MHR University - Individual Roles on the Offensive Line

MHR University - Individual Roles on the Offensive Line
(and QB Adjustments)
Denver Broncos fans have a lot to chew on for this upcoming season. In terms of the offensive line, there are many considerations to talk about. Consider:
-
Denver drafted several OLmen in the 2010 draft.
-
Denver continues the move away from the zone block into the gap block (sometimes mistakenly called "man block").
-
A prominent first round pick (Tim Tebow) is left handed.
-
Denver will likely continue towards the singleback formations, eschewing the need for a FB on the roster.
Let's talk a little bit about the roles of individual OLmen, and how they change (or don't) under the expected program for 2010. See you after the jump!
The importance of being "right"
Let's start with a basic theme throughout football. Most run plays are to the center-right of the line. There are many reasons for this. First, we are in a right tilting world when it comes to cognitive function. About 85% of the world is right handed. We read (in western culture) towards the right. In military protocol, the senior officer or NCO walks to the right, and the right side is a place of honor reserved for one's flag. Dating back to ancient warfare, the best spearmen lined up on the right.
In football, the "strong side" refers to the side that the TE lines up on (almost always the right side). So ingrained in our pysche is the concept of "right" as dominant, that many broadcasters will erroneously assume that the right side is always called the strong side (even former players).
The runs not only go the right more often than not, but the go to the center. In euclidean geometry, the straightest way between two points goes along a straight line. In physics, we know that "bulling" ahead picks up yards when resistance is met, but starting to one side and turning leads to a loss of speed and momentum (as everyone from fighter pilots to submarine commanders now).
This isn't to say that other runs are inferior. Runs to the outside have a higher probability of long yardage, yet have a lower rate of success. Runs to the left side are often played because of the surprise factor or to take advantage of a mismatch. However, since the best run blockers are on the right side of the line we will see more runs to the right side (the pass blockers guard the QB's blind side). In the NFL, only the San Diego Chargers (in our own AFC West) have tried to make major advances in testing the left side for dedicated running routes.
Given the above points, we can now consider the roles of our OLmen.
Individual roles of the OLmen
The center (OC) has a unique problem. He must hike the ball to the QB while still maintaining the ability to either fend off a pass rush or support a run blocking scheme. There is no room for error (as a botched snap can lead to a turnover). The OC must not only be able to make perfect snaps every time (with opponents bearing down on him), but he is also the closest player to the ball, the QB, and (most often) the running lane. In addition to all of this, he often is tasked with reading the pass rush assignments (QBs take this role too, but QBs are burdened with several responsibilities, and often the OC reads the DL better because the DL is his specialty on every single play). In today's NFL, we often prize the left tackle (LT) the most on the OL. Given the sheer number of responsibilities for the OC, one can make the case that it is the OC who deserves the credit as "the OL's anchor".
But for sheer run blocking, the right guard (RG) is the player selected by coaching staffs. Again, most runs are to the center-right, and with the center already encumbered with snapping the ball, the RG gets the primary task of clearing a lane for the runner.
The right tackle (RT) is the lesser of the two tackles. Both are tasked with preventing the common pass rushes and blitzes from the outside, but the left side features two qualities the require the better tackle to play the left side.
- The blind side is to the left side of the formation in most cases, and
- The right side has some help (commonly, there is a tight end [TE] playing the right side),
- Defenses place their better pass rushing DEs and OLBs on the offense's left side.
In opposition the concept that the "lesser" tackle plays the right side, it is the "lesser" guard who plays the left side (as less runs go this way).
Before I get a lot of hate mail for my use of the terms "greater" and "lesser", it may be worth noting that while the better pass blocker is the LT, and the better run blocker is the RG, it is in fact the LG and RT who are most often jacks of all trades. In other words, the LG and the RT may not be specialists in run and pass blocking (respectively), but they are more often required to do accomplish both roles of blocking more so than their specialist counterparts.
Are there changes for left handed QBs?
Do teams switch around these players when a left handed QB shows up? Surprisingly, the answer is most often "no". While any guard and tackle can move to the other side of the line, years of practice make them more used to blocking in their positions (in terms of body mechanics, balance, and anticipating certain nuances from the DLmen - who themselves have certain ways they prefer to play the game depending on where they line up). Further, because OLmen play as a team (coordinating their blocks in real time and not just by the script), shuffling linemen can cause the effect of disrupting years of work built up in knowing what the guy to the left and the right will do in any situation. Runs still go to the right, and the run oriented side of the line is still needed on this side. WRs and TEs shouldn't be expected to change their routes (and the big playbook in their heads) for the sake of one player either. And while the defense may scheme a little differently for a left handed QB, their position assignments won't change either.
Consider also that unless the team has a depth chart full of lefties, the disruption if a back-up right hander comes in would be further chaos. Even for a QB, the coach isn't likely to disrupt all of the other positions on the team. Little nuances exist for every player on the team, and making a symetrical change to how the players line up and what their roles are is a much more difficult proposition than many can imagine.
In other words, a left handed QB doesn't switch the field around so that the game is played in a "mirrored" manner. Instead, a left handed QB changes the entire dynamic of the game.
Impact on Denver / QB adjustments
I anticipate that there may be some bumps in the road for our OL, magnified for the line by each starter that is new to starting for the team. However, one advantage of dropping the zone block program is that adjustment periods for new OLmen will be much shorter.
Also helping the adjustment period will be Denver's system, which features blocking TEs (often two) and quick screens to the edges (which keeps DCs from wanting to over-commit LBs to assisting in attacking the center of the OL).
Without a FB to assist in blocking the center, a mobile QB like Tebow could further assist the team. I won't get into the middle of the Tebow debate here. As a Broncos fan (as well as from a coaching perspective) I am behind whoever is on our roster - starter or back-up. I am pulling for either QB to lead our team to the promised land. My point in bringing up Tebow is as follows.
Defensive coordinators follow a rule of thumb when it comes to how to blitz a QB. Mobile QBs are dangerous if they get out of the pocket, so we want to crash the pocket from the outside (the edges) to keep him from moving. On the other hand, pocket passers do their best when allowed to stay in place to read the field. For pocket passers, DCs like to attack the pocket from inside (straight ahead) to "flush out the QB" from his prime spot. With changes on the OL coming in terms of manpower and scheming, a mobile QB furthers the difficulty for DCs the Broncos will face.
The strength of the Broncos OL right now is the play of the OTs. Both are excellent pass blockers, making blitzes from the outside difficult. If the interior of the OL is the weaker point for Denver, a QB who can run out of the pocket (with amazing pass blocking from the OTs and blocking TEs) should have plenty of time to do his thing. Never the less, if Kyle Orton is starting he will continue to make passes to the edges (and screens) which should kept attacking defenses honest.
Last, what about reports that Coach McDaniels is training Tebow to be a pocket passer? This title (on a recent AP article featured in Yahoo Sports) was a little misleading. Denver is doing nothing of the sort (as the article correctly points out). The coaching staff is bringing in a new rookie QB the way that any team does, by focusing on refining skills and unlearning some of the bad habits that come with college football. He will first master his mechanics, learn the playbook, and only then be allowed to mix in his own skill set.
The game of football is faster and more brutal at the pro level. The difference in also noticed in how much more intellectualy difficult the game is at the pro level. One example: In the case of Tebow (as with Manning and Elway, to use two prominant examples), he doesn't use the pro form for throwing that requires the ball to start near to the QB's head. One can get away with this in college (where the defense may take longer to get to a QB), and college coaches have less time to develop QBs because they only limited times with the players (in terms of NCAA restrictions on practice time as well as the length of time a player is in college). College coaches thus are often focused on winning now.
Do some QBs come out of college with better mechanics? Sure they do. But QBs often rise and fall regardless of how well they learned in college. Peyton Manning's incredible ability to track multiple receivers at the same time made up for his mechanical shortcomings, and John Elway's amazing athletic skills made up for the same issues that Manning had. Players with good mechanics have also busted (and we can name many first round busts).
Frankly, Kyle Orton hasn't received a fair shake either. For years he has been bounced from starter to back-up to starter again, as well as playing with mediocre talent (Chicago's OL and WRs) and switching teams / systems. He hasn't been given any consistency to develop. And still (like Tim Tebow) he is a winner, putting up better than respectable stats.
Denver continues to be a team in transition, but it is a team that is slowly becoming deep in several positions (we recently turned down Jacksonville inquiries into another Denver QB, Brady Quinn, whom we haven't even talked about in this article).
Denver may not have hit any home runs in this draft (depending on one's perspective), but I believe Denver is following a smart, team building strategy. With three OLmen, two WRs, and a QB taken in this draft (and some other picks as well), Denver is putting together a young team full of high quality people. The approach seems to be value based; in other words, we may not have "elites" at every position, but we won't have stars at some positions at the expense of other positions. And despite this approach, elites will emerge anyway.
The bad news is that I don't see Denver as a deep playoff team. However, I think my predictions for last year were on target (8-8 record, but with improved individual play covered up by a new coach, new coordinators, a new QB, and a tough schedule). The good news is that I still see the team on an improvement track. I think we had a solid draft, the team has another year to gel, and the schedule is easier (at least in terms of teams; MHR editor in chief John Bena points out that Denver has several difficulties to overcome, including three consecutive road games, an away game for a MNF match up, a final game that the team can't "take off" as it is against a strong division rival, and yet another away game for an opener).
I'll hold off on my final predictions for the season until I see our pre-season play (team chemistry and player performance, not wins and losses), but for now I think Denver is on course.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Have any questions about the offensive line, the QB position, or anything else "Xs and Os"? Drop your question or comment in the comments section below. Ideas for future MHR-U articles are also deeply appreciated.
Remember, we love to get into the nitty gritty of "deep" football talk, but we love folks that are new to the game as well. There's no such thing as a question that is too simple or "easy". If I don't know the answer, someone on the staff, or one of our incredible members likely has the answer you're looking for. Team and football history, offensive and defensive systems, techniques, contracts, sports medicine, sports law, etc, - MHR has you covered.
Steve Nichols
135 comments
|
37 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Wow
As usual, a great article. One of the reasons I come to MHR is the in depth examination of the game and the knowledgable presenters of said examination. I always read the University, and it never disappoints. Rec’d.
Thanks AZ.
I always appreciate the kind words.
: )
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 12:44 PM MDT up reply actions
Archives?
I know someone else mentioned it, but can we look into creating a “MHR U” tab on the site, to access all the old U articles?
Rec’d.
- Nick
"Know the enemy, know yourself, and victory is never in doubt, not in a hundred battles."
- Sun Tzu
"if you look close, there’s a hoodie lurking in the background of picture 4. similar to the classic sasquatch shot and equally stunning, as the denver temperature today is relatively fair."
-oxmouth
Hm, there used to be one on the left side of the front page.
Guess it was removed.
"All by their heads, he places crowns."
"God I'm excited for those two to fail miserably." - SBNation writer Andrew Sharp on Josh McDaniels and Tim Tebow.
Quitter's People United Member #18
by Tempestuous Binary on May 6, 2010 12:32 PM MDT up reply actions
On the front page
If you look right under the logo, is a pull down menu called “sections” it’s in there.
I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.
Maxwellsdemon is correct.
They’re all there.
: )
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 12:45 PM MDT up reply actions
You guys rock.
Thanks Steve, and Max.
- Nick
"Know the enemy, know yourself, and victory is never in doubt, not in a hundred battles."
- Sun Tzu
"if you look close, there’s a hoodie lurking in the background of picture 4. similar to the classic sasquatch shot and equally stunning, as the denver temperature today is relatively fair."
-oxmouth
There were a few replies
in another thread about this.
You can click the pull down menu under sections on the main page.
Or:
http://www.milehighreport.com/section/mhr-university
Opinions are like......, Well anyway, this is mine.
Don’t worry about it. As an ignorant redneck, I’m qualified to say that(shout out to KB for this quote as I stole it from his post :-) )
haha, oops
Maybe I should read a little further before replying…..
Opinions are like......, Well anyway, this is mine.
Don’t worry about it. As an ignorant redneck, I’m qualified to say that(shout out to KB for this quote as I stole it from his post :-) )
You're good man.
There are so many articles and comments at MHR that it is easy to miss many of them. We don’t mind answering the same questions because if someone has the question, they haven’t found the answer yet.
We’re here to help!
: )
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 1:12 PM MDT up reply actions
I hope
I did not give the impression I was aggravated by seeing the same question!
I was just opening with “Hey, I just saw this” LOL, I actually knew an answer :-D
Opinions are like......, Well anyway, this is mine.
Don’t worry about it. As an ignorant redneck, I’m qualified to say that(shout out to KB for this quote as I stole it from his post :-) )
No way.
I didn’t get that impression at all. You’re beautiful too.
lol
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 2:55 PM MDT up reply actions
Sean, you rock too
- Nick
"Know the enemy, know yourself, and victory is never in doubt, not in a hundred battles."
- Sun Tzu
"if you look close, there’s a hoodie lurking in the background of picture 4. similar to the classic sasquatch shot and equally stunning, as the denver temperature today is relatively fair."
-oxmouth
Thanks Steve!
Excellent article. What is your take on the size of the OL? Going to the gap block scheme, are you concerned our OL is big enough (excluding Clady) to execute it? I noticed most of the Patriots OL are in the 305-315 lbs range as opposed to the Dallas and Philly OL’s being in the 320-340 lbs range. Just curious on your thoughts about this.
There is a misunderstanding about size that runs deep in football circles.
Many folks think that size (in football) is crucial on the line. To some extent, this is true of NTs in 2 gap 3-4 systems. But other NTs (and men on the OL and DL) have more important issues (technique, balance, firing off the line before the opponent, body mechanics, strength, etc) than just size. Size is a factor, but only one of many.
In the case of the OL, the following maxim is true – “Agility is more important than size and even strength on a zone blocking OL”. However, one shouldn’t draw inferences from that statement. For example, it wouldn’t be correct to assume that “…thus, size is the most important factor for a gap block OLman”. Take Clady. Regardless of the run scheme, he is a very talented pass blocker. In his role as a left tackle, he infrequently run blocks. Still, he can hold his own in that respect too.
I’m not saying that we want midgets on the OL. I’m just saying that an OL like your NE example is talented, as is the Dallas line. Size is a factor, but if a player has other factors going for him that “outweigh” a big OLman, I’ll take the former. I Hope that helps a little.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 12:53 PM MDT up reply actions
Of the top three skills for OL
size is not one. The most important is first step. I’ve seen studies that indicate that the player with the first step wins the battle between 60 to 70% of the time. Next most important is hand work; lineplay has been described as martial arts in a phone both. Both players are battling to keep the other from getting superior hand position, especially getting a sholder into them. Finally, balance; in the midst of all the work in the trench both lineman must keep a low, balanced center of gravity. Get too high and you’re toast. Get off balance and you’re a pancake.
As you can see – size isn’t really an issue in those. Now all things being equal, it is harder to drive a heavier blocker backwards into the pocket. But technique will still overcome size.
by SlowWhiteGuy on May 6, 2010 1:13 PM MDT up reply actions 3 recs
You are dead on.
In fact, one of the best seminars I ever attended showed slow-motion film of two lines from several games. The film was well beyond startling, and made a major impression me. In fact, I would place “first step” closer to the high 90th percentile.
The conclusion of the class I took at the seminar is that all of the factors only come into play if both players fire off the snap at the same time.
We preached “first step” religiously in our own program, and to the point that our DL players rarely heard much else. We didn’t do much blitzing because our DL penetration was so elite most years, and it wasn’t uncommon for our opponents to have negative yardage through much of the game while we called a passive defense.
In football, I worship at the alter of “Fire First” for the DL.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 1:21 PM MDT up reply actions
Size vs technique
Back in the 1970’s, I had the honor of being the escort/bodyguard for one of the founders of a martial art that broke off from Daito-ryu aikijujutsu. At second degree black belt, I was the lowest ranked black belt present during that 4 day period. It included several teaching sessions. I was the resident victim on a couple of them – the rest of the classes required many more attackers than just one.
The founder (called a ‘Soke’, a terms that has to be earned and must be approved by a council of Soke in Japan), described, through his translator, how that art is like aikido done in a phone booth – small circle instead of large circle techniques. He threw around American blown and black belts, including several men weighing upwards of 250 lb, like they were poker chips for a couple of hours straight, explaining and teaching the entire time. he had them attack him full strength and tossed them aside like old laundry or tied them in knots. He was 4’11", fairly slender and 72 years old.
Shortly after his time with us, a sign appeared on the wall – “Old age and treachery will conquor youth and skill”. It was very tongue in cheek, but the point was clear – technique really does win the battle far more often than not. Great article, Steve. Rec’d, and thanks.
By the way, a big reason that we took Ron Fields from SF is that by using a high speed camera, they determined that he had the fastest first step on the SF defensive line. they have some very good players, including Franklin and Sopoaga, but Fields was the fastest of them. I wonder if they won’t use him at LDE – he showed a lot of skill last year, but seemed over his head at times at NT.
Gnothi Seauton
by Doc Bear on May 6, 2010 2:09 PM MDT up reply actions 2 recs
Quick question Dr. and sensei....
What is your take on the Clady injury?
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 2:10 PM MDT up reply actions
I haven't see the details on his surgery - perhaps Ponderosa has
What I’ve seen so far has been that it’s a very straight-forward injury. He’s young, in very good shape, and 3-4 months should be enough, so he may be back in mid- August. He’ll have some adhesions to break down, and you never know in advance, but what I’ve read leaves me pretty comfortable that Denver will have him ready in September.
By the way, while Harris’s injury concerns me even more, due to the tendency for it to flare up, Harris and Clady are seriously tough men. I’d be surprised if we miss them for too many games. there’s some good news there – at least as far as what’s been published.
Gnothi Seauton
It's way too early to tell after this surgery.
He’ll be immobilized and the major concern is the effect on the quadriceps muscle. Atrophy of the muscle and loss of flexibility are the main consequences. It will be 3 months before he’s out of the knee immobilizer and it will challenge his fortitude to do the rehab necessary to regain strength and mobility in his knee joint. His initial burst and quick first step are going to affected by this injury. How soon he can get back enough of each to perform adequately will determine his return to playing time. Realistically we won’t know much more till the end of July.
Imagination is more important than knowledge. A. Einstein
Clady's return
hopefully he doesn’t try to come back too soon, like Harris did last year…
by Merlin Scott on May 7, 2010 10:05 AM MDT up reply actions
So can technique be taught?
Should a team concentrate on finding the biggest OL they can get their hands on and teach them proper technique or is that something that can not be taught to an elite level? I guess I am asking, “are the talents of technique, balance, footwork, and explosion off the snap something that only elite linemen have, or can it be taught to big, slow footed doughboys”. Is size the only thing that can not be taught?
By the time an OLman reaches the NFL level...
…he should already be good at what he does. Then his skills are refined.
The skills for an OLman can be taught, but not from scratch. Any big guy off the street won’t make the team (just like a giant man can’t become a sumo without years of study and practice).
In short, you want a combination of everything already on the plate. Then, you want someone who is coachable to learn and refine just a little bit more.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 3:00 PM MDT up reply actions
Exactly....in my sport, and in a lot of sports, there is a need for "mileage"....
That is, doing the same techniques, over and over, in game situations so that it becomes second nature. Thats why I am always a fan of taking players in draft that have had top quality opposition and played to elite level….they normally will be more NFL ready.
Steve, what a GREAT article….REALLY enjoyed it mate!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
Thank you.
Always a good time to hear from our family in places that call each other “mate”. It gives the site a friendly AND an international flavor.
Best to you!
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 5:05 PM MDT up reply actions
Fantastic analogy
Martial arts in a phone booth. Love it!
"I tried to think of the most harmless thing. Something I loved from my childhood. Something that could never ever possibly destroy us. Mr. Stay Puft!"
2 or 3
Obviously we (almost) all see it being 2 or 3 new starters. I voted for 2 (but i would say 3 if Clady doesnt start – i am hoping, maybe against hope, he will be starting week 1). I havent finished reading the write up but this looks like another great one.
Go Broncos!
I'm with you.
I’m voting 2.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 12:54 PM MDT up reply actions
same here
Walton at C, Beadles at LG. If Clady is a no go I think it is either Beadles at LT/s.e.olsen at LG (I’m guessing hochstein won’t be ready to start at the begining of the season) OR Polumbus/Batiste at LT and Beadles at LG.
I seriously doubt that Harris will be considered for a move to LT only to move back to RT as soon as Clady returns, and I suspect that one of the vets will start at either LG or LT, since having 3 rookies on the left side fo the line is scary as heck when you think about it….
Bear Claw Chris Lapp: You've come far pilgrim.
Jeremiah Johnson: Feels like far.
Bear Claw Chris Lapp: Were it worth the trouble?
Jeremiah Johnson: What trouble?
by Jeremy Bolander on May 6, 2010 1:05 PM MDT up reply actions
Agreed with all.
Especially the second paragraph.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 1:14 PM MDT up reply actions
I voted 3 because of the Clady injury....someone will start because of that. :)
Harris, Kuper, Walton, Beadles, Polumbus
Verbose in style, dispersion of thought, procrastination in life.
The guy formerly known as ZAPPA
ugh
please no polumbus.
We must all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately. - Benjamin Franklin
by Orange and Blue on May 6, 2010 4:28 PM MDT up reply actions
ditto
unless he improves by leaps and bounds over last year…
by Merlin Scott on May 7, 2010 10:08 AM MDT up reply actions
Question:
Why do they call it “left/right tackle”? With the possible exception being after a turn-over, if there is one thing an offensive tackle never does it is tackle.
Heh, I wonder
I think a lot of football position names are really old throw-backs to a bygone era. That’s the only intelligent answer I can come up with. Especially since the defensive tackle lines up opposite the Center or Guard. :)
by BroncosBassist on May 6, 2010 12:39 PM MDT up reply actions
wikepdia knows all
The term “tackle” is a vestige of an earlier era of football, in which the same players played both offense and defense. Ironically, it would be a penalty today for an offense tackle to attempt to “tackle” an opponent as long as the offensive tackle’s own team remained in possession of the ball.
admill is correct.
Linemen on both sides of the ball were able to do much more in the early years of football. The game today doesn’t resemble that era’s game much at all.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 12:56 PM MDT up reply actions
Spencer Larsen
That’s why they call him “Leatherhead!”
"All credibility, all good conscience, all evidence of truth come only from the senses." Friedrich Nietzsche
In years gone by
Players played both ways. The descriptor came from when they were lined up on the defensive side of the ball.
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough
by Brian Shrout on May 6, 2010 12:45 PM MDT up reply actions
SWEET
I’ve been waiting for a new MHRU article. Thanks a billion, HT.
I voted 3 myself, because I think that we’ll have a new starting C (assured), a new starting LG (pretty much assured, because I don’t see Hochstein stepping up any time soon), and one of the Ryans is probably going to need a little extra time.
I'm still pulling for both Ryans to heal up.
My guess is at least 2.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 12:57 PM MDT up reply actions
If they don't...
…it’s going to be a long year. Might be anyway. Broncos O line is not going to be great this year.
All that you behold, though it appears without, it is within, in your imagination, of which this world of mortality is but a shadow...and one day you’ll awake and find that you’ve never lived and never died, except in the dream.
William Blake
I disagree....it wont be worse than last year...even a small improvement will be an INCREMENTAL improvement for the team!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
I will say...
..that I regret the loss of Wiegmann. He took Nalen’s place very well. OC will be a big question mark. Still, I think we’ve done all we can with the draft and FA signings to move forward. i think it will be bumpy at first, but still improved over the course of the season.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 5:06 PM MDT up reply actions
yeah he made losing Nalen much less bad for a minute there...
Lead me not into temptation - I can find the way myself.
by Whidbey Bronco on May 6, 2010 6:15 PM MDT up reply actions
Last year's line
Their “poor” play was more due to the mixed scheme rather than personnel (except for Polumbus…), so even though the scheme is changing again, no way they get any worse. Just hope that Polumbus(t) doesn’t have to see extended duty…
by Merlin Scott on May 7, 2010 10:18 AM MDT up reply actions
disagree completely
I think scheme had very little to do with it, which was most clear in the pass blocking (which didn’t really change). They were just plain getting pushed around in the middle… to the point that it wouldn’t matter which scheme was being played.
This happened for 2 reasons: 1) Weigman and Hamilton falling off the cliff with age, and 2) Harris going down which meant there was no extra bodies to double up the interior, because we had to give extra help to Polumbus.
If your long term starting quarterback
were left handed, would it make sense to move your best pass blocking tackle to the right side for the long term? Despite the transition difficulties, it seems like many teams move their tackles around between seasons to get their best tackle at LT. Also, does a left handed QB affect play action or handoffs so it would make more sense to run to the left long term?
Hasn't happened in the past...
the two best examples were Ken Stabler and Steve Young. In both cases their teams did not make significant changes. There are two reasons for this. One, the team is already used to playing together in their current assignments. You wouldn’t split up Upshaw/Shell just for your QB. The other reason, speaking as a left-hander QB, is that the left handed player has spent his entire life adjusting to right-handed systems. He is already adept at making the adjustments where his right handed teammates are not. Its a case of comparative advantage.
Agreed...
..especially on the point “…the left handed player has spent his entire life adjusting to right-handed systems.”
You beat my answer while I was typing, but I wrote, “Also consider that left handed QBs, while throwing with their left hand/arm, have been brought up for years to hand off to right handed RBs, and to play action the game as anyone else does.”
Its good to hear a lefty QB back up the coach! lol
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 1:10 PM MDT up reply actions
actually didn't Cinci make a point to make adjustments for Boomer (Munoz) even to the point of bringing in a lefty back-up?
Lead me not into temptation - I can find the way myself.
by Whidbey Bronco on May 6, 2010 1:46 PM MDT up reply actions
No to both (typicaly)
In both cases, you are asking several players to adjust for the sake of one player. Coaching history seems to have taken the side of leaving the majority of the offense in their own comfort zone, rather than shifting most of the team for the sake of one player (even if that player is the QB).
If I lose about 5% performance from each player I move (or change assignemtns) for the sake of keeping a QB at his own level of performance, that’s a lot to lose when put together.
Also consider that left handed QBs, while throwing with their left hand/arm, have been brought up for years to hand off to right handed RBs, and to play action the game as anyone else does. They also get the added benefit (for the most part) of playing defenses that don’t make major adjustments either. (A defense may try to do some extra blind side blitzes, but they can’t afford to move away the run stoppers from the side that the offense is still going to run to).
So in sum, it always seem to work out that the QB (left or right handed) plays the same game with only minor modifications (for both the defense and the offense).
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 1:08 PM MDT up reply actions
This answer makes sense to me.
but in the case of the broncos, given that we’re looking at 2 or 3 new starters on the line, It’s not like we’d be breaking up a group that was used to playing together for years.
However, since the players we’re talking about switching are clady and harris and both are so good at pass blocking, I doubt it makes much of a difference who plays on the QB’s blind side.
by bailey disciple on May 6, 2010 2:27 PM MDT up reply actions
nobody ever talked about blindside as an issue
until a book was written about it. The bigger issue is strongside v. weakside. Since teams now move TEs to either side, or use 2-TEs or no TEs it is almost a moot point, unless you are a talking head who needs something to talk about.
so it's not an issue?
Seems logical that it would be… turnovers/injuries?
Lead me not into temptation - I can find the way myself.
by Whidbey Bronco on May 6, 2010 2:38 PM MDT up reply actions
Again...
…consider that defenses don’t choose to make major adjustments when facing a lefty either. Remember too that Tebow wouldn’t be changing anything, just several players. That may be several too many.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 2:45 PM MDT up reply actions
rec'd for some great info
I learned several new things today. Thanks Steve.
We live in an age when instant gratification isn't fast enough
Always a pleasure Brian.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 12:57 PM MDT up reply actions
Thanks Steve
another great lesson served……
"I cannot give you a formula for success, but I can give you the formula for failure: Try to please everybody."
We serve our best for family.
Thanks bc.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 1:22 PM MDT up reply actions
I have to tell you Steve this trully is a learning experience for me and thanks a million!
I voted 2 OL starting the season. I think Ryan Harris’ injury will be fully rehabbed and healed, I believe CHris Kuper will fight and keep his job at RG, I don’t know how the Ryan Clady injury will work out and I suppose if he isn’t ready to come back by the season opener then Zane Beadles will get the nod. If he is ready to come back then I think Zane will move to LG. I have a hunch Hochstein will get a little more playing time at Left TE, that’s just a feeling I have and the finalization of McD’s scheme. It may be a bumpy road that they are on as you state, but I have to believe we will be better than last year. I loved the “mirrored” comment, that was brilliant…
Hoch at TE?
that might be pretty interesting…though a little more athletic lineman might work better.
by Merlin Scott on May 7, 2010 10:48 AM MDT up reply actions
Didn't Hoch come in as a TE for a few goalline situations for us last year?
If he’s lined up at TE for us this year, I can almost guarantee you it will be in goalline or 3rd/4th & short.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination."
- Andrew Lang (1844-1912)
Sure he did, but I'm not sure how many times he did it.
I made a mistake and didn’t dedicate the games I taped and they all erased…darn it.
The biggest adjustment to a left handed QB is for the receivers.
The physics of a rotating football cause the ball to drift as much as 3 feet on passes longer than 20 yards. The drift is to the right for right handed throwers and to the left for lefties. The receivers and the QB have to take this into account for completions to occur. It becomes second nature after they practice for a while, but it is different. As a lefty myself, we learn to adapt to a right-handed world very quickly as a necessity. When I was first given surgical instruments designed for a lefty, I couldn’t use them because I had adapted to right handed ones. I still don’t use them as I learned and am more comfortable with the right handed standard. The OL does have a slight adjustment to make because of which way the left handed QB will turn to throw and likely make his first step out of the pocket, but practice makes that easy.
Imagination is more important than knowledge. A. Einstein
Good points all!
Another point (but silly)…
When you do surg, you don’t flip a supine patient to prone to account for your left handedness!
: )
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 2:13 PM MDT up reply actions
funny
though I suppose using scissors in “arts and crafts” in elementary school is good practice… :)
by Merlin Scott on May 7, 2010 10:54 AM MDT up reply actions
A left handed quarterback will throw a tighter spiral though
Because of the earth’s rotational spin towards the east, a football is predisposed to spiral to the left (go flush your toilet for verification). The spin of a righthanded quarterback is thus counteracted by mother earth while the lefthanded thrower’s spin is enhanced.
Both of you are wrong.
The toilet flush thing, as well as the football spiral thing, are myths. I have dozens of sources, but suffice it to say that the Corialis effect is badly misunderstood.
http://www.snopes.com/science/coriolis.asp
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 2:51 PM MDT up reply actions
seems like the premise is still true, just not to that degree...
Lead me not into temptation - I can find the way myself.
by Whidbey Bronco on May 6, 2010 4:56 PM MDT up reply actions
Do you mean Otto Toeplitz?
…
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 5:19 PM MDT up reply actions
sorry Otto Tumlirz and Austrian who wrote the paper ascribing the vortex in drains to the Coriolis effect
Yikes!
I thought you meant Toeplitz, and didn’t make the connection.
No, I didn’t know about Turmlitz. But I am intrigued, and will do some reading on him on-line at your suggestion.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 7, 2010 1:42 PM MDT up reply actions
Well, that's rather disappointing
I have believed that myth since highschool. The learning is obviously not limited to football at MHR. Thanks for the heads up.
Wow, I'm baffled as well. I completely thought that was true too.
The seasons are still reversed down there though, right? jk
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination."
- Andrew Lang (1844-1912)
wow,
that must be why I could never go pro…
by Merlin Scott on May 7, 2010 10:55 AM MDT up reply actions
lol... the one and only reason!
Take my advice... I'm not using it!
"If you can't be kind, at least have the decency to be vague."
Beadles will fill in for Clady
…assuming Clady isn’t ready Week 1. Even after Clady returns, Beadles should move inside and keep starting. Clady/Beadles/Walton/Hochstein/Harris.
Though, out of curiosity, why does Seth Olsen’s name never come up for the starting Center gig? Is it assumed he’s the odd man out? He has a year in the system to his credit.
you think hochstein can beat out kuper?
by all accounts, Kuper seems to me to be the better player for the job?
by bailey disciple on May 6, 2010 2:29 PM MDT up reply actions
I agree
Kuper will be our starting RG. I’ve heard Hoch as our backup C thrown around. I think the O Line will be Clady/Beadles/Walton/Kuper/Harris. I think the biggest camp battle will be S Olsen & Beadles for starting LG.
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts... for support rather than illumination."
- Andrew Lang (1844-1912)
Great article as always Steve!
Really glad to see you put out another article. Your series should be required reading IMHO for all our brethren.
You are a gentleman and a scholar sir! Rec’d
"Precipitation, which side are you on?
Are you on the rise? Are you falling down?
Let me know, Come on let's go, yeah
Got some if you need it!" -EV
Gentleman and scholar?
You are, perhaps, half right.
: )
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 2:52 PM MDT up reply actions
I recall interviewing my mother on television....
…for a high school project. I started the interview with, “Mrs. Nichols, I understand you are the mother of two very wonderful sons”.
“Well Steve”, she replied “I would say that you are only half right”.
When the class watched the interview they died laughing. The teacher said my mother got an A+, regdless of whatever I would get. She was a very sharp woman.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 7, 2010 1:39 PM MDT up reply actions
Moms like that are the best
Take my advice... I'm not using it!
"If you can't be kind, at least have the decency to be vague."
Great article (& posts from those above!)
My football IQ has risen once again…Thank you. rec’d
Lead me not into temptation - I can find the way myself.
GREAT article, Steve.
MHR-U was one of the series that first attracted me to the site, and you definitely haven’t lost your touch. I learn something new every time. great stuff!
Thanks Bailey.
If MHR-U brings folks like you to the site, then it is time well spent for me indeed.
Thank you.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 2:54 PM MDT up reply actions
Another great seminar, HT!
As always, I learned a great deal today. At my age, I can only hope that I can remember it tomorrow. ;>)
Thanks again for your post! Rec’d as always!
'The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits.'
-- Albert Einstein
If you can't remember....
..you are always welcome to come back and read it again. We’ll keep the article on file for ya.
: )
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 3:07 PM MDT up reply actions
Great work as always HT!
On the front page it mentions that the OLman we just signed, Maurice Williams, played primarily at LT and RG (the 2 specialist positionsas you mentioned). How many players would be able to make that switch? And I assume if he can play those 2 positions, he can play any position on the OL (with the possible exception of C).
Playing LT and RG are pretty rare.
The skill sets are radicaly different. It is done at times (because of a lack of quality depth for the most part), but a player that plays both indifferently is uncommon.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 5:20 PM MDT up reply actions
zim and stink
i seem to recall that we ran t.d. to the left primarily on important downs, regardless of opponent strengths, etc. was this simply a personnel advantage? did we catch the opposition off guard this way, it seemed to be pretty standard for some time. i don’t recollect a te being lined up on the left, either. maybe there was, sometimes. an anomoly? i am sure of this, and my reasoning at the time was we were just running behind our talent on the left side, and it worked most of the time. anyone else recall this? if we needed a first down, it was left-pretty much all the time.
regarding injuries, i too am most concerned with harris. many seem to forget his back issues in his rookie year, and our resident doctors are at least a little concerned about his current injury, and return to 100%(if possible). clady, hoch, and some depth and rookies round out the current o-line situation, along with a new coach, qb coach, and full-time scheme-though that should simplify things a little for the rooks. expect some growing pains here, especially if clady, harris, and kuper aren’t starting game 1. i applaud mcd for selecting 3 ol in the draft that may help us here. most important unit on a football team there is. can’t tell me different.
mhr university article? defense! how about any indications if wink is going with the 5-2, the rex ryan 3-4, 4-3 hybrid,… what would HT do with the current talent on the defensive side of the ball? sorry, i’m all about the d, pretty much, and it looks like we’re in good shape. for the short-term, anyway. i do have my doubts with the ex-pats linemen, and the young depth there. maybe we can create a broncos D section, now that we seem to have one to talk about again. great article as usual, and i also became enamored with this site with the nuts and bolts posts such as these. good to see some again
taste my blitzkrieg!
sign doom now
A few thoughts...
Remember that Davis often started to the right, then cut back to the left. When he hit the line, his route was labled as where he penetrated. In the zone block there isn’t a pre-determined gap to hit. Often times, the talent on the zone block team is on the left side (or they credit at any rate) because the cuts come back to them, or because the second level blocking in the center off the field comes from the LG and LT.
Right of the bat, let me say that we stick with the 5-2 look for the 3-4. I don’t see us changing that anytime soon. Without a look at the pre-season play of our players (and the resultant depth chart), I’m not sure what I would do with the current defense. (You can bet that a former high school DC would only screw up a pro level defense! lol)
As we get nearer to the season, I’ll have a better picture though, and will do my best. From you comments (and a poll done in a member’s post recently) I can see that – despite the Tebow and WR pick in the 1st round – folks want more on the defense. I like hearing that (being a defense guy), and will try to slant in that direction in upcoming MHR-U stories.
: )
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 5:34 PM MDT up reply actions
and just as i click post...
we sign a starter on the o-line in maurice williams. a bona-fide starter. beautiful, great move. i feel better already
taste my blitzkrieg!
sign doom now
Given his age...
…I think he is insurance. If there is any way our younger guys can start, they will.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 5:25 PM MDT up reply actions
Good to see they brought an experience OL to teach the new draftees
Love the way our depth is coming along.
oc60
"We are what we think.
All that we are arises with our thoughts.
With our thoughts, we make our path."
really really appreciated...rec'd
very easy to graps. And even tho there are probably millions more details you could have written about it, it makes me smart enough to be dangerous. Thanks!
One quick question: is there “lefty” centers (snapping), or is it trained into them to always snap with their right hand?
We must all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately. - Benjamin Franklin
I am rarely stumped.
That is something I’ve never encountered (as a DC) and never given much thought to. Perhaps some of our illustrious staff or brilliant membership can chime in.
I’m not ashamed to admit that I don’t have an answer on that one. My guess is that it doesn’t matter, but I don’t know that with any certainty.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 6, 2010 5:24 PM MDT up reply actions
Considering the ball winds up in between their legs in a spot that is a balls width wide [wow that sounds awful], the only difference I could see would be the shotgun snap and the spin it places on the ball.
As a right handed individual, it might be better to snap it with the left hand so that you can get your dominant/stronger arm up faster for blocking purposes. I doubt anyone does this though =)
Is Maurkice Pouncey right handed?
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
PS3 ID: broncomaniac6
Let me put my 2cents worth in
STEVE, thanks for this great article. The reason MHR is my favorite place to visit first!!!
oc60
"We are what we think.
All that we are arises with our thoughts.
With our thoughts, we make our path."
Thanks oc!
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 7, 2010 1:28 PM MDT up reply actions
Great read Steve!
I think we will be starting 2 newbies this year…most likely Beadles and Walton. I hope and pray that we don’t need to have subs for BOTH tackles….
Future 2010 MHR Fantasy Football Champion! ;)
"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."
John Adams
Primo stuff, Steve. Rec'd!
This is a question that has been rolling around in my mind since Simms was signed last year. SWG’s comment about Stabler and Steve Young made sense as well.
This is being emailed to my files for future reference. Thanks everyone.
I voted 2 new starters
I expect Clady to return in time for the regular season, while it’s Harris who’s the question mark. No one knows how well his toe has healed and I assume for now, that we’ll have someone fill in for him in the beginning of 2010.
The LG and OC positions will be up for grabs. I expect Hochstein (LG) and Walton (OC) to start, but it could end up being S. Olsen (LG) and Fry (OC) for all I know. It’s anyone’s guess at this point.
Nice article for a DC. JK!
"All credibility, all good conscience, all evidence of truth come only from the senses." Friedrich Nietzsche
Sorry I'm late coach
I learned something again, Thanks.
I guess I’ll be taking a lap now.
Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
Nah.
I’ve never seen an assistent coach take a lap for being late. You just have to buy the first round after practice.
: )
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 7, 2010 1:30 PM MDT up reply actions
You got it!
Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
I foresee a rough year for the offense
I think our line will struggle – new blocking scheme + 3 guys trying to return from injuries plus a bunch of rookies. Add a struggling o-line to very few, if any, playmakers on offense and it’s going to be a long year.
by Broncos_FTW on May 7, 2010 11:46 AM MDT reply actions 1 recs
draft eval
Nice article. It’s been great getting an education from this site on the X’s and O’s of football. I’ve always had a pretty good instinctive feel for it but this stuff is great.
I was surprised you mentioned that we didn’t hit any home runs in this draft.
I just think you have to wait a few years to see how things pan out.
For example, when Terrell Davis was drafted did anyone have a clue that we had just drafted a player who would play for us at a HOF level?
I guess it’s your right to project based on what you know of those players but maybe I just prefer to be optimistic about my Broncos no matter the scenario.
Context, my friend.
I wrote…
Denver may not have hit any home runs in this draft (depending on one’s perspective), but I believe Denver is following a smart, team building strategy.
Place an emphasis on “..may not..” and “..depending on one’s perspective…” My sentence is a gentle way of saying, “Even if you don’t think Denver hit any home runs”.
I myself think Denver had a very good draft, and that anywhere from 2 to 3 players will be major starters for us. A couple more will be “just” good players for us. But I didn’t want the article to decend into argumentation about the draft. Indeed, I already went a little off course discussing the draft and the team’s future when the article was just supposed to be about the OL. I was holding back.
: )
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 7, 2010 1:36 PM MDT up reply actions
Motivation
Amazing post Steve! Every time I read one of these MRHU posts, I want to learn how to break down film. I am a devote follower of the “win the trench battle, win the game” theory and while it seems that we did address both sides in the off season, a closer look shows that there are more questions than comforts. For example, a different starting line (I can’t speculate as to how many, but we know it will not be the same as last year) will certainly take time to develop chemistry, it could be 3 months or two years, who knows. Additionally, how will our aging D-line handle a full season? And can any of this truly be gleaned from watching film or Training Camp?
So, here are my (non-rhetorical) questions… How will you base your evaluation of the line for the up coming season? I know you said you expect there to be bumps, which makes sense, so what will you be looking for during camp to give you a feel for how the unit as a whole is developing and how each player will perform (or is that proprietary information)?
Next, I know it’s a little off topic, but I was wondering if there was a place to view game tape (other than just tv footage)?
Finally, my suggestion for the next post would be to stay in the trenches, but focus on the substitution patterns and responsibilities of our d-line throughout a normal series, perhaps with a comparison to another team.
Good stuff!
I’ve never really broken down film of an offensive line in depth. My DL assist. watched for the finer points. However, when I do my own superficial evaluation of an OL, I look for the following.
1. How quick is the first step?
2. How many obvious mistakes does the player make (missed assignment in pass blocking, blocking out the wrong defender in the second level for run blocking)?
3. Does the player ever get pushed around?
4. Does the player keep his upper body balanced well over his hips?
5. Does the player follow through on his blocks?
6. How much “pop” does the player get when jamming his defender?
7. Is the player aggressive on each play – initiating instead of reacting?
8. How often does the player have to resort to holding if he gets in trouble, and does he cover it well?
9. Does the player get low in his stance and keep that low gravitity when engaged?
There are dozens of finer points to watch for if one is at the tactical level of coaching either line’s individuals. At the strategic (macro) level, I’m more concerned with the overall quality, team work, and areas of weakness for exploitation.
I watch very little film anymore. I have a good grasp for what I’m seeing in real time, but (rarely) I’ve been known to tape and re-watch a game. The pros on the OL are so refined that it is tough to watch for micro level errors in technique. The mistakes on the line typicaly fall into two categories: First, mistakes caused by a dominant opponent, and second, mistakes made as an entire unit (as opposed to an individual). Again, this is the line we’re talking about. I notice many more mistakes with other positions (LBs and secondary), both those are in the open field.
DL substitutions and process may make for a really good article. I’ll see waht I can do!
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 7, 2010 10:17 PM MDT up reply actions
A little late to ask a serious question
but I was wondering about the pulling of the left guard in power running situations. Is the LG always expected to abandon his position and assist on the strong side?
And what about the case for running to the weakside? How would the LG “pull” in that case?
Thanks for another solid article Steve.
"All credibility, all good conscience, all evidence of truth come only from the senses." Friedrich Nietzsche
Never too late.
Sometimes I could miss a question if the article falls off the front page, but you can always reach me in the next MHR-U or by e-mail (if you can’t wait). : )
The LG is not always expected to pull. It depends on the abilities of the LG, but it also depends on the OC. There are advantages and disadvantages to pulling a guard. For example, a pulling guard can miss an excellent run blitzer who gets in behind the runner (because the guard is out of place by being pulled).
The LG can pull to the weakside, but this often signals that the run is going wide. (The Safs may be too far back to see this, but a good LB at th college or pro level will pick it up).
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 8, 2010 12:40 PM MDT up reply actions
Late here, as well...
Can we just run laps together?
Thanks for another excellent MHR-U. Like many others have said, it is these informative articles that wowed me at the beginning and keep this website one of the first I visit every day.
I voted (will vote as soon as I finish this comment) two new starters for the O-Line. A new OC and LG, but I like the flexibility of the rookies and believe we’ll see them in different spots in the future, as the veterans move on.
I did have a question. Someone commented regarding the learning curve of the power blocking scheme versus the zone blocking scheme that was in place here in the past. Is the power blocking scheme a much more straightforward proposition for lineman to absorb? Can they step in as rookies and implement that scheme better than attempting to come in as a rookie and perform in a zone blocking line?
Do our rookies have a chance of being more than just proficient (assuming their talent and work ethic is in place) in McD’s power blocking scheme?
Take my advice... I'm not using it!
"If you can't be kind, at least have the decency to be vague."
My reply to you is below.
“Good stuff” below. I hit the wrong reply button.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
by Steve Nichols on May 8, 2010 12:47 PM MDT up reply actions
Good stuff.
A power blocking scheme (even many coaches call it that, but it is really called "gap blocking) is much easier to adapt to. It is vastly easier to implement that zone blocking.
Our rookies have a good shot at stepping in right away. Their learning will be a continuation of college level skills, instead of a difficult un-learn / re-learn proposition. Often (not always) gap blockers in college go to gap blocking in the pros. Only the very “fleet of foot” agile guys go to the zone block in the pros, and many of them already zone blocked in college. And while there is some cross over both ways, in our case this year the OL rookies will be playing a similar program to what they played in college.
Their sucess will pivot on how well they study a bigger playbook, how strong their natural talents are, and how well they respond to coaching. At this point, it is up to them.
Formerly known as Hoosierteacher or just HT.
"I presume that all of you here think me worthy of pity. But Great God, when I think I was on the point of doing nothing, I consider myself worthy of envy." Jean Valjean, Hugo's Les Miserables
Thanks for the reply!
I appreciate the answer. It makes me anticipate the upcoming TC and see/hear how our rookie class will perform.
Take my advice... I'm not using it!
"If you can't be kind, at least have the decency to be vague."

by 







































