Post draft review
NFL Pro Scouts define needs for all 32 teams. Here is the Broncos.
THEY NEED: C, LB, DL, TE, WR, CB, QB.
THEY DON'T NEED: K, P, S.
POSSIBLE FIRST PICK: LB Rolando McClain, WR Dez Bryant.
OUTLOOK: The Broncos bought a defensive line (Bannan, Williams, Green) in free agency after watching teams run the ball straight up the gut last season. Now, they have the prototypes to complete their conversion from a 4-3 to a 3-4 defensive alignment. What would really help are inside and outside linebackers (Ayodele, Kirlew). They also could use a center (JD Walton) following Casey Wiegmann's return to Kansas City, a pass rusher (Ayers,Moss) to play opposite NFL sacks leader Elvis Dumervil, and a wide receiver (Thomas, Decker) following the trade of Pro Bowler Brandon Marshall.
The bold is my insert of the players that s/could solve those holes. The additional CB's (Cox, Jones, Thompson) should make the secondary twice as good and they were great last year.
One area the scouts missed (IMO) was oline. But that was covered really good by (Beadles, Olsen). This really gives Denver the best young OLINE in the NFL.
This is a Fan-Created Comment on MileHighReport.com. The opinion here is not necessarily shared by the editorial staff of MHR
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I am not sure I would call players that haven't even played an NFL snap the best O-line
in the league. I want to see them play at least one season to make that assessment.
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by Broncoman on Jun 16, 2010 1:47 PM MDT reply actions 1 recs
Don't forget we covered the QB question there as well,
by signing Quinn and drafting Tebow.
"I cannot give you a formula for success, but I can give you the formula for failure: Try to please everybody."
re: LB numbers
What would really help are inside and outside linebackers (Ayodele, Kirlew).
Let’s recap — we cut Davis and moved Haggan to the inside, so another OLB would keep us at the status quo.
There’s some chance that we’ll keep either Ayodele or Greisen but we may just stick with 3 — D. J., Haggan and Woodyard, and occasionally Larsen if needed. In fact, it’s exactly what we relied upon last year, except that Haggan replaces Davis.
A big part of the belief that we needed to another ILB was based on the fact that we cut Davis, which is something the MSM noticed. What the MSM didn’t notice is that Haggan had switched positions.
The one big difference between Haggan and Davis (to my knowledge) is that Haggan can pass cover, so we’d actually be ahead of last year in terms of assignments. Another difference between Haggan and Davis is that Haggan can play STs and usually does (3rd in STs’ tackles).
Removing a player who does less (in number of assignments) and replacing him with one who does more is an increase in our capacity. Even better, since assignment math is fuzzy math and players rarely come in parts, replacing Davis with Haggan could allow us to carry one extra player — although probably not an ILB since we don’t gain a player if we merely replace Davis. In other words, the point is to do more with less (players), and that allows us to carry another player somewhere else.
Usually, the player you gain in the process of having fewer players do more is a player who offers something you don’t have. I think of positions such as power RB which we don’t have,
no goats, no glory.
by Colinski on Jun 16, 2010 8:08 PM MDT reply actions 1 recs
Great points Colinski. McD has emphasized his preference for versatile players in several of his press conferences this summer, so I agree with your thoughts on Haggan and his impact both at ILB and on overall roster composition. Keeping an RB4 or a WR6 may depend on precisely this sort roster arithmetic.
that's it
I always look at the total number of RBs + WRs, which may sound strange. So you’ve hit upon something. We’re looking to carry 11 if we can [ 6 WR; 4 RB, 1 FB ]
The particular problem in our case is keeping enough WRs to run a 3-WR system while also providing enough depth to weather the attrition at RB. And we also need some depth at FB in case of injury. The final objective is to carry both a speed back and a power back.
Re: the LBs. We’d still like to add some attributes to OLB. Compared to last year, we have one opening. However, the biggest added contribution could be from Moss if he can produce as a speed rusher. The added OLB – whether he be Kirlew, Davis, Alexander or Atkins — can be in the same basic Elephant mold as long as he contributes. If we’re able to stay on 3 ILBs + 5 OLBs then we’ll be able to carry 10 DBs, which helps for defending the multiple WR sets. And we’ve got the depth to warrant keeping that many, too.
no goats, no glory.
Haggan/Davis
The one big difference between Haggan and Davis (to my knowledge) is that Haggan can pass cover, so we’d actually be ahead of last year in terms of assignments. Another difference between Haggan and Davis is that Haggan can play STs and usually does (3rd in STs’ tackles).
Good points. Haggan was also a little faster, younger, more versatile, and then there are the issues you noted – ST work and coverage. I find myself more concerned with Ayodele – he lead the league in missed tackles last season and his coverage skills are considered poor. I hope that Greisen is ready by the end of camp – I think that he’d be a better option moving forward. The other player that you mention could well be Kirlew, who has some skills that I’d like Denver to take advantage of.
We now have a power runner, but we have to see if he can play NFL power running football – Toney Baker. The more I read on him, the more I like him. Here are two YouTubes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-huZvIfTRv4 – 26 seconds long
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIPp4Y7V-1E – 9 minutes long
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAw2DMesgjM
Here’s an interesting quote: Scout.com rates him the No. 5 running back nationallyNFLdraftscout rates him as the #31 RB in the county. He runs the 40 in the 4.5 range (anywhere from 4.50 to 4.59), with 4.59 his average on Pro Day. He has a 1.63 10 yard dash and 37 inch vertical. His playing weight is around 225 and he was up to 235 on Pro Day. The biggest issue is that his knee took about 2 seasons to fully heal, although it appears to be fine now.
Gnothi Seauton
adding by subtraction
RB is the one area where our numbers get scary. The ‘less is more’ post above is motivated by desire to carry one more player without reducing our assignments. And the Haggan for Davis switch actually increases our assignment capacity, as I stated. Moreover, Larsen is still available and provides emergency depth, so we’ve added again through subtraction by borrowing him if necessary. The other area where we add by subtraction is TE, since Branson’s use in a FB type role borrows from that position.
I wasn’t comfortable with the RB numbers because the wear-and-tear at RB is too great, but solutions to the problem invariably draw numbers from positions where we either needed depth, such as the OL, or had quality depth that could contribute if we could find room, such as WR. As far as T Baker, I was sold the day we signed him after seeing the tape.
One other position that could benefit by utilizing versatility is the OL. I’m not sure how many people have noticed that the OT/OG solution I was advocating before the draft was realized when we drafted Beadles, who’s already practiced at OT before being moved to OG. I don’t expect too much from him immediately but he could provide depth for OT in time. The other OL whose versatility could be crucial is Hochstein. My concern is that we may have to carry an extra OT like Gorin who adds little besides emergency depth. Clady’s presence on PUP gives us temporary room for an added player but the depth problem still doesn’t go away. The ultimate beneficiary could be someone such as Fry or Eric Olsen, who might not be kept if we have to carry more depth at OT. As I recall, Hochstein can play OT, which, when added with Beadles’ versatility, could eliminate the necessity of carrying both Batiste and Polumbus.
no goats, no glory.
Remember that Polumbus is a natural LT who was used at RT last year.
If we keep our OL draft picks then Hochstein is the oldest and due to the injuries would be the versatile (t,g,c) backup. Gorin would be a waste (IMO) I would rather see Marinelli.
the great backup Tackle controversy
Call it mountainizing a molehill. However, finding a solution to the backup OT problem is relatively important.
I used Gorin (who’s no longer with the team) as an example of wasting a roster spot, since his only real function on the team last year — besides a trivial amount of playing time — was to serve as an emergency backup. It’s an important enough position to necessitate keeping one but it always seems like a waste when a roster spot is used on a player whose job is to sit on the bench, just in case he’s needed.
The basic problem of roster numbers on the OL is one of most important, and recurring, problems in determining the roster. I addressed this before the draft under posts related to our 1st pick. In those posts (and there are many), I discuss using our 1st pick on Trent Williams (OT). My suggestion that Trent Williams might be a good pick should be understood in two ways — firstly, as a value pick for that range (#11), and secondly, as a way of resolving our ongoing problems at OT and OG, and I suggested that we use him as an OG & backup OT.
NFL teams don’t want to carry an abundance of bench-sitters. And the OL best illustrates this tension between having an emergency reserve and getting some use out of the members of the roster. The idea being illustrated in this case is the idea of ‘platoon depth’ versus ‘situational depth.’ And the problem is exacerbated in the case of the OL by the 53 man roster, which makes it difficult to carry backups at every position on the OL. Further exacerbating the OL’s depth problem is the active list, which limits the amount of players in any single game to 45 ( + a 3QB).
Our current situation involves injuries to Clady and Harris, which makes the decision regarding backup OT even more critical since we’ll probably need to find a replacement for Clady for the initial games and the long term looms larger, in part, because of the precarious nature of recovery from the type of injury Harris suffered.
An added aspect of the backup OT problem is the salary cap, and the basic structure of the problem will remain even if the cap is changed because it involves a basic allocation of resources dilemma. No team wants to overspend on a reserve (“bench-sitter”) but no team can afford to go without a competent LT backup. The structure of the problem has discrepant values of importance, since the reserve LT can be a non-issue, because he almost never gets to play when the starter remains healthy, but can become a major issue when there is an injury to the starter. Teams often resolve this problem by using older vets who are in decline or younger players who are (still) inexpensive. And a considerable amount of inexpensive young OTs are looked at and sorted through to find the magic combination of reasonably competent yet cheap enough. The continual bargain hunting that goes on is a focused effort to find an OT who reflects these contradictory characteristics.
A final twist in our situation is the difference between RT and LT. OT/OG hybrids who can play RT are easier to find than LT types. A number of our OLs — Hochstein, Kuper, Beadles — could handle RT with its lessened demand for pass blocking skills, but LT is a somewhat different story. And the final decision on roster cuts could mirror the difference between the two Tackle positions. A bigger run blocker type such as Batiste might be passed over for a LT type such as Polumbus for the simple reason that our immediate need is at LT. On the other hand, the PUP roster exemption would allow us to carry both temporarily, and we’d need the added depth at the position.
Balancing all the concerns in the decisional criteria for the membership of the OL will be the last decision we make going into the season. Since it’s nearly impossible to carry 10, we have to go 1-deep at one of the positions. That position would normally be in the interior but we don’t want to sabotage our efforts to rebuild at LG and OC. Therefore, a solution that allows us to double-up a player from another position — such as Beadles, a LG, as a backup RT, or Hochstein, a G/C, as an OT — would allow us to carry adequate depth at OT while still developing the interior OL. One fewer Tackle may not seem like a big deal but it could allow us to carry a power back such as Toney Baker. And uncertainty over the OT position could force us to protect ourselves and carry someone like Brandon Gorin, who rarely saw the field and made a negligible contribution.
no goats, no glory.
Hochstein has played tackle as well as guard and center
As poorly as I’ve seen him play, I suspect that his versatility tends to keep him around.
Gnothi Seauton










































