In contrast to his critics' complaints, Orton ranks third in the NFL in pass plays of at least 20 yards, fourth in average yards per completion and eighth in yards per attempt. Impressive production, considering Orton's average completion reaches the receiver 5.7 yards from the line of scrimmage.
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Doc Bear
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All with
a cumbersome glove on his throwing hand, it should be noted, too.
I look forward to seeing him play without that on his hand.
The commenter formerly known as "Dashiell".
I expect to see...
…further improvement this week too.
There is only One Moment—this moment—the Eternal Moment of Now
Is that from a
Campbell’s or Progresso Noodle Arm. ;-)
"You give 100 percent in the first half of the game, and if that isn't enough, in the second half you give what's left." – Yogi Berra
"We don't stop playing because we grow old; We grow old because we stop playing." -- George Bernard Shaw
Breaking jaws or the NFL in Oakland who cares? Fall on your pirate’s sword - Ponderosa
Who cares?
Did it not really happen or something?
Just kiddin’ – but that’s almost insulting…. As if it didn’t count or something….
Nonetheless, a pertinent and reasonable question, just had to give a little pro-Kyle smack-talk
; )
First team to three consecutive SB wins!!!! and then some, right? I think four and we oughtta let someone else have a fair shot : )
by PearlJamBroncoGFunk on Sep 24, 2009 10:48 AM MDT up reply actions
It actually is not...
Thats like asking every other QB to take away tips, lucky plays, unlucky INTS…it is what it it….a completed pass….and it was lucky but every other QB has some luck too.
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
by boydy2669 on Sep 24, 2009 11:12 AM MDT up reply actions 3 recs
I'll rec that sentiment, boydy.
That seems to be one of the favored arguments with some of the KO anti-fans.
Like you said, if you give him special consideration, you have to do the same thing for the rest of the QBs.
For example, the pass to Chris Johnson in the Titans-Texans game. Is Collins any less of a QB for recognizing that NO ONE was covering CJ when he split out wide? That pass went about eight yards through the air, and it was all Chris after that.
DP Message Board Refugee & Drinker of Kool-Aid
I don’t like quarterbacks. - DOOM
If we're going to delete that one,
then we need to take away one of Gaffney’s completions as well, since he caught a pass deflected by a D-lineman.
We’ll also need to discount our first interception of the year since that came off a Bailey tip. NYG had an interception that came after a receiver kicked the ball with his heel.
And we’d have to go through every pass of every game and remove every deflected pass caught for a completion for every quarterback.
Deflections are a part of the game. I’m amazed how many people want to diss Orton for having that pass count in his statistics rather than celebrating Stokley’s football smarts for being there to catch it.
Sorry, BFTW, that little rant wasn’t directed at you personally, but rather the whole attitude that says we should discount that pass.
"The best defense is a good offense. Or is it the other way around." Wolverine
Pray for the best, prepare for the worst, and know you will come down somewhere between the two.
Livin' in La La Land and Lovin' It
by Brian Shrout on Sep 24, 2009 10:53 AM MDT up reply actions 4 recs
Great point!
We also need to add back all of the drops. Imo, the long deflected pass at the end of the Cincy game just made up for the 7 or 8 drops during the game. During a 16 game season, it all comes out in the wash. You get good brewaks and bad breaks.
Those plays even when they are rare they happen for one reason.
Planning, practicing and heads up play. Look for the yards to escalate in the coming weeks and I believe Orton and Marshall will start hooking up. Royal seems a little displaced at the moment and he did take some hard licks in the first 2 games but when that motor start running watch out defenses. I would love to see Lloyd in the mix, the kid can make some acrobatic catches which is just plain fun to watch.
by bfree2bronc on Sep 24, 2009 10:58 AM MDT up reply actions
Plus I think defenses see Royal as the #1 receiver
which means they’re covering him more closely than before.
"The best defense is a good offense. Or is it the other way around." Wolverine
Pray for the best, prepare for the worst, and know you will come down somewhere between the two.
Livin' in La La Land and Lovin' It
by Brian Shrout on Sep 24, 2009 11:00 AM MDT up reply actions
That's right, BShrout
You can also note that Orton is spreading the ball to 8-9 receivers per game. If they decide to lock on Royal, he will still make some of the catches in traffic, but usually it means that someone else is open. Orton has been very good at working to the open man, as long as it’s part of the progression that he’s given as part of the play.
bfree also makes a good point – when Stokes was first interviewed after the catch, his comments started out, “I was just trailing the play like I’m supposed to in case there’s a tipped ball…..” That, to me, eliminates the ‘just luck’ theory. It was a designed aspect of the playcalling and coaching, which makes it a lot more than random chance.
Hillis/Moreno in '09
That is why I would love
for Marshall to be on the field more. Just his presence will make defenses adjust a bit and open other WRs up.
2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant
QFT
And it’s not negative. It’s realistic. You’re only setting yourself up for disappointment with these incredibly small sample-sized stats. Orton isn’t a Pro Bowl-caliber QB. He’s a professional duck thrower. But he either throws the ducks to the right-colored uniforms or he throws them away. He’s a game manager. That’s all. we. need.
His arm is a LOT better than you give him credit for...its as good as almost anyone out there apart from 5 or 6 QB's.
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
I have seen more lasers than ducks.
The problem is that sometimes he doesn’t get enough air under his longer throws.
That’s not a “duck” problem. That’s a touch problem.
It's a testament to the receivers more than anything
…and if you take away the Stokley miracle, the numbers are much less impressive.
However, it doesn’t matter. All Orton has to do is protect the ball. As long as Nolan is on his game, all the offense has to do is not kill itself. Kyle Orton and Shaun Hill are similar in that respect.
Moreno will get comfortable and that will add another tweak to the gameplan, but all this system needs is a responsible QB. He’s the Anti-Cutler.
It's a testament to the whole team
It’s a testament to the coaches for implementing a system that can generate big yards out of short passes.
It’s a testament to Kyle Orton in his increasing knowledge of the system and where to go with the ball (even if that is away from everyone).
It’s a testament to the receivers who likewise must know where to be, and who then execute and get the extra yards.
Because, honestly, I don’t care how the yards come anymore. I’ve never liked QB ratings (158.3? Really?) Just give me a team executing, and I’ll be happy. Right now, I’m in the “very optimistic” stage, waiting for the last few pieces to sync up. Wouldn’t surprise me to see Orton lifted above “game manager” status later in the season.
So, yeah, I think I’m just agreeing with you ELGee, even if it didn’t sound like it. lol
"Don't feed the trolls. Remember to be polite. And please show self-restraint in comment length!" -Me, to myself, because I need constant reminding.
This information does not surprise me . . .
Orton is a winner . . . Plain and simple. I don’t care how he gets his yards. As long as he is moving the football effectively, its all good (and as a defensive coach, it thrills me to no end he is moving the football . . . gives the defense rest time).
My only regret was reading the comments of the DP trolls. Even with the stats staring them in the face, they still rip on Orton. Guess they can’t get over their man-crushes on the former QB.
"The men who have done big things are those who are not afraid to attempt big things, who were not afraid to risk failure in order to gain success."
- B.C Forbes
by HSFBCoach on Sep 24, 2009 11:22 AM MDT reply actions 1 recs
Most of those guys...
…are 50-something scumbags who resent McDaniels’ success at an early age. The Cutler fans are mostly pimply teens that liked his haircut. A third sect thinks way too highly of Brandstater and believes Orton is squashing his path to stardom.
To all of them, I say: Scoreboard, bitches.
Nice comment El Gee!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
Scoreboard, Scoarboard (clap,clap, clap) . . . . Scoreboard, Scoreboard (clap, clap, clap) . . .
Love it!!!
"The men who have done big things are those who are not afraid to attempt big things, who were not afraid to risk failure in order to gain success."
- B.C Forbes
While I like Orton
I’m interested in Brandstater too. I thought he played well against AZ and could possibly be our no 2 next year and starter in 3 to 4 years.
Not that there's anything wrong with 50-something scumbags...
Who actually are really excited about having McD as our coach, are oh so happy that JC is gone, and that are looking forward to seeing TB become a good QB someday, if with the Broncos or somewhere else?
by BroncoSense72 on Sep 24, 2009 6:14 PM MDT up reply actions
Hey, hey, hey
Careful with casring aspersions at 50-something scumbags. I resemble that remark, as do a number of other MHR community members and Orton fans.
Noooooooooooooo
The 50-somethings on MHR aren’t scumbags. They’re pleasantbags.
As for the above comments regarding Brandstater.. while I’m not at all sold on his future prospects, of course I’d be happy for him if he did become something somewhere else. I just don’t get the hub-ub. He basically matched touchdowns with picks at Fresno.
Though I’ve been saying all along, this system doesn’t need a star.. so he could probably flourish here. But so could Orton and Simms. It’d be pointless to groom a stud QB for a dink and dunk offense – hence my skepticism.
I think that if you throw out the lucky tip
his stats look a bit more pedestrian, but that’s OK, because he’s done what he was brought here (together with two #1s) to do and that’s protect the ball and move it down the field – slowly if need be. Everyone needs to keep in mind that he’s still learning the offense, his teammates, etc. and as someone above pointed out, Moreno is not quite untracked yet and we’ve seen very little of what Hillis is capable of either. Stay tuned – it’s goin’ to be a ride!
Go Broncs!
It's "just" football
How come you don't throw out tipped passes that turn into INT's?
I just don’t get the throw out the tipped pass argument. No one credits the QB’s stats back if those tipped passes end up as INT’s. Therefore it shoudln’t be thrown out if a tipped ball ends up as a completion either.
People can use statistics to prove anything, 87% of all people know that.
Uh, simply because
tips for interceptions are far more common than tips for 81 yd TDs that happen to secure victory as the (nearly) last play of the game. Easy man, I’m being cautiously optimistic here! Let’s play some more games!
It's "just" football
Kyle has the weapons to make big plays,
“Everybody wants to get the ball down the field,” Orton said. “I’m no different. I feel like I can make those throws. But if they’re not there, you can go from having a chance to gain a lot of yards to a chance to have a disaster happen on the play, too. So that’s not very smart.”
whether it’s down the field or short screens or dump offs. Chewing up yardage is what it’s all about.
Good points, bfree
That same article had discussed the fact that most of the league is going to this type of system – with variations, of course – because of the faster safeties in today’s game. They can act as an additional cornerback – please refer to Darcel McBath’s strength as a covering safety as an example – and that makes it impportant to control the ball by taking the yardage that you’re given, rather than deciding to force the ball where youu don’t have a good matchup. That’s just good football.
The ‘Air Coryell’ system deliberately considered INTs and incompletions as part of the game and didn’t mind the turnovers. It wwas exciting as all get-out, but didn’t win a Super Bowl to my knowledge. The basis of our system has some (not all) of its roots in the Walsh version of the WCO. He believed that taking care of the ball and taking what you were given would win game and championships. It has, too – a half dozen off the top of my head and quite a few that it influenced. Personally, I find winning very entertaining and this system suits me fine.
Hillis/Moreno in '09
agreed!
and actually I really enjoy a good Defensive chess-match.
"Take what you can. Give nothing back!"
by Colorado_Kitten on Sep 24, 2009 1:04 PM MDT up reply actions
Me too, CK
Growing up watching Dick Butkus gnawing on opponents legs left me with a deep appreciation of the defensive end of the game. And a taste for barbecue…..lol
Hillis/Moreno in '09
Yeah...Butkus and Nitshki used to have QB BBQ-Rib eating contests
by BroncoSense72 on Sep 24, 2009 6:19 PM MDT up reply actions
I wouldn't doubt it, BroncSense
Butkus was one of a kind, but Ray was a kindred spirit
Hillis/Moreno in '09
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