Broncos release QB Tom Brandstater
by John Bena on Jun 4, 2010 11:57 AM MDT
in 2010 Denver Broncos Offseason
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PrintFour quarterbacks are indeed too many - at least for the Broncos. Denver took care of their logjam at QB by releaseing Tom Brandstater today, according to the National Football Post. Brandstater was drafted by Josh McDaniels and the Broncos in the 6th Round of the 2009 Draft and became sort of a cult hero with Broncos fans after a solid performance against the Arizona Cardinals starting defense in the final Pre-Season game last season.
Some were even hoping that Brandstater would get a shot to compete for the starting job this season.
Once the Broncos acquired Brady Quinn from the Browns and drafted Tim Tebow in the 1st Round of the 2010 NFL Draft, the writing was on the wall for Brandstater. By releasing him now, the Broncos have allowed Brandstater plenty of time to find a new home - and he should be a pretty attractive commodity in a League starving for quarterback talent.
Best of luck to TB in his future endeavors.
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Best of Luck Brandstater!
I had always hoped that we could genetically combine Tom Brandstater and Brady Quinn to make a Tom Brady.
by troycdunn on Jun 4, 2010 12:01 PM MDT reply actions 3 recs
lol
NOT
"All we're trying to do is win the *********** game!" -- Josh MF McDaniels tearing into his offensive line after three false starts in the red zone. The tirade turned the tide of the game, and the Broncos dominated from that point on.
by broncosmontana on Jun 4, 2010 4:19 PM MDT up reply actions
lol
"The never-ending search for a truth never told."
"God I'm excited for those two to fail miserably." - SBNation writer Andrew Sharp on Josh McDaniels and Tim Tebow.
Quitter's People United Member #18
by Tempestuous Binary on Jun 4, 2010 2:17 PM MDT up reply actions
Not a big surprise, I wish him luck, too. And this is a classy move
to do it right now because it gives TB time to latch on with another team. I hope he finds a home somewhere, preferably not in the AFC so I can root for him. ;-)
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers/Lakers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants/Warriors country, and damned proud of it.
Which you said above. Meh should've read your whole post ;-)
Anyway, yeah big difference between beg of June release vs August release, which is what I was afraid they might do. Now he can really find a home.
There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers/Lakers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants/Warriors country, and damned proud of it.
HOLY CATS! THAT'S UNBELIEVABLE!!
Not Tom B! He was the next Tom Brady!
j/k – The writing was on the wall, I’m afraid. I’m sure it took a little time to assess his place in the QB competition, but just yesterday I was thinking, “Wow, he’s still with them — maybe he’s actually showing them something!”
If so, now he can show someone else. Good luck, TB!
"All we're trying to do is win the *********** game!" -- Josh MF McDaniels tearing into his offensive line after three false starts in the red zone. The tirade turned the tide of the game, and the Broncos dominated from that point on.
Bah
I always thought they would trade him (to NE for a 5th…)
Best if luck to you Tommy B.
Owning the Patriots since September 9, 1960
lol Dude I totally had dyslexia when I read that last line. : )
"All we're trying to do is win the *********** game!" -- Josh MF McDaniels tearing into his offensive line after three false starts in the red zone. The tirade turned the tide of the game, and the Broncos dominated from that point on.
by broncosmontana on Jun 4, 2010 12:14 PM MDT up reply actions
not a bad idea, but................
I think the market was very weak for a developmental late pick (estimated value). Developmental is a late pick so that’s redundant, actually.
There’s just not a lot of teams who think they need to use a pick to find a QB of Brandstater’s ability and value.
We might have found a little value (although not necessarily) but we would have had to wait and see if anyone developed a need late in preseason (or around then). And even that’s questionable because a developmental QB isn’t a need filler but a project, which you plan.
Cutting Brandstater at this point is a favor to him. It allows him to find the best opportunity, and it gives him time to find it before camp starts.
It would be easy to view his waiver as a loss to us, but it’s also short-sighted. Looking out for the interests of players, even those who leave the team, demonstrates that we’re a good organization. And future FAs see this and make it part of their decision when they look for a new team. It’s misleading to frame the situation as one in which we hold all the cards. Free agency is a voluntary exercise. In other words, it’s closer to courtship than slavery. Teams that treat their players well gain the respect of the players (both their’s and other team’s). It’s not all about ‘the money.’
no goats, no glory.
by Colinski on Jun 4, 2010 1:06 PM MDT up reply actions 8 recs
Well put. It gives him am opportunity to learn another system in time to be a contributor.
Imagination is more important than knowledge. A. Einstein
+1
"The never-ending search for a truth never told."
"God I'm excited for those two to fail miserably." - SBNation writer Andrew Sharp on Josh McDaniels and Tim Tebow.
Quitter's People United Member #18
by Tempestuous Binary on Jun 4, 2010 2:20 PM MDT up reply actions
hording value
The trap that people fall into is in thinking of the situation as a zero-sum game. Being ‘nice’ has rewards. We can’t keep four QBs so why try to milk every bit of value out of the situation, even when it hurts him?
Helping Brandstater now creates a climate in which we can acquire FAs later. We both win. And we both lose if we cling to his rights and receive nothing in return.
It’s a trap in thinking. Being nice can produce rewards for both sides. Saving that bit of value we might have received would have virtually ensured that we hurt his chances. And we were unlikely to find a trade parner, anyways. By looking out for his interests, we generate good will and increase our chances of attracting FAs in the future — and at no cost to us.
no goats, no glory.
by Colinski on Jun 4, 2010 2:32 PM MDT up reply actions 7 recs
We do gain by showing we are a fair organization to players
We probably tried but got no takers for a trade. So we at least gain props for treating him fairly and releasing him early.
Good Luck Tom...
I for one, will be rooting very hard for you to get an opportunity to prove yourself with another Team…Wrong place, Wrong time…Go Take It!
- Whatever "it" was that got you to where you are today, "it" will certainly not be enough to enable you to stay there going forward! -
the only way
I’ve refrained from contesting the belief that we’d somehow find a way to keep four QBs, but Brandstater was doomed the instant we drafted Tebow.
Brandstater has the chance now to find team in need of a developmental QB.
It’s a little disappointing considering that we gave up some picks to move into position to draft him:
2009 DRAFT DAY TRADES
Broncos receive:
" 2009 sixth-round pick (No. 174):
QB Tom BrandstaterLions receive:
" 2009 seventh-round pick (No. 235): LB Zack Follett
" 2010 fifth-round pickAnalysis: NFL Network’s Mike Mayock noted during Sunday’s draft broadcast that Brandstater is a “down-the-road pick,” given that the Broncos only have two quarterbacks currently on the roster and the team needed a young passer to develop. The Lions’ pick, Follett, developed a reputation as being one of the Pac-10’s hardest hitters. For complete pick-by-pick analysis, check out NFL.com’s Draft Tracker.
I don’t have any problems with the idea of shoring our QB position through bringing in Quinn and Tebow, however. Late round picks are the spending money that we use to expedite the process.
no goats, no glory.
By the way
Zack Follett is a really funny dude. Check out some of his random videos he puts up on YouTube (like going to a grocery store wearing his Lions helmet.)
by Bradoncadonc on Jun 4, 2010 12:31 PM MDT up reply actions
a likeable talent
The only problem with thinking that we “lost” a player whose talents we needed (which is often believed), is the number crunch. I mention it here only because it’s been on my mind.
Talent becomes superfluous at a certain point. And further acquisition become impossible because you can only keep 53. Moreover, added talent is shed in each offseason so better players aren’t always useful because they’re still replaced. This is the problem of ’cost of a temporary structure."
I realize that this is a segue here but it’s an interesting mathematical problem. The indication is that a high quality 3rd stringer is pointless if you upgrade later — so don’t waste the pick value. All those extra late picks we use to move up and find a quality reserve are wasted when you take an upgrade such as Tebow.
The lesson is that much of the emphasis that fans place on conserving pick value is misplaced. We see how McX have used late picks; they spend them with abandon when there’s a possible good fit. Losing an extra late pick doesn’t concern them because that amount of pick value is lost to attrition regardless of what they do. Moreover, a UDFA may be the best choice for filling final spots on the roster because of financial reasons. It’s almost pointless to pay a late draftee more and then cut him later.
The pennywise, pound-foolish philosophy scrimps across the board but doesn’t conserve pick value any better. Spending money/pick value to get what you want & need makes more sense. Getting the right player in the right position lessens attrition even though it often spends value to find it.
no goats, no glory.
by Colinski on Jun 4, 2010 1:35 PM MDT up reply actions 2 recs
In game theory
its known as bricklayers or gladiators.
Adding more brick layers can be an improvement. But if only one gladiator is allowed in the contest, having more in reserve is not an improvement.
Likewise, two average bricklayers may equal one superior bricklayer. But two average gladiators do not equal one superior gladiator if only one at a time is allowed to fight.
Whoa with your friday afternoon "deepness"...
Some of us are self employed and already started the weekend. If this were tuesday I would have loved it though.
by jayhawk bronco on Jun 4, 2010 2:54 PM MDT up reply actions
thanks, very interesting
It’s a problem I’ve pondered a lot. And there’s some nuances that relate to roster limits, salaries at particular ranges, and keeping position open to allow future additions.
Fans tend to see holes as shortcomings but I see openings for future players. For example, I’m not worried about the lack of an R-OLB in this draft (except for Kirlew), because the proper round to take a quality pass rushing specialist is fairly early. We also still have to resolve the ‘Moss issue’ before we make a move, so this is his last chance to prove himself.
The mistake that fans often make is to ‘pit solutions against each other.’ There are times that you want more than one solution, and you array a number of solutions in the hopes of finding one, because finding a solution is very important. However, there are times in which your solutions undermine each other. Pick value is necessarily wasted because there’s no eventual solution set that includes all the value, and you can even create problems in the process that worsen the situation — such as destabilizing a position by not having a clear-cut winner.
I strongly dislike the willy-nilly acquisition theory of competition (“we’ll let them work it out”). Competition can become destructive and/or pointless. The reason teams stay away from drafting players at the same position in consecutive rounds is because it tends to lead to confused roles. it’s one thing to “flood a position” in an attempt to let competition sort out the situation, but unintentionally flooding when you’re trying to draft reserves is merely bad planning.
no goats, no glory.
I love discussions like this on MHR
seriously… you guys are great.
Take my advice... I'm not using it!
"If you can't be kind, at least have the decency to be vague."
I see the Chargers or the Cardinals picking him up.
We must all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately. - Benjamin Franklin
Whoa there...Did you just say what I think you said?
My prescription: two happy pills, (since they’re best taken with food, enjoy a nice medium rare Tebown steak), chase the whole thing with a glass half full of the orange koolaid (Orange Crush will do in a pinch), get a good night’s sleep and try that comment again…. - Broncs Cheer
by Orange and Blue on Jun 4, 2010 12:33 PM MDT reply actions
The Negative Response Menu
1. We’re not even in training camp yet and Tebow has already dropped back to the bottom of the QB’s. McHoodie wasted the #1 draft pick.
2. McDaniels said he was all for competition, but instead he eliminates competition. Jr. is a hypocrite.
3. We could have used that 6th round pick last year to draft a star running back. Shanahan knew to do this with Terrell Davis.
4. Our sophomore coach obviously doesn’t know how to handle quarterbacks. This is the third QB shipped out in 15 months. Pretty soon no quarterback in the league will want to work with us.
5. Brandstater was the future of the Broncos. He was the only QB to go undefeated in his starts. Is McB Jr. blind?
6. How do we expect to win without a 4th string quarterback?
by Alan_Smithee on Jun 4, 2010 12:44 PM MDT reply actions 8 recs
Hilarious
Hopefully, no one gets on here and agrees with any of this, but I wouldn’t be surprised.
Maybe if you posted it in the DP?
"It's all over Fat Man" - Tom Jackson to John Madden 1977 AFC Championship Game
RIP Barrel Man - 12/5/09
by DesertBroncoFan on Jun 4, 2010 12:49 PM MDT up reply actions
LOL
Nice! Saved them the trouble!
Why hate on your OWN team when you've got the Raiders?
by TheMastermind on Jun 4, 2010 12:59 PM MDT up reply actions
# 7.
The Broncos cut Tom Brady?!
"I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work."
- Thomas Alva Edison
"Success is not a place at which one arrives, but rather... the spirit with which one undertakes and continues the journey."
- Alex Noble
Haha, nice.
"The never-ending search for a truth never told."
"God I'm excited for those two to fail miserably." - SBNation writer Andrew Sharp on Josh McDaniels and Tim Tebow.
Quitter's People United Member #18
by Tempestuous Binary on Jun 4, 2010 2:46 PM MDT up reply actions
#4.....Nice.
Floyd Little: HOF Class of 2010.
2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant
Nicely executed : )
rec
"All we're trying to do is win the *********** game!" -- Josh MF McDaniels tearing into his offensive line after three false starts in the red zone. The tirade turned the tide of the game, and the Broncos dominated from that point on.
by broncosmontana on Jun 4, 2010 3:32 PM MDT up reply actions
LMAO!
Pretty funny and rec’d :)
Future 2010 MHR Fantasy Football Champion! ;)
"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."
John Adams
Too bad
I was hoping McD still had confidence in Brandstater for the future, since we may have been able to keep him on the practice squad and keep developing him.
Agree this is a combination of a classy move (giving him a chance to compete on another team) and not having much confidence that he will become valuable in the future.
Hope this means our coaches have a lot of confidence in our other three QBs and this was just a classy move. But still disappointing, that we get nothing for drafting TB and carrying him on the roster for a year.
I'm actually a little surprised
I just assumed Brandstater made the perfect 3rd string QB. No name recoginition and not much pay. It is kind of exciting to be going into a season with three QBs with pretty big names. I’m finding it hard to come up with a scenerio in the past where the 2nd and 3rd stringers kind of have bigger names than the first string. No offense to Kyle Orton, but IMO (and this I’m not arguing talent) most fans of other teams would recognize Brady Quinn and Tim Tebow’s name before his.
None of us go out and play for stats. You just do whatever you can to help the team out. -- Eddie Royal
Nice. That was a wasted 5th round pick in 2010. San Diego used this pick to take Cam Thomas. We could have used the pick to take Cam Thomas, Authur Jones, Andrew Quarless or Jon Dwyer, or someone else. Nice to know we were so aggressive in a draft we had a few months to prepare for. Big shocker this pick didn’t work out….
Brady Quinn is actually younger than Tom Bradstater (whom turns 26) this season. He is pretty old for a 2nd year player and that will limit his options. I’m sure someone gives him a shot and he’ll probably be signed within the next few days, but at his age, he won’t have many 2nd chances vs a guy that was 22 or 23, like most rookies.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
How the heck is the pick wasted?
I see nothing unreasonable, or wasteful, about drafting a developmental QB with a 5th round pick from the following years draft. The pick didn’t turn out, but most don’t and you have no way of knowing if any of those other picks would turn out.
Team building is not about maximizing the value of an individual pick. It is about maximizing the collective contribution of all the moves, FA and all draft picks combined. Investors who try to maximize the value of every investment in isolation, generally lose money. Smart investors look at an entire portfolio, knowing that some picks won’t pan out but others will.
coincidentally
I posted something on this general topic above, SWG.
The situation is similar to an easter egg hunt in which your arms are already full but you still want to acquire more eggs.
I love the example of ‘we could have picked up player X’ because that’s the player we’d have cut instead at the end of preseason. So… in other words……… the picks we saved were still wasted in the end. At least there’s a story that goes with it, and a lot of righteous indignation and outrage, too.
Meanwhile, the talent level is rising at every position. I think I need to post something on fuzzy roster math related to the attrition problem, in order help people understand how attrition can help or hurt us — depending.
no goats, no glory.
I’m not sure how our offensive roster is more talented today than it was at the end of 2008. That is a very questionable claim that cannot be supported by 2009 results.
No doubt about the D though. Much better today than 2008.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
You are assuming
a. that you should evaluate offensive talent and defense talent independently. I think you have to look at the team as a whole, and
that the Broncos were willing to pay Marshall what he obviously wanted.If you assume that it was inevitable that Marshall would leave then you will arrive at a different result than if you assume the Broncos should have paid whatever it cost to keep him.
BTW: it’s only my personal belief, but I don’t think Orton was actually that much a step down from Cutler and I don’t think Sheffler is that hard to replace. So in my assessment the only real loss is Marshall.
My thoughts are
that it is not a wasted pick because who knew we could get Quinn and Tebow?!
No one knew we would get either of them when the last draft occured, and McD had Orton and Simms to work with..
From a precautionary standpoint, this was a gamble but not a wasted pick. It was a Cover your Arse move. Which I think, given the situation before the 09 draft, was very smart
"I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work."
- Thomas Alva Edison
"Success is not a place at which one arrives, but rather... the spirit with which one undertakes and continues the journey."
- Alex Noble
by DenBronx on Jun 4, 2010 2:47 PM MDT up reply actions 3 recs
proxies & straw men
I think we’re more talented on offense but I think I said “more talented,” referring to the entire roster.
“Proving” is different than knowing (or believing that..) a state exists. We rely on our scouting/pro personnel dept. to do their homework and then wait for the process to unfold. If we’ve done our homework adequately then the results speak for themselves in time.
Most of our offensive positions are clearly more talented (at least as measured by a draft position proxy) but there’s going to have to be some development before we experience a substantial return. I would have preferred seeing (for instance) a FA or two on the OL but the pick value is there, and we’re able to address the situation again, both this season or in next year’s FA crop.
QB — three high picks. It’s certainly arguable whether any of them are better than Cutler but the depth is clearly better. I hesitate to overrate Cutler at this point after seeing the RZ turnover machine in action last year.
RB — one #1 and lots of value in Buckhalter and Arrington. It’s probably not fair to be comparing Selvin Young to anyone’s RB corps. There’s some other names from 2008 but nobody worth mentioning.
WR — lots of high pick value. Some names — Keary Colbert, Darrell Jackson. Marshall is the only star we’re missing from then but our depth is much better, and we have Gaffney, Lloyd and McKinley now. Again, young players are where a lot of the pick value is so we have to wait on their development, but the talent is obviously there.
TE — Scheffler and Nate Jackson. Quinn is going to be a different kind of player so this is tough to measure. Branson is mostly unknown and there’s room for adding talent if he’s not satisfactory. I give Scheffler credit for obvious pass catching ability but take it away for failing to block and going south (statistics-wise) since then. The extra pass catcher is going to be a WR for the current team so we should look there.
OT — the difference in mainly Pears V. Beadles, with the latter being a much higher selection.
OG — Hamilton was around, as well as Lichtensteiger. Not much to speak about here. We’ve spent a few middle picks here lately but that’s only potential. Hamilton was in decline by then so his talent was disappearing by that point, even though he clearly had it earlier in his career.
OC — Nalen only played a few games in 08 and was gone in 09. Walton is the highest pick we’ve used on a Center recently. And we have Eric Olsen, too. Weigmann is about it for then, and he had experience (of course) — which counts — but that’s not talent. Again, we’ve made the investment now but the talent has to develop.
FB — not much to mention here. Hillis had some talent but it’s the same kind of problem as in comparing TEs. Pittman was a useful player but there wasn’t a true FB (besides Larsen and Hillis).
There’s clearly a lot more high draft picks on offense but their youth is going be our biggest impediment till they develop. Players such as Decker are a lot more talented than, say… Colbert, but it’s going to take time before we get their full contribution. Much of the story is on defense, so it’s interesting that you added “offense” in an apparent straw man maneuver. Experience is our greatest deficit on offense, particularly the OL. And that’s partly because of injuries. We can probably weather the storm if Clady and Harris are healthy but the middle is still a concern. The offense may need the defense’s help early in the season. I expect the offense to have matured enough by mid-season to produce a rather healthy late season record, the opposite of last season’s results.
no goats, no glory.
by Colinski on Jun 4, 2010 5:26 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
The only thing that is clear is that we have traded away a lot of proven NFL players for high draft picks.
Let me ask you a simple question.
How many 1st round picks pan out? How many 2nd round picks pan out? That team you list is a ton of projection but very very little actual NFL production.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
odds
I don’t have the numbers at hand but I’ve seen them listed here on several occasions.
The obvious problem with talking about production is they’ve only just completed their first year (for the McX draftees). The UFAs are another story, and they’ve done well.
Projections of our current high draft picks are not skewed, we’re merely assuming that the normal number of them will achieve at the normal level. Even given those assumptions, our large number of draft picks should produce a fairly large improvement in the team’s success as they reach their 2nd, 3rd & 4th years,etc., (or around there).
The reason this team appears to be better, besides talent, is because we’re no longer hamstrung by the horrible drafts that marked many of Shanahan’s (et al) groups. The drafts of 06, 07 and 08 (of Goodman, and Xanders) also contained some talent, which has helped.
no goats, no glory.
good of place as any
to post some recent research.
When McDaniels came on board he had 9 picks available in the 2009 draft, and full complements in the 2010 and 2011 drafts. As things stand now we selected 10 players in the 2009 draft, 9 in the 2010 draft and as of today 6 selections in the 2011 draft.
When it comes to “roster currency”, we have:
-4 players brought in via trade
-4 players departed via trade
-18 draft picks traded away
-13 extra draft picks acquired
-25 players drafted (two cut)
-24 free agents aqcuired (that are still on the roster)(one starting free agent has since been released (davis))
-2 contracts redone (DJ Williams, Stokley) and 2 contracts renewed (Kup and Doom(I’m jumping the gun with that announcement))
-33 CFAs brought on board (11 didn’t make the roster, approximately 68% of the 2009 CFA class, which is better odds than it sounds like, part of the temporary structure)
I was initially planning on calculating draft pick value via the trade chart, but it isn’t worth it. What is key here is that we leveraged opportunities to acquire significantly more players in the draft than we were “entitled” too, and when viewed in its entirety, none of the trades have created some insurmountable deficiency of value in roster currency.
We have acquired a ton of players, accomplished a tremendous amount of rebuilding (the defensive rebuild has been staggering) and we are going into 2011 with one fewer pick than the standard complement, but two picks in the second round. Hardly a deficient position.
-
Bear Claw Chris Lapp: You've come far pilgrim.
Jeremiah Johnson: Feels like far.
Bear Claw Chris Lapp: Were it worth the trouble?
Jeremiah Johnson: What trouble?
by Jeremy Bolander on Jun 5, 2010 12:23 AM MDT up reply actions 2 recs
We have 7 picks in the 2011 draft.
Are you forgetting we added a second #2 for Marshall. I see that you factored in the 2011 5th round pick we traded away for two 7s in the 2010.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
I have us trading a 5th and 6th
and acquiring an extra 2nd. The 5th was to TB for the sevenths, as you mention, and the 6th was part of the quinn trade.
Bear Claw Chris Lapp: You've come far pilgrim.
Jeremiah Johnson: Feels like far.
Bear Claw Chris Lapp: Were it worth the trouble?
Jeremiah Johnson: What trouble?
by Jeremy Bolander on Jun 5, 2010 10:03 AM MDT up reply actions
Hum… I believe that was a 2012 draft pick that we traded for Quinn.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
that too
in addition to the 2011 6th rounder, there was a 2012 conditional pick based on Quinn’s playing time.
I haven’t really thought about it, but now I’m curious when that playing time has to accrue. Potentially (and worst case scenario) it is a set number of games over the full two years before the pick comes due. Best case scenario is it is a (low) percentage of possible snaps, since that number won’t become easier to obtain if the accrual period is longer…
Bear Claw Chris Lapp: You've come far pilgrim.
Jeremiah Johnson: Feels like far.
Bear Claw Chris Lapp: Were it worth the trouble?
Jeremiah Johnson: What trouble?
by Jeremy Bolander on Jun 5, 2010 8:55 PM MDT up reply actions
What about opinion?
Let’s leave game-one out of the question. We’ve got some pretty high-profile, high-resource players to fill every roster spot on offense. And we’ve still got three of the first 64 picks next year. We’re in a good place, just maybe not immediately.
I’m not sure how you feel about The Tebow, but with him, Bay, KnowMo, Royal, Decker, Quinn/Graham, Clady, Harris, and whoever wins out in the ubber competitive competition at interior line… it’s tough to be negative moving forward. These guys are cheap. They’re young. And most of their contracts aren’t due for a while. It’s a good time to be a Bronco fan.
We could end up having an all-drafted starting offense in 2011, with an average age of like 24 and an average draft position of about the 2nd round. The glass is more than half-full.
In fact, if I can find odds on winning a SB in 2011, I’m taking it. Odds for 2010 are/were 50:1. I’d love to take those odds (or better for 2011.
November, gentlemen. We go again to their house and we make it OUR MF house!! We take our Crown from those punks, not from around those punks! We take it in November and we protect it in January. Two wins. That's it. Take it!!!
Too much projecting on your part. You guys keep saying about half of top picks don’t pan out. Okay. Let me turn this around on you then. That means either Tebow or Thomas will likely bust. Means either Walton or Decker won’t pan out. They are draft picks so it happens all the time.
With Marshall, Scheff, Cutler and Hillis, you knew you had NFL players that made it happen. Only one of these guys was good under McD, but all four were studs under Shanny.
We will likely find that a guy like Thomas or Beadles is not good and a wasted pick. Happens in every NFL drat. If we were to be unlucky and miss on our WR picks or O-line picks, we will be screwed. That is the risk of the draft vs having know NFL caliber players like the guys we had in 2008.
It’s only going to be good to be a Bronco fan if our draft picks turn into good or great players. Based on the 2009 picks, I’m not too excited about McD’s eye for talent.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
I'm a bit hesitant to agree with you McG
But I will anyways, fans are often only seeing one side of things and ignore the other side. Everyone keeps mentioning McD’s eye for talent, and I do agree he is a great personnel scout, but when a player leaves, like Brandstater, they don’t mention that. Or when they say a lot of picks don’t pan out, they still blindly hope that all our picks will be awesome. I’m a realist, I hope all our picks turn out well, but I know that some may struggle in the NFL, even some of our top round picks.
I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.
Damnit Jim=)!!
(I think we have a lot of Star-Trek fans around here.)
Seriously, you’re killing me man. Yes, let’s say we only make average(ish). We’re still looking at a full glass of Miller LIght.
You’ve never been shy about penning your thoughts down, so go on record right here. You’re not going anywhere and neither am I. My address is 444 Mountain View Lane, Burley, ID, 83318. My phone number is 208.219.9543.
The Broncos go the Championship Game by 2011. That’s good odds my friend. We’ve got much to be excited about. I win, it’s a hundred bucks… AND you wear a big T-shirt on your profile pic that says “Alex is the Man” (paid for with my winnings). You win, you call it…
Our Broncos are in amazing shape. I used to think you just hated the trade and draft for Phonz, now I’m not sure.
November, gentlemen. We go again to their house and we make it OUR MF house!! We take our Crown from those punks, not from around those punks! We take it in November and we protect it in January. Two wins. That's it. Take it!!!
You Idaho fans are good ones. Say hi to the Snake for me. I always liked him as our QB.
I can’t be on sports. I used to put money in an NCAA basketball pool, but then I would end up rooting for teams I hated like Duke or Kansas and against teams I liked such as Villanova or UCLA. Money is evil.
So I won’t bet money for or against the Broncos since I don’t want something as ugly as currency to clould my feelings for my favorite team.
But we are a long long way from the Super Bowl in 2011. You have to admit that I am right about draft picks. I can pretty much assure you that two or three of Tebow, Thomas, Beadels, Decker and Walton is bust in the NFL. Just in the same way to two or three of Moreno, Ayers, Smith, McBath and Quinn will bust in the NFL. We need better players to be a Super Bowl team and we don’t have those guys on the team right now unless you project all our young guys to be good.
I will pay for and wear your T-shirt, size large, if you are right. I’ll send you (your call) something like stone crab claws, Cuban cigars, mangos (the tree in my yard is about to bear its fruit), empanadas, cocaine, or anything else we are known for in South Florida.
If I am right and Denver is still on the outside of the playoffs, you will be wearing a hot pink T shirt that says something like "Josh McDaniels is dumb" and I guess I’ll be getting something like a sack of potatoes.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
I think in their limited [or not limited play] that Ayers, Moreno and McBath have shown they are ready to play. Obviously Smith had issues last year — whether his injury had anything to do about it, I don’t care, he didn’t play and he needed to be playing. I don’t really see how R. Quinn doesn’t get play time considering we only have three TE’s on the roster. Bruton also looked better than decent in his limited time.
To me this leaves Seth Olsen, Kenny McKinley and the two guys we have already released in Brandstater and Schleuter.
I'll take the 8-ball of coc lol
Alright Mr., you’re on. Pink shirts in our profile pic, they’ll say something G-Rated yet shameful, paid for by the loser – pic stays up for 30 days, beginning game-one of 2012. But with the lower bet, I gotta have the lower goal… we win at least one playoff game before SB of 2011.
As for the picks panning out, I get that you’re just being a realist and working with the average. And I can’t really debate the statistical facts and averages of draft picks working out, only that personally, I feel very confident in Tebow and Decker – that we don’t “need” Phonz to work out, and that we’ve got enough competition at interior OLine for it to work either way. I also really like Ayers to be great, not just good (by 2011). McBath seems like he’s ahead of the curve and Quinn remains a giant question mark.
I think if I had to pick an area where my glass is fuller than yours it would be that I don’t think we need 80% of these guys to pan out. Our coach is a MF Rock Star when it comes to free agency, AND we’ve had so many high draft picks between 2009 and 2011 that the rate of 1-3 round misses doesn’t scare me (and that percentage is much lower than the later rounds, btw).
P.S. Should you accept the bet, your T-Shirt will be extra small. Because the only thing better than making a man wear a pink shirt due to a bet, is making a man wearing a skin-tight, too small for your body, pink shirt due to a bet -)
November, gentlemen. We go again to their house and we make it OUR MF house!! We take our Crown from those punks, not from around those punks! We take it in November and we protect it in January. Two wins. That's it. Take it!!!
We are going to need some guys like Ayers to be great. We have very few great players on our team right now (Elvis and Clady) is really all we have since Champ and Dawkins are both on the downside of their greatness. They will be very good, but not elite players in 2010, just like they were in 2009.
Maybe Harris is great, but after that… it’s a big drop off.
Pretty much every SB champ over the last two decades has had several great players on the roster. Never a team over average and good players with a great coach (which McD is far from at this point).
Great players win playoff games and we need some of our recent draft picks to become great. A guy like Ayers getting zero sacks on 1 tackle per game doesn’t qualify.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
Well McG, we got a bet or no?
Champ was still elite in ‘09. I know you’ll argue that, because I think I remember you saying that he’s our most over rated player? Could be wrong.
Out with the old, in with the new. You’re not really accounting for even some of these guys taking a big role. Or free agency getting us a guy like Dawk or Jamal in the future.
P.S. Didn’t Dawk have more tackles than our linebackers? True, he’ll need to eventually be taken out on passing downs, and true, I actually believe it will be this year. Still, if our concern is our 7th ranked defense getting worse, well, I’m pretty ok with that. I’ll take the upside any day.
P.S.S. You’re grabbing a guy like Harris as being our only great player, but not accounting even for your own math.. your own odds of draft picks panning out. We’ve had/will have like a hundred draft picks on the team that we taken in the first three rounds. Some of them have to be good, some great.
November, gentlemen. We go again to their house and we make it OUR MF house!! We take our Crown from those punks, not from around those punks! We take it in November and we protect it in January. Two wins. That's it. Take it!!!
On Champ
He’s a great leader on and off the field, makes plays when it counts, but really he’s not a top 10 corner any more. 3 interceptions, pretty low comparably, 63 is above average for some corners, but he still ranked 11th there among corners, 15 passes defended is middle of the pack, and add in 0 forced fumbles and 0 sacks, you have an above average corner. While I agree he’s still top 15 for his awareness and skill, but he hardly creates the turnovers that we need. Andre Goodman actually had a better season then Bailey did in almost every way.
I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.
Diversification into the Tom B stock turned out to be something of a drag on our portfolio. We could have used those picks on better stocks in the 2010 draft.
Again, making decisions and trades is not brave or a hard thing to do. Making smart moves is what counts and trading away future draft picks on guys you’ve had little time to scout just plain ole dumb (i.e. Bradstater and Phonz).
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
totally agreed - Brandstater was easily a wasted pickup and another poor draft decision by mcdaniels
Hindsight is 20/20.
"The never-ending search for a truth never told."
"God I'm excited for those two to fail miserably." - SBNation writer Andrew Sharp on Josh McDaniels and Tim Tebow.
Quitter's People United Member #18
by Tempestuous Binary on Jun 4, 2010 3:33 PM MDT up reply actions
I'd consider Brandstater and Phonz two entirely different situations
at the time we drafted Tom B, we only had Orton and Simms at QB. Picking up a 3rd developmental QB was a way to hedge their bets.
To me Phonz was different in that, a) we invested a lot in that pick, and b) I’m not sure the drop-off to the next best CB justified the premium we paid.
Assumption..
Maybe they had done enough homework on them for trading up to get them to make sense.. your assuming they didn’t.. and that assumption is helping to form your view.
Not that Brandstater was eminently talented
but the way Simms stunk it up last year, I’m not sad at all that we picked up Tom B. last year as insurance. He seemed competent enough in the preseason against second/third stringers.
It’s not very difficult to nitpick a decision like this knowing what we know now about our QBs for 2010. At the time, it seemed reasonable to have the depth. IMO.
"All we're trying to do is win the *********** game!" -- Josh MF McDaniels tearing into his offensive line after three false starts in the red zone. The tirade turned the tide of the game, and the Broncos dominated from that point on.
by broncosmontana on Jun 4, 2010 3:39 PM MDT up reply actions
We could have used our 6th or 7th round picks in the 2009 draft to take a QB.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
True
He obviously valued Brandy more highly than his 6/7 round options. That or he just wanted to be around a guy named Tom B, which is my pet theory. : )
"All we're trying to do is win the *********** game!" -- Josh MF McDaniels tearing into his offensive line after three false starts in the red zone. The tirade turned the tide of the game, and the Broncos dominated from that point on.
by broncosmontana on Jun 4, 2010 4:17 PM MDT up reply actions
We can also get a developmental guy on the waiver wire after the last cuts...quick every one put on their steel toed boots and start kicking McDaniels....
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
Hindsight is always 20 20.
None of us go out and play for stats. You just do whatever you can to help the team out. -- Eddie Royal
That is why I said this, like the Smith and Quinn trades were dumb back in April 2009.
Of course I also said Prater should be cut and now he is one of the best kickers in the NFL. Sometimes I’m right and sometimes I whiff.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
McGeorge my man
You have no idea how Thomas will work out, and just because you like him doe snot mean much as none of us know these guys all that well. And in case you did not notice all NFL coaches and GM’s miss on draft picks. And you keep saying we could have used that pick, FOR WHAT? You cant keep 100 guys on the roster. Move on and stop finding ways to get upset with McD it will do you alot of good to enjoy the success hopefully. Have a good one McG.
2/3 of the earth is covered by water the other 1/3 is covered by Champ Bailey!
THIS IS BRONCOS COUNTRY!!!
Based on 2009, it looks like McD might have missed on a lot of his only draft picks in his only draft of players that have seen an NFL field.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
So who missed then?
Schuelter (sp?) and Brandstater?
I don’t agree that Brandstater was a wasted pick, he was on our team for a year, he had a role, like many of the 6th round picks every year he didn’t work out.
But that doesn’t mean he was a bad pick, he was a good pick given the information we had on him and given our needs for depth at the position, and please don’t give me that McD didn’t know enough about him crap, he knew plenty otherwise he wouldn’t have been targeted in the way he was. No coach can tell how a player would work out a year down the road, but as is the case in most instances, the higher round guys are more likely to stick, also they get more money to it makes more sense in terms of focusing player development there. TB2 was a developmental prospect when we drafted him, his development didn’t get to where they wanted it too but they also got the opportunity to vastly improve the depth at QB this year, with the Quinn trade and the Tebow pick it mean’t that the talent level increased and TB2 was the odd one out. But McD didn’t know last year that that is how things would go this off season so really it bears little relevance to McD’s decision to pick Tom. McD himself said that Tom didn’t necessarily do anything wrong but that the other too guys where just better and he has to keep the three best guys.
Anyways i just had a bit of a revelation when writing this, there is no point trying to convince you because you see it the way you see it and rarely budge from a position so i’ll save my slightly more positive views for people who appreciate it. :-P
This is a more succinct version of my point.
"I didn’t say he wasn’t a fit," McDaniels said. "It’s that we’ve got three guys that are a better fit than he is."
So he wasn’t a bad pick it’s just that things have happened since then that have made him the odd one out and it isn’t really much of a loss because as a 6th rounder he came pretty cheap.
Be happy that we improved at the position, getting bogged down in “oh but we could have drafted superman” or “why wasn’t Tom Brandstater more Bradyish” is irrelevant and tiresome. We needed him last year we don’t need him now, our roster is better and our team is better in comparison to last year so that is a very good thing.
I really need to learn when to quit.. lol
by HorseStance on Jun 4, 2010 4:34 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
You have no proof he has missed on anyone....still not even into year 2 of the 2009 draft class>
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
I have proof that he missed on Schuelter and Brandstater since neither ever made an impact in an NFL game for the Broncos.
Unfortunately, there will be more next offseason.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
Late round picks have a tendency of doing that
Plus, the log-jam at QB was unforeseeable, someone had to go. If we didn’t get Quinn for pennies, I doubt even you would think that Brandstater would have already been moved.
November, gentlemen. We go again to their house and we make it OUR MF house!! We take our Crown from those punks, not from around those punks! We take it in November and we protect it in January. Two wins. That's it. Take it!!!
I think Woody said it best months ago when he said Brandstater sucked so bad on the practice field during 2009, that he had no shot of making the 2010 team.
But I think we will be talking about 2009 draft picks like Quinn and Smith and maybe ever Ayers not panning out next offseason. That will take care of the late round only talk.
Ayers may have the physical makeup of an NFL player, but I’m not sure he has the mind to be a good NFL defender.
I have very little hope for Smith and Quinn is a backup NFL TE on a good day.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
It's good to have hope..
I wouldn’t like to live in your bleak world McG..
“Oh crap my computer has a virus.. may as well throw the whole thing away!”
“Dang, I didn’t quite do enough work yesterday, guess i should quit.”
“Man, that puppy i brought last week only went and weed on my carpet.. stupid little thing.. i’m going to have him put down.”
Firstly neither Quinn, Smith or Ayers where expected to be all pros in their rookie year.
Second, they where all playing behind quality players and learning the skills of their trade so that they can become good players.
Third, you seem to thing that if a rookie doesn’t play well in their first year they are going to fail down the line? Wrong, i guess Darrelle Revis and Nnamdi Asomogha are busts then, and i’m sure their are hundreds of other examples.
Dude, you take a glass that is half full/empty and throw all the water out until your glass is dry as a bone.
Lighten up, sheesh.
And here I was thinking that it was a wasted 6th round pick in 2009. Actually, I think it was a wasted second round pick in 2005, because we shipped Scheffler out to get back into the 5th round in 2010. We could have used that 2005 pick to draft Tarvarias Jackson, who Minnesota got a couple picks later. Then we wouldn’t have needed to draft a 3rd string caliber QB in 2009. But wait, Shanny was in charge back in 2005. So does that mean that Shannahan really wasted a 2nd round pick on Brandstater? I’m starting to get confused.
by asdqqq on Jun 4, 2010 1:45 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
The 2009 pick we traded away to take Bradstater was a 2010 5th round pick. It’s not that complicated, unless one is a moron.
I'm rooting for Team USA at the World Cup!
It was a joke
Sorry, I guess I should have put a little smiley at the end to make it clear for those who have a hard time detecting things like that :) But seriously, you could just as easily look at it as giving up Sheffler to get (and then cut) Brandstater.
The bigger overall point, as we’ve previously debated, is that I find it far more useful when evaluating a GM to separate the trades involving draft picks from the players taken with the draft picks. McD traded a future higher draft pick to acquire a present lower one. You disagreed then and now. I’m fine with that strategy then and now, particulatly with later round draft picks where there isn’t really much differentiation in perfromance based on draft round. (see the end of this article). You’ve got a better point with the Smith trade. I don’t know what your objection is to the Quinn trade because that just involved trading one pick down to get another pick moved up.
As to drafting players, we can now conclude McD has failed on all of his low round draft picks that can be evaluated so far, as he’s cut his 6th and 7th rounders from last year. If the pattern continues forever, that will be a legitimate complaint, though the stats show that hardly any of those really pan out, so I don’t consider it that big a deal. The jury is still out on his earlier round selections.
So, in conclusion, I’d say we made a whatever trade in 2009 and we wasted a draft 2009 6th round draft pick and neither thing seems like its worhty of much concern and leave it at that.
Notice how McGeorge...
…didn’t/couldn’t/wouldn’t come right back here and, #1, admit or address that asdqqq was joking and, #2, apologize to asdqqq [and everyone here at MHR] for calling him (or her?) a moron? Of course, it is said that it takes a big man to admit when he is wrong.
Makes perfect sense to me
other than it was 2006, not 2005…
Why would Shanny even think about picking TB in his first draft while not with the team ;-)
"It's all over Fat Man" - Tom Jackson to John Madden 1977 AFC Championship Game
RIP Barrel Man - 12/5/09
by DesertBroncoFan on Jun 4, 2010 2:43 PM MDT up reply actions
lmao
Love the logic even if i can’t follow or completely get behind it. ^^
"All we're trying to do is win the *********** game!" -- Josh MF McDaniels tearing into his offensive line after three false starts in the red zone. The tirade turned the tide of the game, and the Broncos dominated from that point on.
by broncosmontana on Jun 4, 2010 3:43 PM MDT up reply actions
How is the pick wasted again?
He served his role on the team last year in doing the opposing team duties.
There were no guarantees that Brady Quinn could have been signed this year or Tim Tebow drafted for the other two spots and he was in the mix last year with Simms. You can’t predict the future and 6th round picks are exactly for those kind of chances. We got more use out of him than with most late round picks that never made the roster and Tim Tebow obviously has more potential as a developmental quarterback of the future.
Good thing you got your Masters Tom.
I like the guy but doubt he will be more than a 3rd string QB anywhere in the league. I think a backup is possible but I doubt it considering his age and now he will need another couple of years to learn a new system. Yes he showed glimpses in preseason but now he frees up a roster spot for more talented players at other positions unless we sign him to the practice squad which I wouldn’t be opposed to. Good luck Tom
Good thing you got your Masters Tom.
I like the guy but doubt he will be more than a 3rd string QB anywhere in the league. I think a backup is possible but I doubt it considering his age and now he will need another couple of years to learn a new system. Yes he showed glimpses in preseason but now he frees up a roster spot for more talented players at other positions unless we sign him to the practice squad which I wouldn’t be opposed to. Good luck Tom
Deja Vu
If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!
by Trinidad Jack on Jun 4, 2010 1:45 PM MDT up reply actions
Deja Vu
If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!
by Trinidad Jack on Jun 4, 2010 1:45 PM MDT up reply actions
Just kidding around.
If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!
by Trinidad Jack on Jun 4, 2010 1:45 PM MDT up reply actions
lol.
I was tempted to do that myself.
If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!
by Trinidad Jack on Jun 4, 2010 3:48 PM MDT up reply actions
lol.
I was tempted to do that myself.
Nice avatar.
If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!
by Trinidad Jack on Jun 4, 2010 3:50 PM MDT up reply actions
And here
People actually thought he would be a future starter for Denver.
You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?
You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen
Speaks for the amount of depth at the position, frankly.
"The never-ending search for a truth never told."
"God I'm excited for those two to fail miserably." - SBNation writer Andrew Sharp on Josh McDaniels and Tim Tebow.
Quitter's People United Member #18
by Tempestuous Binary on Jun 4, 2010 3:56 PM MDT up reply actions
Too Much Time On My Hands
I did some number crunching on the 22 QB’s taken in the 6th round between 1998-2007:
2 Never made it out of training camp.
9 Never made it to their second season.
Only six have played more than 16 games.
Half (11) washed out without playing more than 1 game in their career.
Only 4 players have/had a higher lifetime QB rating than Kyle Orton (2 or more games).
Those four were Hasselbeck, Bulger, Sorgi, Brady.
by Alan_Smithee on Jun 4, 2010 2:40 PM MDT reply actions 2 recs
Thx..
People are freaking out about a 5-6th round pick?? Seriously?
He was a long shot when drafted, now we have two better guys on the roster, if we didn’t get both of them this off season he may still have been here.
The reality is that we got better at the QB position this off season and that is the positive that people should be focusing on rather than looking back and wishing they could have got the 5th round pick back for him. We needed him last year, he did his job, now we have 2 guys who are better at his job so he gets cut!
McG you sir are a drama queen.
by HorseStance on Jun 4, 2010 3:10 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
Mmmm....am I right to assume that it was, and still is, a 6th round pick. Really? People are blowing up about this. It would seem to me this is just some more kindling people want to use to go after McDaniels more than being sad TB is not here anymore!
Those that cant coach, compete!
Failing to plan is planning to fail.
All I want is 53 Rod Smiths. Is that asking too much????
"Peyton Hillis didn’t rip the sleeves off his jersey, they flew off out of fear."
Calijoefornia.
+1
I mean seriously. Just another reason to hijack the thread and cast stones in McDaniels’ direction.
by AllBroncsallday on Jun 5, 2010 10:28 AM MDT up reply actions
Opps, I just pretty much copied you before reading this
So yeah, I agree that TB would still be here if not for the log-jam.
November, gentlemen. We go again to their house and we make it OUR MF house!! We take our Crown from those punks, not from around those punks! We take it in November and we protect it in January. Two wins. That's it. Take it!!!
The odds were really against him.
"The never-ending search for a truth never told."
"God I'm excited for those two to fail miserably." - SBNation writer Andrew Sharp on Josh McDaniels and Tim Tebow.
Quitter's People United Member #18
by Tempestuous Binary on Jun 4, 2010 3:57 PM MDT up reply actions
Best of luck, Tom.
"The never-ending search for a truth never told."
"God I'm excited for those two to fail miserably." - SBNation writer Andrew Sharp on Josh McDaniels and Tim Tebow.
Quitter's People United Member #18
by Tempestuous Binary on Jun 4, 2010 2:44 PM MDT reply actions
I wish him the best
But I’m not disappointed by this move. I hope he catches on with somebody and we see him starting sometime down the road.
"Mr. President, call in the National Guard! Send as many men as you can spare! Because we are killing the Patriots! They need emergency help!" - Shannon Sharpe
I can't say I am surprised.
I guess we all saw this coming and I wish Tom Brady….no Tom Brandstater all the best. I was very pleased with how he played in the last preseason game last year. He will definately help someone out. Denver and McDaniels show how much class they have and give him plenty of time to find a new team.
Floyd Little: HOF Class of 2010.
2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant
Wow, didn't see that coming
Maybe:
1. New England will pick him up and he really will become the next Tom Brady
2. This will end the speculation about trading Orton, or Quinn (but it won’t).
Thiswillshould end the speculation about trading Orton, or Quinn
Fixed.
"It's all over Fat Man" - Tom Jackson to John Madden 1977 AFC Championship Game
RIP Barrel Man - 12/5/09
by DesertBroncoFan on Jun 4, 2010 4:26 PM MDT up reply actions
And then there were three..
I’ve often said that having four QB’s early in OTA’s wasn’t a problem (while we had 80+ guys), but that it would soon become one – that it would be unfair and an impedement to the learning process of our other QB’s.
It’s too bad to see Brandstater go, but as I said in a comment last week, “I used to get the impression that McDaniels was very high on Brandstater. I don’t necessarily get the opposite feeling these days, but I get more of the impression that he likes TB’s work ethic, but that’s it. Just my read on it.”
Some days, I was hoping Orton would be traded (because it would mean that somebody better has shown themselves), and some days I was hoping Brandstater would be moved. In the end, I’m just glad to see an unlogging-of-the-jam. So good luck to TB, but good luck moreso to our final-three. Here’s hoping they make the best of their additional reps.
November, gentlemen. We go again to their house and we make it OUR MF house!! We take our Crown from those punks, not from around those punks! We take it in November and we protect it in January. Two wins. That's it. Take it!!!
Not surprised at all.....I wish him luck.
Nobody could have foreseen the acquistion of Quinn (on the cheap) and Tebow in the offseason. I believe this speaks well of TT’s ability to pick up the playbook and at least be prepared as a 3rd QB….
Future 2010 MHR Fantasy Football Champion! ;)
"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."
John Adams
I thought he was a keeper, but now I'm not upset
First, I thought 4 QBs are one too many. But I thought Tom B was a keeper. Here’s why. Today we have 3 QBs, who all want to start (KO/BQ now, Tebow in the future). KO/BQ could be backups only with a chance to compete for a starter job, IMHO. In 2-3 years at most, Tebow would be in the same position: want to have a shot at starting. None of them would want to be #3 QB (except Tebow for now). So we will have 3 players for 2 positions (#1/#2 QB) and no #3. This means one of them will be gone and we will need a #3. My thinking was that we could keep Tom B for that role and deal one of the top 3 guys.
Now I see the flaw in my logic: this situation is not happening until Tebow is ready. And so I suspect that he will sit for a while as #3 QB – and only then we will release one of the 3 QBs on the roster today AND draft a project to be our #3.
Oh, and I’m not upset that we released our 6 round pick. I honestly do not understand all the hand wringing. It is not like we released Phonz after 1 year.
Wow. There sure is some serious hand-wringing and thread-jacking going on over cutting a 6th round pick.
Good luck to Brandstater, but this is hardly the drama that some have made it into.
by AllBroncsallday on Jun 5, 2010 10:27 AM MDT reply actions
The coach gets a good reputation here by taking care of players.
Just like helping some of the high profile players get traded to where they wanted to go to their boyhood teams, this helps the coach and the Broncos team organization get a reputation to helping out former players.
He did not have to do this now, and obviously the team gets a benefit with more reps for the remaining QBs, but by releasing him now where he has a better chance to land with a better team and a better situation he earns respect with current and potential new players.
If you act like an adult professional you get treated like an adult professional.
This probably increases Orton's standing a lot and makes the QB situation much clearer
With Tom B gone here, that pretty much stabilizes the QB situation for the year.
No chance now that Orton will be traded and with a year on Brady in the system it makes it likely that all three QBs will be involved this year.
Orton will be the starter until he gets injured or fails completely, with Brady as the injury backup as a week by week starter if Orton cannot start, and Tebow will be able to play situationally and will be given time to develop and get up to NFL speed by running the opposing team offense and 3rd QB duties during the week.
If I understand it, that probably means on a week to week basis that Brady Quinn can be the emergency quarterback, if Orton falls to injury and Tebow can be the 2nd QB on the day so he can play situationally besides the 4Q.
The release of Tom B also implies that the coaching staff is comfortable in the pace of development of both Quinn and Tebow and is comfortable with Orton as the starter for the year.
We probably gets more out of a reputation gain here than out of a late round pick anyway,
Probably could not get a pick anyway at this time even a 6th or 7th (we probably tried but no one bit) so the team gets some positive value out of the situation by treating him fairly so that players and others can notice how the team treats someone who acts like a professional.
If someone claims him off waivers do the Bronco’s get any compensation?
on waivers...
As obviously noone knows an answer – this is the most comprehensive answer I found – although the dates may have changed over the years:
Q: How does the waiver system work??
A: The following explanation was found in the 2005 NFL Record & Fact Book. As far as I can tell, it is still appropriate. "The waiver system is a procedure by which player contracts or NFL rights to players are made available by a club to other clubs in the league. During the procedure, the 30 other clubs either file claims to obtain the players or waive the opportunity to do so – thus the term “waiver.” Claiming clubs are assigned players on a priority based on the inverse of won-and-lost standing. The claiming period is three business days from the beginning of the League Year through April 30, 10 days from May 1 through the last business day before July 4, and 24 hours after July 4 through the conclusion of the regular season. If a player passes through waivers unclaimed, he becomes a free agent. All waivers are no recall and no withdrawal. Under the CBA, from the beginning of the waiver system each year through the trading dealine (October 19 1999), any veteran who has acquired four years of pension credit is not subject to the waiver system if the club desires to release him. After the trading deadline, such players are subject to the waiver system."
Source: http://www.patscap.com/faq.html
This is the best bit I found on a search on the waiver system, although the dates are a bit off I think. My understanding in this situation the Bronco’s get no sort of compensation if someone picks him off waivers. Its not like a restricted free agent signing sort of compensation situation.
found this also on the waiver system
***Waiver system: The procedure by which a player’s contract or NFL rights are made available by his current team to other teams in the league. During the procedure, the 31 other teams either file a claim to obtain the player or waive the opportunity to do so, thus the term waiver. The claiming period is typically ten days during the off-season, but from early July through December, it lasts only 24 hours. If a player is claimed by two or more teams in this period, priority is based on the inverse won-lost standing of the teams. The team with the worst record has priority. If no team selects the player, he’s free to sign with any team, including his previous employer. If no one signs him, he is unemployed — technically fired from the NFL.
http://www.dawgtalkers.net/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=3076&an=0&page=0
Not sure if this has been brought up - they needed the spot to sign Kyle Eckel and Tom B is a known commodity
Post on the other site makes sense
Why was Brandstater released? It is actually VERY simple: The Broncos signed fullback Kyle Eckel today. The only way they could do that was by releasing someone else. Who to let go? Well, the roster is full of players who will be cut but most of those are yet to show what they can or cannot do. On the other hand, McDainiels already knows exactly where Brandstater is at ability wise. That, coupled with the quarterback position considered to be pretty deep, made that the place to create room. It was not so much the PLAYER as it was the POSITION that determined who was to get the axe. It probably will not happen but it is far from inconceivable that once the roster has been trimmed down, Brandstater may be brought back in. Remeber Mustard?
http://neighbors.denverpost.com/viewtopic.php?p=1458879#p1458879
Well, according to the poll results from...
…(“A Penny for Your Thoughts: Trading Kyle Orton” by kentuckybronco on May 12th last month), Tom Brandstater received the most votes (862) for “which quarterback will be traded or cut before the season opener,” so this was about as close to a foregone conclusion as anything.
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