Horse Tracks 7/21/09 - Happy Birthday, Wesley Woodyard; wait, you mean they actually have a plan?!
by Douglas A. Lee on Jul 21, 2009 5:33 AM MDT
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DB - 2009 Position Previews: Defensive Backs
Well, isn't this interesting? According to Mike Nolan, the Broncos' first offseason goal was to remake the secondary with experience and talent. So, when the MSM convinced so themselves and so many others that the defensive front was the most glaring need in free agency and the draft, and that Denver clearly had to be looking there first, they didn't even bother to consider another path. Add in Knowshon Moreno and Alphonso Smith, and Josh McDaniels & Co. "don't have a plan," according to folks like John Clayton. To paraphrase what Nolan said, mistakes by the secondary equal touchdowns; mistakes by the front can be cleaned up by the secondary. Now, we don't all have to agree with Nolan's outlook or like his plan. But to everyone who thinks there is no plan, here is a fine response.
DP - Nine draft picks remain unsigned
Klis has an interesting tidbit; Brian Xanders began giving rookies "split" deals last year, in which the team is protected against players going on IR. I wonder if Torain and Powell had such contracts.
DP - Mailbag: Apple pie or sour grapes?
Klis covers the gamut of Broncos questions.
NFL - Broncos should follow history and trade Marshall
Solomon Wilcots shows his "wisdom" by saying the Broncos should trade BMarsh for "multiple draft picks." He doesn't consider that Marshall doesn't quite have the same trade value that Chad Johnson did a year ago. He also thinks the Broncos don't have a first-round pick next year. Well, that explains a lot...
TS - 2009 NFL Offensive Rookie of the Year Odds – Moreno Favored
For the gamblers out there, Knowshon is a 5-to-2 bet for ROY.
PRL - Legendary Coaches, World Champions Headline Inaugural Brother Rice HS Athletics Hall of Fame Class
Former Broncos DT Mike Lodish, who appeared in SIX Super Bowls, will be inducted to the Brother Rice High School Athletic HOF.
TT - Clark could be part of solution at receiver
Former Broncos WR Brian Clark is hoping for a bigger role in Tampa Bay this year.
SDUT - Countdown to Camp - Kevin Acee
Acee covers the Dolts' running backs.
KCS - Chiefs fans buying tickets for Cowboys, Steelers games pay for exhibitions, too
Wow. The Chefs are either playing dirty with their fans, or they're trying to keep out the opposition's fans. Or both.
ESPN - 2009 Training Camp Guide: AFC Team-by-Team
Travel info.
NFL - Unsatisfied with recent endings, Favre wants to go out on top - Thomas George
NFL - Favre expected to decide on whether or not to join Vikings by Friday
PFW - AFC South training-camp previews
NFP - Diner morning news: First-year coaches
Lombardi looks first at Mike Singletary.
CBS - Training camp battles: AFC East - Pete Prisco
NFP - Comparing NFL and NBA contracts - Andrew Brandt
Y! - Vick begins getting life, career back in order - Charles Robinson
SI - Michael Vick deserves opportunity to play in NFL again - Jim Trotter
SI - Michael Vick should be banned for life from NFL - George Dohrmann
ESPN - The UFL might be the best option for former Atlanta Falcons QB Michael Vick - Chris Mortensen
NFP - NFP late hits: Vick far from NFL-ready - Matt Bowen
Y! - Roethlisberger listed as defendant in Nev. lawsuit
NFLN - NFL Videos: Art of the receiver
Brian Baldinger learns how to properly catch a pass from the Seahawks receivers.
NFLN - NFL Videos: 32 in 32: New England Patriots
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A funny anecdote..
I was listening to Sirius yesterday where Schein and Solomon were hammering on the Broncos, with their argument based squarely on Denver not having a 1st round pick.
I rang sirius, and told the producer that his hosts needed to do some research, and Denver did in fact have a 1st round pick. Producer (or Sirius employee) told me he knew, that Wilcots had it wrong and he would tell him again. and sorry to me as a Broncos fan. I told him this lack of research made arguments by these 2 not hold any water and pissed off Bronco fans. For another hour they went on with the same argument. After this, I wrote an email to Schein and Wilcots. Soon after…finally…..a Denver fan called into the show. Solly had no answer but Schein covered their tracks by saying; “We have been saying Denver does not have THEIR pick.”…….well, they were not saying that all.
Schein relied to my email, saying thanks for the note, but in a sarcastic way that “……you knew what he meant.”
Did I? I consider myself not an idiot, and he kept saying we did not have a pick in the 1st round!
Anyway, Schein covered Wilcots butt for him, using semantics, yet Solly kept wailing and whining on the same argument.
He finally reached Jamie Dukes level, proving what a complete and utter moron he is, and that, yes, he does indeed have a vendetta against the Broncos.
Thanks as normal for the tracks NYC!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
Solomon..
needs to change his first name as he is an embarrassment to it. Wilcots motto is speak before listening. A good journalist listens and then asks questions based on what he’s heard, not what he has made up. A lost art as we all have witnessed in the MSM, only a few seem to understand this point.
Sorry you had to go through that boydy, but, thanks for standing up for us Bronco fans.
No worries my friend....
All it proved to me is that both he and Schein are complete blowhards. My theory became a fact. I found it funny as hell…
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
Shame on you, Tunga.
You should see your local analrapist to remedy this.
"Old apple dessert = lots of vomit. :("
by Tempestuous Binary on Jul 21, 2009 12:10 PM MDT up reply actions
Yes.
But only if you help me out with Afternoon Delight.
"Old apple dessert = lots of vomit. :("
by Tempestuous Binary on Jul 22, 2009 5:40 AM MDT up reply actions
Mailbag by Klis was REALLY good.
Maybe Mikey is starting to think outside the box a bit!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
He gets it. Always has.
They just muzzled him or heavily edited him during McJayGate. He’s the first guy in the NFL world— outside MHR— that recognized that Denver’s secondary was the huge elephant in the corner the last two years. You can’t do much of anything if your DB’s can’t or won’t play whole team defense.
He’s a great example of why I love and appreciate Horse Tracks. I can read him and make sure the only hits I provide to DPO are Klis driven. It’s a small thing, I know, but its the principle of the thing.
There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance-- that principle is contempt prior to investigation."
-- Herbert Spencer
by PredominantlyOrange on Jul 21, 2009 7:57 AM MDT up reply actions
Yes!
In commenting on Legwold’s return the other day, I didn’t intend to exclude Klis as a good local resource. Being on MHR the last year or so, I don’t follow all the DPO articles as I used to, but I DO appreciate the mailbag by Klis. He seems to take it seriously enough to provide complete and thoughtful answers, and was a HUGE breath of fresh air after the birdcage liner that Williamson turned it into. (Dunno who coined his moniker “Pork Chop”, but it seems to fit. I can believe he was more interested in lunch than in crafting an informative article.)
agreed
I always liked Klis and was surprised at his behavior during McJaygate. Until he proves otherwise, I have forgiven him those transgressions. It is a huge weight off my mind since I can now wnjoy his stuff again…
There is no army so powerful as an idea whose time has come.
by Jeremy Bolander on Jul 21, 2009 1:01 PM MDT up reply actions
Loved this bit
The Broncos were leading the AFC West by three games with three to go last season. It’s not like they need the greatest resurrection in sports history to make the playoffs this season.
And this:
Remember, if the Broncos are just average in defending the run this year, they’ll be much improved from the previous two seasons.
Sounds sorta familiar, no? : )
"Talk about the Broncos and I'm gonna 'put my dukes up'. I'm gonna hit you with these rings." -- Rod Smith giving the Kennison rebuttal to Jamie Dukes
by broncosmontana on Jul 21, 2009 8:47 AM MDT up reply actions
Thanks NYC
"You give 100 percent in the first half of the game, and if that isn't enough, in the second half you give what's left." – Yogi Berra
"No, I'm from Iowa, I only work in outer space."
The secondary was atrocious in 2008 and needed a full overhaul. I think any new coach/GM would have made massive changes to that unit. I think the Coach did a good job rebuilding this group, but it’s not like he is the only person that realized Manuel, McCree, Lowry, Bly, Paymuh, etc comprised the worst secondary in the NFL the last decade+.
Secondly, the D-line starters are listed as Peterson, Fields and McBean. Three career backup and/or practice squad players. If you guys are sold on this trio, I’m speechless. IMO, it looks like we have the least talented D-line in the NFL. I challenge anyone to name two teams with lesser regarded talent on the D-line.
Dude....who cares how they are regarded....I could not care less....
It is whether they are a fit for what WE are doing….not what everyone THINKS WE SHOULD BE DOING.
Please, going off your argument, tell me why they CANT succeed.
Its an unwinnable argument.
Here is what we do know about the D Line:
- Ronnie Fields has played in the NFL at NT and DE in a 3-4/ Hybrid and been coached by Nolan.
- Ronnie Fields has more experience at NT than BJ Raji and Ron Brace.
- Carlton Powell has BETTER college stats as a run stuffer than ANYBODY that has come out the draft in the last 4 years.
- The only DE from the draft that had played extensively in a 3-4 system was Rulon Davis. We acquired him.
- The only NT prospect to have played NT in college was Chris Baker. We acquired him.
- Ryan McBean played at Pittsburgh in a 3-4. Apparently they have a pretty good D and pretty good teacher in Lebeau. he is big, mean and has been in the NFL.
- Kenny Peterson has a history with McDaniels and will be a better fit for a 3-4 DE than a 4-3 DT he was used for by Green Bay and Denver.
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
New here too...
I’ve been watching y’all for quite awhile and I’m totally impressed with the knowledge and passion of the MHR staff and Members…Your reply is yet another example of the depth of understanding of the game and specifically, the Broncos that finally convinced me to join and be a part…
Thanks boydy…you often are speaking for many of the rest of us!
by BroncoSense72 on Jul 21, 2009 8:49 AM MDT up reply actions
Add to that...
Say, hypothetically, that the DLine is merely functional— average at best. The big difference is that Andra Davis can tackle— an important element missing from Nate Websters game— and when he (Davis) misses one, he’s got Brian Dawkins not Calvin Lowrey and Renaldo Hill not Marquand Manual watching his back.
There is no better way to illustrate this point than to point back to the NE game last year. Watch it on NFL Rewind if you have it or off the DVR…and add up NE’s rushing yardage after a routine missed tackles at the second level. I emphasize ‘routine’. Plays you’d expect a high schooler to make on regular basis. This pattern repeated its self over and over the last two seasons. The defensive line simply was not the biggest problem in the run game. They were bad pass rushers but get way too much blame in overall scheme of things. It has become the most convienient and trusted argument, but it simply falls short.
There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance-- that principle is contempt prior to investigation."
-- Herbert Spencer
by PredominantlyOrange on Jul 21, 2009 9:28 AM MDT up reply actions
+100
Freaking Pee Wee Herman would play better at MLB than Webster did last year. I can’t believe he was put back in last year after his injury.
I don’t want breakaway speed. I want break-some-poor-fool-as-I-bowl-you-over power getting 6 yards off a play that should have been stopped for 2 at most.
ILBs
One of the differences between this year and last is having DJ in the middle. I don’t mean to neglect Davis in this calculation of how good we’ll be, but it’s significant that we have a star LB manning the middle of our LB corps.
Some time ago I posted a blog entry by a knowledgeable Bronco fan (MUG) from another site on the subject of which LB position DJ should play. MUG’s pet peeve was the unexamined myth that DJ was opposed to playing MLB, which started when he complained about being repeatedly moved. DJ clearly didn’t like SAM, and he also liked WILL, but he also liked MIKE and hoped to become one of the luminaries at that position, but the demise of Run Contain and the firing of Bates ultimately derailed that ambition.
We’re not an untalented defensive team, even though the results of the last two years would hardly support that claim. But there was a reason for that record, and it’s this point that’s frequently lost when the pundits blather about what our defense lacks in an all-knowing way. Obviously, it’s far easier to imply that there were problems (which there clearly were), but ridicule and an “everyone knows” attitude are the tools of people who want to appear to be knowledgeable instead of proving it.
DJ’s performance in late 2007 suggests that we could be very solid up the middle. One of the unintended consequences of moving to a 3-4 is that we’ve moved him back to a position for which he’s very well suited. Familiarity leads to overlooking him, but the contrast between DJ & Davis versus Webster in the middle could not be more stark, and along with it the contrast between Dawkins and McCree, etc., who in turn provide run support for LBs. We’ve become surprisingly solid up the middle in an almost casual and unnoticed way. Nobody questions whether DJ, Davis and Dawkin can defend the run but there was very little fanfare when they were brought aboard or moved. The end result is that we don’t ‘feel’ we have a potentially strong run defense — in part — because DJ was part of a bad defense that included players such as Webster.
I’ll save most of my argument for another post but a good way of seeing our defense clearly is by examining 2005’s defense. I wish I could say that we were much more talented then but the truth is that incremental changes and fewer holes produced a vastly better defense.
"If people define situations as real, they are real in their consequences". W. I. Thomas
Gem of a Comment
Nobody questions whether DJ, Davis and Dawkin can defend the run…
I think this is a good point because it really does help the run defense. If we can go back and stop runners from last year who reach the 2nd and 3rd levels in their tracks rather then let them continue to rip off yards it would be a significant improvement.
Tis better not to throw it to the deep receiver but the open receiver.
Nail on the head
Boydy . . . you truly understand the game of football. Your points are EXACTLY what I have been trying to get across to the naysayers for months! IMO, this DLine will be the surprise of the NFL
"The men who have done big things are those who are not afraid to attempt big things, who were not afraid to risk failure in order to gain success."
- B.C Forbes
Thanks for the nice comments HSFB!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
Yep sorry Doc...
I was really away doing a clinic on how to swallow MSM “truths” without gagging, but clearly it did not work.
I will try my VERY best to never let facts get in the way of sensationalism or kicking in the teeth of the Broncos.
Sorry friends!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
Ronnie Fields was a career back-up in San Fran, not one of the better defenses or D-lines in the NFL. Jamal Williams… he is not.
Carlton Powell is a guy that has never played one snap of NFL football and coming off a very serious injury. He was also a 5th round pick so every NFL team could have drafted him several times before Denver pulled the trigger. If he was a slam dunk run stuffer and NFL stalwart, he would have been picked much higher. He is, at best, a wild card to make the team.
Rulon Davis is a long shot to make the team.
Chris Baker was primarily a 3-4 DE in college. He is said to be down to 320lbs. Like Powell, he is a maybe to make the roster.
Ryan McBean is a practice squad player from a very good organization. Like Powell, he is a maybe to make the roster.
Kenny Peterson is as average an NFL player as you can find. He plays hard, does nothing well or poorly. He’d probably not start for more than 3 other teams in the NFL.
Add in Marcus Thomas and Ayres (maybe) and you have the makings of our D-line rotation. They may shock the NFL and they may shock you guys with how bad they are.
If your being honest, you have to admit Denver has underwhelming talent on our D-line. If you are looking for a weak link for the 2009 team, I’d suggest right here. If they play poorly this season, it will severely limit the effectiveness of our back 8.
If Paige and Krieger are right and Denver goes 5-11ish in 2009, we could have used that 1st round pick we traded away to draft one of the several great DT prospects that should be available in the 2010 1st round (Gerald McCoy, N Sug, T Cody (great NT), Marvin Austin). Maybe I’m just a crazy person, but I’d have preferred we kept our 2010 1st round pick, gotten by with Jack Williams or Bell at nickel CB and used our 2010 1st rounder on a D-linemen. If the season plays out like you guys believe it will (Denver is good to average), it may not be a big deal. If the season plays out like I believe it will (6-10) I think we’ll really miss not having the chance to upgrade the D-line in the 2010 draft.
Other 3-4 teams like the Pats (start 3 1st rounder’s on D-line), San Diego (two high picks), KC (two Top 5 picks), Steelers (Hampton, Hood) spend their high picks on D-line because they know how important it is to have a stout front three. 1st round picks BUST all the time, but most 3-4 teams place a very high emphasis on talent in their front 3. In our current group, I see not one player that would be a starter on a decent D-line in the NFL.
You’re being too hard on Fields, he is not a career backup, he has started, he has played solid if not spectacular. This has been addressed.
However, more importantly is your point on top picks. Teams do spend high end picks on Defensive lineman and that’s fair. They didn’t do it all in one year however. Denver took a potential defensive lineman/hybrid linebacker player with a first round pick this year. If we take one with our first rounder next year we would be right on pace. Heck if we take one two years from now we will be on pace with the teams you have mentioned.
I think Nolan made an interesting point when he mentioned the desire to have veterans in your backfield. When tasked with overhauling an entire defense, like they were this year, I think the strategy of bringing in veterans to play in the secondary makes sense. For that matter, getting Ayers where we did and getting Moreno where we did makes sense.
This may be an average defensive line. I am willing to put good money though that they will be better than last year and money now that they will be even better two years from now. That is all I could ask for.
Tis better not to throw it to the deep receiver but the open receiver.
Average? San Diego has an average D-line. Denver... No.
Fields is getting paid like a low end starter or decent backup. The guy started a few games in 2006, but he has been a back up ever since. A backup on a rather weak defense. People on this site are putting a lot of faith in this guy. Expectations are not being managed vs reality.
And you and others keep referring to Denver’s D-line as average. Average means middle of the pack or a Top 16 unit. This is not an average D-line. This is a below average D-line. Possibly bottom 3 in the NFL.
From what I’ve read, it appears Ayres is being groomed at OLB. If that is the case, we are playing a bunch of low round, unheralded and (by far most importantly) unaccomplished players on our D-line.
Hope springs eternal on this site, but there is a good chance that Denver will be overhauling the D-line in 2010, like they did the secondary in 2009. I’m someone that thinks a good D-line helps a below average secondary far more than an good secondary helps a below average D-line.
I believe you are right
about overhauling the D Line in 2010. Baby steps are better than no steps.
"You give 100 percent in the first half of the game, and if that isn't enough, in the second half you give what's left." – Yogi Berra
"No, I'm from Iowa, I only work in outer space."
Wow Man
You can at least try to absorb the point of my post. Or you can take one line and go berserk like you have discovered a bomb.
Ayers is projected to play both. I reference him in that regard, you have been around enough of the forums that I am sure you have read that before so it seems foolish that I would have to mention it again.
If you must focus on the term average then I would say you should take it with a + or – standard deviation. Which, if you didn’t know, a range of performance.
I will try to give you an analogy to help things along. Lets suppose you had a slow car and wanted to make it faster. You could spend your entire budget on superb brakes. In fact many experts would tell you that the most important part of a fast car are its brakes, in fact the other big cars you might go against probably all have excellent and expensive brakes. Still after blowing your wad you would still have a slow car.
You could also try improving a variety of things. The engine, the suspension, maybe in the process you even upgraded the braking a little but nothing like before. This time the car runs significantly better! Then next year you could even think of upgrading the brakes a bit more.
Tis better not to throw it to the deep receiver but the open receiver.
San Diego?
They have ONLY ONE 1st round pick on their PROJECTED starting front 3. Right from their own website: Projected Defensive Line starters are Ryon Bingham, Jamal Williams and Luis Castillo. Castillo is the ONLY 1st rounder on the line. Ryon Bingham was a 7th round draft pick and Jamal Williams was a 2nd round SUPPLEMENTAL draft pick. Jamal Williams was drafted in 1998, but did not start an NFL game until 2001 (hmmm . . . sounds like a back up to me). Ryon Bingham was drafted in 2004, but not officially start in the NFL until 2007 (sounds like another back up to me).
The point of this is that it takes a TRUE NFL defensive linemen between 3 and 5 years to hit his stride. For those of us who have coached and played the position, it takes a lot of time to develop a quality defensive lineman. The guys we have are at the point of becoming true, qualilty defensive linemen.
My problem with a lot of your assumptions is that the Defensive line was the total problem with the defense last year. However, if you dig into the stats (and read some of the excellent analysis put on this website) you would realize that the defensive line was ACTUALLY the strength of the defense. Again, IMO, this will be the most surprising line in the NFL and will be the key to our defense being a top 15 defense.
"The men who have done big things are those who are not afraid to attempt big things, who were not afraid to risk failure in order to gain success."
- B.C Forbes
Who ever said the D-line was the total problem last year. Oh, that would be you that just said it. So I guess you have a problem with your assumptions. I think the entire defense was terrible last season D-line, LBs, secondary. No one unit played capability. I’ve said that maybe 20+ times. I think the 2007 and 2008 defenses were the worst Bronco D’s I’ve ever witnessed.
Secondly, your argument about D-linemen taking years to develop is nonsense. Most players don’t peak in their rookie year. QBs, WRs, TEs, OLBs, CBs, etc usually get better with experience and age. A guy’s prime is not when he is 22. That applies to more than just D-linemen. Is Matt Ryan as good as he is going to get? Is Royal? Is Keith Rivers? Is Kenny Phillips? They’ll all get better, just like the USC DT that went to the Saints in the last draft (Ellis I think). So if you’re telling me that D-linemen improve with experience, thank for the insight Captain obvious.
If San Diego is using #1’s and #2s on their D-line (which I said was average), then they are still putting some major resources towards the D-line. Denver has not. When Seattle uses our pick in the 2010 draft, it will be a painful moment for Broncos fans like us.
McGeorge,
One of the hardest positions to develop quickly is D Linemen…..thats what former and current players say, thats what former and current coaches say. Its a fact……and I will take their word, and that of HSFB, who by the way, coaches football, over yours or any MSM expert out there.
We have a young D Line….and that excites me.
You cant compare it to other positions….thats comparing apples to oranges. SO, now you are agreeing that the D line can improve, but you want to scrap it anyway.
Your arguments make no sense man….you agree that all players take a while to develop……the D line takes longer….but you want to scrap the players, start again, and ste the team back even more….ok.
Some of the guys on our roster (Thomas, McBean, Peterson) could be ready to break out.
We have talent on our D line: Thomas was graded as a 1st round talent, McBean in the 4th, Peterson in the 3rd, Powell in the 5th, Ayers in the 1st…so Denver has used resources on the line.
We will agree to disagree….you are prepared to right the line off sight unseen, as I am prepared to let the ressults speak for themselves…mayeb they will suck, maybe they wont…..but I do know this.
We now have backers that can tackle and blitz…we have safetys and corners that can tackle and wont give up bug plays…..and we have one of the best DC’s in the business with an awesome D Line Coach and Linebacker coach….makes me enthused!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
I remember when people wondered why we picked up Casey.
Then he Centered one of the best O-lines in Bronco History. I guess it worked out OK. Let’s give Mr. Fields a chance and see how it goes.
by ThorpeBroncosfan on Jul 21, 2009 5:03 PM MDT up reply actions
If only you were speechless...
I’ll say it again: most d-lineman take years to develop. Meaning most begin as backups.
The trick is getting them when they’ve figured it out and going from there. Personally, I thank the ’Niners for grooming Fields for us.
As for the rest, training camp will let the Broncos know what they have. Personally, I have faith in Fields and Thomas, think Peterson is solid, and think Powell, Baker, and several of the UDFA have huge upsides. I don’t know too much about McBean, other than that he couldn’t crack the Pittsburgh squad a couple of years ago.
But what that also means is he has experience learning the 3-4. We’ll see if it’s his time…
Trevor Pryce
hardly even got onto the field his first year.
"Sanity is the realization that everyone is insane to some degree." Me
McGeorge
I am not sold on our DL. They are not stellar, but they aren’t slugs either. I believe that they are the weak link in our Defense. It looks like we’re just going to have to live with that for another year. It appears that this issue will be addressed better in next years draft and FA.
"You give 100 percent in the first half of the game, and if that isn't enough, in the second half you give what's left." – Yogi Berra
"No, I'm from Iowa, I only work in outer space."
Keep something in mind
Pre-training camp starters don’t mean a thing other than the fact that McD wanted to get a look at some guys. While many roster spots are set ( I don’t take seriously the idea that Champ and Goodman aren’t our starting CBs), all of the positions can change based on performances in camp and injuries, which are inevitable.
The options at DL were limited this offseason and draft. You’re right KK – they will change over the next couple of years.
Hillis/Moreno in '09
How good is this DL?
We won’t see any of them voted to all-star teams but the frame — as in what they’re not — subtly implies they’re bad, which is a little unfair.
What McX are probably looking for is competence at this point, and that’s especially true for DL34s because of the blue collar nature of their position. They won’t be given credit — rightly or wrongly — for tying up blockers since there is no statistic for this, so they could be doing an exemplary job and the only place (or one of them) it would show would be in running yards allowed.
Despite laudatory language about the virtues of team play, there’s still a great ‘un-appreciation’ of how individual play feeds off of the contributions of other positions. Being merely competent is not a bad thing, and it describes most of the players and teams in the league. And we can do well if most of our players are merely competent, as long as a few do very well and there are no weak links.
I use terms such as “solid” to describe how I hope they’ll play. I think we’re still missing a stellar performer, but I don’t think that player was available this year, either through free agency or the draft. One stellar performer could turn what was considered a weakness into a strength — oddly. And that presumes that we were solid to begin with. I think we’re in the solid range right now, and we also have depth. Additionally, we have a number of players (a quite surprising number) who are good physical specimens and the right somatotype.
"If people define situations as real, they are real in their consequences". W. I. Thomas
Love this site
Just signed up, but have been reading this site for over a year now—best Broncos site on the web by a mile. And Jamie Dukes is an idiot—hope he gets fired for being fat and obnxoious (not to mention uncontrollably biased).
GO BRONCOS – Just got my half price tickets for the Steelers Monday night game!!!
Enjoy that man. And welcome to MHR!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
Welcome, Iowa!
"Talk about the Broncos and I'm gonna 'put my dukes up'. I'm gonna hit you with these rings." -- Rod Smith giving the Kennison rebuttal to Jamie Dukes
by broncosmontana on Jul 21, 2009 8:48 AM MDT up reply actions
Welcome Iowa, and you're right . . .
Two of the broadcasters I have the most contempt for are Solomon Wilcots and Jamie Dukes, and they often appear together. Wow. 
Never argue with a fool, lest you take on his appearance. - my daddy
Thanks NYC!!!
Appreciate (again) you wading through the articles to pluck out the good ones for us!
Take my advice... I'm not using it!
Just click your heels together three times and say, "There's no player like Hillis... there's no player like Hillis."
MSM still hilarious
Ignore the Rockies, bash the Broncos with half-truths and no real knowledge of the team or situation then move on to, um, servicing the east coast teams that are the extent of what you have actually watched.
Oh and Chicago, because Cutler is apparently Joe Montana with a gun for an arm.
Thanks, NYC.
"Old apple dessert = lots of vomit. :("
by Tempestuous Binary on Jul 21, 2009 12:08 PM MDT reply actions
First, I want to thank NYC.
You really make it easier for the computer illiterate like me.
Next, I went to the first site and read about Nolan’s approach and liked it. Isn’t that what our expert’s here at MHR have been telling us, that we can reasonably expect to see fewer of these long, gashing runs.
Then, while there I clicked on the video of Brian Dawkins. I was impressed. I’ve heard all the talk and read all the articles, but to hear him speak, to look into his eyes when he speaks. Here is a frighteningly intelligent man. And you can see the focus and intelligence in his eyes, even in the news conference format.
The Broncos definately got someone special. I can hardly wait.
If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!
Breaking story on FOX News, Ben Rothlesberger served papers for sexual assault on nine women!!!
While playing golf…LMAO…
Man, hope he was not hitting the ball well...
That could really screw a good round!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
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