What a difference a Coach makes...

by broncorat on Jul 2, 2009 12:59 PM MDT Comment 27 comments

What's not to love about the guy(s) McDaniels picked to run his offense?

Josh McDaniels joined the Patriots on March 1, 2001 as a personnel assistant in the scouting department and assisted the defensive coaching staff for three seasons. He began serving as the Patriots' quarterbacks coach in 2004 and was named offensive coordinator/quarterbacks coach on January 20, 2006.

Tom Brady: http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BradTo00.htm

Positives: Good height to see the field. Very poised and composed. Smart and alert. Can read coverages. Good accuracy and touch. Produces in big spots and in big games. Has some Brian Griese in him and is a gamer. Generally plays within himself. Team leader.

Negatives: Poor build. Very skinny and narrow. Ended the '99 season weighing 195 pounds and still looks like a rail at 211. Looks a little frail and lacks great physical stature and strength.
Can get pushed down more easily than you'd like. Lacks mobility and ability to avoid the rush. Lacks a really strong arm. Can't drive the ball down the field and does not throw a really tight spiral. System-type player who can get exposed if he must ad-lib and do things on his own.

Summary: Is not what you're looking for in terms of physical stature, strength, arm strength and mobility, but he has the intangibles and production and showed great Griese like improvement as a senior. Could make it in the right system but will not be for everyone.

Tom Brady Passer Ratings

Regular Season

2002 85.7

2003 85.9

2004 92.6

2005 92.3

2006 87.9

2007 117.2

Super Bowls

2002 86.2

2004 100.5

2005 110.2

Tom Brady+Josh McDaniels:

•Three time Super Bowl champion
•Twice named Super Bowl MVP
•Three-time Pro-Bowler
•Sports Illustraded "Sportsman of the Year" 2005

Kyle Orton+Josh McDaniels:

Let the games begin!!

p.s. Love the Griese references!!!

This is a Fan-Created Comment on MileHighReport.com. The opinion here is not necessarily shared by the editorial staff of MHR

4 recs | Comment 27 comments

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definitely a reason to hope

thanks for the parallel.

Pray for the best, prepare for the worst, and know you will come down somewhere between the two.

Livin' in La La Land and Lovin' It

by BShrout on Jul 2, 2009 1:31 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I would dare to say

Orton09 is way ahead, physically and experience wise, of where Brady04 was when he first got involved with McDaniels full time. The same Positives, arguably none of the Negatives and much better overall than that Griese guy he replaced in Chicago.

broncorat

by broncorat on Jul 2, 2009 3:14 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Seems to know what he wants

and how he wants to do it. I like that about him. He has also assembled and really good staff around him to help carry out his vision. Something the MSM never focuses on.

by bchiper on Jul 2, 2009 1:50 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

I heard Steve Young comment today

On Mike and Mike in the morning on ESPN radio on how embarrassing it was for the Broncos to lose Cutler and how much it would hurt them. He also was very critical that McD didn’t repair the relationship. Doesn’t anyone else besides MHR understand this was a Bus Cook ploy from the very beginning and Cutler wasn’t going to patch it up because they had no intention of being anything but impossible from the outset? It was all intended to get Cutler out of Denver to get a big contract he was never going to get here. When in doubt follow the money. This was all about greed and not team. I for one am happy to have Orton behind center this year and I look forward to humbling so called experts just like Eddie Royal did last year.

by Ponderosa on Jul 2, 2009 3:12 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

why wasnt cutler going to get a big contract here?

i think if cutler would have played another pro-bowl caliber season here denver would have given him his deal

by purplesocks on Jul 2, 2009 8:54 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Nope.

Wasn’t going to happen. Bus Cook has a history and was expecting to land the largest QB contract in history for Cutler. McD and Xanders have a whole new philosophy, he wasn’t going to be bigger than the team. Follow the money!

by Ponderosa on Jul 2, 2009 9:31 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Even if Kyle Orton has a passing rating over 100,

the media would give all the accolades to the receivers, not Kyle for his passing proficiency, or McDaniels coaching abilities and system.

by bfree2bronc on Jul 2, 2009 4:06 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

no kidding

and they’d give credit to Cutler for having developed those receivers into the great players they are today.

Pray for the best, prepare for the worst, and know you will come down somewhere between the two.

Livin' in La La Land and Lovin' It

by BShrout on Jul 2, 2009 4:12 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Carried Away

Let’s not get too carried away. McDaniels may help the QB’s. He may not. I am hopeful but not predicting. Keep in mind that McDaniels has the whole team to coach now, not just the QB’s or offense. It is reasonable to say, however, that McDaniels brings a superior opportunity to improve not just the QB’s but the team as well.

As for Steve Young: he should be embarrassed for his statements before truly researching the facts. For me, the Broncos are not embarrassed. It is instead only a perception foisted by the MSM. There was no relationship to repair, and that lack of relationship was all Cutler’s fault.

As for follow the money. I don’t think that was it. Cutler’s still playing for Chicago with his rookie contract. My take is that Cutler couldn’t stand the heat of competition. McDaniels brought in Simms and paid him more than the team was paying Cutler and, therefore, obviously to compete with Cutler for the starting position.

by Endzone on Jul 2, 2009 4:25 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

Orton has already improved

with very little coaching in Chicago. There is very little to fix Endzone. What Kyle needs, is now in place with the Broncos. Good receivers, a solid offensive line, and a good offensive scheme. Orton’s stats will improve dramatically in Denver in 09. There are maybe two or three QBs in the NFL who might(that’s might) have achieved more on the field in Chicago, given the same conditions that Orton had. Orton is the real deal and will prove it with the Broncos.
Steve Young has a very short memory. After a brief stint with the USFL, he played several years for Tampa Bay. With the Buccaneers, he had to work with lousy receivers, a pourous offensive line, and a coaching staff that couldn’t coach their way out of a paper bag. Young’s performance in Tampa was horrible, but Bill Walsh saw his potential and traded a 49ers 1st round pick for him. After several rough years with the 49ers, Young finally won the starting job and developed into a HOF QB. If there is anyone within MSM that gets it, this should be Steve Young. He better than anyone, should understand why there will be a huge difference between the Chicago Orton and the Denver Orton.

by rocko1 on Jul 2, 2009 6:43 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

i think you are overrating orton

by saying there are maybe two or three QBs that could have achieved more on the field in chicago is basically saying that orton is the 3rd or 4th best QB in the league. I liked the trade for Orton and think he can succeed here but we really have no idea how orton will play. plenty of QBs have had one great year and then flamed out

by purplesocks on Jul 2, 2009 9:08 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I dont know...

Name many gustier QB;s than Kyle in the NFL.
he survived on pure guts and determination with no help from anyone.
He is a TALENTED Qb that survived and succeeded against the odds.
Lets see him now in a system that is fit.
Does anyone think that Jay is a fit for the Chicago system? Does anyone think that the offensive system with Turner, the roster and Lovie is going to change overnight?

Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.

by boydy2669 on Jul 2, 2009 9:16 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Orton's flame has just been ignited

2008 was just the beginning. If you want to get an idea of how he will play, start by watching some Purdue games. Then watch 2007/2008 Bears games. Peyton Manning and Tom Brady have never played well when their offensive lines get beat like a drum by the opposing team’s front seven. Look at Roethelsberger’s stats for 08, they were the same as Orton’s. The Steelers had a horrible OL last year. Look at the Bears’ offensive line. They were one of the worst in the NFL. Improve the players around Orton, play him in a spread offense, and upgrade his coaching staff…….you get the idea. He’s tough, smart, very competitive, a leader, underrated arm, and a great teammate.

by rocko1 on Jul 3, 2009 5:15 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Might have been the competition

Might it not also have been the difference in attitudes between Shanahan/Bates (who seem to have believed that Cutler was great just as he was) and McDaniels/McCoy (who seem to have believed that Cutler needed to improve and compete)?

Pray for the best, prepare for the worst, and know you will come down somewhere between the two.

Livin' in La La Land and Lovin' It

by BShrout on Jul 2, 2009 8:18 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

+1

"Reality continues to ruin my life." - Calvin (Calvin & Hobbes)

by RockyMtnHigh on Jul 3, 2009 12:47 AM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Cha-ching

It was about the money. Agents are poisoning the league.

by Ponderosa on Jul 2, 2009 8:22 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

You bet Pondarosa

It was all about money. Cutler and Cook wanted more. McD and the Broncos said prove that you’re worth it, then you’ll get paid accordingly. Then sh*t hit the fan.

by rocko1 on Jul 2, 2009 8:59 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Remember this about Young..

Mike Shanahan was his offensive coordinator in SF and he HATED to see Shanny leave when he did. I would say its a safe bet that the two of them are still very close friends. There could be more loyalty to Shanahan involved in the remarks about McDaniels than what might otherwise be there.

I believe you have to give McDaniels credit for his work with QBs and I believe it will improve Orton’s game a lot this year. It’s the way he goes about things. No detail left untouched. All it takes is a QB willing to listen to benefit from the approach.

Thank God we seem to have one of those now too.

by AlanC on Jul 2, 2009 4:44 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

CAN WE ALSO REMEMBER THAT KO IS NOT A HACK? FOR THE NAME OF ZEUS HE IS A QB WITH A 20-12 RECORD IN A SYSTEM THAT WAS AS WELL SUITED AS A FUR JACKET IN THE SAHARA!

by boydy2669 on Jul 2, 2009 4:45 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Man...

Nothing personal, but boy do I hate it when QBs (and SPs in baseball) are judged by their TEAM’S record… there are plenty of reasons to like Orton, but that is certainly not one I care about in the least.

"A player who conjugates a verb in the first person singular cannot be part of the squad, he has to conjugate the verb in the first person plural. We. We want to conquer. We are going to conquer. Using the word 'I' when you're in a group makes things complicated." ~ Wanderley Luxemburgo, 1999

by ejruiz on Jul 2, 2009 5:10 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Thats cool...thats the one I care most about.

by boydy2669 on Jul 2, 2009 5:37 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

How Come?

So much goes into wins and losses that isn’t up to the QB… heck, even a lot of “his” passing stats are dependant on other players, play-calling and circumstance. Honestly, INTs are probably the stat I care about the most, but that’s an extension of my belief that turnover margin is the single most important stat in football.

by ejruiz on Jul 2, 2009 6:33 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree with TO's but as the QB is the leader of the team, the rest of the team live and dies buy their belief in that leader. That was half the problem with Denver last year.

by boydy2669 on Jul 2, 2009 9:18 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

QB Worship

I often hear team matchups as “Manning vs Brady” or such. For crying out loud! It is the TEAMS that are meeting. This personalization of team matchups irks me to no end.

by Endzone on Jul 2, 2009 7:07 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

Good point on Young's relationship with Shanahan

by Ponderosa on Jul 2, 2009 6:13 PM MDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'll second Endzone's first comment

McD is now a head coach, not the offensive coordinator and there’s a world of difference. But I’ll disagree and say that the “fault” in the Cutler-McDaniels relationship probably lies with both of them – however, the coach is the boss and even if he’s at fault, Cutler is just a player and was being paid to sit down and shut up. And last, while I truly hope that the Orton-McDaniels relationship is as fruitful as the Brady-McDaniels relationship was, it has to be acknowledged that Brady had a much more talented defense to work with, at least so far – the jury’s obviously still out on how far the Broncs have come on D in the past year.

It's "just" football

by Donkhead on Jul 2, 2009 4:46 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs

My thoughts on Cutler

I do not think it as anything to do with the relationship with McDaniels or how it was handeled. Cutler was not happy from the time Shanahan was let go and wanted out. The trade talk was just what he and his agent needed to ask to be traded. I do not think anything could have been done to keep him here.

by torlandoco on Jul 2, 2009 6:11 PM MDT reply actions 0 recs