocal was identical to that of the drafted rookies? were there procedural differences concerning their joining the team roster?
you already know.
by justwhytee on Jul 18, 2009 10:34 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Everybody needs to sign
in order to participate in camp. Undrafted free agents sign contracts when they join a team (no draft rights), so those guys are already done. Draft picks must sign contracts before they can participate in training camp (they usually sign a treatment waiver for OTAs that allow them to be covered under league medical plans, just to make sure they are covered if they get hurt during OTAs). That is my understanding of it anyway.
by 5280FT on Jul 19, 2009 10:34 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well
I think that they’re already signed to contracts(otherwise they would go somewhere else), so they should just show up. Is that helpful?
"You give 100 percent in the first half of the game, and if that isn't enough, in the second half you give what's left." – Yogi Berra
"No, I'm from Iowa, I only work in outer space."
by KaptainKirk on Jul 18, 2009 10:42 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, generally I wouldn't be too concerned . . . But . . .
With rumors of Mr. B being in brokesville (one of the reasons I believe we traded next year’s 1st rounder for a second this year for Phonso), and with us having 2 first rounders and THREE second rounders, I’m getting kind of concerned – especially give that all of our top 5 picks figure to be set to compete for starting jobs or at least significant roles. If we don’t get them all in camp, it could set them and our team back in developing the players.
I mean, I understand the process but we have 9 picks and have only signed one seventh rounder. Camp starts in 9 days . . . 1 pick a day if they start tomorrow. Even if you’re hopeful that we’ll get everyone in camp, which I am, McX needs to get crackin’.
by GJcontingent-rAd on Jul 18, 2009 10:53 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
The only financial issue the Broncos have....
is staying under the salary cap. I haven’t heard anything about Bowlen being broke, which I seriously doubt is the case. He might be feeling the pinch of the recession like a lot of people, but I seriously doubt that he’s broke. In any case, trading next year’s first rounder and this year’s picks not all being signed yet has absolutely nothing to do with that. We’re one of the best run, well managed and highly profitable teams in the NFL and Bowlen has never been a penny pincher or frugal when it comes to paying players; we’re almost always up near the ceiling of the salary cap. As was said in other comments here, this is pretty much standard fare for the Broncos and they will have everyone signed and in camp on time.
"Reality continues to ruin my life." - Calvin (Calvin & Hobbes)
by RockyMtnHigh on Jul 19, 2009 2:19 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fianances?
If Bowlen was financially strapped, he wouldn’t be paying Shanny 7 Mil for nothing. As I understand standard in these kind of contracts, Shanny would have to at least try to find a job to get the full 7 mil. but Bowlen being the outstanding Boss that he is allowed Shanny to take a years paid vacation, which will probably do Shanny well. Big difference between Pat and Al Huh.
"Sanity is the realization that everyone is insane to some degree." Me
by 3nS on Jul 19, 2009 1:47 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
agreed
It does seem that we’re cuttin it closer than most teams right now. Good point GJ bout the potential roles for our top 5 picks, does give their side more leverage in negotiations. It seems almost certain to be a busy week for the Broncos FO, which also means Bronco news other than BMarsh dispute
you already know.
by justwhytee on Jul 18, 2009 11:11 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't the Broncos usually wait till the last minute
"It's the first time that I've probably ever seen a 260 pound back run into a free safety and go flat on his back, I mean it was exciting." ~John Elway
by jibbons on Jul 19, 2009 12:47 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs
The Philosophy isn't Generally Financially Driven
If you sit down and do the work, you can pretty much figure the general parameters for every slot in the draft. The only time money hangs things up is when a guy feels like he transcends his draft position. For example, hypothetically, Knowshon could say that he was better than his 12 slot because nobody before Denver really needed a running back. Not saying he will, but thats what usually gums things up and causes holdouts. Conversely, Jacksonville basically tried to get Derrick Harvey to conceed that he was sort of a reach— they traded up in an unabashed ‘need-reach’ to get him— and apparently expected him to be a good sport about it and he held out. It rarely works for either side, but it causes holdouts.
More often, all the last second contracts are by team design. They don’t want their new, young-20’s prize fresh out of the restrictions of college running around with millions of dollars in their pocket without some measure of accountability. What if you give a Robert Ayers his coin in May, and he spends the summer in nightclubs brawling and getting fat? Its simply a mitigation tactic. Many of these kids aren’t ready for the responsibility and temptation of wealth, especially in an industry that requires them to be be in supreme physical and mental condition. By with withholding the big money until the last possible moment, teams feel like they give these kids the best chance to succeed in that pivotal first camp. This works out well for everybody, because usually the draftee can use his future contract as a way to secure line of of credit that will allow him to live comfortably until that contract is signed. He just can’t go bonkers.
There can be other elements that cause a hold out, but generally what is happening is purely by design and Pat Bowlen’s history is such that I don’t think Bronco fans need to lose any sleep about getting everybody in on time.
There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance-- that principle is contempt prior to investigation."
-- Herbert Spencer
by PredominantlyOrange on Jul 19, 2009 7:35 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good Answer PdO
"You give 100 percent in the first half of the game, and if that isn't enough, in the second half you give what's left." – Yogi Berra
"No, I'm from Iowa, I only work in outer space."
by KaptainKirk on Jul 19, 2009 7:45 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good Point
I never thought about the last second contracts being in the best interest of the rookie and team. You are absolutely right that these rookies don’t need so much coin in their pockets before training camp! Well done!
by Endzone on Jul 19, 2009 10:47 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
"Reality continues to ruin my life." - Calvin (Calvin & Hobbes)
by RockyMtnHigh on Jul 19, 2009 1:51 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not so sure about that
You posit that a reason to wait to sign these “about to be rich” kids is so they don’t go nuts, but I bet they all have a pretty hefty line of credit as soon as they are drafted.
The sage is full of anxiety and indecision in undertaking anything, and so he is always successful.
Chuang - Tzu
by bradley on Jul 20, 2009 1:34 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Denver has traditionally signed their draft picks from last to first
in that order. THis is tricky because the top draft picks are the biggest numbers. If you were doing the acconting at home you would want to start at the top and work down, so that hte big numbers had plenty of room.
The last to first methodology helps in that it gives the team more leverage at the end. Remember that the rookie salaries come out of a pool of signing money for rookies: there is a limit to what we can spend on rookies (details oare laid out (with much complexity) in the CBA.
I think Denver talks with all of the agents and players, and basically gets EVERY contract figured out, before sitting down for the nuts and bolts signings, where last minute changes over a day or two are worked out.
In other words, they take the extra time to make a detailed (and knowing Xanders it is probably hyper-detailed with contingencies) blueprint of the process, and then start from the bottom of the draft and work their way up. THis is why the signings happen so quickly at the end…its not because of a time crunch, but because the work has already been done, and they are just dotting the i’s and crossing the t’s.
There is likely a contextual overlay to this breakdown of the process, involving the fact that we are signing, essentially, 3 first rounders (even though ’Zo is a 2nd rounder, and his contract will be slotted accordingly, they will still design the contract to accomodate his expected contributions, in the neighborhood of a first rounder…no reason to have him outperforming his rookie contract in the last two years, as BM proves), the number of draft picks we are signing, the expectations of sticking points in one or more contracts, etc.
Just like the “measure twice cut once” mantra, caution in the rookie deals is good and the best tool at hand is time: take the time to run over the scenarios, for both the current cap, long term cap, and non- or no-cap situations. Go over it once. Go over it twice.
In short, they haven’t signed all the rookies yet because they are thinking about it.
And that is a good thing.
There is no army so powerful as an idea whose time has come.
by Jeremy Bolander on Jul 19, 2009 12:08 PM MDT reply actions 1 recs
reasons for 'late' signings
There’s a number of reasons; saving money (interest on signing bonus), reducing risk involved from handing over a large chunk of cash (I’ll relate this below), positioning (many teams are waiting, or not, for other signees to set the price (bracket), and a few others I can’t recall.
I’ve been asked many times, "When do contract negotiations start up for draft picks?" The answer is that a majority of teams will wait as long as possible to get things done. Why? A few common reasons: Hold on to your money longer and earn interest, keep your draft picks hungry and out of trouble by not lining their pockets with big summer cash, and see how the market shapes ups for certain rounds. Keep some cap salary powder dry for as long as you can.
You can read the rest.
There’s also some other articles on NFP about players who got into trouble after the sudden infusion of large amounts of cash. It’s a good way to make ‘friends’ of the wrong type. And this a very good reason that agents should become serve as business managers or at least provide that service to their clients and let the football players focus on football.
"If people define situations as real, they are real in their consequences". W. I. Thomas
by Colinski on Jul 19, 2009 1:34 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
A complete segue
Reading about things from the agent’s perspective is a good way to learn more about the business of football. I was hunting for the story about the ‘poor’ player (both literally and figuratively) who blew his bonus and eventually his future in football, but I thought I’d post this instead:
[LINK IN POST DIRECTLY ABOVE]
he media: When I got into the business of writing for the National Football Post, it awakened me to how many media outlets compete for information and eyeballs about football — which brings us to the many mock drafts that are floating around on the Internet. A good number of players will spend a lot of time checking these mocks and position rankings. Eventually, they may start to believe everything they’re reading from many unqualified "draftologists." In taking a good look at the mocks I see out there, I would encourage players not to take anything they read too seriously. It gets pretty difficult to predict the draft after the first 20 picks. I feel more comfortable about our own mock draft because it was put together by people who have actually been there; we were at the all-star games, Combine and pro days. Film was watched on every player. As a matter of fact, I know of several teams that are using our mock draft to gauge what other teams may do. However, no mock draft has all the information that area scouts can gather such as hidden injuries, social habits, practice habits and locker room profiles. I do know that our guys dig for this info, but players should not rely on mock drafts to predict their future employers and pay scale.
AMEN. I have a longstanding interest in recruiting and the draft and I find it astonishing how many people now consider themselves experts and dish out criticism and praise without ever pausing to question their own certainty.
"If people define situations as real, they are real in their consequences". W. I. Thomas
by Colinski on Jul 19, 2009 1:58 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
link correction
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/great-expectations-part-i.html
"If people define situations as real, they are real in their consequences". W. I. Thomas
by Colinski on Jul 19, 2009 1:59 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs
Once again
I have learned a lot. Great post and highly rec’d. I always thought that it was a ongoing 2 or 3 month ordeal. But I can see from the great post the logic of waiting till just before camp to get these players on board. I for one would like to see some sort of rookie cap. even if for the first 2 years then upgrade it for the next 2 years according to their contributions to the team. case in point BMarsh. He would beor have been eligible for a 2 year up grade and we wouldn’t be having the discusions about him posibly holding out. What these figures would be I don’t have the knowledge to say X amount for this and that. It just seems logical to me IMO
by papasteven on Jul 19, 2009 2:47 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
how contracts are calculated
I thought I’d post a little more on ‘contract math’ since it’s not usually well covered in the sports section of local newspapers.
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/A-look-at-rookie-contracts.html
"If people define situations as real, they are real in their consequences". W. I. Thomas
by Colinski on Jul 19, 2009 3:09 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Thanks Colinski
I knew you could contribute a lot in this area. I’ve seen that those subjects interest you. I look forward to your analysis’ in the future for the 2010 Draft season.
"You give 100 percent in the first half of the game, and if that isn't enough, in the second half you give what's left." – Yogi Berra
"No, I'm from Iowa, I only work in outer space."
by KaptainKirk on Jul 19, 2009 3:27 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
Those links were very valuable
from that 2nd link, this:
The July 4 holiday has passed, and NFL teams now will step up their efforts to bring the rookie class of 2009 into the fold contractually. Of course, the fact that very few high picks have signed is meaningless at this point, as every player has participated in offseason activities and mini-camps, all secured by injury protection forms signed prior to their first team activity in May.
should answer one of your questions justwhytee.
"You give 100 percent in the first half of the game, and if that isn't enough, in the second half you give what's left." – Yogi Berra
"No, I'm from Iowa, I only work in outer space."
by KaptainKirk on Jul 19, 2009 3:57 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs
I just keep learning and learning.
What a great site!
If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!
by Trinidad Jack on Jul 20, 2009 10:05 AM MDT reply actions 0 recs

























