Bowlen Speaks; Broncos Country Listens
by John Bena on Feb 6, 2010 9:00 PM MST
in Denver Broncos in the News
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PrintBroncos Owner Pat Bowlen, who hasn't spoken since his football team ended an 8-8 season, spoke with the Denver Post about a wide-ranging number of topics on the eve of Super Bowl 44. Here is the gist of what Bowlen had to say.
On Josh McDaniels handling of Week 17(Marshall/Scheffler)
If I learned anything, (it) is these kinds of things are learning experiences, especially for a brand new, 33-year-old coach, who obviously has all the pedigree but has never before had the job. And now he's faced with the job. And so I think from my standpoint, he did a very good job handling that.
I wasn't particularly upset or in angst about the way he handled it. He wants to establish his own discipline and his own personality as far as the way he wants to run his club. And I think, as time goes, that will mellow out a little bit. But I think he was trying to make a point or let people know that he wasn't going to be a pushover. And I think a lot of that comes from his age. The fact is he's young, he has to assert that kind of authority. And I agree with him, because he has to gain the respect of the players.
I'm certainly not disappointed. We would have liked to have won a couple more games and made it to the playoffs, but we didn't. We were 8-8 essentially for the fourth year in a row, but he's got his stamp on the team. I think at this point going forward, players and staff are going to know what to expect.
On Brandon Marshall
"I think Brandon is going through a maturing process. Personally, I saw change in his personality and approach to things (this past season). He didn't have the same sort of attitude and anxiety that he's had. I personally would like to see him stay. And there's still a good possibility that could happen.
I'd like to see Brandon stay. Now, if the head coach sits down and says no, I want to trade him, or I've got a deal that's going to be beneficial to the club, I don't think I'm going to override him.
"I think Brandon going through this whole process last year, I think it matured him a little bit, if not a lot. And I think he's, at least I hope he is, wondering if it's the right thing for him to move to another team. I think that's a question mark in his mind. He hasn't told me that, but I have a sense of that.
On Kyle Orton
I want Kyle back. Orton is a good quarterback. I'd also like to think we might have the opportunity to draft a young quarterback, not necessarily to come in and play right away, but if you have the opportunity to draft somebody, that would be a plus for us.
Bowlen's answers seemed forthright and honest, as Mr. B usually is when he takes the time to talk about the Broncos. For better or worse he seemed confident of where the Broncos are. For now, at least.
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Interesting
I always enjoy hearing what he has to say, and it’s good to have some actual insight into what is going on with the Marshall situation. Personally, I don’t want Marshall to go anywhere (I have two of his jerseys). I think the Broncos can work out a solid deal for him, but if he rejects, then I think it’s best for him to move on.
Thanks John
Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
Title says it all
Intersting take on Marshall and good to see that he would like him to stay. I guess at this point it is up to McDaniels and Marshall to work things out, however I haven’t seen or heard anything that would suggest which way they are going.
Bowlen’s thoughts on the direction of the team is exactly what I feel as well. McDaniels has an idea of how he want to run this team and like anybody needs the time to do just that. I like our situation after his first year as a HC over what other teams have done when trying to rebuild.
Thanks John.
Floyd Little: HOF Class of 2010.
2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant
Very interesting.
I think what is most interesting is the 2 times in the article where he said he wants to draft a qb.
“He wasn’t specific, but the assumption is the Broncos would not wait until the later rounds if they chose to draft a quarterback.”
The Problem is there is
not that IT QB in the early rounds this year.
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 6, 2010 10:07 PM MST up reply actions
???
There are several good QB prospects in this draft. Bradford, Claussen, Tebow, Pike, Snead, McCoy, Canfield, etc. This is as good a year as any to roll the draft dice on a QB.
Besides, IT Qbs are always drafted in the Top 5 and Denver has picked that high in decades.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Who would you grab up
with Our first pick McG?
(Sorry if you’ve said before)
First team to three consecutive SB wins!!!! and then some, right? I think four and someone else oughtta have a 'fair' shot ( =
by PearlJamBroncoGFunk on Feb 6, 2010 11:37 PM MST up reply actions
Myself I'm thinking Canfield from Oregon St.
Tall and beefy, the arm is so so but he ran for 500+ yards last year. In the 5th if he’s there.
His Arm did not look impressive at all in the Senior Bowl
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 7, 2010 10:15 AM MST up reply actions
I would take Sam Bradford in a heartbeat, but he won’t fall to 10 or 11.
Bradford is tall, has a quick release, knows how to operate an offense out of shot gun, has great throwing mechanics, but most importantly, Bradford is accurate. Is there anything better than an accurate passer?
Of all the QBs in this draft, I believe Bradford is the one most likely to develop into a franchise QB.
BTW: I hate the University of Oklahoma and I actively rooted against Bradford in college so please don’t think I’m pushing this player for any other reason than that I think he’ll star in the NFL.
My guess is Shanny takes him at #4 overall.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Yes...
I think Shanny will want to start his reign with a franchise QB who can be the face of the franchise. Bradford is that guy.
Committing random acts of Brandon since 2006...
No trade for Jay Cutler????
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
"I think we’re past that. I love the city of Denver. I started there and I’d like to finish there." - Brandon Marshall at the 2010 Pro Bowl
tongue in cheek...
but it does make you wonder…if I were Shanny, I would sure love to groom the guy I drafted…I also think that’s why he’ll make the argument to draft a stud rook QB with their #1 pick.
Committing random acts of Brandon since 2006...
Even with the crappy O line play and the makeshift D line, you would still take a QB, McG?
Like they say on ESPN: “Come on, man!”
by Gristle McThornbody on Feb 7, 2010 8:00 AM MST up reply actions
You can call me crazy, but I guess I think having a great QB is more important.
Orton is decent, but he’ll never be a great QB. One year of sitting on the sideline watching Orton and learning the offense could have Bradford ready for 2011.
You can always draft OGs and 5 techs in round 2 and 3.
Come on man.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
So if you think Brandstater is the answer, why do you want a new QB?
"In the topsy-turvy world of heavy rock, having a good solid piece of wood in your hand is often useful." -Ian Faith
Who the heck said anything about Bradstater? I know I didn’t. He is an average prospect at best. I don’t even know if he has as many tools as Orton.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Brandstater is a much better
prospect then most of the guys you mentioned above. People forget he would probably have been a 2nd round pick if he did not have the 4 OC in 4 years. The guys learned a new offense every year in college and still put up good numbers. I will take Brandstater over pretty much every guy coming out this year. This is just another example of McGeorge hating on one of our rookies
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 7, 2010 3:53 PM MST up reply actions 1 recs
I will take Brandstater
over the likes of Claussen, Tebow, Pike, Snead, McCoy, Canfield. I might even take him over Bradford. I know it was the preseason but Brandstater showed he has all the tools to be a successful QB in the NFL in that last preseason game. He also played against the cardinals starting defense for more then 1 half of that game and played very well
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 7, 2010 3:55 PM MST up reply actions
Thank god you are not the Bronco’s GM. Your ability to objectively evaluate players is ZIP.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Right back at you
you have no idea what you are talking about buddy
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 8, 2010 7:01 PM MST up reply actions
Actually, I’d say this is just another example of you being wasted on the Kool-Aid and talking your usual nonsense. It’s not the first time and trust me, no one with any MHR cred is going to come to your defense on that ramble above.
Good thing you are not an NFL GM. If you were, based on your talent evaluation skills, your team would be about as good as the current Rams.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Dude you act like you have any "Cred"
Most people here can not stand you. I love that you think you are so freaking important. Half the shit I read from you is crap and nonsense. I am surprised anyone buys the bull you type around here. You are just a pessimistic person that see no positives in anything. The only people that think you are worth a damn are the fellow everything in bronco country sucks people. You are one reason MHR is not what it used to be. You still fit in perfect over at the DP blogs.
And for the last time I am far from a Kool aid drinker. Just because I never agree with you does not mean I am a kool aid drinker. I have been critical of multiple players and the coaches through out the season. The difference is I actually say positive things about the team I am a fan of. You just see the negative in everything. You are pretty pathetic. You talk tough on the internet but you would never say half this stuff in person because you would probably get your ass kicked half the time. I guarantee you would not say half the shit you do to me in person.
One last thing. You do not know everything and your opinion is not the end all be all for everyone here. You are entitled to your opinion but you are not entitled to talk down to people. I am surprised you have not been banned yet actually.
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 8, 2010 7:11 PM MST up reply actions
this was supposed to read
“I guarantee you would not say half the shit you say to me in person.”
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 8, 2010 7:13 PM MST up reply actions
Well, I, for one, really enjoy McGeorge's comments.
I don’t agree about some things that McG says, but that’s to be expected at times. It’s not to say that half of his stuff is nonsense. I really appreciate McGeorge’s comments and think that MHR really needs opinions like his.
Certainly, he doesn’t know everything, but neither do any of us. Collectively, we can all learn and grow from other members and be more educated, overall, and that’s why McGeorge is a good member at MHR. He’s one of those guys that gives us a different perspective on things and makes us reassess our preconceived opinions.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
"I think we’re past that. I love the city of Denver. I started there and I’d like to finish there." - Brandon Marshall at the 2010 Pro Bowl
Thats fine and you are welcome to your opinion
but when McGeorge first posted here he was the most hated guy on this site. Do not know what has changed because he hasn’t. He still writes as if he is talking down to you and as if his opinion is right and yours is wrong. He writing comes off as him saying "I am smarter then you’. He has the right to his opinion but my beef with him is how he talks to and treats people. There are ways to say things without coming off as and ass but he chooses to write that way. I believe he is the one of the people that started the Kool aid drinkers term and started using it on anyone that has something positive to say about the Broncos. He was on of the people started the whole Kool aid Drinkers vs the negativity group. He has admitted he came from the DP blogs and you can still see it in his writing. He is not as bad as most of the people over at the DP blog but the tone of his writing is very similar. He does not treat people with enough respect around here. In his mind if you do not agree with his opinion then you are a kool aid drinker and your are wrong.
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 8, 2010 8:47 PM MST up reply actions
Also I do not hate the guy
because I really do not hate anyone. I just disagree with most of the stuff he says and do not like the way he treats people on this site. He loves to insult people. He also words sentences that insult people and words them in ways that says to the other person “you are stupid” I am pretty sure he hates me but still chooses to reply to my post. If you do not like my opinion then do not reply to my post it is that easy. Where I came from if you talked to people the way her does you would be hurting from getting you ass kicked all the time. He is not capable of having a respectable conversation about football.
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 8, 2010 9:09 PM MST up reply actions
True, but a great offensive line will make an average quarterback look good.
It improves the running game and opens up the playbook for longer routes in the passing game.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
"I think we’re past that. I love the city of Denver. I started there and I’d like to finish there." - Brandon Marshall at the 2010 Pro Bowl
by Troy Hufford on Feb 7, 2010 10:41 AM MST up reply actions
Seriously.
Look what Payton Manning does for a below average O-line they have in Indy.
A great QB masks a million more problems than a great O-line. I’d like both, but I’d take a great QB over a great O-line EVERY SINGLE TIME.
Do try to out think yourselves. We all know O-line play is very important, but QBs, then coaches, then great defenses are how NFL games and championships are won.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Fair enough. A legendary future Hall of Fame QB can mask everything.
I’ll give you that. If we can draft Peyton Manning 2.0, I’m all for it.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
"I think we’re past that. I love the city of Denver. I started there and I’d like to finish there." - Brandon Marshall at the 2010 Pro Bowl
Dunno if a legendary HOF QB can mask everything.
- 7 couldn’t cover up several other shortcomings of a few DEN SB teams.
- Nick
"We got 'em right where we want 'em!" - Keith Bishop, right before John Elway orchestrated The Drive. 'Nuff said.
Another valid point.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
"I think we’re past that. I love the city of Denver. I started there and I’d like to finish there." - Brandon Marshall at the 2010 Pro Bowl
Problem is....
I’m 100% sure there is no Manning 2.0 in this draft. HOF QB’s are EXTREMELY rare. P. Manning was one of those few QBs who was basically a consensus #1 pick. We’re talking about the best of these guys (Bradford) potentially falling to #10….
We are extremely spoiled as fans these days with the quality of QB play in the league as a whole.
Think about the number of not just good, but great QBs in the league the past decade:
P.Manning, B. Farve, T. Brady, K. Warner… there is 4 HOFers. How often do you have 4 sure-fire HOF QBs playing at the same time?
Because of this (and a number of other very good QBs like McNabb, Rivers and Roethlisberger), I think folks have completely unrealistic expectations of QB play.
Our QB just threw for 3800 yards in his first year in a new system…. and folks think we need a BETTER player? The chances of getting one are miniscule! Everybody remembers the Flaccos and Ryans, but conveniently forgets about the R.Leafs, Harringtons, Couch’s, Carr’s, A. Smiths, etc… all of those guys were considered almost “sure things”….
Basically, I think if Bradford falls to #10, you gotta take him. Before his injury, he was considered a consensus #1 pick kind-of-guy… you just can’t pass on that type of BPA, even if hes really risky because of injury, etc….
However, thinking that ANY of the QBs in this draft has more than a ~50% chance to be better than Orton was this year, to me seems like crazy wishful thinking.
QB stats in 2009 are much different than they were ten or 20 years ago. You’re comparing apples to oranges.
Current NFL rules favor WRs and QBs. Hell you can even hit QBs anymore. If QB of the last two decades had played with similar rules and similar passing Os, their stats would reflect this.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Like Archie Manning did
A great QB masks a million more problems than a great O-line. I’d like both, but I’d take a great QB over a great O-line EVERY SINGLE TIME.
And Ken Anderson
Take it easy. But take it. Studs Terkel
You can’t be serious. I could name 10 great QBs with bad or average O-lines that won Super Bowls.
I can’t name one bad or average QB that had a great O-line and won Super Bowls.
Maybe you can, but it would still be 10 to 1 in favor of the importance of excellent QB play being the key factor in winning Super Bowls vs a great O-line.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Trent Dilfer
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
"I think we’re past that. I love the city of Denver. I started there and I’d like to finish there." - Brandon Marshall at the 2010 Pro Bowl
Baltimore had an All Time D, not a all Time O-line.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Yes, that and a pretty good running game.
They had two games over 200 yards rushing and only five games (including playoffs) did they rush for under 100 yards. Combined between Lewis and Holmes they had over 1900 yards rushing.
They had only one “pro bowl” offensive linemen, but everyone knows that pro bowls aren’t the true measure of a player.
The only thing that held their offense back was a lack of explosive WRs and a poor Quarterback. You can’t put that blame on the offensive line or runningbacks, though. They did their part.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
"I think we’re past that. I love the city of Denver. I started there and I’d like to finish there." - Brandon Marshall at the 2010 Pro Bowl
You are off your chops if you think Bradford, or any of the hacks in this years draft will be great!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
I’ll remember to rub this in your face next offseason when a few of this year’s QBs turn out to be awesome.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Go for ir....
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
Boydy...no more kool-aid for you
Cmon man…seriously? There are some very very good prospects in this years draft. I think you are just being contrary. Like anyone though Roethlisburger was going to be good…or Flacco…right?
"Precipitation, which side are you on?
Are you on the rise? Are you falling down?
Let me know, Come on let's go, yeah
Got some if you need it!" -EV
Really thats why most people
that cover the draft professionally say this is a WEAK QB draft
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 8, 2010 7:15 PM MST up reply actions
I hate having to think about Shanahan with another team.
Especially a Shanahan who is fresh and realizes he needs to change his approach a little. Washington might be dangerous. Sadly, if he had stayed in Denver, he would never have gotten that push to reflect on himself as a coach, and never would have gotten better.
-Harvey J. Neptune
"Practice doesn't make perfect. PERFECT practice makes perfect." - Vince Lombardi
I do not think Shanny will draft a QB
I think he goes LT with someone like Okung. The Redskins Oline is bad so I think he will fix that first
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 7, 2010 10:27 AM MST up reply actions
I think Shanny builds similar to the Jets and Ravens, not the Lions.
Look at teams like the Jets and the Ravens. They built a great defense, a great running game, great lines… THEN drafted their future QB. Each of those teams are a reciever, or so, away from the big game.
Then look at the Lions. They drafted a falshy new QB before they developed a line capable of keeping him on the field healthy, or a defense that was capable of keeping him off the field. It’s no surprise that he was injured last year, and that they’re again drafting top-two.
Good luck with the Redskins Mr. Mike! I'll be watching and cheering for a non-Bronco team for the first time in my life. Well, except when they play the Broncos!
Exactly. Cutler had to play behind a strung out drugged up junkie LT (Lepsis), and a joke of player in Pears.
Shanny will take his QB first.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
really that was the same Oline that had us at 7-4 before culter was put in
and was coming off a trip to the AFC Championship game. They were not as bad as you seem to remember
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 7, 2010 3:57 PM MST up reply actions
point remains...
that line was an AFC championship quality line just the season previous, and had the team at 7-4 despite Plummer’s complete implosion (~65 QB rating) under the pressure of having the rookie behind him.
I do agree with you there...
the Skins line is atrocious. I think that’s what bothered me so much about our loss to them, they actually move the ball on us with relative ease…Ugh…still blocking that game out. As a DC native, that one hurt.
It ought to be interesting…same guy who drafted Cutler, also drafted Clady, so there’s clearly a precedent. Of course he already had his stud QB, whereas the Skins have nothing but Lionel Richie.
Committing random acts of Brandon since 2006...
HELLLOOO
I’ve been alone with you inside my mind…..
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
NEVER EVER WOULD I TAKE BRADFORD...GLASS QB WITH NO ARM....NO THANKS!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
I am with you Boydy . . .
Bradford has shown me little in the way of durabiltiy. One good hit, and he is done. He is not tough enough, in my opinion, to take the punishment of the NFL.
"The men who have done big things are those who are not afraid to attempt big things, who were not afraid to risk failure in order to gain success."
- B.C Forbes
i like Snead....
but his scrambling ability might not get showcased in our system.
-Harvey J. Neptune
"Practice doesn't make perfect. PERFECT practice makes perfect." - Vince Lombardi
The Only one I like out of that
group is Bradford. The rest will take longer to develop. Claussen is was overrated and should not go in the Top 20. Pike, Snead, Canfield will all go in or after round 3. McCoy will be lucky to go in round 2. I was simply stating their is not that can’t miss QB coming out this year. I do not want a good QB prospect with my first round pick. If we use the 1st round pick it better be on a great prospect.
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 7, 2010 10:14 AM MST up reply actions
But that goes back to my point that great QB prospects like the Manning bros, Palmer, Rivers, McNabb, Matt Ryan, Sanchez, Stafford, etc, NEVER fall out of the Top 5.
Denver has not picked in the Top 10 since the very early 1990s and not since the early 80s before that. That is one Top 10 pick in a generation.
Bradford, if he was available (and again, I don’t think he’ll fall to us), would be the best QB prospect Denver had a shot at drafting in two+ decades. Our QB is Kyle Orton. I think we can do better in the long run than Orton. If Bradford fell to us, we’d be crazy to pass on him. INSANE.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Don't be surprised
If Bradford falls to us at 10. A QB coming off shoulder surgery will fall a few spots in the draft. That issue will ultimately determine Bradfords fate, I just don’t like a QB coming off a major injury to his throwing shoulder. He is greatly skilled but don’t be surprised to see him fall 5 spots due to this McGeorge. You could very well get your wish.
by northoftheborder on Feb 7, 2010 1:34 PM MST up reply actions
I’d piss my pants if Bradford fell to us. His injury was not that bad and he’ll be ready to go 100% by training camp, likely several months earlier.
With Buffalo (at 9 and hating on Trent Edwards) and Seattle (Senica Wallace? Nah) picking ahead of us, he won’t make it all the way to 10 or 11.
I don’t think he makes it out of the Top 5.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Was it 2 separate injuries this year?
Or just reaggravating the first injury his first game back? I’ve never been a big fan of the kid, so I don’t know much about his soph injury. Was it to the same shoulder, or was it something else?
- Nick
"We got 'em right where we want 'em!" - Keith Bishop, right before John Elway orchestrated The Drive. 'Nuff said.
It was a reaggravation of his 1st injury. Again, nothing as serious as a torn ACL or Tommy John surgery.
Kyle Orton is also injury prone.
No prospect is perfect and Branford’s injury history is a noteable negative on his resume. If that negative pushes an elite prospect to Denver at 10, I’d thank our lucky stars. If he’s as good as several scouts think he is, it could change the course of Denver’s future for a decade.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Sorry, not to be dense
But I was asking two different questions.
1.) Were the two injuries his Sr year basically one injury that was reaggravated? (I think you answered that.)
2.) What was the injury his soph year?
Sadly, I agree with what you said about Orton here. I have always been big on Orton, going back to Purdue. For a QB who was already not exactly mobile to suffer several severe ankle injuries in a few seasons is very troubling to me.
- Nick
"We got 'em right where we want 'em!" - Keith Bishop, right before John Elway orchestrated The Drive. 'Nuff said.
I dont think Orton is injury prone . The finger was a freak injury and
the ankle injuries both came on him scrambling . The fact is he is a pocket passer and he shouldnt be scrambling . If manning hurts his ankles running two years in the row they are not gonna say manning is injury prone they are gonna say we have got to do a better job of protecting him so that he doesnt have to run and increase the risk of injury .
I like Bradford but Im not so sure about giving a rookie QB 40-50 mil when Im not so sure he could beat out Orton this year or the next.
If he didn't hurt his shoulder...
We would be talking about him as the #1 pick in the draft. His shoulder injury has already hurt his draft status. I like him too McGeorge but a shoulder injury to a QB( Throwing Shoulder only) is like tearing your acl or mcl for any of the skilled positions.
by northoftheborder on Feb 7, 2010 1:47 PM MST up reply actions
I hope you’re right and he falls to us at Ten. Maybe I should wish upon a star that he doesn’t heal in time to throw for teams in the Top 10.
He would have been a Top 5 pick in the 2009 draft had he entered.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
If we draft him
He would have a year or two to develop and get stronger with proper weight training and nutrition. Just those two injuries will still scare a lot of teams especially since he doesn’t have the strongest of arms to begin with ( definitely not a pee shooter). A third injury and we would be talking about Pennington in terms of durability with the shoulder joint. Huge upside but equally huge risk in terms of durability.
by northoftheborder on Feb 7, 2010 2:02 PM MST up reply actions
that is actually something to watch for...
Oklahoma’s pro day will be in midmarch sometime, and that will be the first time he has thrown in a while. He may be:
a)not ready to throw yet, which could drop him, since teams who are looking at him will also be looking at Clausen
b)not throw well, which could really benefit teams that have the luxury of starting a quality guy ahead of him while he gets back to 100%
We are definitely in agreement that Bradford is the guy to have, but yeah, if he is what we think he is, he’ll be gone. If we don’t get Bradford, but we take a QB, I’ll be a little disappointed. From the sounds of the Bowlen interview, we won’t wait longer than the second to take a QB if certain guys are there….
Precision in thought, concision in style, decision in life.
"That's MR.Styg..."
by Jeremy Bolander on Feb 7, 2010 2:34 PM MST up reply actions
Top 10 in the draft
St. Louis (1-15)- need a QB but is not going to pass up on Suh
Detroit (2-14)-does not need a QB will take McCoy from OU
Tampa Bay (3-13)-Does not need a QB
Washington (4-12)-Needs a QB but shanny is unpredictable. I think he goes Oline
Kansas City (4-12)-Does not need a QB
Seattle (5-11)-Carrol said he was happy with Hasselbeck. I think he will wait a year for a chance at the local kid lockler
Cleveland (5-11)-Not going to take a QB with the money they have invested in Quinn and Anderson
Oakland (5-11)-Not going to take a QB
Buffalo (6-10)- The could take a QB but I do not think Bradford fits their system.
Jacksonville^ (7-9)- I think they are happy with Garrard and have much bigger needs
Denver – from Chicago^ (7-9)-We could go multiple ways. If Bradford falls I might actually be happy we drafted him. I think he was a hell of a player at Oklahoma and has the tools to play at the next level. My only concern about him is his injury history and he sometimes panics under pressure. He also did not take a lot of snaps from under center at OU. I love the kid because I am a big OU Fan. I Kinda hope he has a bad combine so he has a better chance of falling to us.
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 7, 2010 4:07 PM MST up reply actions
Seattle
Has to take him
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
But can they protect him?
I tend to think Seattle has to go tackle at 6. Just IMO.
"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars."-- Oscar Wilde
by PredominantlyOrange on Feb 8, 2010 11:56 AM MST up reply actions
I disagree. I think
he could easily fall to us at 10. The only team I think that will take a QB in the top 10 is the redskins and possibly buffalo. He could very easily be there at 10
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 7, 2010 4:00 PM MST up reply actions
The Seahawks will look to take a QB. Locker will be the #1 overall pick in 2011, you think Carroll wants to plan on being the worst team in the NFL next season so he has a shot at the local guy? Come on.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
I'm with McGeorge here
Seattle will absolutely take him if he’s there. Hasselback doesn’t have much left in the tank and hasn’t been consistent for a couple years anyhow.
"Precipitation, which side are you on?
Are you on the rise? Are you falling down?
Let me know, Come on let's go, yeah
Got some if you need it!" -EV
I am 99% positive Seattle does not take a QB
Hasslebeck is not half bad when you give him an oline that can protect him. Their oline is horrible up there. They will OT with their first pick and defense with their 2nd pick
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 8, 2010 7:17 PM MST up reply actions
The only QB I would take in the first is Bradford
I like Dan LaFevour a little. He looked pretty good in the Senior Bowl. I like his size at 6’3 and 238. He has good arm strength and showed good accuracy at the senior bowl. LaFevour is also very good scrambling out of the pocket. I am an Oklahoma fan but Bradford worries be a little with his size. He seems a little fragile. I do not know if he could take the hits you get at the next level
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 7, 2010 10:25 AM MST up reply actions
So I guess that Bowlen doesn't think
Brandstater is progressing well? Why did we pick a QB last year if we were gonna have one this year?
-Harvey J. Neptune
"Practice doesn't make perfect. PERFECT practice makes perfect." - Vince Lombardi
Great read John, thanks for bringing it to our attention.
I have a great deal of respect for Pat Bowlen, and to hear him back McDaniels and express a desire to see Marshall stay are both major positives for the direction that the Broncos are going (IMHO).
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough
So am I reading this correctly
Bowlen says he’d like to keep Marshall several times during the interview. To me that means “I want Marshall on the team and I’m willing to pay for it.” Is that a reasonable assumption? He said Marshall is due a raise early in the season, and now he says this. So obviously to him money isn’t an issue with respect to Marshall.
You’ll have to wait a few more weeks to know if your assumption is reasonable (or better said) accurate. A lot can change in a month, even Feb as we’ve learned with McDaniels.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
We’ve learned it with Brandon as well. I’m curious to see if he really has changed or if we’ll be reading about another incident.
He finally seems to have heard the message that trouble = no $.
If Brandon loves money as much as I think he does, I believe we’ve seen the last of his legal troubles.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
At least until after he gets a new long term deal
with a good chunk of guaranteed money.
- Nick
"We got 'em right where we want 'em!" - Keith Bishop, right before John Elway orchestrated The Drive. 'Nuff said.
Good players always make a lot more money than the guaranteed portion of their contract. Champ only had something like $12MM guaranteed on his deal, yet he’s made about $50MM as a Bronco and will pocket another $12MM in 2010.
Some guys know they are lucky to get a big signing bonus (a semi talent like G Warren comes to mind), others with actual elite talent (like BM) know a 2nd big deal may await in his early 30s. It’s good motivation.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
I agree with that.
But it looks to me like a big part of Marshall’s issues (on and off the field) stem from an impulse control problem. Oftentimes, a player in a contract year (Haynesworth) will play great and be a ‘model citizen,’ then revert back to being an underachiever after they get the big deal. In a similar vein, players who know another big deal may await them still act like petulant children after signing a deal (TO springs to mind), maybe because they just can’t control themselves?
I hope Marshall has his mind right for good this time, but hopefully you can understand my skepticism. Until he shows that he can act like a mature professional for more than a few months at a time, I’m going to wait and see. I hold out hope that you’re correct, and that we’ve seen the last of his legal troubles because I’ve seen him do some good things as a person. On a secondary (and more selfish) level, I hope the “new and improved” Marshall remains in Denver for his entire career.
- Nick
"We got 'em right where we want 'em!" - Keith Bishop, right before John Elway orchestrated The Drive. 'Nuff said.
Haynesworth has been a great player for several years. He, like Marshall, has elite talent. Albert has a history of injures, but he has never been a Gerard Warren type that put together one flash in the pan season. Haynesworth is the truth.
When has Marshall ever been an underachiever? My biggest complaint with Marshall is that he plays too hard (recklessly) and one of these days, he’ll take a shot to his leg that puts him out of commission for a long time. He needs to be more like Marvin Harrison and dive to ground like a sissy after more of his catches. But Marshall doesn’t play smart sissy ball like Harrison. Instead, he tries to make something happen just about every time he touches the ball (much to my chagrin).
If we trade Marshall, it might be ten or twenty years before we get another WR with his talents and production.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Haynesworth put together two great seasons before his payday
Both of which could have fairly been called “contract years.”
- Nick
"We got 'em right where we want 'em!" - Keith Bishop, right before John Elway orchestrated The Drive. 'Nuff said.
No. He has several good to great years on his rookie deal. He was rightly considered the best D-linemen in the NFL for a few years.
Tennessee literally won and lost several games because he either played or was injured.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
I never followed TEN super close
But I seem to remember his “great” or “dominant” seasons being those in which he was eligible for RFA and UFA.
- Nick
"We got 'em right where we want 'em!" - Keith Bishop, right before John Elway orchestrated The Drive. 'Nuff said.
And I am having a hard time speaking today, sorry.
I never said Marshall is an underachiever. I was using the classing “underachiever who steps up for money, then reverts” example to illustrate my theory about players who have legal troubles and other behavioral/disruption problems, and how they might show a similar pattern. Control themselves and do whatever they have to in order to get what they want, then become a headache again after getting theirs.
- Nick
"We got 'em right where we want 'em!" - Keith Bishop, right before John Elway orchestrated The Drive. 'Nuff said.
I would be lying if I said it wasn’t a possibility and I don’t have a rep at MHR as a liar. Giving BM a new deal does scare me a bit. Don’t know if I’d do it with my money. And I’d take a deep breath signing that contract if I was Bowlen.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Hahahhaahah
That’s an interesting thought. I wonder if Mr. Bowlen ever looks at how well all of us would spend his money…
- Nick
"We got 'em right where we want 'em!" - Keith Bishop, right before John Elway orchestrated The Drive. 'Nuff said.
Therein lies the rub,...
…because the calculus is easy if this was all about Brandon Marshall on NFL Sundays.
But, alas, it is not.
So this is war...misfortune at every bend in the road. Misery and murdered mules and sudden death in a ditch.-- Rick Atkinson
by PredominantlyOrange on Feb 7, 2010 2:46 PM MST up reply actions
I also understand your skepticism.
Giving him money is a high risk high reward proposition.
But trading him for draft picks is more of a high risk medium reward proposition (IMO).
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Agreed.
And you should boycott “high risk medium reward”….sheer awesomeness!
- Nick
"We got 'em right where we want 'em!" - Keith Bishop, right before John Elway orchestrated The Drive. 'Nuff said.
I mean TRADEMARK that saying!
See what I mean about having trouble with the English language today? Jeez, I have no idea where the hell I got “boycott” from for that context…..
- Nick
"We got 'em right where we want 'em!" - Keith Bishop, right before John Elway orchestrated The Drive. 'Nuff said.
yeahhh... bowlen also said he wanted to keep cutler.
i think he called him his “franchise quarterback.”
much as i like bowlen, he’s not always accurate with his word. that’s not to say he’s a liar so much as an… imprecise speaker.
I don't know if I would say inprecise
He let’s the Coach coach so to speak. He has his opinion, but he is pretty hands off when letting the Coach do what he thinks is best for the team. Though in relation to Cutler, Bowlen probably changed his mind pretty fast when Jay didn’t call back.
I'm glad we had this talk.
(signature courtesy of TJ Johnson)
by BroncoInExile on Feb 7, 2010 12:29 AM MST up reply actions
i'm just sayin'
… he once called broncos fans “his fans”, he said zimmerman was the second best bronco ever—a week after he said the exact same thing about rod smith. he referred to the navy blue uniforms as predominantly orange and said that shanahan was his “coach for life.” for someone who speaks barely more than garbo, that’s a nice collection of imprecision. heck, bowlen himself has even said he’s not a good speaker. he’s an intelligent man but he’s just not the best speaker. that’s okay. we can still like him.
I like this:
that’s okay. we can still like him. :) He’s also stated that he’s getting more forgetful at his age lately.
I'm glad we had this talk.
(signature courtesy of TJ Johnson)
by BroncoInExile on Feb 7, 2010 2:07 AM MST up reply actions
i know, huh.
as a matter of fact, the last few times i’ve actually seen him talk i got a little concerned. this particular interview though seems very lucid and flowing, so hopefully i was misreading or he was just going through a phase. :-)
He also said
He hopes Brandon is wondering if going to another team is the right thing to do….
That’s so Aes Sedai…. He’s not necessarily saying whether he hopes Brandon’s thinking about moving to another team and realizing Denver is the place for him, or that Brandon’s thinking about moving to another team and realizing that would be the right thing for him….
Just like mid-season or so when he said ‘Brandon has earned his paycheck’ – that doesn’t mean with Us….
Anyway, that’s what I love about Our owner, he never lies. He is straight up, even when it hurts, which is always best… Even if sometimes, it can seem like he takes f-o – r – e – v – e- r to let us or even the media know what is going on.
But in this, I anticipate next season much more than I did last season (that feels like de-ja-va from after the ’97 season, oddly enough).
First team to three consecutive SB wins!!!! and then some, right? I think four and someone else oughtta have a 'fair' shot ( =
by PearlJamBroncoGFunk on Feb 6, 2010 11:50 PM MST up reply actions
+1 for the Robert Jordan reference :)
"Brandon Marshall will be a happy BRONCO WR in 2010"
Broncotodd - 2009
"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."
John Adams
Hey now
Girls don’t always rule… They can be just as evil as anyone (just ribbin’ ye), and I’m sure everyone realized I was referencing de-ja-vu of course, as opposed to de-ja-va which strictly applies to females…. Which is why MHR’s Girl was like ‘YES!!!’ – jk, and thank you for catching the WOT reference, but remember the Wheel has been broken many a times, and now Aes Sedai are not all female as some may be accustomed to thinking.
; )
First team to three consecutive SB wins!!!! and then some, right? I think four and someone else oughtta have a 'fair' shot ( =
by PearlJamBroncoGFunk on Feb 7, 2010 10:15 PM MST up reply actions
Thanks John!
I’ll check DenverBroncos.com sometimes before I come here, but it’s hilarious because even when I do (as I did tonight) – even if db.com has a mention/link to something in, say, thedenverpost.com or whatever, I will still come here to get the overall of anything possible and such…. then proceed to the link from here…
Which brings me to a somewhat sadder note, it was good to have Horse Tracks…. y’know…. Did Doug copyright the phrase/do We have any leads to get someone with the time and kindred awesome-ness to provide MHR with said similar gist of everything – on – the – interent – Broncos?
If I ever get wealthy enough, I will certainly take the time to contribute in a much more concentrated and openly beneficial fashion. Thank you some more, again, still.
First team to three consecutive SB wins!!!! and then some, right? I think four and someone else oughtta have a 'fair' shot ( =
by PearlJamBroncoGFunk on Feb 7, 2010 12:00 AM MST reply actions
Thanks, John.
Interesting read.
"All by their heads, he places crowns."
Matt Prater, pre-2009 season: Despised, lambasted, Josh McDaniels is derided for not replacing him.
Matt Prater, post-2009 season: Loved, praised, everone forgets the time when they called Josh McDaniels an idiot for not replacing him.
by Tempestuous Binary on Feb 7, 2010 1:33 AM MST reply actions
Screw The Haters
Mr. Bowlen has spoken and for all those a-holes and hacks who say the best owner in sports has lost his mind, he’s in charge and you’re not. All I can say is thank heaven that’s the case because if Woody Paige and other MSM morons were calling the shots, this team would be worse than the Lions. We do have a bright future, we will win, there will be a new CBA in time and the Super Bowl will be epic in a few hours. That is all. I’m not a Pollyanna, I’m quixotic in my approach. The Broncos will not let me down and thanks again Mr. Bowlen!
Brad James
by the new Bradfather on Feb 7, 2010 1:39 AM MST reply actions
Wow
You have high hopes
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
Sounds like Marshall may very well be fine in Denver..
if he wants to be.
Mr B’s comment on the QB has me concerned….I have to assume that he does know how Brandstater is/isn’t progressing, so that doesn’t look good for Tom B…. if that’s the case, they shouldn’t pussy foot around if Bradford is available at 10/11. No other QB this year looks to be much more than Brandstater IMHO.
This will certainly change up the mocks a bit LOL.
"Brandon Marshall will be a happy BRONCO WR in 2010"
Broncotodd - 2009
"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."
John Adams
I wouldnt read too much into his statements
At this time of year owners and coaches are always saying things.. This could just be a ploy to drive up the trade costs for Marshall and lower Ortons asking demands.
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
Agreed
If he really thought Orton was the be all, end all, he would have said so with a louder endorsement.
Orton is going to get a 1 year deal as we tag him as a restricted FA. My guess, he gets a 1st round tender and no team will surrender that kind of bounty to sign him. Orton is getting screwed as much as anyone by the lack of a new CBA. He just had a career year and he’ll be back in 2010 making less than 1/3 of what lesser QBs like Cassell make and he’ll be on a one year deal with no signing bonus.
I’m curious to see how he reacts.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
i dont think he will be tendered
I think that he will get a deal that is fair to both him and the broncos in the 3-5 year range!
Davis and Sharpe to the Hall!
"Teamwork divides the task and double the success."
- Unknown
by Jon Tollerud on Feb 7, 2010 10:09 AM MST up reply actions
Why would Denver when we don’t have to give him a fair deal.
Just listen to Bowlen. He signs the checks and he doesn’t sound like an owner in love with his QB. Bowlen, like me, sounds like he thinks Orton is decent, but not the LT answer at QB.
BTW, give me one example of a QB in his prime and coming off a career year like Orton signing a 3 year deal. Don’t waste your time because you won’t be able to.
Would you really want Denver giving Orton a 5 year deal?
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Bowlen said we wanted Orton back what more could he say when contracts are still up in the air ?
How much do you think Ortons price tag goes up if Bowlen says I think Ortons a franchise QB ?
We have no one behind Orton so of course we should be getting a young QB who if Orton were to go down we would be okay with taking the lumps with . But it doesnt mean that we are looking for Ortons replacement . We struck out last year in the veteran fa QB market(3 mil per year to Simms ) so whose to say we arent trying to go different route this year in obtaining a backup/future starter ?
Orton, like Marshall, doesn’t hold many cards. Bowlen can say whatever he wants this offseason. It won’t effect how much he has to pay Orton when he can just tag him and move on.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Actually he does hold some cards . You cant say how important the QB position is and then say a QB doesnt hold any cards .
Why would he just tag him ? Again its a negotiation and Orton has been the ultimate team guy and played well even better than the majority thought he would .
Why also wouldnt we want to give Orton a 5 year deal ? If we could give Orton a 5 year deal around 50-55 if he meets his incentives i would love it because it would allow us to really create a sound financial plan starting with the teams most important position.
I think you and I are talking two different things. You seem to see Orton as a long term player for Denver and I don’t.
If Bowlen doesn’t have Orton is his long term plans (and it sounds like he doesn’t), it doesn’t matter what anyone says since Denver will just tag Orton for 2010 and see what 2011 brings.
Orton is the easiest decision Denver has to make this offseason. Give Orton a 1st round tender and move on to Elvis, BM and Kuper.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
If you give Orton a 5 year deal
I’ll smash my head against the wall in fustration. He hasnt done enough to warrant a 5 year deal. Even his biggest supporters would have a hard time justifying it.
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
here is why
Orton has done nothing but what is asked of him, you can argue this all you want but he came in and was asked to learn a new system and not make a ton of mistakes. I think he did that very well to be honest. I am not sure Orton is the long term answer, the last real QB i was behind here was Plummer! I think Orton and the Broncos will sit down be straight with each other and we will see the outcome! I do think that Orton will get a 5 five year deal because even if someone surpasses him on the depth chart at some point, it still pays to have a good backup!
Davis and Sharpe to the Hall!
"Teamwork divides the task and double the success."
- Unknown
by Jon Tollerud on Feb 7, 2010 10:26 PM MST up reply actions
If Orton is willing to take a 5 year deal at backup QB pay, I’ll eat my shoe and then I’ll eat yours.
I generally like you posts and think you know football quite well, but that last point you made about a 5 year deal and being our back up shows me you don’t understand the business/contract side of the NFL. Not even a little bit.
If Orton gets a 5 year deal, it will be based on how much comparable guys like Cassel make. It would be real damn expensive. Orton didn’t play like a back up in 2009, he played like a decent starter and decent starters make about $6-$8.5MM per season with a big signing bonus. That ain’t back up money.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
ok I may have not stated it well enough
I am very good at that. The Broncos can front load the contract to the point that it can be comparably lower in the last two years to justify it as a back up or re negotiation time. I think Orton would take a deal like that. I am not saying we pay the man a 5 year 10 million contract I don’t think he would take that. Lets say we give him a 5 year 40 million contract with 18 gar. (just a theory number) and we ensure that the majority of that money is in the first three years which as you say are the years we should use him for. Then he spends a few years grooming our next QB, nothing he does or says tells me he is all about the money.
As for me, I will never admit to knowing much about the business side, I was a player which at the high school stage isnt about cash, even the college level isnt about that so I wouldnt have a clue!
Always fun McG
Davis and Sharpe to the Hall!
"Teamwork divides the task and double the success."
- Unknown
McGeorge..he will react the same way as if he just won the SB. AH jeez we are proud to compete at this high level.
Remember, KO stated “all football players get paid too much for what we do”.
from McGeorge
I’m curious to see how he reacts.
It is possible that we are already seeing how he will react. Even us out of the loop fans can see pretty clearly what is going on with the CBA negotiations, so there is no way that Marshall’s agent is blind to the most likely scenario here.
Marshall sounds like he is getting right, preparing for a year of playing under a high RFA tender. He can’t do it without teammates, so he seems like he is getting his head right to rejoin the team and the coaches.
This really indicates that maybe he and his agent just got ahead of themselves in trying to “bust” him out of denver…but economic reality has a way of setting in. But also, Brandon doesn’t seem as fully in control of this situation as, say, Bus and Jay were. I think Brandon’s impulsiveness has inflamed this situation a few times, which will always be a concern unrelated to whether he is a Bronco or not…
Bottom line is that what we may be witnessing is his reintegration into the Broncos, in a steady, controlled manner that leaves as many doors open behind him as possible. It looks so different from his normal path with all its burned bridges…
Precision in thought, concision in style, decision in life.
"That's MR.Styg..."
by Jeremy Bolander on Feb 7, 2010 2:46 PM MST up reply actions
If Denver puts a 1st and 3rd on BM, I think three or four teams give up those expensive 1st round picks to sign a sure fire Pro Bowl player.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
That's the risk
I don’t envy McX on this process.They have to be tempted to see what happens to a BMarsh with a payday… but at the same time, they wouldn’t be looking forward to, at any moment, getting “the call” when something is starting to unravel in beastland. Marshall is just one of those guys where he could have 7 solid months of on and off he field behavior, and then out of nowhere…
On the other hand, two high draft picks in a draft where we will have opportunities, but need more flexibility, has to be very tempting as well. It is a much more conservative approach, not in terms of what is gained, but in terms of what is risked…
I lean towards this organization being risk averse this offseason, but if they aren’t, I won’t be surprised. Bowlen is kind of funny that way.
Precision in thought, concision in style, decision in life.
"That's MR.Styg..."
by Jeremy Bolander on Feb 7, 2010 3:38 PM MST up reply actions
When did the draft ever become a risk adverse approach?
Marshall is a sure fire NFL super star. I don’t think any team would rather have a chance to draft the likes of Ayers and Quinn (1st and 3rd) for Marshall.
I understand that giving Marshall a big deal is risky. I agree. But so is trading him for draft picks that may or may not prove out as NFL players. Even in the 2010 draft, the 1st round will be littered with BUSTS, it always is.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Just like he got screwed last year
Making less than the second string quarterback the whole year. That pissed me off, not that I have any worthy place in the matter, but damn….
First team to three consecutive SB wins!!!! and then some, right? I think four and someone else oughtta have a 'fair' shot ( =
by PearlJamBroncoGFunk on Feb 7, 2010 10:17 PM MST up reply actions
Marshall made less than Royal, he made less than Gaffney and he made a lot less than Stokley, yet BM is single handedly far more effective, productive and better than all three combined.
Orton, Marshall and Elvis are all vastly underpaid.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
I really like Orton
I’m not saying he is Manning or Brees, but i think ha can be a pretty good QB. I am going to wait until we get our O-Line set, & our running game up to par, before I make a final judjement on Kyle.
I tend to sit on the other side of the fence
I think a great QB helps make those other positions. Great QB’s can overcome the teams deficiencies. Orton is a QB who can look good but like you said, he needs all the pieces of the puzzle in place around him.
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
yes great QBs can overcome a teams deficiencies for a game but please name me some that have done it for a season(s)
Even the great ones need talent around them . Teams who forget that fall into the same sort of trap the bears did .
With youngsters like Clady, Harris and Kuper on the O-line, Denver has more than it’s fair share of O-line talent.
We could use a much better LG, but that is only because Hoch and Ben sucked so so so bad. Denver would be wise to plug average players into LG and C. Spend more money where it is needed (D-line and QB).
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
we wanna be a power running team that requires a power line so we just cant plug in average players
when the O-line is key to everything we do offensively . The QB position is fine when he has protection just as the run game was awesome when they had solid blocking .
In a league with a salary cap, you must have average players somewhere in the lineup. Not team is full of stars across the board because they can’t fit that under the cap. It’s why guys like Micheal Turner leave SD.
We can have average players at O-line so long as they are the right kind of average players and we have above average players at RB, QB or WR.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
I feel that Orton is a above average QB and so I dont feel the need to use that pick on replacing him but instead
would use it on strengthening the talent around him. Of course not everyone is a star in the nfl but when you know that you can win games if you protect your QB then you find the best line available you dont try and find a QB who doesnt need as much protection.
Which is easier to find ? a quality linemen to step in or a QB who doesnt need protecting ?
AS bird in hand beats two in the bush everytime . If Orton was two years older I would probably feel differently but at 27 I feel he can more than get the job done .
I don’t think Orton could ever string together three wins vs the likes of Manning, Rivers, Brady and Brees.
He may be above average, I guess I think he is. But not much above average and no where near elite as a QB.
A lot of NFL QBs could be very good surrounded by an awesome O-line, big time WR and 1st round RB.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
None of the guys you did either .....BY THEMSELVES
Not one of those Qbs have one a SB or won in the playoffs by themselves .
The saints just won the SB but people forget how many 3 and outs they had against the Vikings and how the defense came up big throughout that game . Brees himself even said the key was just managing the game and not hurting the defense.
The Saints tonight had fantastic special teams play and defensive play and without those things they dont win tonight.
Brees didnt beat Manning the SAINTS did . They also beat FAVRE and Warner . They are not playing one on one and the Saints won not because Brees is better than those Qbs but because overall they had a much better and balanced team in all three phases .
I wont even get into the fact that we beat ROMO,BRADY,RIVERS in consecutive games this season but it was not one man but the entire team .
Of course alot of Qbs could be good surrounded by talent and thats what those teams try to achieve they dont keep rolling the dice trying thinking HOF QB or bust . Its much much easier to fill in those pieces than to strike gold on a HOF Qb .
Never say ever
KO is still a youngster with lots of potential to improve. He can be every bit as good as Brees if he continues to improve. Look at Orton’s trend dude. The position is all about IQ and Orton has what it takes. Forget about drafting a ? in the 1st round.
I don’t think there is a smart football person (NFL GM or decision maker) on the planet that thinks Orton can become as good as Brees.
Orton is a decent starting QB in the NFL, but he has never been anywhere near elite.
His lack of athletic ability, his injury prone body and struggles with accuracy will always prevent him from reaching this level.
If other’s think he is as good as you do, he’ll get signed by another team this offseason and the Broncos will get a very high draft pick in return. I’ll gladly admit I was wrong and I’ll also point out that the team that just gave Orton a big deal is going to regret it.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Yes KO is
decent/above average after 48 starts in his career. Most QBs don’t reach their peak until their 30s. Imo, Orton hasn’t come close to reaching his full potential. Is he as athletic as Elway, Favre, or Brees? No, but I think it’s a mistake to label him as having a lack of athletic ability. There have been many elite QBs with about the same god given athleticism. There were ? about Brees, Favre, and many great players early in their careers. I also believe you’re jumping to premature conclusions about injuries and his accuracy…His accuracy has improved every season and was never an issue at Purdue. He’s had his share of injuries, but has only missed two starts out of 50 games.
Kyle would be an instant starter on many teams that are in need of a QB. Cardinals, Titans, Raiders, Bills, Vikings(if Favre retires), and 49ers just to name a few. He’s a perfect fit with the Vikings and Cardinals, who both would only be parting with a 1st round pick in the high 20s. That would be a great bargain for both teams. Broncos going to risk getting stuck with the 29th pick in exchange for Orton? Then what? Draft an unproven and questionable QB in the 1st round? what are the odds of a Bradford or McCoy working out or ending up better than Orton is? Very low that’s what history has proven. Imo, the Broncos see the same scenario and will end up resigning Orton to a new deal before the March deadline. Enough of the silliness about letting Orton slip away or taking a QB in the first three rounds. There are much bigger fish to fry on the roster.
Absolutely agree
They’re just so damn hard to find. I do have faith though that Josh can spot them. The only way I agree to a Marshall trade is if he sees one of these QB’s as Franchise material. In other words the first round pick better be to draft or better situate themselves for a Franchise QB. Then the Marshall trade wouldn’t sting so much in my mind.
by northoftheborder on Feb 7, 2010 2:15 PM MST up reply actions
A bird in hand
is worth two in the bush. I agree 100% about Orton. Just no way any QB in the draft will come close to KOs abilities. Orton is a keeper and will continue to work hard and improve. I’m predicting top 10 in 2010. He plays four games with a splint on his finger, five more with an ankle sprain…has the best year of his career. What’s up with the fans in Denver anyways? KO is on the exact same path as Drew Brees. Dawson…Griese….Brees….Orton.
“NO WAY any QB in the draft will come close to KO’s abilities”.
That is a stupid statement that not one GM in the NFL would agree with. Apparently Bowlen doesn’t agree with you either.
Too many of you guys got hammered on the Kool Aid last night. Go eat some carbos, take a few Advil and try to regain your reasoning ability.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
Agreed
I dont understand the love affair with Orton here. I understand you like him but to think he is better then any QB in this years draft is ridiculous. The guy was a 4th round draft pick in his draft. He was benched by his original team on the way to their superbowl run and was part of a trade package that landed us (2) 1st rounders and a 3rd rounder.
SO you’re basically telling me that is Kyle Orton was in this years draft he would be the first QB taken?
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
Orton only went in the 4th rd because he was injured his senior year at Purdue . Prior to his injury he was a hesiman candidate so saying hes a 4th rd pick is irrelevant.
From whats been posted around here when we first traded for Orton he was never benched .Grossman was the starter the entire year of the SB run .
Orton was also the reason we chose to deal with Chicago not the multiple 1st rd picks there were several team offering those .
Players who come from shotgun systems are looked at much differently now in the NFL than they were in 2004.
“not one GM in the NFL would agree”… and you would know that of course. I believe all GMs would tell you that a QB doesn’t reach his full potential at the age of 27 and 50 games. You know that most draft picks are a crap shot. That’s very much the case with the 2010 QBs. None are impressive and a sure thing.
""aparently Bowlen doesn’t agree with you either"… Sound reasoning wouldn’t form a conclusion about what he meant by his statements in the DP article. I believe he also stated he wants KO back and thinks he’s a good QB right now after 48 starts.
Maybe you don’t like Sam Bradford or Claussen, but each guy will sign a contract in a few months that pays him more money in one year than Orton has made in his 5 year career. I’ll let GMs and facts back my point.
These QBs don’t need to impress you, but they will get picked in round1 whether you like it or not. Some team will believe enough in them to pay them 1st round dollars. Unlike Orton, which no team has ever stepped up to secure with a long term deal befitting of a star QB.
After 5 years, everyone knows what you get from Orton – a decent QB than can win games. Kyle was vastly underpaid in 2009 – no doubt about it. But the guy is not an elite player and you’ll see what I mean in March when he tag him and no one steps up to trade away high draft picks to sign him. Instead, they’ll draft guys like McCoy and Claussen because the GMs will feel better about spending money on those guys than spending it on Orton.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
the fact that some GMs throw lots of $$$ at unproven players proves nothing to me. For every 1st round QB that pans out, there are two maybe three on the scrap pile that didn’t come close to Orton’s credentials through 48 starts if they made it that far. I like Bradford, but he appears injury prone. Claussen is a big ? in my book. Never won in South Bend…cocky…arrogant. Who knows. We’ll see what happens with Orton. the current labor issues come into play, so if the Broncos resign him(which I believe they will), it will likely be to a one/two year extension with a sizable raise…Matt Cassell salary maybe. Take a picture of GMs paying big bucks to unproven rookies. It will be a thing of the past under the next labor agreement. The NFL will go to a format similar to the NBA imo.
Lots of QB's need the pieces
Look what happened to Brady in the playoffs without Welker. I didn’t say Orton was Great. I said I think he will be pretty good, once teams can’t pin their ears back on every down, because they know he is going to throw it.
Draft a QB
I would love to see broncos draft Tony Pike- from what I’ve seen of him, he can throw accurately down the field and seemed to have that “it” factor we all thought Cutler had…
Tony Pike also is a tooth pick
at 6’6 and 225. He needs to fill out his frame an put a good 20 pounds on before he starts in the NFL
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 7, 2010 10:31 AM MST up reply actions
Can anyone tell me about....
Ryan Mallett? Saw highlights of him but there is not much to go on. He’s huge with a rocket arm and above average mobility. Would greatly appreciate some insight on this player. Apparently some scouts compare him to Big Ben??
by northoftheborder on Feb 7, 2010 10:51 AM MST reply actions
he went back to school
so if you want to watch him it will have to be in college ball next year
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 7, 2010 11:14 AM MST up reply actions
northof..spot on. Mallet from Arkansas or Jake Locker from Washington would be my two.
If these two came out then no current QB would go in the 1st.
Mallet and Locker both cost themselves millions and millions of dollars to return to school.
The owners will demand an rookie cap in the next CBA and the players will likely give in if it means more money for vets.
Their advisors are moron’s to the nth degree. Who knows, Locker might not even have an NFL to enter in 2011 and he’ll miss out on two years of NFL salary and then have his rookie deal capped. What a dumbass.
San Diego Super Chokers – The annual preseason Champs, eternal post season chumps. Stay Classy
I loved Mallett too
Of course, I’m biased because he was a former Wolverine. He wouldve been a project if he came out this year though.
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
Forget last comment
Sorry guys, did not realize he was staying in college.
by northoftheborder on Feb 7, 2010 11:02 AM MST reply actions
Plus
I’m telling Al Davis you’re looking at his quarterback.
Why does Madden suck at ranking the Broncos so much?
I take it.....
He’s that bad, ouch!
by northoftheborder on Feb 7, 2010 11:16 AM MST up reply actions
another QB
that might be worth looking at is Jonathan Crompton from Tennessee. He would be a project for down the road, but he has good size (6’4, 224 ), & a good arm.
Bowlen
made my day when he said it would be great if the Broncos could draft a qb and like Klis said it sounds like he was talking about drafting a qb early in the draft instead of the middle and late rounds and that is what I have been hoping happens since the season ended because Orton, Simms, and Brandstater are not the answer to leading us to the SuperBowl so you might as well spend a high pick (top 3 rounds) on a guy in this draft that you think can be THE GUY we can all get excited about. Probably won’t be getting Bradford or Clausen unless we trade up so it could be somebody like Pike or Snead. I still like Snead even though he had a rough junior season but during his sophomore year he played great, especially in the Cotton Bowl when they embarrassed Texas Tech. If Snead gets good coaching in the NFL, I think he has a chance to be a great NFL quarterback.
I read his comments about Orton to mean that they need someone behind him and that they prefer to not pay an old FA bust like Simms again .
He also is not gonna say too much about Orton when the team may be trying to get a deal done .
What did Bowlen really say?
I think we may be reading to much into Bowlen’s comments. Mostly, they’re about what we should expect especially this year with uncertainty about the CBA.
Talk about QB only means that he wants to maintain a strong negotiating position with Orton and he wants all the other teams to think he could be interested in a QB. If Clausen, Bradford and Tevow are all picked in the top 10, Rolando McClain, Anthony Davis or maybe even Joe Haden might fall to #10-11
IMO none of the QBs in this draft have the upside of Brandstater. You will recall the take on Brandstater last year was he’s big (6-5), has a rocket arm, and is very smart (finished a Master’s Degree in his 5 yrs in college). His weakness was that his footwork was undeveloped and caused occasional inaccuracy. From what I heard (and saw) he improved his footwork quickly and seemed to be learning the complicated system very quickly.
Drafting Bradford, IMO, would give us an expensive understudy to an understudy (and the potential for eventual QB controversy).
If none of the three I mentioned above fell to #10-11, I still think they would consider Dan Williams, Bruce CAmpbell, Trent Williams or even Taylor Mays before Bradford or Clausen. Pike in the 4th or 5th round I might consider.
Don't you get it?
Bowlen just publicly announced that Broncos WILL be drafting a QB…and a good one! After his comment, I’m thinking he just signaled to McD that the 1st pick will be a QB. He was simply giving orders via MSM! He WANTs another franchise level QB to replace Cutler! I’m thinking Bradford!
"Attitude reflects Leadership" Hogblog...aka KSM
I don't think that is how Bowlen rolls
that reeks of a JerryJones type of move…. I think Bowlen was asked about his feelings, and felt like he was addressing broncos country, so he kept it real. But if you look at what he actually said, as opposed to Klis’ conclusions, it is actually not very specific about anything…
I think the Broncos like at least a couple of the QBs in this class, and that they are interested in acquiring them to compete with Orton, but would expect a new QB to be behind Orton on the depth chart. This feeling is probably prompted by the fact that we have a non-answer (simms) and a complete question mark (TomBra) behind Orton, which simply isn’t good enough.
But that interest is one of opportunity, and if these QBs aren’t available, or would be too expensive to acquire, they will look elsewhere. Bradford needs to drop, where we might be able to target him with a trade up from #45 into the bottom of the first, or we need to acquire another 1st round pick to take Bradford at #10/11 if he only falls that far.
I don’t personally advocate doing either. If Bradford is there at #10/11I think it is in Denver’s best interest to seriously consider the pick, and to do so publicly. He could have a spot on the roster without blowing up the lockeroom, and if nothing else, teams who want Bradford may be calling to trade up…
Precision in thought, concision in style, decision in life.
"That's MR.Styg..."
by Jeremy Bolander on Feb 7, 2010 6:01 PM MST up reply actions
I think
there are at least 5 or 6 qb’s in this draft with better upside than Brandstater but then again I have never been that high on Brandstater to begin with. I took Bowlen’s comment this way-he wants Orton back for the short term but wants to draft a qb pretty high with a lot more upside than Orton, Brandstater, and Simms that can learn from Orton for a year or 2 before taking over for Orton. But I only see this happening if McDaniels thinks Brandstater isn’t the guy to take over for Orton and I have no idea how high or low he is on Brandstater’s potential. About the only thing I am sure will happen with our qb situation is that Simms will be cut.
Wow!! Never thought there would only be 16 points scored in the 1st half of the Super Bowl. I don’t care who wins- I just want the game to down to the wire.
I don't get that!
If you read Bowlen’s comment: “I’d also like to think we might have the opportunity to draft a young quarterback, not necessarily to come in and play right away, but if you have the opportunity to draft somebody, that would be a plus for us.”
to mean that
“Bowlen just publicly announced that Broncos WILL be drafting a QB…and a good one!”
than you think Bowlen is an idiot!
Bowlen would never tip his hand or force McD to do so. I, as most analysts don’t rate this crop of QB’s very high. Bradford is the best fo the crop, but there are questions about his armstrength, his ability to throw with a collapsing pocket and his mobility. Plus his durability might be a question. He’s best quality is that when set, he throws accurately.
I think Pike has more upside, but would take some time to develop. Clausen is a gamble.
Bowlen’s comments could simply mean that if a QB is available that fits the draft position, they’d take it. It could also mean that if other’s want a shot at Bradford, they’ll have to trade for it (and some do). You may not like Brandstater, but I don’t see anything better – especially worth wasting a high draft pick for.
I'm just saying...
For Bowlen to even comment on the need for a QB publically, signals he wants one….and if your not looking at Bradford, you better be looking at LeFevour. Don’t like Pike, hate Canfield(chck his career stats)! If he wasn’t wanting to tip his hand, why would he even mention it to the MSM. I think he’s just thinking outloud w/o concerns about what Orton/Josh think. Clearly he thinks Brandstater AINT cutting it. He’s just an owner speaking his mind. My guess is that McD wishes Bowlen would’ve said NOTHING. Clearly the gaunlet has been laid down…
"Attitude reflects Leadership" Hogblog...aka KSM
by Hogblog on Feb 7, 2010 7:49 PM MST via mobile reply actions
Bowlen
is speaking like a fan who is as concerned and disgusted with our qb situation as I am. He knows that we don’t have a great qb on our current roster and he is hoping McDaniels changes that this offseason.
Seriously
“He knows we don’t have a great QB on our current roster”
1. I do not think you or Mr Bowlen is the best person to evaluate talent. You and Mr Bowlen have no idea what we have in Brandstater and Orton played pretty good in his first season in a very complicated offense. He also played behind a pretty bad oline.
2. There may only be about 5-8 teams with so called “Great QBs” on their roster. Orton is an above average starter. he is better then most QB in this league. You just do not know how to judge a QB. Its obvious you do not know anything about QB when you are disgusted about out QB situation because it is really not bad at all.
3. You are reading to much into this. He in no way said he wanted to draft a QB. He said they may be in a position to draft a better prospect with the 10 or 11th pick. He also calls Orton a “Good” QB so I do not think he is concerned or disgusted. Try to spin his statements to make you seem like you are right but you are not
by gnarlybroncodude on Feb 7, 2010 8:32 PM MST up reply actions
I'm ust saying...as well
If I was Bowlen and/or McD and thought Orton and Brandstater were not the answer and that we needed a QB, preferably Bradford, I’d not annouce it. I’d say nothing or little about it – or say I love Orton. If others wanted a QB and thought Denver was not interested, they’d not trade up to try to get him before us.
However, if I had my eye on one or two of the other top ten players, (and there are a couple I like a lot) I’d do what I could to increase the chances they were there. One of the things I would do is make sure that everone knew that a QB was an option for me. Then, those looking for a QB before us might take one to be safe. And those after us, if they thought, or eventually knew, that Bradford or Clausen were available at #10-11, they might strongly consider offering an attractive trade. Two picks for one in this draft appeals to me, and i’d like to get the best deal available.
Frankly, I like both Orton and Brandstater better than wha’s available in this draft. The best prospects are projects that come later – LeFevour, Pike, etc. Bradford, IMO, is no improvement on Orton – is a lot like him, with less presence under pressure.
Neither Orton or Brandstater may be the long term answer. But there is, IMO, no sure improvement over either in this draft. To replace Simms I’d look to rds 5-7 or UFA.
Interesting, isn't it . . .
how a group of people can hear exactly the same words from a person and arrive at polar opposites in deciding what it means:
I want Kyle back. Orton is a good quarterback. I’d also like to think we might have the opportunity to draft a young quarterback, not necessarily to come in and play right away, but if you have the opportunity to draft somebody, that would be a plus for us.
I find it fascinating that some believe that this means “We have a quarterback problem, we need a new one.” While others see it as simply a statement that should the opportunity to draft a young QB appear, it would be nice to do so.
A couple of things to consider in all this: If we draft a QB with a high pick, it may be assumed that that QB will make the roster. I think it is safe to say that Denver will not go into 2010 with 4 QBs on the roster. So who goes? The most logical (based on performance in 2009) would be SImms. So this means that our QBs would be Orton, Brandstater (1 year removed from his rookie year) and whoever the rookie is. I find that to be a terrifying scenario, should Orton go down.
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