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Horse Tracks - 5/7/10 - The Raiders are finally above the Chargers

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Yep.  You read that right.  The Oakland Raiders now have the upper-hand over the San Diego Chargers.  By dumping former #1 JaMarcus Russell yesterday the Raiders have overtaken the Chargers for drafting the biggest bust in NFL history.  Ryan Leaf, the former title-holder, was not nearly as bad as Russell, who collected a ton of money for throwing a ton of incompletions.  That said, should Broncos fans be excited to see Russell go?  Part of me says 'Yes!".  Like Leaf, many of Russell's 'bright spots' came against the Broncos, in Denver no less.  In beating the Broncos in their own backyard - in both 2008 and 2009 - Russell and the Raiders in many ways kept the Broncos from making the playoffs.  In 2008, it cost the Broncos a division title and likely set the wheels in motion that resulted in the firing of Mike Shanahan.  While we can laugh a bit at the Raiders for this one, also breathe a sigh of relief.  As bad as Russell was, he did beat Jay Cutler and Kyle Orton, in Denver, in crucial match-ups.  I, for one, am glad he's gone!

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Star-divide

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Russell's "bright spots"

I was hoping that JaMarcus the Hutt’s Montana-like performance in Denver last year would buy him another year. At least then, there would have been a silver lining.

Now they just got torched by the biggest bust in NFL history at home, with the playoffs on the line.

(sigh)

And as always, thanks for the tracks.

by Velveeta on May 7, 2010 6:34 AM MDT reply actions   1 recs

It’s Japorkus the Hutt!!!

by LTC Pain on May 7, 2010 8:38 AM MDT up reply actions  

My thoughts EXACTLY

sigh!

- Nick

"Know the enemy, know yourself, and victory is never in doubt, not in a hundred battles."
- Sun Tzu

"if you look close, there’s a hoodie lurking in the background of picture 4. similar to the classic sasquatch shot and equally stunning, as the denver temperature today is relatively fair."
-oxmouth

by ncm42 on May 7, 2010 11:31 AM MDT up reply actions  

Too freakin true :)

Still can’t believe the D didn’t dial up the blitzes in that game….

Future 2010 MHR Fantasy Football Champion! ;)

"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."
John Adams

by Broncotodd on May 7, 2010 7:21 PM MDT up reply actions  

That drive is still haunting to think about

To think that they were down to their 4th string QB at one point when Losman came in for a play. And that all we had to do is stop the worst QB in the NFL on 4th and 10 and our season would have been completely different.

by admill on May 7, 2010 6:55 AM MDT reply actions  

I still have nightmares of a 300 lb. human blob

sliming the football past the first down marker while every player wearing orange was either blind or had their feet encased in cement (or both).!

Oy-vay!

Take my advice... I'm not using it!
"If you can't be kind, at least have the decency to be vague."

by BroncTastic on May 7, 2010 8:02 AM MDT up reply actions  

On that note...

The Hutt didn’t beat Jay Cutler and Kyle Orton. He beat Bob Slowik’s crappy defense and Mike Nolan’s tired, battered unit.

Hopefully, this has been largely corrected.

Got Tebow?

by TheMastermind on May 7, 2010 8:53 AM MDT up reply actions  

We scored a total of 29 points in those 2 games....

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by John Bena on May 7, 2010 10:08 AM MDT up reply actions   1 recs

And, fair or not,

A QB is like a starting pitcher. Gonna be judged as much on W/L as on anything else.

- Nick

"Know the enemy, know yourself, and victory is never in doubt, not in a hundred battles."
- Sun Tzu

"if you look close, there’s a hoodie lurking in the background of picture 4. similar to the classic sasquatch shot and equally stunning, as the denver temperature today is relatively fair."
-oxmouth

by ncm42 on May 7, 2010 11:33 AM MDT up reply actions  

+1

One score makes the difference in that fader game. I was as disappointed in our offense as I was with our defense that game.

"Precipitation, which side are you on?
Are you on the rise? Are you falling down?
Let me know, Come on let's go, yeah
Got some if you need it!" -EV

by sadaraine on May 7, 2010 2:27 PM MDT up reply actions  

Hate to admit it, but the Raiders have me worried

They haven’t had an offseason this good since Tampa Bay overpaid for Gruden. (And I good, I mean not bat-s$%-crazy.) At least they don’t have a first-round pick next year, so I don’t think they’ll be able to build themselves into a contender any time soon.

by Paxos on May 7, 2010 7:19 AM MDT reply actions   1 recs

Agree 100%

I wasn’t all that shocked that they came in and beat Denver last year. They’re actually a pretty talented team. I watch the AFC West as much as possible on Sunday Ticket, and the Hutt was like a 2-ton ball and chain for them. He wasn’t just physically bad, but clearly demoralizing and deflating for the team as a whole. They were (are) twice as good by subtraction— he was that bad— and as soon as they pulled him, the Raiders played pretty much everybody tough and close. They could be a real wildcard in the division/conference, and, at the very least, could be a serious spoiler for everybody this year.

I’ll be uptight for both games next year. Very uptight.

Denialists replace the open-minded skepticism of science with the inflexible certainty of ideological commitment.-- Michael Spector

by PredominantlyOrange on May 7, 2010 9:44 AM MDT up reply actions  

Me too but look at it this way

1) The Broncos are better, too. Especially on defense. 2) Even when the Raiders were otherwise crap the past 2 or 3 years they managed to get some wins against the Broncos so it can’t be worse than that. 3) the rivalry is more fun if both teams are solid, and this way it’ll be less embarrassing if they lose. ;-) But seriously, as long as the Broncos keep improving and becoming a better defense, then, whatever. And the Chargers are worse imho. So there’s that.

There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers/Lakers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants/Warriors country, and damned proud of it.

by underdog on May 7, 2010 11:29 AM MDT up reply actions  

Oakland probably is due because

of the consecutive string of poor years. That is not only early 1st round picks (which they uniformly screwed), but also early second and early third round picks, where there tends to be acton in the trenches. You can’t blow ALL those opprtunities, and they have in general done better in the trenches than with their skill positions. Even if by accident, that’s not bad.

by idahobronc on May 7, 2010 10:20 PM MDT up reply actions  

Leaf is still the biggest bust in my book

I say that because the Chargers traded two first-round picks, a second-round pick and Pro Bowler Eric Metcalf for Leaf. His stats are also worse than Russell’s.

by Fan in Exile on May 7, 2010 7:41 AM MDT reply actions   1 recs

Then after reading an apology

from a piece of paper, he crumbles it up and throws it on the floor…..PRICELESS.

Floyd Little: HOF Class of 2010.

2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant

by weazel on May 7, 2010 10:31 AM MDT up reply actions  

Agreed

Leaf is 1
JaMarcus is 1A

- Nick

"Know the enemy, know yourself, and victory is never in doubt, not in a hundred battles."
- Sun Tzu

"if you look close, there’s a hoodie lurking in the background of picture 4. similar to the classic sasquatch shot and equally stunning, as the denver temperature today is relatively fair."
-oxmouth

by ncm42 on May 7, 2010 11:33 AM MDT up reply actions  

Leaf is 2

Jamarcus is 1. Just like where they were picked

"Cheering for the Lakers, Cowboys or Yankees is like going to Vegas, standing behind the dealer and cheering for the house."

by BillBert11 on May 7, 2010 2:33 PM MDT up reply actions  

Really?

You think JaMarcus is a bigger flop than Leaf? I still would put Leaf as a bigger disappointment, but I do see your logic, that draft position should factor into it.

- Nick

"Know the enemy, know yourself, and victory is never in doubt, not in a hundred battles."
- Sun Tzu

"if you look close, there’s a hoodie lurking in the background of picture 4. similar to the classic sasquatch shot and equally stunning, as the denver temperature today is relatively fair."
-oxmouth

by ncm42 on May 7, 2010 6:31 PM MDT up reply actions  

Also, Leaf could have easily been the 1st pick, if not for another QB in that draft.

Remember it was actually considered a ‘coin flip’ if Manning or Leaf should go 1? FAIL.

- Nick

"Know the enemy, know yourself, and victory is never in doubt, not in a hundred battles."
- Sun Tzu

"if you look close, there’s a hoodie lurking in the background of picture 4. similar to the classic sasquatch shot and equally stunning, as the denver temperature today is relatively fair."
-oxmouth

by ncm42 on May 7, 2010 6:32 PM MDT up reply actions  

See my link about 2 comments down

I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.

by Topher Doll on May 7, 2010 8:03 PM MDT up reply actions  

Agreed, no question

San Diego could have been good with another quarterback, Oakland would have struggled with just about anyone. Have a link:
Bigger Bust

I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.

by Topher Doll on May 7, 2010 12:06 PM MDT up reply actions  

wow the Tebow quotes from McD in the Paige article are pretty crazy

by Todd Jewell on May 7, 2010 7:41 AM MDT reply actions  

yes it does....

He was talking about Tom Brady coming in and SAYING he was a great player without having to be told.

McD was comparing Tebow’s confidence to that of Brady. He said Tebow does not need to wait to be told he’s a great player. He already knows he will be, and does NOT need to be told.

It makes perfect sense….he said a guy who needs to be told he’s great….will not end up being great. thats what it means.

"I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work."
- Thomas Alva Edison

"Success is not a place at which one arrives, but rather... the spirit with which one undertakes and continues the journey."
- Alex Noble

by DenBronx on May 7, 2010 7:57 AM MDT up reply actions  

???
It makes perfect sense….he said a guy who needs to be told he’s great….will not end up being great. thats what it means.

Nonsense. There is a very fine line between confidence and conceit. Not saying that Tebow is conceited, in fact I’m a huge Tebow fan, just arguing that someone who has to be told he is great can be great. Humility and being a great player do not have to be mutually exclusive!

by Adam Manter on May 7, 2010 8:31 AM MDT up reply actions  

That's a little harsh.

Some people have great talent but lack the level of confidence in order to maximize it. Sometimes those kinds of people never reach their potential because they constantly doubt themselves. I’ve worked with a number of people like that.

Very few statements apply to all people everywhere without exception, it’s just a professional observation. But I’ve known plenty of people like that. It’s depressing.

Got Tebow?

by TheMastermind on May 7, 2010 8:58 AM MDT up reply actions  

You are right Mastermind, using nonsense was too harsh

I should have said that I disagree with DenBronx’s premise. My bad.

by Adam Manter on May 7, 2010 9:18 AM MDT up reply actions  

ROFL

I’m not sure he was talking about your post…I think he meant mine…….

But I still stand by my point whether you agree or not, Someone who has to be told they are great will lack the tools needed to be great. That does not translate to “if you say you will be great you will”, but it does translate to “if you know you will be great, and are confident in that truth, you stand a MUCH higher chance of ever being even close to great than someone who does not believe it, and must be told someday down the line that they were great”.

Wow that was very long winded HAHA

"I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work."
- Thomas Alva Edison

"Success is not a place at which one arrives, but rather... the spirit with which one undertakes and continues the journey."
- Alex Noble

by DenBronx on May 10, 2010 9:46 AM MDT up reply actions  

Wow... if McD's quotes are in context... Wow

One of my favorite sections of the Paige piece:

During that final visit with Tebow, the coach began to explain the Broncos’ offensive terminology, and the quarterback picked it up immediately. When McDaniels quizzed the QB about defensive fronts, Tebow proved he could recognize every variation and how to respond.

“You know what Tim doesn’t know about our playbook?” McDaniels asked, then answered. “Only what we haven’t told him yet.”

If those quotes by McD are all in context, then look for Tebow to play QB by mid-season THIS year.

Take my advice... I'm not using it!
"If you can't be kind, at least have the decency to be vague."

by BroncTastic on May 7, 2010 7:52 AM MDT reply actions   1 recs

Don't know why the quote block didn't cover the whole quote, but hey...

Take my advice... I'm not using it!
"If you can't be kind, at least have the decency to be vague."

by BroncTastic on May 7, 2010 7:53 AM MDT up reply actions  

Its scary...but he almost makes it sound like Orton isn't going to touch the field after pre-season.

Thats what this article sounds like.

"I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work."
- Thomas Alva Edison

"Success is not a place at which one arrives, but rather... the spirit with which one undertakes and continues the journey."
- Alex Noble

by DenBronx on May 7, 2010 7:58 AM MDT up reply actions  

No kidding....

it seemed like he went out of his way to say “he gets the play book” and “he can start early”…man crush it is.

303
魏 多福

by Gr3yStreet on May 7, 2010 9:45 AM MDT up reply actions  

I think Woody has realized

that his job will be easier (meaning more articles) if he chooses to write about Tebow in a positive manner instead of bashing him. He will get more mileage that way.

Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks

by KaptainKirk on May 7, 2010 9:27 AM MDT up reply actions  

grade A man crush for sure and the more he talks the more worried I get that this situation is gonna go badly

Josh has spent his entire time in Denver so far brow beating everyone with the no one player is above the team mantra and now here is he talking up this rookie before he even steps on the field with the vets . This is typical rookie coaching mistake if Tebow is as good as he thinks then he doesnt have to say anything because nature will take his course.

Hes just adding more and more pressure to the situation and any moves he makes now will make sham of the entire QB competition. This isnt College football or HS football this is the pros and a coach cant verbally be trying to legitimize the pick only the picks play can do that .

by Hoopforia on May 7, 2010 10:37 AM MDT up reply actions   3 recs

I haven't seen or read a single word anywhere

where McDaniels compaired Tebow to any other player on the team, or put him above any other player. McDaniels is simply bragging on how impressed he is with how fast Tebow is learning the playbook.

It’s the fans speculating, and saying things like “Orton isn’t going to touch the field after preseason” and “look for Tebow to play quarterback by midseason”, who are putting him above others. People can speculate all they want, it’s fun afterall, but the only words that mean anything in the real world are what comes out of McDaniels’ mouth, and I don’t think he’s ever said or implied anything other than that Orton will be the starter.

by CompUser on May 7, 2010 11:15 AM MDT up reply actions  

Well

McDaniels said Tebow has “IT”. He hasn’t sadi that about any other Bronco player, certainly not the QB’s. If you don’t think that is comparing Tebow to all the other Bronco players you might try re-thinking your statement.

All that you behold, though it appears without, it is within, in your imagination, of which this world of mortality is but a shadow...and one day you’ll awake and find that you’ve never lived and never died, except in the dream.

William Blake

by bradley on May 7, 2010 11:43 AM MDT up reply actions  

Totally agree, Hoopforia

McDaniels is making a grade A mistake. He should at least wait until we’re into TC before gushing all over his new pet.

All that you behold, though it appears without, it is within, in your imagination, of which this world of mortality is but a shadow...and one day you’ll awake and find that you’ve never lived and never died, except in the dream.

William Blake

by bradley on May 7, 2010 11:45 AM MDT up reply actions  

You guys should all go back

And read what McDaniels had to say about Sims, Orton and Branstater after they were aquired. He doesnt bring in anyone that he doesn’t think can compete for a job.

But what they can learn and what they can use to execute in the game are two different things.

Everyone last year was shocked when McDainels made Orton the starter after OTAs and then appeared unshaken when Simms actually looked better than Orton in the first few pre season games.

Bu tlo and behold, it seems he was right. Not only did Orton have a better grasp of the offense faster, he made better on field decisions and EXECUTED the offense ata a far higher level than Sims.

Orton is the starter and I dont think anyone can or will be able to displace hiim in OTAs. The starter at the beginning, middle and end of the season will always be the guy who gives us the best chance to win.

Attempting to divine the future from a few sentences at this point in time is .. well pointless. You will know when Tebow is the best QB on the team when and only when McD makes him the starter for a game when no injuries have ocurred, and not before.

"My team's on the floor"
Gene Hackman - Hoosiers

by AlanC11 on May 7, 2010 1:23 PM MDT up reply actions  

The gist of it was two parts:

1. He said it was foolish of the Broncos to trade three draft picks for an unproven college player. He said it is not foolish to trade draft picks for a proven pro player. He actually said something like, “It is a horrible idea to trade draft picks for draft picks.” His thinking is that the draft is such a crap shoot that you can never predict the future of the pick. What a stupid thought! By his thinking, trading up for somebody is always wrong!

2. He actually interjected race into the Tim Tebow debate. Ray Lewis had a comment about Tebow that questioned why everyone was so willing to help him (John Gruden etc.). Cowturd inferred that Ray Lewis was crying racism and basically said Tim Tebow has been helped by so many people and drafted so high just because of his race. He compared his skill set to another QB (I think it was the Kentucky QB) who is black and had good numbers and wondered why the Kentucky QB and Tebow weren’t equally drafted.

After hearing this, my respect level for him plummeted. Talk about horrible logic.

by swg777 on May 7, 2010 8:08 AM MDT up reply actions  

I've noticed

that none of the talking heads talk about trade value. That (if you believe the points value) the first round pick we traded for (to grab Tebow) was valued only slightly higher than the picks we gave up. Meaning, Tebow only cost us a late round pick… so it wasn’t that big of a reach.

If he really works out like McDaniels is suggesting, this whole conversation will be forgotten about, and his move up a thing of beauty. If not, still worth the risk, I’d say.

But haven’t heard too many with this view, except maybe Dungy, but what does that guy know??? :)

Still got your Creedence...

by OutOfYourElement on May 7, 2010 8:49 AM MDT up reply actions  

we essentially gave up a late round pick IN ADDITION to the value of the 25th pick

So by the points system we spent the value of a slightly higher 1st round pick than 25. But yes, if he works out it will be worth it.

by admill on May 7, 2010 9:18 AM MDT up reply actions  

yup

What he said

Still got your Creedence...

by OutOfYourElement on May 7, 2010 9:20 AM MDT up reply actions  

Andre Woodson of the Giants?

That guy was a 6th rounder.

If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
PS3 ID: broncomaniac6

by Troy Hufford on May 7, 2010 4:51 PM MDT up reply actions  

I don't think Russell is the biggest NFL bust of all time until he is out of the league completely.

Considering that he is a big enough bum to just retire right now, it might not take long. But somebody is probably going to be willing to give him another shot, and he might take it.

by black_knight101 on May 7, 2010 8:03 AM MDT reply actions  

Russell might suprise

and be a star at OG or C. He is almost there size-wise all he needs now is to learn techinque. As a former failed quarterback he would be fairly athletic for a guard or center.

by Adam Manter on May 7, 2010 8:44 AM MDT up reply actions  

The Hut

should have $30 some million in the bank, unless he spent it all on pimp rides and bling. Maybe he was content studying plays on Madden ’10 instead of the Raider playbook…

Still got your Creedence...

by OutOfYourElement on May 7, 2010 8:52 AM MDT up reply actions  

didnt you see his earrings? bigger than my head

by Todd Jewell on May 7, 2010 8:58 AM MDT up reply actions  

Also

Isn’t it interesting that McD figured out how to improve Tebow’s mechanics by fixing his right side, something that I don’t think anybody has talked about before?

by black_knight101 on May 7, 2010 8:07 AM MDT reply actions  

That was something I found extremely interesting...

Take my advice... I'm not using it!
"If you can't be kind, at least have the decency to be vague."

by BroncTastic on May 7, 2010 8:39 AM MDT up reply actions  

I Loved That

This is why McDaniels is in a much better position to evaluate the draft than Kiper or McShay. Because McDaniels knows what to fix and how to fix it and those guys don’t have a clue.

Woody has been writing some good stuff lately. Where is the real Woody Paige?

"No more my bad just make the play"-McJedi

by RockyMountainThunder on May 7, 2010 8:54 AM MDT up reply actions  

Woody's excitement for the Broncos went up dramatically after we drafted Tebow

and as a result, he has been doing actual research on the Broncos instead of complete speculation. That’s my best guess.

by black_knight101 on May 7, 2010 8:56 AM MDT up reply actions  

LOL

IMHO Woody’s been phoning it in for years. Since this draft he’s knocked off the Dramamine and started writing again. Good for him.

Got Tebow?

by TheMastermind on May 7, 2010 9:00 AM MDT up reply actions  

Thanks for the Morning Tracks John

lots of good reads there.

"I cannot give you a formula for success, but I can give you the formula for failure: Try to please everybody."

by bchiper on May 7, 2010 8:55 AM MDT reply actions  

Love this McDaniels quote:
“You know what Tim doesn’t know about our playbook?” McDaniels asked, then answered. “Only what we haven’t told him yet.”

by Adam Manter on May 7, 2010 10:38 AM MDT reply actions  

I post this thing everywhere now.

Lifelong Arizona Cardinals/Chicago Bears fan.

I can't stand fair-weather/bandwagon fans, stick with your team, throughout the good and the bad.

by JoeCB1991 on May 7, 2010 11:46 AM MDT reply actions  

Ah come on

Now you are just disgracing the real player here, he wanted to be known for his size and you don’t even mention who it is!

I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.

by Topher Doll on May 7, 2010 12:13 PM MDT up reply actions  

I have no idea who the guy in the picture is.

I just put a Raiders helmet on it so it could look more like Russell.

Lifelong Arizona Cardinals/Chicago Bears fan.

I can't stand fair-weather/bandwagon fans, stick with your team, throughout the good and the bad.

by JoeCB1991 on May 7, 2010 3:23 PM MDT up reply actions  

Hold on a sec

I got that confused with another picture, my bad. But good job adding the helmet.

I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.

by Topher Doll on May 7, 2010 4:08 PM MDT up reply actions  

I just put it over the picture of him with the helmet I found.

I think someone added the Helmet to the picture as well, there is one where he doesn’t have one.

Lifelong Arizona Cardinals/Chicago Bears fan.

I can't stand fair-weather/bandwagon fans, stick with your team, throughout the good and the bad.

by JoeCB1991 on May 7, 2010 7:59 PM MDT up reply actions  

This is gonna be a very interesting year!

Beef on the lines…Tebow’s fast learning… and the NFLPA boycotting hotels…

OK so not the last part, but it is going to be a very interesting season for we Broncos fans!

Future 2010 MHR Fantasy Football Champion! ;)

"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."
John Adams

by Broncotodd on May 7, 2010 7:34 PM MDT reply actions  

I agree with much of what Kreiger had to say about Dumervil's contract

Understand the league issues but this guy has been a classy, healthy, team player. Although it will be a lot of money, he deserves it and doesn’t carry any of the intangible risks that BM carried.

"Space is big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mind- bogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the chemist's, but that's just peanuts to space."

"It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes" Douglas Adams

by orange&blue_aussie on May 8, 2010 5:04 AM MDT reply actions  

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