Robert Ayers in 2010
by black_knight101 on Mar 18, 2010 9:19 PM MDT
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PrintWith the release of Andra Davis and the speculation that Mario Haggan will be moved into the primary LILB slot, I wanted to do some more research into Robert Ayers, who looks to be the starting LOLB next year. How is this going to pan out?
Here is the scouting report on Ayers from NFL.com:
Positives: Powerfully built athlete. ... Good lower-body strength to hold up at the point of attack. ... Flashes the ability to anchor and split double-team blocking off the edge. ... Good initial hand punch to stun the offensive tackle. ... Flashes some upfield burst to challenge wide and has good lateral quickness to redirect to the inside. ... Good use of hands to prevent tackles from latching on and steering him away from the plays. ... Varies his speed off the edge and can surprise blockers with his suddenness. ... Can close with authority, flashing explosiveness. ... Versatile defender with experience at tackle and end. ... Developed into a team leader as a senior. ... Could be an ascending player who is just beginning to scratch the surface of his talent. Negatives: Lacks an elite first step or the straight-line speed to be true edge rusher. ... Relies more on varying his speed off the snap and strength at the point of attack, rather than pure athleticism to make plays. ... Moved around a lot in this defense and was allowed to exploit mismatches. ... Likes to tackle high and can allow stronger ballcarriers to escape his grasp. ... Can be a bit of a showboat, which could lead to penalties in the NFL. ... Stepped up his play significantly as a senior and evaluators will ponder whether he was a one-year wonder motivated by the big NFL payday
Ayers was a 4-3 DE in college, but was asked to move to 3-4 OLB for the Broncos. He is 6'3 272 lbs, but as you can see from the image, looks to carry that weight very well. I'm no expert on the 3-4, but from what I have gathered this is larger than some 3-4 OLBs, but I assume this is not a problem because he plays on the strong side. He was considered a "one year wonder", but at the Senior Bowl and combine he shot up draft boards.
I went back and looked at some of the Senior Bowl video of Ayers, which can be found
here. The thing that shocked me about these videos is how well Ayers got leverage on the Offensive lineman that he was going up against (including top guys like Michael Oher). Some people on other sites such as DB.com forums like the idea of drafting Brandon Graham. To those people I ask, isn't Robert Ayers essentially the Brandon Graham of last year? Both guys shot up draft boards during the Senior Bowl based on their pass rushing abilities. Both played DE in college and project to a 3-4 OLB. If for some reason we lose Dumervil, I would definitely be interested in getting Graham.
Reading posts around here, most people at MHR have a cautious optimism about Ayers next year. Although he didn't step in right away and assume a starting role, he seemed to improve as the year went on. The media, however, has general negative viewpoint about Ayers:
According to beat writer Frank Schwab, anyone believing 2009 first-rounder Robert Ayers had a positive impact as a rookie "can't see past their orange and blue tinted glasses."
Although he didn't have any sacks, to say that he didn't have a positive impact is exaggerating quite a bit. He did have several QB pressures, and for crying out loud he was a rookie transitioning to a new position in a new scheme that he had never played before. Some players make transitions quickly, others do not. Its as simple as that.
One important factor in Ayers' development in 2010 is going to be our new Defensive Coordinator, Dom Martindale. Ayers said that Martindale told him before the draft that :
Coach Martindale pretty much told me I was his guy
Read more: http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_12230256#ixzz0iaPnRmxY The fact that our Martindal had Ayers as his OLB prospect is probably an indication of how much Ayers will be used now that Martindale is a DC.
The Broncos probably liked his versatility: in college he rushed from a position standing up, played ILB in high school, played some DT in college, had some experience in the 3-4 at Tennessee. This flexibility is important for the OLBs in the Broncos scheme because as many of us have noticed, the Broncos line up in a 5-2 front much of the time. Having experience as both a down lineman and a stand up rusher is probably something that the Broncos are going to look for now and in the future from their OLB prospects. I also wonder if this flexibility is going to allow him to play ILB or DE/DG on some plays in the future.
Interestingly, it sounds like Martindale had an influence in the Broncos selecting Ayers at #18 overall. The Broncos had a huge need for 3-4 OLB (especially with uncertainty about how good Elvis Dumervil would be in the 3-4), and it sounds like Ayers was at the top of their board for this position. When Ayers was asked about Martindale as the new DC, Ayers said that "They couldn't have made a better choice". There seems to be a good working relationship between the two. The confidence that they seem to have in each other is exactly what you want from your coaches and players. we're not sure how much Martindale is going to change the Bronco's scheme, if at all, but I would figure Martindale is excited about getting Ayers more playing time.
Looking ahead, how is Ayers going to do when he is counted on more consistently? After a year of familiarity with the scheme, I think he is going to be very good. He has the skill set to be a great pass rusher; it seems to me like he needs more practice so that he can improve his timing and instincts. There is reason for caution, however, because we don't know how he will adapt to a more important role and increased workload. It may take him more time to adjust to the new position. But I certainly hope that he and Doom become a pass rushing force.
This is a Fan-Created Comment on MileHighReport.com. The opinion here is not necessarily shared by the editorial staff of MHR
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I hope for the pro bowl
but realistically I just think he is going to be a very good player this year.
Good post, bk
Rec’d. Despite the folks who claim that Ayers ‘disappeared’, he was quite visible on film. If you look at the number of hurries (17) in limited reps, you begin to understand that while it is true that he is not likely to be a great pass rusher, he’d an unusually good football player. Thanks for bringing it up. I have also wondered if we move Haggan to ILB, where he is well suited, will Denver look for another OLB? It’s well worth consideration.
It all starts with the lines
agreed
Ayers had a few very good games last season. He was really all over the field in the Eagles game if anyone gets the chance to look at some footage from that. dkn about the stats, but I really remember him being all over the field in that one.
The future looks bright!! dkn if he’ll be a pro bowler next year, but i could see it somewhere down the line. but the pro bowl isn’t necessarily the best judge of talent anyway (see Ryan Clady’s snub his rookie year after allowing only one half a sack, best in the league that year).
by bailey disciple on Mar 18, 2010 9:53 PM MDT up reply actions
+1
I was at the eagles game and he was great on the field, and not necessarily in the box score. Look at his tackle of westbrook on Þhe first drive. He saved a TD which led to a fumb le. He was also very voacl and was a leader on ST. I believe in him
by DBroncs1414 on Mar 18, 2010 10:11 PM MDT via mobile up reply actions
I think we will, in the later rounds...
However, I’m a UNC fan, and if we really want a 3-4 OLB, we should hope that Robert Quinn from UNC falls to us in 2011. He is going to be a straight up BEAST.
I know that is obviously not a good strategy/reasonable speculation, but obviously McD likes guys named R. Quinn from UNC :)
by black_knight101 on Mar 18, 2010 9:53 PM MDT up reply actions
Quite right, Doc
I remember on several occasions last year thinking to myself, ‘Damn, there’s #56 again." Seemed like he was always around the ball, and if he wasn’t doing his job, the coaches wouldn’t have had him on the field as much as he was. Personally, I’d be ecstatic with a handful of sacks each year and a good all-around 3-4 OLB. We already have our sack specialist. If Ayers can stop the run, cover on occasion, and put enough pressure on QBs to keep ’em honest and flush them toward Doom, the defense will tough.
by BroncosBassist on Mar 19, 2010 12:48 PM MDT up reply actions
I also dug this out on Ayers,
Another view:
Mixed martial arts trainer Denis Acuna, who has worked out with Ayers, said: “I never have seen a big guy as fast as he is, and I’ve worked with all kinds of professional athletes. . . . He moves like a lightweight, he moves like a 155-pounder. I’ve never seen the power-speed combination he brings to the table.”
It all starts with the lines
by Doc Bear on Mar 18, 2010 9:53 PM MDT reply actions 1 recs
wow, that's interesting.
I really think that he’s going to be a good player at this level. Pro-bowl? Maybe not, but I think he’ll be quite good.
by BroncosBassist on Mar 19, 2010 12:49 PM MDT up reply actions
I've heard about various players getting MMA training, and I find it very interesting.
Sorry if I get a little off subject, briefly, but it seems like it might be something that could help our starting QB in one or two areas.
Now, back to your regularly scheduled discussion about a talented LB with a promising future.
"People who live in glass houses...shouldn't."
by jayrockstone on Mar 19, 2010 4:03 PM MDT up reply actions
Mayock's comment from last years draft
When we drafted Ayers last year, I distincly remember Mike Mayock saying something to the effect of “don’t look for much out of Ayers in 2009, but by 2010 he will turn out to have been one of the best defensive player’s taken in 2009”. Hope my memory and his prediction are accurate.
yeah, in my research i came upon that comment
that is exactly what he said
by black_knight101 on Mar 18, 2010 9:56 PM MDT up reply actions
Agreed Phantom
Out of all the draft guru’s Mayocks words carry the most words for me.
I think he is going to have a much better year and will turn out to be Denvers best pick in the 2009 draft.
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
most weight
Off day this morning
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
I'm a big UM fan
So I am probably a little biased. I’ll just say that anybody that watched Brandon Graham play the last 2 years knew he was a 1st round talent. The Senior Bowl just showed everybody that doesn’t watch Big 10 football what he’s capable of. He’s the only player opposing teams really had to account for the past two years and he’s had 20 sacks and 45 TFL. The only other player with that kind of production the past 2 years is Jerry Hughes from TCU. I personally would love to have either in a Broncos uniform, I don’t care if they play the same position and have the same build as Dumervil or if he’s this years version of Ayers. It’s not easy finding guys that play with a non-stop motor and have a knack for playing in the opposing teams backfield.
I would like to have him too
I just don’t think we can tie up that much money at one position
by black_knight101 on Mar 18, 2010 9:57 PM MDT up reply actions
I respectfully disagree.
I think the hardest things to find in football are franchise quarterbacks, shutdown corners, great left tackles, and dominant pass rushers (probably in that order too). If you believe in the philosophy of drafting the Best Player Available in the first round, then you shouldn’t ever turn down the opportunity to draft one of these players, the only exception I can see to that is if you already have a franchise quarterback or left tackle. We have the Left Tackle and that Quarterback doesn’t exist in this draft. If Haden were to drop to us, I think we would be foolish to not pick him. I also really like the Dan Williams, but after that I would much rather reach for Graham than I would reach for McClain (yes, reach), Pouncey, Iupati, or Bryant.
yes!! another UM fan
I’m a huge UM fan myself Gheid. You’re not biased at all. Everything you wrote is absolutely 100% correct.
I especially like this quote:
The Senior Bowl just showed everybody that doesn’t watch Big 10 football what he’s capable of.
I couldnt have said it any better myself.
Btw.. How do you feel about Rich Rod?
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
I like Rich Rod
I think people lose sight of just how bare the cupboard was when he stepped in. Assuming Donovan Warren still gets picked by somebody (after a horrible combine and pro day), that will make 4 players from Michigan that were drafted since Rodriguez came in. Brandon Graham is the only one that will be picked in the first 3 Rounds! That’s unheard of, not only for Michigan, but for any major college football program.
That being said, 3 straight losing seasons is pretty tough to accept. I think he either has to finish with a winning season, or sub-500 season while somehow beating Ohio State.
UM
I respect UM but I have to disagree on Rich Rod, he is a joke and does not belong at such a storied college. He already is in trouble with the NCAA and his spread O at Michigan is rough to watch, like when Callahan went to Nebraska and took away power football, that as a CU fan i hated but respected. Rich Rod will be gone in 1-2 years.
2/3 of the earth is covered by water the other 1/3 is covered by Champ Bailey!
THIS IS BRONCOS COUNTRY!!!
by The 3 Amigos on Mar 19, 2010 2:34 PM MDT up reply actions
UM
NCAA violations are a really big deal, I will agree with that. Some of the things were very wrong and stupid on his part, and some I believe were honest mistakes. If you were to launch a major investigation on every football program in the country, I think you would find that a majority of them have violations in some fashion. I also think it’s funny that one of the sources for the article that led to the whole investigation was Toney Clemons, and he transferred to your CU Buffaloes. I hope he complains about all the work he has to do there too, and it leads to another Dan Hawkins Intramurals rant!
As far as the spread offense is concerned, all I care about is that they execute whatever offense they choose to run, and win football games.
i agree woth u 100 percent
Ppl thought anthony spencer was a bust until this year. Plus its tough to make a change like DE to OLB. Even if he isn’t great this year I still won’t give up on him. This isn’t exactly the easiest transition to make
by DBroncs1414 on Mar 18, 2010 10:05 PM MDT via mobile reply actions
Anthony Spencer is an excellent example....
For both Robert Ayers and Jarvis Moss! Moss and Spencer came out in same year. In fact, if we hadn’t moved up for Moss, Spencer would’ve fallen to us naturally. Bet Jerry Jones is still laughing about that move. I hope there’s something salvageable from J Moss! If not, this kid’s gotta go!
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Nicely done BK
Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
Dont forget too
He hasnt had a full trraining camp yet. I think with a full training camp this yr he’ll improve much more
Thats his own fault
I like Ayers but he doesnt get a free pass for holding out. He still got paid top quid regardless of the training camp.
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
Thats his own fault
Well, yes. I really don’t like holdouts – one of the reasons I don’t like Moreno. But still, what DBroncs said is true – Ayers missed time last year and it set him back. Here’s hoping he’s a lot better in his second year, with a full TC behind him.
A man does what he has to do, and sometimes it’s not what I believe he should do. There’s no reason to use up energy hating him for it. Shoot him if you have to, but don’t hate him.
Louis L’Amour
I understand that it is up to an individual to make a decision on whether to hold out or not
but all of the players in the group immediately behind Crabtree held out. I don’t understand the whole dynamic at work there, but it is the first time I recall a group of players holding out, as opposed to individuals. I prefer to blame the raiders and DHB for that ridiculous contract…
And to your next question, no, I don’t want Moreno to jump off a bridge just cause all his friends do… :)
There's a big hard sun, beating on the big people, in the big hard world.
formerly Styg-like
by Jeremy Bolander on Mar 19, 2010 11:48 AM MDT up reply actions
I'm not sure it should be considered a holdout.
The teams below DHB were waiting to see how much the contracts in front were going to be before signing anything with their own draft picks. Nobody wants to pay more than the team who picked before them. It was a waiting game, from what I remember. I don’t fault either of the 1st rounders.
by BroncosBassist on Mar 19, 2010 12:56 PM MDT up reply actions
Agreed
It’s logical to wait to see how a deal above you affects you. I don’t like holdouts either, but in this case it’s totally understandable.
by AllBroncsallday on Mar 19, 2010 3:53 PM MDT up reply actions
This.
Definitely more on DHB, Crabtree and Al ’what’s his 40’ Davis than on Ayers and Moreno.
It would have been great if they could have said ‘just get me a reasonabe contract based on ’08 payscale plus the usual %,’ but I don’t think the agents were going to let that happen if they could help it.
"My job description is to win football games. I'm a hard worker. I'm not flashy by any means, but my job is to play football and win and I plan to do that." Kyle Orton
Don't forget
about J. Moss @ OLB. he had a solid preseason and I think he fits prefect @ the position. He’s on the team for a reason – he has mad skills!!!
Moss' play hasn't lived up to his projected potential.
He may have had a couple of moments in pre season and in games that counted, but he hasn’t lived up to the value he was drafted at. The three years he has been on the roster his performance has been subpar for the first round @17 spot he taken at. I have been on the Jarvis Moss bandwagon since day one, but the spokes are starting to fall off of it. I’m disappointed in his play and I am sure McDaniels will have to make a decision with him later this year before the season starts. He isn’t worth trading so he would be cut most likely if the team doesn’t think he is a fit for it.
Let's hope you're right
Because his performance on the field hasn’t suggested that he’s got those skills. Hope he breaks out this year- if not he won’t be around.
by AllBroncsallday on Mar 19, 2010 3:54 PM MDT up reply actions
agreed
Unfortunately, I think Jarvis won’t make it out of TC this year. We’ve had another year to get better at all positions, and there just probably won’t be room on the 53.
by BroncosBassist on Mar 19, 2010 7:29 PM MDT up reply actions
agreed
Unfortunately, I think Jarvis won’t make it out of TC this year. We’ve had another year to get better at all positions, and there just probably won’t be room on the 53.
by BroncosBassist on Mar 19, 2010 7:41 PM MDT up reply actions
Yeah
that may be true, BUT well just have to see. I’m not a hug fan of the guy, but when I watched(TIVO, yeah I still have TIVO:) him in pre-season he looked pretty natural @ the position – I’m just saying – thats all. Maybe his heart is not into playing fooball. That could be the reason he doesn’t making it. But skills wise, the guy is pretty gifted!!
Yeah I think that's right
I think he’s got the skills, but does he have the heart and desire? So far, the answer has been No, but that doesn’t mean he can’t break out this year.
We’d all love to see it, but I’ll admit I’m not very confident that we will. Unfortunately, I don’t see him making it out of training camp this year. He barely made the team by the skin of his teeth last year, and didn’t contribute on the field in any meaningful way (Zero tackles) during the season
These are not good signs.
by AllBroncsallday on Mar 23, 2010 10:32 AM MDT up reply actions
One way or the other, we'll know this year
Moss is approaching the end of his rope with Denver. I don’t really think about him only due to past performance – it he ‘gets it’ I’ll be thrilled as well as surprised.
It all starts with the lines
That would be a lovely surprise..
.. but i’m not holding my breath.
A.Smith is about as likely to win the starting job from Champ as Moss is to have a place on the teams final 53.
Looks like you're back in the saddle horsestance
good deal.
There's a big hard sun, beating on the big people, in the big hard world.
formerly Styg-like
by Jeremy Bolander on Mar 19, 2010 11:52 AM MDT up reply actions
So you're saying there's a chance?
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
PS3 ID: broncomaniac6
by Troy Hufford on Mar 19, 2010 11:54 AM MDT up reply actions
And circle gets the square. lol
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
PS3 ID: broncomaniac6
by Troy Hufford on Mar 19, 2010 12:16 PM MDT up reply actions
Ayers was talkin a lot about Baraka in his press conferance..
he will be competition in camp at olb, long with Reid and Moss. If Haggan is moving inside they might need to take one more olb prospect in the draft to sure up the position.. but maybe not a high pick. Or a certain highly rated ILB so Haggan could be potential back up for Ayers as well.
Heard that too, who is Baraka?? Am I having a slow moment?
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by bronco-Maine-iac on Mar 19, 2010 7:42 AM MDT up reply actions
Baraka Atkins.
He was drafted by Seattle in 2007, 120th overall. Likely playing DE.
"All by their heads, he places crowns."
"Brandon Marshall isn't as good as you think he is." - a random hobo I met
by Tempestuous Binary on Mar 19, 2010 9:34 AM MDT up reply actions
you mean olb right?
was mentioned by Ayers as working out with the backers.. 6ft4" 268lbs.. not the 300+ DE’s we have been going for.
I actually thought about that when I checked his weight.
I figured it was a shade too heavy for LB and he was beefing up to play DE, which is his original position. Guess I’m wrong here. It’ll be interesting to see how he shakes out.
"All by their heads, he places crowns."
"Brandon Marshall isn't as good as you think he is." - a random hobo I met
by Tempestuous Binary on Mar 19, 2010 10:39 AM MDT up reply actions
Baraka Atkins
projects as an edge rusher. which is a DE in a 4-3 and OLB in a 3-4. he would be an OLB for us.
by bailey disciple on Mar 19, 2010 11:02 AM MDT up reply actions
Great Post
Liked the fact you focused on a specific player. I voted he will be very good this year. I’m an optimist by nature and I like to think that all our picks will work out.
btw Rec’d your post very nicely done.
Well done BK...Rec'd
Anticipating this kid to break out and flourish this year!
-Stick to the fight when you are hardest hit - it's when things seem worst that you must not quit!
Mistake of being too "stats focused"
With all due respect to our very own TJ, I think a lot of criticism of Ayers is due to his lack of sacks. At his position, that’s not really his role. He’s in more of a containment spot. It’s like the difference between offensive left and right tackles. If he was lining up at ROLB and not recording a sack all season, I’d be worried. As it is, in limited playing time, he progressed fine this past season and I look for him to really step up this year as he’s way more comfortable in the system and the NFL in general.
Step aside, my friend, I been doin' it for years.
Said sit on down, open ya eyes, say open up ya ears....
Oh, rec'd too, BK
Step aside, my friend, I been doin' it for years.
Said sit on down, open ya eyes, say open up ya ears....
Well?
You are getting ahead of yourself with all this pass rush excellence and versatility talk.
Robert Ayers made 19 tackles in 2009. That is barely one per game for a guy that saw a lot of PT as it was.
If he is going to see even more PT, he better show up against the run (short passes too) and learn how to bring down the guy with the ball. Haggan had 63 tackles last season and Elvis (not exactly a great run defender) had 49.
Ayers needs to focus on his run support and tackling above all else if he wants Haggan’s spot. I’d like to think he can do this, but he didn’t flash much in this critical area of importance.
His bull pass rush is pretty sweet though! The kid can collapse a pocket.
In my opinion.
I wonder if he would make a better DE
Coming out of the draft we were told that he has the versatility to play both positions. He’s a little light for the end position as of now but I’m sure with a good offseason program the weight wouldnt be an issue. However, with all the DE’s we’ve signed this offseason I doubt they would move him now.
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
He looks like a 4-3 DE to me.
But I admitting don’t know much about the 3-4 so we shall see in 2010.
In my opinion.
I wonder if we'll see more of a traditional 3-4 this year
Then a 5-2 with the new lineman Denver brought in.
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
I'm sure that is the goal
I too wonder if we get over the hump with that this year.
There's a big hard sun, beating on the big people, in the big hard world.
formerly Styg-like
by Jeremy Bolander on Mar 19, 2010 11:54 AM MDT up reply actions
we'll need more traditional LB, I think
I’m not sure we’re equipped at LB to handle that. Elvis isn’t much of a coverage guy, and can’t stop the run very well. Ayers might be more rounded, I think, so it might work out.
by BroncosBassist on Mar 19, 2010 12:59 PM MDT up reply actions
Ayers didn' see enough PT for that number to be considered to low.
He didn’t really play a lot until the last couple of games of the season, and even then, Ayers was in on mostly Passing downs.
He’s Martindale’s guy, so i think he’s probably doing fine at OLB.
and now that martindale’s going to have had a year to coach up his converted OLB’s to be able to fill more non-pass-rushing roles, we should see more of a traditional 3-4.
by bailey disciple on Mar 19, 2010 11:07 AM MDT up reply actions
I don’t know which Bronco games you were watching, but I remember him playing all season (except Wash) and playing quite often.
This is a wild ### guess, but I bet he played in roughly 50% of all defensive snaps in 2009.
Ayers saw a whole lot more PT than guys like Phonze or McBath.
In my opinion.
I'd love to see an actual stat on that, because i don't remember him seeing the field much.
(except 3rd downs.)
by bailey disciple on Mar 19, 2010 1:41 PM MDT up reply actions
PFF has Ayers at 42% of snaps
Phonz was in on 15% of snaps and McBath was in on 13% of snaps.
There's a big hard sun, beating on the big people, in the big hard world.
formerly Styg-like
by Jeremy Bolander on Mar 19, 2010 2:36 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
wow
i guess he saw the field a lot more than i realized.
in that case, McGeorge is correct, he didn’t make a big impact for much of the year.
I do remember him comking on pretty strong near the end of the season though. he played very well against Philly. he wasn’t in on nearly any of Jamaal Charles’ longer runs either.
by bailey disciple on Mar 19, 2010 3:28 PM MDT up reply actions
I would say that our entire defense needs to improve on run support
so we’ll see what happens
by black_knight101 on Mar 19, 2010 11:48 AM MDT up reply actions
Some guys that didn’t carry enough of their weight in 2009 (Ayres) will have to carry more weight vs than others.
Ayers is one of the main guys that needs to get much more done in 2010. 19 tackles is way too low for 2010 vs a guy like Haggan that had 63 tackles in 2009. That is a good goal for Mario again in 2010.
In my opinion.
Ayers to me needs at least a season starting
We are going to have to accept the growing pains, but having him on the bench doesn’t teach him much, he really needs to get a feel for the position, I still think he is probably two years away from being a guy you can count on, but I think he has a high ceiling.
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Voted Pro Bowl earlier and didn't comment.
First I would like to say that Haggan did a good job last year. Although I would be shocked if Ayers doesn’t start and play extremely well this year. Due to the fact that it will be his second year in the system and he has great physical tools for the position. With the vast improvements along the D-line, Ayers and the other LB’s will be free to make big plays. Ayers production will increase because teams will pay more attention to Elvis and slide protection to his side. Now if we only draft McClain our LB will be sick!
I keep getting the sense that McClain is going to slide
He might not be a good value pick at #11 for Denver.. But by no means am I an expert
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
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by johnnystarr on Mar 19, 2010 11:01 AM MDT up reply actions
I Liked him
Last year if you look back at the games late in the year. He was lined up in the down D-End position alot and was fast to the QB. He just could not finish. If he works on finishing the job after he gets through he will become one of the better ones in the league in my opinion. He was at the QB a lot and just needs to be able to take him down.
Great post Black_Knight and rec'd
Ayers was experimented with all of the positions across the line in a couple of games. His transition from college 4-3 to Nolan/Martindale’s 3-4 (5-2) defense was slow to develop (if one is to believe that a top 20 pick should start right away), but he showed that he has the energy and strengths to get through a play. At times he looked a little confused and hesitant, not really playing with instincts, but with a lot of thinking. I believe that part of him will subside and his play will get better, especially now that we signed three potentially new starters on the line to help with the run and disruption of opposing blockers.
The biggest thing going for Ayers
is Jamal Williams. There were a bunch of times last year when he was getting double teamed out of the play. It looked like it was happening for no reason other than that they didn’t have anyone else to bother with. I think the stats people are going to see a huge improvement this year and talk about how good he’s gotten, but the true upgrade will be just being able to play man on man.
And who could forget that suplex tackle he had?
It was totally worth the 15 yards.
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Chiefs fans are still a tad upset about that one
http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2010/3/15/1374226/quinn-for-cassel
I got into it with some of them a few days ago. I thought it was a righteous tackle.
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I agree bradley even though it was border line unnecessary roughness.
What’s a guy to do when you have this little rat (err player) running all over you. And besides, Jamaal was still trying to gain yards, it wasn’t like he had given up on the play.
I don't want to see Charles get hurt
but Cheifs fans need to understand where we are coming from with that. Our run defense was pitiful for 2 straight years…I mean nasty-bad…. and to close out a pretty good 2009 season where we saw legit progress with a stink up like that, well, it was nice to see the new kid on the block (ayers) wasn’t going to take it lying down like the 07 and 08 defenses did.
It was a very satisfying moment.
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by Jeremy Bolander on Mar 19, 2010 5:59 PM MDT up reply actions
That's the key
Charles hadn’t yet given up trying to gain yards, and he’d already broken how many tackles that day? The Ds job is to make sure they get the ball-carrier to the ground, and that hadn’t happened yet- the play was still live, no whistles had been blown.
Yes, it was a rough tackle but, this IS tackle football and it’s a rough game. I personally saw nothing wrong with it at the time, and still don’t.
by AllBroncsallday on Mar 23, 2010 10:38 AM MDT up reply actions
He still has a bit to learn.
As you can see, Dawk’s is a bit cleaner. Notice how he arches his back instead of landing on his side. :P
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by papigrande on Mar 19, 2010 8:07 PM MDT up reply actions 3 recs
haha, very nice. I'm sure that Dawk will teach him the correct way to do it. He's got some time to learn the art of the suplex. lol
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by Troy Hufford on Mar 19, 2010 9:12 PM MDT up reply actions
The fact that Ayers may have not heard a whistle is proof enough that this is a big call.
I want my tacklers just like McD wants his, to finish out the tackle and make a statement that if your going to bring that, I’m going to give you this. After all, it is ‘tackle’ football, isn’t it?
Thanks Black_Knight
My feeling is that Ayres showed that he has the physicality required to compete in the NFL. Not only did he dominate the OL during the senior bowl, be he also dominated offensive tackles all season long. So much so, that he became by far my favorite player to focus on right after the snap. It’s just fun watching a guy that appears to be half the size of another man and grab a hold of him and drive him backwards.
We have to put McGeorge’s stats in context. Ayres played primarily in the nickel defense, and his primary responsibility was to set the edge of the defense. It was his job to challenge the team’s best tackle and create a solid pocket for DOOM who rushes against the best matchup (i.e., weakest tackle). This was evident against Cleveland. Watch the highlight package on DOOM from NFL network here. On Elvis’ first sack, Ayers isn’t in. On the second sack, Ayers pushes Joe Thomas right into the backfield and when DOOM dominates St. Clair, there is no where for Quinn to go because Ayers has Thomas in the backfield. The same exact thing happens on the fourth sack. On the third sack, Ayers makes a great inside move and DOOM barely beats him to Quinn.
This is the type of work that does not show up in stat columns. Having said that, my question is— is that all we get out of the #18 pick? I hope not. Sure, the guy is strong and athletic and can hold his own physically with anyone in the league and was able to handle his role very well for 2009, but I expect more. Some of the early grumblings coming out of camp last year was that he was having trouble lining up and consistently handling the more nuanced respects of his assignments. A lot of that is expected from a rookie learning to play a new position. If he ever gets that side of the game down, I think he has all the tools to be a pro bowler, which is how I voted.
The good news is the mental aspect of the game is coachable. The physical side of the game is not.
by ButteBronco on Mar 19, 2010 3:29 PM MDT reply actions 2 recs
Brandon Graham was a lot more productive in college, so that is a bad comparison
Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.
by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 20, 2010 10:15 AM MDT reply actions
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