Answers in Search of a Question: Post-Elway Era Drafts (1999-2008)
"We learn more by looking for the answer to a question and not finding it than we do from learning the answer itself." -- Lloyd Alexander.
"With the 61st pick of the draft, the Denver Broncos select Paul Toviessi, Defensive End, Marshall" The Broncos select who?? Leroy Fields? Ahmaad Galloway? Clint Mitchell? Aaron Hunt? Who are these people?
This edition of ASQ has arisen from a number of comments that I've seen in threads, both this year and last year, in which the suggestion has been made that at least a portion of Denver's problems over the last few years have their origins in the drafting strategy/choices of Mike Shanahan's staff. That may or may not be an accurate fact. It can be helpful when planning for where you want to go, to take a look back at where you came from. Ultimately, in regards to the draft, what can be said is that every draft choice does affect a team, its strategies, and its future. If nothing else, picking one person precludes picking a different person in that spot. Think anyone in Indianapolis is unhappy that the Colts selected Peyton Manning rather than Ryan Leaf? Anyone believe that San Diego doesn't wish they had made a different use of their first pick in that same draft? Some draftees will go on to long and storied careers which place them firmly in the legendary lore of the team, while others will become little more than a footnote in the team's history. Who are these young collegians who set their sights on becoming the next NFL legend at their position? Who are the ones that the Broncos saw as the next, best cog for the Broncos' machinery? More after the fold.
Every team begins the draft with a base set of 7 picks -- 1 per round. Through trades, and NFL rules like Restricted Free Agent tendering, a team may gain additional picks. Theoretically, there is no limit to the number of picks a single team may hold within a single draft. A team may also be awarded up to 4 compensatory picks in any given draft. Compensatory picks are made at the end of rounds 3-7. These picks are given to teams who lost more free agents who meet specific criteria than they gained during the previous year's free agency period. Teams may also be awarded compensatory picks if they had an even exchange in free agents, but lost higher valued FA's than they gained. These picks are awarded at the NFL Annual meeting.
In the ten years between Elway and McDaniels, Denver had a total of 82 picks. I chose to not attempt to determine which picks were among Denver's original 7 picks for any given year, which were compensatory picks, and which were acquired through trades. Ultimately, it is not particularly significant how the picks were acquired but rather how the picks were used. The picks can be broken down in multiple ways: by Year, by Round, and by Position.
| Year |
# of Picks |
Round |
# of Picks |
Position |
# of Picks |
| 1999 |
12 |
1 |
9 |
QB |
4 |
| 2000 |
10 |
2 |
13 |
RB |
9 |
| 2001 |
6 |
3 |
10 |
FB |
1 |
| 2002 |
8 |
4 |
15 |
WR |
14 |
| 2003 |
10 |
5 |
10 |
TE |
5 |
| 2004 |
10 |
6 |
11 |
OT |
3 |
| 2005 |
6 |
7 |
14 |
OG |
6 |
| 2006 |
7 |
C |
3 |
||
| 2007 |
4 |
DE |
10 |
||
| 2008 |
9 |
DT |
6 |
||
| LB |
5 |
||||
| DB |
14 |
||||
| K |
1 |
||||
| P |
1 |
A few things stand out when this data is examined.
First, the Broncos had 10 or more picks in 4 years (1999, 2000, 2003, and 2004). Denver had 3 years in which they held fewer than the base set of 7 picks (2001, 2005 and 2007). The Broncos had a remarkably few picks (4) in 2007. Denver's options were extremely limited by having that small a number of picks in 2007.
Second, it is interesting to note how many of Denver's picks occurred in the later rounds. The three largest rounds, in number of picks, were the 7th (14), the 4th (15) and the 2nd (13). Denver had 1 year (2005) when they didn't have a 1st round pick.
Third, 34% of Denver's picks have been spent on WR (14) and DB (14). 20% of the Broncos picks have been on the defensive line (10 DEs & 6 DTs). Thus we can see that over the last 10 years, over 50% of Denver's picks have been spent on 4 positions. The large number of DBs and D-linemen may be due in part to the turnover in Defensive Coordinators.
Fourth, 45 (54.8%) of Denver's 82 draft picks were used on offensive players. This may well be a result of Shanahan's interest in the offense. I remember hearing one of the Broncos' defenders had remarked that he felt like the defense was treated like second class citizens.
Another way the drafts can be looked at would be to examine which positions were drafted in which rounds. When we take this approach we find:
| 1 |
2 |
3 |
4 |
5 |
6 |
7 |
|
| QB |
1 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
3 |
| RB |
0 |
2 |
1 |
2 |
1 |
1 |
2 |
| FB |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
1 |
| WR |
1 |
2 |
2 |
2 |
3 |
3 |
1 |
| TE |
0 |
1 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
2 |
2 |
| OT |
2 |
0 |
1 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
| OG |
0 |
1 |
0 |
3 |
2 |
1 |
0 |
| C |
0 |
0 |
0 |
1 |
0 |
2 |
0 |
| DE |
1 |
2 |
2 |
2 |
1 |
1 |
1 |
| DT |
0 |
1 |
0 |
3 |
1 |
0 |
1 |
| LB |
2 |
2 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
1 |
0 |
| DB |
2 |
2 |
4 |
2 |
2 |
0 |
2 |
| K |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
1 |
| P |
0 |
0 |
0 |
1 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
What can we glean from this information?
First, OT, LB and DB were the most common 1st round choices, comprising 2/3 of the Denver's 9 1st round picks. QB, WR and DE make up the rest of the 1st round choices. Interestingly enough, 44.4% of the Bronco's 1st round picks were spent on defensive players. Denver only spent a single 1st round pick on a QB.
Second, rounds 2-5 were evenly split between offensive and defensive picks with 24 on each side of the ball. Rounds 6 & 7 were heavily invested in the offensive side of the ball -- 18 offensive picks to 7 defensive.
Third, 3/4 of the QBs were taken in the 7th round. 7/9 of the RBs were taken in the 3rd round or later -- 2/3 of the RBs were taken in the 4th round or later. Only 1 FB was taken -- in the 7th round. 11/14 of the WRs were taken in the 3rd round or later. 4/5 of the TEs were taken in the 6th & 7th rounds. 2/3 of the OT were taken in the 1st round. 6/7 of the OG were taken in the 4th through the 6th round. 2/3 of the Cs were taken in the 6th round -- none were taken earlier than the 4th round. The DEs were spread throughout the draft, though 60% of them were taken in the 2nd through 4th rounds. 1/2 of the DTs were taken in the 4th round. 4/5 of the LBs were taken in the 1st or 2nd round. 8/14 of the DBs were taken in rounds 1-3. No kicker was taken before the 4th round.
There is one final way to look at these players: their longevity as Broncos. In other words, how long did each player remain a Bronco? Did they move on to other teams? How many years were they a primary starter? Did they play well enough to be selected for the Pro Bowl? Where they so exceptional that they were selected as an All Pro player? The statistics in the tables has been drawn from pro-football-reference.com. The following tables -- which are quite lengthy, since there are 82 players to look at -- have the following pieces of informaiton:
| Name |
Pos |
Rd |
Yrs |
St |
G |
AP |
PB |
Other |
| Obviously, the player's name |
The player's position |
The round in which the player was taken |
# of years the player played for the Broncos |
# of years player was a primary starter at his position for the Broncos |
# of games the player played for the Broncos |
# of times the player was voted All Pro as a Bronco. |
# of times the player was selected for the Pro Bowl as a Bronco. |
Did the player play for any other teams? |
Please remember: These statistics reflect only the time each player spent as a Bronco. This is important since many of the players moved on to other teams. Also please note that the data from pro-football-reference.com does not include the 2009 stats for the 2008 draft class. I am not certain why this is so, and have sent a note to the site requesting an update.
DRAFT CLASS OF 1999
| Name |
Pos |
Rd |
Yrs |
St |
G |
AP |
PB |
Other |
| Al Wilson |
LB |
1 |
8 |
8 |
125 |
1 |
5 |
No |
| Montae Raegor |
DT |
2 |
4 |
0 |
45 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Lennie Friedman |
OG |
2 |
3 |
1 |
33 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Chris Watson |
DB |
3 |
1 |
0 |
14 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Travis McGriff |
WR |
3 |
3 |
0 |
34 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Olandis Gary |
RB |
4 |
4 |
1 |
35 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| David Bowens |
DE |
5 |
1 |
0 |
16 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Darwin Brown |
DB |
5 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Desmond Clark |
TE |
6 |
3 |
0 |
41 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Chad Plummer |
WR |
6 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Billy Miller |
TE |
7 |
2 |
0 |
22 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Justin Swift |
TE |
7 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
There were 12 players selected in the 1999 draft. Three players (Brown, Plummer, Swift) did not make the team; two of those (Plummer, Swift) ended up with other teams. 9 players ended up player for other teams after playing for the Broncos. Three players (Wilson, Friedman, Gary) won starting positions for at least 1 year. 1 player (Wilson) was voted to the All Pro team. 1 player (Wilson with 5 trips) was voted to the Pro Bowl. The average number of years played for the Broncos (not counting the 3 players who did not make the team) was 3 years. Wilson had the longest tenure at 8 years.
DRAFT CLASS OF 2000
| Name |
Pos |
Rd |
Yrs |
St |
G |
AP |
PB |
Other |
| Deltha O'Neal |
DB |
1 |
4 |
2 |
61 |
0 |
1 |
Yes |
| Ian Gold |
LB |
2 |
7 |
4 |
99 |
0 |
1 |
Yes |
| Kennoy Kennedy |
DB |
2 |
5 |
4 |
73 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Chris Cole |
WR |
3 |
3 |
0 |
35 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Jerry Johnson |
DT |
4 |
1 |
0 |
9 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Cooper Carlisle |
OG |
4 |
7 |
2 |
95 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Muneer Moore |
WR |
5 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Mike Anderson |
RB |
6 |
5 |
3 |
74 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Jarious Jackson |
QB |
7 |
4 |
0 |
5 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Leroy Fields |
WR |
7 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
No |
There were 10 players selected in the 2000 draft. 2 players (Moore, Fields) did not make the team. 5 players (O'Neal, Gold, Kennedy, Carlisle, Anderson) played for other teams after playing for the Broncos. 5 players (O'Neal, Gold, Kennedy, Carlisle, Anderson) won starting positions for two or more years. None of this class was elected to the All Pro team. Two players (O'Neal, Gold) were elected to the Pro Bowl. The average tenure of this class (not counting Fields & Moore who did not make the team) was 4.5 years. Gold had the longest tenure at 7 years. A larger percentage of the 2000 draft class stayed with the Broncos for a longer average tenure than the 1999 class.
DRAFT CLASS OF 2001
| Name |
Pos |
Rd |
Yrs |
St |
G |
AP |
PB |
Other |
| Willie Middlebrooks |
DB |
1 |
4 |
0 |
51 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Paul Toviessi |
DE |
2 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Reggie Hayward |
DE |
3 |
4 |
1 |
47 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Ben Hamilton |
OG |
4 |
7 |
6 |
111 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Nick Harris |
P |
4 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Kevin Kasper |
WR |
6 |
3 |
0 |
27 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
The 2001 class was one of the smaller draft classes during the time we are considering. Two players (Toviessi, Harris) did not make the team; Toviessi did not make the team due to injury issues, Harris was cut, but picked up by another team. 3 of the 4 remaining players went on to play for other teams. Only 2 players (Hayward, Hamilton) were able to win starting positions. The average tenure of this draft class (not counting Toviessi & Harris) was 4.5 years. Hamilton had the longest tenure at 7 years. None of this class has been selected to the All Pro team, nor to the Pro Bowl.
DRAFT CLASS OF 2002
| Name |
Pos |
Rd |
Yrs |
St |
G |
AP |
PB |
Other |
| Ashley Lelie |
WR |
1 |
4 |
3 |
64 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Clinton Portis |
RB |
2 |
2 |
2 |
29 |
0 |
1 |
Yes |
| Dorsett Davis |
DE |
3 |
1 |
0 |
14 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Sam Brandon |
DB |
4 |
5 |
1 |
63 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Herb Haygood |
WR |
5 |
1 |
0 |
4 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Jeb Putzier |
TE |
6 |
4 |
0 |
41 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Chris Young |
DB |
7 |
2 |
0 |
21 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Montsanto Pope |
DT |
7 |
4 |
1 |
48 |
0 |
0 |
No |
The class of 2002 is the first of the classes under consideration in which all of the draft choices made the team. 4 of the players (Lelie, Portis, Brandon, Pope) went on to secure starting positions. Only 3 of these draftees (Lelie, Portis, Putzier) went on to play for other teams. 1 player (Portis) was selected for the Pro Bowl. The average length of this class' tenure was 2.9 years. Brandon had the longest tenure at 5 years, though 3 players (Lelie, Putzier, Pope) were close seconds with 4 years.
DRAFT CLASS OF 2003
| Name |
Pos |
Rd |
Yrs |
St |
G |
AP |
PB |
Other |
| George Foster |
OT |
1 |
4 |
3 |
49 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Terry Pierce |
LB |
2 |
2 |
0 |
18 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Quentin Griffin |
RB |
4 |
2 |
0 |
16 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Nick Eason |
DT |
4 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Bryant McNeal |
DE |
4 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Ben Claxton |
OG |
5 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Adrian Madise |
WR |
5 |
1 |
0 |
11 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Aaron Hunt |
DE |
6 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Clint Mitchell |
DE |
7 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Ahmaad Galloway |
RB |
7 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
No |
This would appear to be the most disappointing class of the post-Elway era. There were 10 collegians drafted. 6 out of the 10 (Eason, McNeal, Claxton, Hunt, Mitchell, Galloway) failed to make the team. Only 2 of those 6 (Eason, Claxton) caught on with other teams. Of the 4 players that made the team, only Foster became a starter. None of this class made it to the Pro Bowl, nor were any selected to the All Pro Team. The average tenure for the 4 who made the team was 2.3 years.
DRAFT CLASS OF 2004
| Name |
Pos |
Rd |
Yrs |
St |
G |
AP |
PB |
Other |
| D.J. Williams |
LB |
1 |
6 |
6 |
91 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Tatum Bell |
RB |
2 |
4 |
1 |
49 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Darius Watts |
WR |
2 |
2 |
0 |
22 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Jeremy LeSueur |
DB |
3 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Jeff Shoate |
DB |
5 |
2 |
0 |
14 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Triandos Luke |
WR |
6 |
1 |
0 |
10 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Josh Sewell |
C |
6 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Matt Mauck |
QB |
7 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Brandon Miree |
RB |
7 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Bradlee Van Pelt |
QB |
7 |
1 |
0 |
3 |
0 |
0 |
No |
This would appear to be another disappointing draft class. Of the 10 players selected, 4 (LeSueur, Sewell, Mauck and Miree) never played for Denver. 3 of those (LeSueur, Mauck, Miree) were picked up by other teams. Only 2 of the 6 (Williams, Bell) who made the team played for more than 2 seasons. Only 2 (Williams, Bell) won starting positions. The average tenure for the 6 Broncos from this draft class was 2.7 years. There were no All Pro nor Pro Bowl Players among this group.
DRAFT CLASS OF 2005
| Name |
Pos |
Rd |
Yrs |
St |
G |
AP |
PB |
Other |
| Darrent Williams |
DB |
2 |
2 |
2 |
27 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Karl Paymah |
DB |
3 |
4 |
0 |
60 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Domonique Foxworth |
DB |
3 |
3 |
0 |
46 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Maurice Clarett |
RB |
3 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Chris Myers |
OG |
6 |
3 |
1 |
41 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Paul Ernster |
K |
7 |
2 |
0 |
18 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
The class of 2005 will be forever etched in Broncos' fans' memory for two things: the untimely shooting death of the rising young star, Darrent Williams, and the failed Maurice Clarett reclamation project. Though a small draft class, this one began by showing promise -- 5 out of the 6 (all except Clarett) made the team. 5 of the 6 lasted more than a single year. It is interesting to note that 1/2 of the draft picks were used on DBs in this draft. It is also interesting to note that only 2 (Williams, Myers) won starting positions. The average tenure for this group was 2.8 years. Unfortunately, none of this group made the Pro Bowl, or were selected to the All Pro team.
DRAFT CLASS OF 2006
| Name |
Pos |
Rd |
Yrs |
St |
G |
AP |
PB |
Other |
| Jay Cutler |
QB |
1 |
3 |
2 |
27 |
0 |
1 |
Yes |
| Tony Scheffler |
TE |
2 |
4 |
1 |
56 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Brandon Marshall |
WR |
4 |
4 |
2 |
61 |
0 |
2 |
No |
| Elvis Dumervil |
DE |
4 |
4 |
2 |
61 |
1 |
1 |
No |
| Domenik Hixon |
WR |
4 |
1 |
0 |
4 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Chris Kuper |
OG |
5 |
4 |
2 |
35 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Greg Eslinger |
C |
6 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
No |
The class of 2006 followed the same sort of pattern as earlier draft classes. Only 1 player (Eslinger) failed to make the team. Only 2 players (Hixon and Cutler) went on to other teams. Among the players that remained with the Broncos, 5 (Cutler, Scheffler, Marshall, Dumervil, Kuper) became starters. Their average tenure was 3.3 years -- this is not a surprising number since the maximum any of them could have been Broncos is 4. 3 players (Cutler, Marshall and Dumervil) won Pro Bowl honors. 1 (Dumervil) was voted All Pro.
DRAFT CLASS OF 2007
| Name |
Pos |
Rd |
Yrs |
St |
G |
AP |
PB |
Other |
| Jarvis Moss |
DE |
1 |
3 |
0 |
19 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Tim Crowder |
DE |
2 |
2 |
0 |
19 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Ryan Harris |
OT |
3 |
3 |
1 |
27 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Marcus Thomas |
DT |
4 |
3 |
0 |
27 |
0 |
0 |
No |
This was the smallest of the draft classes in the time period we are considering. It has done very well with draftees staying with the team -- only Crowder has moved on. 1 player (Harris) secured a starting position. There were no All Pro or Pro Bowl honors among this group. The average tenure (realizing that there is a maximum of 3) was 2.75.
DRAFT CLASS OF 2008
| Name |
Pos |
Rd |
Yrs |
St |
G |
AP |
PB |
Other |
| Ryan Clady |
OT |
1 |
2 |
1 |
16 |
1 |
1 |
No |
| Eddie Royal |
WR |
2 |
2 |
1 |
29 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Kory Lichtenstein |
C |
4 |
1 |
0 |
16 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Jack Williams |
DB |
4 |
2 |
0 |
17 |
0 |
0 |
Yes |
| Ryan Torain |
RB |
5 |
1 |
0 |
2 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Carlton Powell |
DT |
5 |
2 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Spencer Larsen |
LB |
6 |
2 |
0 |
19 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Josh Barrett |
DB |
7 |
2 |
0 |
14 |
0 |
0 |
No |
| Peyton Hillis |
FB |
7 |
2 |
1 |
22 |
0 |
0 |
No |
With the class of 2008, we begin to see Denver holding on to draft picks (after the 2007 season where we only had 4) and using them to develop the team. Out of the 9 picks we had in 2008, all players made the team. Since then, however, 2 (Lichtenstein, Torain) only played a single year and neither player moved on to another team. 1 player (Williams) played well, but eventually changed teams. 1 player (Powell) has had to deal with being sidelined by injuries. The rest of the players have all made contributions to the Broncos. 1 player (Clady) has won both All Pro and Pro Bowl honors. The average tenure among this group is 1.8 years (out of a possible 2 years).
So, what do we make of all of this? There's a lot of data, and a number of inferences which could be made. but first, let's summarize what we've found (for those who did not choose to wade through the tables): The Broncos selected 82 players in the draft between 1999 and 2008. 19 (19%) draft picks failed to make the team. 36 (44%) players eventually ended up on other teams. 28 (34%) were able to win a starting position for the Broncos. 3 players were awarded All Pro honors. 7 players won Pro Bowl honors. The average tenure of this group of players has been 3.1 years. According to the NFLPA, the average NFL career is 3.5 years.
To gain a small comparison, let's take a brief look at the Indianapolis Colt. The Colts qualify as a "winning" team given the fact that between 1999 and 2008, they have had only 1 year with less than 10 wins. They've had 4 years with 12 wins, 2 years with 13, and 1 with 14. During the time period we looked at, the Colts drafted 81 players (1 less than the Broncos). 8 (10%) of the draftees failed to make the team. 27 (33%) players eventually changed teams. 40 (49%) players became starters. 4 players won All Pro honors. 10 won Pro Bowl honors. This suggests that the Broncos might have been able to do better.
All of this leaves us with a fair number of questions: How do we judge effective draft strategies? What criteria do we use: longevity? Impressive stats? Non-tangible contributions to the team? Winning a starter's role? Pro Bowl selection? All Pro selection? Win-Loss record each year? Just what does it mean to say we had a successful draft?
Another issue that arises is: as mentioned above, the NFLPA has stated that the average NFL career is 3.5 years. Yet, we are told that we can not judge whether or not a rookie has reached his potential for approximately 3 years. This would seem to create a bit of a dilemma. If we can't tell how a draftee will pan out until his third year, and the average career is 3.5 years, chances are we'll only have that player for 1/2 of a year once we figure out whether or not we should keep him.
Some things that bothered me, after compiling this data
(1)The fact that almost 20% of the Broncos' draft picks did not even make the team. It would be interesting to see to see what the league-wide average is on that. Indianapolis, for example, only had about 10% of their picks fail to make the team during that period, so my suspicion is that the league average is somewhat lower than Denver's result. Perhaps a future edition of ASQ might address this, if an enterprising member doesn't happen to take it up in a fanpost (hint hint).
(2)The fact that 44% of Denver's draft picks eventually ended up playing for other teams. Again, it would be interesting to see what the league-wide average is on that. Again, my suspicion is that the Broncos had a higher than average turnover. Interestingly enough, however, is the break out of the players who left in terms of offense vs defense. The situation in Denver has often been portrayed as one in which -- in essence -- Shanahan doted on the offense and tolerated the defense. Of the 36 players who left Denver and went to another team (whether via being released, through free agency, or being traded), 20 of them were from the offensive side of the ball.
(3)The fact that 16 out of the 28 draftees that won starting positions, ended up playing for other teams.
(4)The fact that the average tenure with the Broncos for our draftees during this period was shorter than the league average for player careers.
What do I draw from all of this? The results of Shanahan's draft choices were, overall, mediocre at best. Oh, make no mistake, there were highs -- such as 2002, 2007 & 2008 where all of the picks made the team; also 2000 and 2006 which each contributed 5 starters to the team. Yet there were also equally low lows -- such as 1999 where 9 out of 12 picks ended up on other teams, 2000 where 5 picks that became starters went to other teams, or 2003 where 6 out of the 10 picks failed to even make the team. We must also not forget 2007 where we only had 4 picks in total.
Looking at these results, I am left with the impression that Shanahan truly believed the Broncos were only a player or two away from contention. It also strikes me that he tended to be reactionary in his drafting -- such as in 2004 when the Broncos were torched in the wildcard game by Indianapolis' passing for 458 and 4 passing TDs, the first 3 picks in the 2005 draft were DBs. So, as I mentioned above, at best, Shanahan's strategy can be considered hit and miss, and does not really reflect an intent to build up the team through the draft. For that reason, I would have to agree with the assertions that a portion, IMHO a very large portion, of Denver's decline and struggles have to do with how Shanahan approached the draft.
How do you see Denver's drafts from 1999 to 2008?
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I've stood by this point for a long time, even when people think I'm crazy for it....
Mike Shanahan was a terrible draft person. There’s no two ways about it.
John Clayton is the head Dean at Fail University (known as F.U. in short)
Formerly known as Calijoefornia
not nice at all... probably trusted his scouts as much as his DC's
i hope he didn’t learn his lesson for Washington! (Even know I’d like him to prove me right about being a great coach…)
by Whidbey Bronco on Mar 4, 2010 6:31 PM MST up reply actions
e. None of the above
Mostly terrible…Mostly. Some of it makes me wince.
I think you’re right that Shanny believe we were one player away. That sort of tunnelvision ended up costing him his job.
Brilliant post by the way. I believe McX will have a better curve. It seems to me it is Josh’s pet peeve to waste picks. Why make a selection if they won’t make the team. Might as well throw the pick to the Lions. (Pun intended)
Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
I tend to agree
I don’t think Shanahan’s drafts were a total bust, but I hope McDaniels/Xanders can do better
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough
Toviessi was a physical monster who never played a down in the NFL due to injury
Shanny took a number of those injury fliers. And then, in the Late Shannyassic period, it makes sense that he was so paranoid about injuries to players.
Shanny sent out some seriously bad vibes when it came to injuries, and right up until the end, when we saw 5 RBs to IR and others injured, those vibes just kept coming back to him as tidal waves….
Precision in thought, concision in style, decision in life.
"That's MR.Styg..."
It took me quite a bit of digging to find out much of anything about Toviessi
quite a sad story in & of itself.
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough
Looking at that list
hurts my eyes. If you go back and look at the Steelers first round picks since 98, they’ve hit on more players than Shanny hit on in his entire 10 drafts.
Despite 10 terrible drafts
I only counted 1 losing season, which was in 99
by BroncosFaN88 on Mar 4, 2010 6:43 PM MST via mobile reply actions
2007 was 7-9
Technically a losing season. I’m not nitpicking you mate, just sayin.
John Clayton is the head Dean at Fail University (known as F.U. in short)
Formerly known as Calijoefornia
It is also helpful to remember that there were 3 8-8 seasons
So 1/2 of Shanahan’s last 10 seasons were 8-8 or below.
What concerned me more was that we had only 4 playoff appearances during that span, and just a single playoff win.
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough
by Brian Shrout on Mar 4, 2010 8:36 PM MST up reply actions 1 recs
That's true, BFN88
But over the last couple of years, you could see the wheels coming off the truck. We kept hoping for something to turn around, but it never did.
Don't say rebuild - say reload...
Shanny did have some great drafts
and some bad ones, and most teams fall into the same type of drafting histories I guess. I noted we compared to the Colts and in the notes the Steelers. Before someone calls it a Titanic draft I feel the Lions, Raiders or Redskins should be referenced. Shanny was an average to below average drafter. But the teams had a winning record over that time period which goes to his abilities as a coach I believe. Glad we have McD, but Shanny the coach was great.
Bronco Learning Curve
"I don’t want to lose any time... I don’t want the team thinking I’m a money-first guy. I’m here to play football and to win. Money is secondary." Robert Ayers
"I’m still around .... I might just do it for my own well-being. I don’t get no bonuses for it, I’m just doing it because this is what I do." Doom
"He can throw a fastball, he can throw a touch ball, he throws an awesome deep ball" Brandon Lloyd on K.O.
I agree sbhchawk
I wouldn’t classify Shanahan’s drafts as the Titanic. I tend to see them as “Fair to Middlin’” at best, and “Worst than Most, Better than Some” at worst.
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough
Picky, picky
If 19 of 82 didn’t make the team. That’s not 19%; it’s 24%. Pretty high as compared to the Colts.
Great read, by the way.
You, IMO, make MHR a joyful indulgence.
Thanks for the kind words and the correction on the math.
That’s what happens when trying to deal with that many numbers all at once. :)
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough
An inkling?
I’ve been a Bronco fan for over 35 years (no misprint). As I remember, Red Miller and John Ralston were regarded more highly for their drafting than their coaching ability.
Dan Reeves was, as I remember, not regarded as especially good at drafting, but did not have control of that until late in his time in Denver (which IMO resulted in his fall).
I’ve always had the impression (perhaps not supportable with facts and statistics, since I don’t have the inclination or ability to do what you do, BShrout) that the more control Shanahan took of the personnell part of the operation, the more noticeable the drop in the talent level of the team.
Could be wrong, though.
That could well be, though I haven't actually tried to corollate those two factors.
I would definitely tend to agree that the more control Shanahan exercised over the day-to-day operations, the more we saw — as Emmett Smith says it — the wheels start to come off.
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough
Reading this has made my teeth hurt and I really really hate that!
Great teams build their depth through the draft. The players don’t have to be all-pro, but they better be valuable contributors. Talent can’t be replaced easily. It’s why drafting best player available is the most sound strategy. Our drafts have not built a team with adequate talent or depth to compete for a championship. Let’s hope this administration builds us the right way. The jury is still out on 2009 draft (at least in some of our minds) but having more time to plan and judge talent will hopefully help with the process.
Imagination is more important than knowledge. A. Einstein
I voted for pretty poor, but not awful, by the way.
Imagination is more important than knowledge. A. Einstein
It will be an interesting draft to follow this year
I do believe that McDaniels/Xanders on the right path — building up the depth through the draft with the best player available.
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough
Not to get on your case (since you got these stats elsewhere)....
…. but Bradlee Van Pelt did land with the Texans in 2006 eventually, although he was cut early in 2007.
Thanks for that update
I drew the information from the player information on pro-football-reference.com. They for some reason did not show Van Pelt’s Houston tenure.
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough
Actually, you point is more valid
24% did not make the team would make your point even more valid.
That’s not a good number.
Ivanthenotsobad
in regards to what you said earlier, Ralston did draft well, but not Red Miller. Two of his three first rounders were busts(Schindler, 1977 and Clark, 1979), and a lot of other picks failed to make a contribution. He also orchestrated the ill-fated Robinson trade of 1980.
As for Shanahan, it did seem like he was turning the corner with his 08 draft in terms of character players, but he didn’t seem to put as much stock in that in previous years, especially with the Clarett drafting. I think that his FA forays since Elway left, however, were just as bad, like getting Dale Carter in 99, Daryl Gardener in 03, and bringing in the whole Cleveland D-line five years ago.
I'm thinking you may be correct:
As for Shanahan, it did seem like he was turning the corner with his 08 draft in terms of character players, but he didn’t seem to put as much stock in that in previous years
I’m also still mulling over a comment by Whidbey Bronco who commented that part of Shanahan’s issues with the draft came from the sense of urgency in getting to the SB before Elway retired. Three years of the “quick-fix” through free agency and the draft followed by a SB win may have cemented in a perception that this was the way to go. The problem was when John left, and later the loss of TD and others from those SB teams, Shanahan couldn’t shift away from the ingrained strategy, even though his team was no longer in the same place as it had been prior to the SB wins.
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough
Great post B
It’s something I have always wondered about. Where exactly do we fit in with the league wide averages for those years would be a great part II. I voted worst than most better than some. Corection in percentage from 19% to 24% makes me think this was “the at best”. and "pretty poor but not awful “the at worst”.
Rec’d of course
Thanks PS
Great. I just realized, that I now have another project. LOL. With 32 teams it may well be a part II, III, IV, V . . . . ;-p
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough

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