The Phonz . . . a post-mortem

Squid is a 7th Rounder. Vaughn was Undrafted.

Both are showing some good stuff. The round you’re drafted in means nothing more than the amount of hope people put in you based on your past playing record. And like any stock broker will tell you. Past performance is no gauranty of future performance. Phonz didn’t perform on the big stage. Get over it. The round he was drafted in, and other future “what ifs” we could have had mean nothing. If half the players in a draft pan out, it’s a blessing. Phonz didn’t. We cut bait and now we’re back fishing. We dumped $3M down the Green rat hole for the exact same reason. I’m glad McD is putting the best players on the field, regardless of draft status or money paid. And I’m glad he’s willing to continue to take chances bringing in potential talent.

First they ignore you.
They then laugh at you.
Then they fight you.
Then, you win.
--Gandhi

by Santa Fe Bronc on Sep 4, 2010 7:07 PM MDT reply actions 4 recs

I wonder

If you and everyone else will be so nonchalant about this move if the team wins 3, 4, or 5 games or will you be up in arms over not having that pick back.

Its easy to say who cares when a 6th rounder doest work out. A 2nd rounder is a totally different ball game. Those picks are expected to form the nucleus of your team for the next 5 or 6 years.

You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?

You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen

by johnnystarr on Sep 4, 2010 7:44 PM MDT up reply actions

I've been a Broncos Fan Since Age 12--41 years ago.

This is not really that big a deal to me. I really like the direction the team is headed. I loved the Cutler pick when it was made, but was glad to see him get traded, as it was clear to me after 2 & 1/2 seasons that he was a liability when it came to seeing long drives get completed into touch downs. Though there was a lot of controversy about trading him, no one talked about his #1 pick being wasted. And though we all loved Shanny, no one dared talk about more than a handful of his #1 picks being wasted. They reason why? Because he won Super Bowls, even while wasting picks here and there.

The team will have it’s ups and downs. One high pick hitting or not over the long run is nonchalant to me. I see the team improving every year over the last over. If we do only win 4 games, I’d be heartbroken and would have to rethink my belief in what McD is doing. But that would be a whole systemic change of wanting a new coach and value system at Dove Valley. It wouldn’t be about a wasted draft pick, but rather a wasted 2 years. And then I’d hope the new coach can build a dynasty. And as the new coach started, I wouldn’t begrudge him wasting a few high draft choices along the way either. It’s the nature of the draft.

First they ignore you.
They then laugh at you.
Then they fight you.
Then, you win.
--Gandhi

by Santa Fe Bronc on Sep 4, 2010 9:44 PM MDT up reply actions 8 recs

Rec'd for the wisdom.

So many people (especially young people) just stress themselves out too much over things that really don’t matter.

Great response SFB, it’s a shame your outlook isn’t shared by more people. I too was excited when we drafted Cutler and equally pleased when he was traded. Most people are either far too cautious, or far too bold – not many have a great balance of both. McDaniels seems to have this balance, and I hope he continues to operate like that. You have to take risks to win in this league, but you also have to be smart and know how to cut your losses.

Shanahan took risks, but he held on to those decisions with a deathgrip – and it ultimately did him in. He was bold and an offensive genius, but he wasn’t great in the department of cutting losses. Anyone can see this when they look at the types of players he kept on the roster that he had to defend their stupidity mutliple years in a row when he could have just cut his losses and moved on. I wish Shanahan the best in DC, but he still seems to be lacking that “cut-your-losses” aspect of the job that is so crucial in today’s “win or lose-your-job” league, because Haynesworth is still on the roster. He’s taking his risk with Haynesworth – and maybe Albert will start to like Mike and his staff (doesn’t seem like it now), but more than likely he needs to just go.

Anyways… went off on a tangent there. The point is, you HAVE to take risks, and you have to know when to give up on them when they are bombing. Alphonso could still very well be the next Asante Samuel – but he’s taking longer than we planned to develop, and he just hasn’t worked out in Denver for whatever reason (maturity, passion, the staff, the system, w/e). I’m glad to see McDaniels swing on this guy (I was hoping we’d draft him, and surprised we did after bringing in so many FA’s in the secondary). I’m also glad to see McDaniels recognize when his swing is a miss and put the strike behind him and move on to the next possible homerun.

Like any great Quarterback or Cornerback you’ve got to put big mistakes behind you and keep taking your shots downfield and keep jumping those routes. If you hang on to your mistakes you’re going to fail, and if you don’t keep taking risks you’re never going to get where you need to be.

McDaniels is still a genius in my book, and it’s EXACTELY because of how he handled the Alphonso Smith pick.

"It is better to be rougly right than precisely wrong." - John Maynard Keynes

by Alexander Wall on Sep 5, 2010 5:10 AM MDT up reply actions 4 recs

A genuis?

Drafting Shonne Greene wouldve been the genuis move.

You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?

You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen

by johnnystarr on Sep 5, 2010 6:54 AM MDT up reply actions 1 recs

Easy to say after the season's transpired.

I’m sure the Baltimore Colts would have loved to NOT draft Elway if they knew he wasn’t going to play for them. It’s easy to call someone an idiot or genius AFTER you see the end results – but much harder to do if you’re predicting it. Way to go on your evalutation. Two thumbs up. Lol.

"It is better to be rougly right than precisely wrong." - John Maynard Keynes

by Alexander Wall on Sep 5, 2010 8:07 AM MDT up reply actions 3 recs

you should be a lawyer

IF you believe the crap you spew.

You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?

You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen

by johnnystarr on Sep 5, 2010 2:24 PM MDT up reply actions

Question

IF I steal your car, smash it up but return it back before the end of night will you call me a genius because I had the decency to return it? Or do you hold me accountable?

You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?

You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen

by johnnystarr on Sep 5, 2010 2:45 PM MDT up reply actions

I have a different recollection

Elway made it very clear that he would not play for Baltimore before he was drafted. In fact, Elway made it clear that he would go play baseball instead.

Baltimore drafted him anyway.

"It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..."

by Alan_Smithee on Sep 5, 2010 4:58 PM MDT up reply actions

+ 1

Thank you.

Having a hard time seing how he got 3 REc’s for that comment.

My defense was simple. If you’re passing out the genuis grade for making the WRONG mistake I dont think I need to carry my arguement any further.

You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?

You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen

by johnnystarr on Sep 5, 2010 9:24 PM MDT up reply actions

Thats exactly it

Everyone roasted Shanny because of the failed draft picks and dead money. The front office is doing the same thing. Only MCd gets congratulated for having the guts to admit his mistake. I’m sorry but I just dont see how any Denver fan can turn this around and try and make it positive.

The Smith trade reeked all year of a failed move. When he was twice replaced as a Dime CB everyone reached to explain it away why he wasnt playing well. Only a few members on this site stood out for calling it what it was: a terrible move. Now the same thing is happening. MHR members are reaching to back their coach (and GM) instead of calling him out this move.

Look, regardless of how you or I feel these moves there is no disputing that the perennial solid teams dont miss on top draft picks. 40% of the 2009 draft class is out only a year later and thats not even counting McKinley who I think is hurt. Thats not how you build a team.

You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?

You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen

by johnnystarr on Sep 5, 2010 6:43 AM MDT up reply actions

Its not that they don't miss on high draft picks they just don't trade a first for a second

by Daemon on Sep 5, 2010 7:51 AM MDT up reply actions

Did I miss something??

Who roasted Shanahan? If my memory serves me correctly he actually got LESS criticism overall after he left than McD has gotten since arriving. Some people have opinions as to why Shanahan was relieved of his duties, but there are a LOT more people with opinions on how McDaniels is doing as a coach now, and many are saying his ship has sunk before its hardly left the bay.

Shanahan lost his job, so that criticism was rightly earned. McDaniels – by all accounts from the FO and Pat Bowlen – is doing fine so far. And who ISN’T going to congratulate a guy for admitting his mistakes when doing that very thing is so rare in our culture today. I say MORE people need to give him props for saying that, rather than just expecting it.

Don’t think for a minute that McD won’t rightly earn his criticism and contempt if he makes the team worse and gets fired. If that happens he will and the fans will reem him vehemently, just don’t sound so eager for it to happen already. How about we wait and see if we actually get WORSE before you spout off how McDaniels is or isn’t building a winning team. So far we’ve maintained our 8-8 trend, thats maintaining our average performance which (given the circumstances) is an upgrade to me.

Statistically most coaches’ (not all) teams perform better in their second year. So hold your horses. I’m not asking you to lift McD on your shoulders or shout praises to him, but there’s no need to condemn him before any condemnation is due.

People are so hasty to criticise these days.

"It is better to be rougly right than precisely wrong." - John Maynard Keynes

by Alexander Wall on Sep 5, 2010 8:18 AM MDT up reply actions 1 recs

who roasted shanny???

GO read any post on MHR why the Shanny was fired and why he was fired.

PLease do that and then we’ll talk.

You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?

You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen

by johnnystarr on Sep 5, 2010 9:27 PM MDT up reply actions

opps

I meant to say go read any post on MHR why Shanny was fired. Almost everyone said it was because of dead money and failure to draft.

You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?

You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen

by johnnystarr on Sep 5, 2010 9:45 PM MDT up reply actions

Johnny, Johnny, Johnny...

compare the number (or %) of failed Shanny picks the number (or %) of failed McD picks. Or compare the number (pr %) of players on the team that did not get a job in the NFL to the bottom 30 players on our team now (more subjective). Many other ways to look at it to illustrate that Shanny had much more glaring weakness than McD in assessing player talent overall, though he was somewhat stronger on offense than he was for defense. Come on, man, you’re better than that.
I’m too lazy to do the research, but I would in fact like someone to dispute your last paragraph. I suspect that perennially solid teams do in fact OCCASIONALLY miss with top draft picks, just not often.

by idahobronc on Sep 5, 2010 1:54 PM MDT up reply actions

Agreed

I fully expect 50% of first rounders to not live up to expectations.

A little while back I did an analysis on 1st round quarterbacks. There was at least a 50% failure rate for the group.

"It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..."

by Alan_Smithee on Sep 5, 2010 5:00 PM MDT up reply actions

Heres the thing

Shanny has a larger body of work to nitpick from. I’m not going to argue Shanny’s merits when drafting. We all know Shanny was fired for his failure to draft. But if we’re going to hold MCD up to Shanny’s success rate in the long run is Denver going to be further ahead? I doubt it.

Lets choose another team. Detroit. Schwartz. Sure its easy to say they had the top pick two years ago but Stafford sure looks like the real deal as opposed to Jaramcus or Couch. 2nd pick Delmas had a stellar rookie year and looks like the real deal. Big time play maker

2010. Suh so far is a beast and Best has shown for more explosiveness than Moreno has ever shown.,

My point…. Detroit hit on their picks.. regardless of draft position, while making shrewd moves to get Best. That 1st rounder Denver traded that everyone is so casually discounted… That couldve been used in a trade like Detroit did to secure a Rb that looks like the real deal.

There are no give aways in the draft.. You should be held accountable for every pick. So far Cox and Squid look like decent players( in preseason I might add) so no one cares about the Smith pick. The thing is, that pick coulve been used on Shonne Green (I would argue we wouldnt be worrying about the run game) or Iupati (the Oline would look pretty solid). But because of the position (CB) everyone thinks its a throw away pick.

You probably get this a lot. This isn't the real Caesar's Palace is it?....Did Caesar live here?

You know where I wanna go? I'll tell you where. Someplace warm. A place where the beer flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of Capistrano. I'm talking about a little place called Aspen

by johnnystarr on Sep 5, 2010 9:42 PM MDT up reply actions

What difference does it make what round the guy who worked out was drafted in?

The fact is, he either worked out or he didn’t. If it feels better for you to tell yourself that Cox, Thompson, and Vaughn were all drafted higher, do so. After all, they were late round picks, and like you yourself say, who cares if they hadn’t worked out?

The nucleus of your team is, in theory, supposed to come from high round picks. But that’s not always the case.

by JeffG on Sep 4, 2010 10:53 PM MDT up reply actions

Dude,

come on. We wiffed on a first round pick. That sinks teams. What has Squid or Vaughn done in a regular season game? I’m not just going to pretend like it didn’t happen. It happened and it’s really really bad. Can we overcome it? I think so. But it’s bad.

by GJcontingent-rAd on Sep 4, 2010 9:55 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs

The Saints

Go look at the Saints 1st round picks. They haven’t really nailed them the past decade or so. It seems to me that their team didn’t sink either.

by ten_fiver on Sep 4, 2010 10:42 PM MDT up reply actions

Amen

This discussion should end @ Santa Fe Bronc’s comment!!!!!

by numeraluno on Sep 5, 2010 1:17 PM MDT up reply actions

Hogwash.......

No, I will not pine over the “lost” pick. I did not pine over Lelie, Middlebrooks, or any other “lost” picks, including the ones given up for Moss and Thomas.

Crikey. Grow up already…………

by Gulbrand on Sep 4, 2010 9:38 PM MDT reply actions

Yeah, and how many winning seasons have we had since those misses?

Middlebrooks pick started our march into mediocrity – 2001 to now how many great years have we had? Thanks for proving my point though . . .

by GJcontingent-rAd on Sep 4, 2010 9:57 PM MDT up reply actions

Remember

we fired shanny the gm, not shanny the coach.

by GJcontingent-rAd on Sep 4, 2010 9:57 PM MDT up reply actions

well...

we fired Shanny the coach too. Teams had figured out how to beat his bread and butter of the 90’s, and he was struggling to adjust. Add to that his ‘kitchen cabinet’ of d-coords and you’ve got problems with Shanny the coach, not just the GM.

Quitter's People United Member #396
Because Montana has no professional sports, I gotta support the land of my birth.
Socrates was once executed for 'trolling'.
^Needs explaining: don't call someone asking uncomfortable, slightly antagonistic questions *for the purpose of learning* trolls. It's real easy to differentiate a 'Socratic' post from a trolling one.

by Drizzt396 on Sep 4, 2010 10:21 PM MDT up reply actions

did go to the playoffs in 2003-04-05. Not too mention the AFC title game

Not gonna lose sleep over this missed pick especially when it looks like the Broncos got 2 better players in the secondary this year. #1’s are a crap shoot. Not every #1 can be Elway, Manning, Marino, ect. Its what they can do with the later rounds and the over all scouting. Look one of the greatest players for Denver was a 6th. Sure #1’s are vital but not the end all. 1986 Denver didnt draft until the 4th round and still went to Pasadena.

- Dan Noreen.

by broncfanstuckinsd on Sep 5, 2010 12:52 AM MDT up reply actions

This is my take on any draft pick...

It’s a crap shoot and the people that were unhappy with the pick have something to grip about, that is it! If Phonse would have been a great player addition then it would have been different. Get a life Phonse haters, he probably will be a good player eventually, Syd and Cox kinda of made the selection difficult, didn’t they?

by bfree2bronc on Sep 4, 2010 9:53 PM MDT reply actions

Still looks to me like he's going to play in the NFL for a while

Thats a good draft pick by one definition.

No one could expect we would get two steals in this years draft at CB.

by Kosty on Sep 5, 2010 8:27 AM MDT up reply actions

Personally,

I have a bigger problem with cutting Stokely. You’re getting rid of one of (if not the) best slot players of the decade while still trying to turn your third-year rookie star into a slot machine?

Quitter's People United Member #396
Because Montana has no professional sports, I gotta support the land of my birth.
Socrates was once executed for 'trolling'.
^Needs explaining: don't call someone asking uncomfortable, slightly antagonistic questions *for the purpose of learning* trolls. It's real easy to differentiate a 'Socratic' post from a trolling one.

by Drizzt396 on Sep 4, 2010 10:23 PM MDT reply actions

That would probably be one of the toughest decisions that McDX has made thus far...Cutting Stokley.

The guy is a team player all the way and stopped Marshall from getting tagged several times. I hope they keep him in some capacity as a coach/mentor…I love Stokley’s style.

by bfree2bronc on Sep 5, 2010 10:17 AM MDT up reply actions 1 recs

stokely

Stokely went to ir He wasnt cut He is injured and not playing anyway. We will see what happens with him next year

by turnertwo2003 on Sep 4, 2010 11:30 PM MDT reply actions

Smith not working out doesn't really bother me.

I feel that this is a league that is more about the present than the past. I did want Smith to work out but it is what it is and tomorrow is a new day. Sure it would have been nice to have had our #14 pick this recent draft. However, it also would have been nice if our Defense had stopped McNabb from getting a 1st down on that 4th and long last season or stopping Jamarcus Russell from driving on us in the late 4th quarter. There are a lot of different things that we all wish we could have back in history, but since it is already written in the books…. Why continue to dwell on something that cannot be changed when all we can really do is learn from it and move on?

"If we cannot find a way, we will make one." -Hannibal

by AvalancheRescueDog on Sep 4, 2010 11:38 PM MDT reply actions 1 recs

I heard it was a 6th

for Phonz w/ Dan Gronkowski

"I don't need love, I just need wins.'' - Kyle Orton, 2010

by gahoagie on Sep 4, 2010 11:45 PM MDT reply actions

If, with that 6th round pick...

We find another late round gem (ala Squid) then this is a win… If we don’t then lesson learned on that trading a future 1st rounder for a 2nd round pick. I don’t feel this whif is team tanking or anything, it just shows the strength of the draft we had this year and the quality people we have on the roster.

"I don't need love, I just need wins.'' - Kyle Orton, 2010

by gahoagie on Sep 4, 2010 11:48 PM MDT up reply actions

Relax...

I had this college professor, now passed on, that did very well in the stock market. One day in class he explained his success. He said that when he picked stocks he was wrong 50 percent of the time. The trick was, when he was wrong he cut his losses and quickly sold his stock, when he was ‘right’ he hung onto it.

Another example…

Many, many years ago was I was on a road trip as a consultant. I met a branch manager in Detroit whose sales numbers were far exceeding others in the region. I asked him how he explained his success and he answered that when he hired people he was afraid to quickly cut bait and let them go if they didn’t work out. If they worked out, he felt it was his job to do everything in his power to make them successful.

Drafts are a crap shoot, always have been. We will have good drafts and bad drafts. It’s apparent that under this coach the best players will be kept…period. Even if there was a large cost involved with those he’s letting got. I really like that about him.

As for Alphonso Smith…he could have been a starter on this team a few years ago. However, with the success of other three new players he was expendable. Parrish Cox, Syd’Quan Thompson, and Cassius Vaugn all showed reasons why the should be kept. If we’d done a poorer job of selecting talent this season Smith would have stayed.

A final point…

A lot of draft picks fail. Last year was tough for the new coach and GM. They only had a couple of months to prepare for the draft and during those months were also busy setting up the organization (staffing, playbooks, etc.). This past year the had their own scouts that they trained in their own specific way. They spent the year leading up to the draft working on who to pick. As a result, the Broncos appear to have one of their most successful drafts ever (time will tell). It’s doubtful that every year’s drafting will be as good as this year, but the signs look good.

Life is short, don’t fret over one player.

"It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..."

by Alan_Smithee on Sep 5, 2010 6:36 AM MDT reply actions 5 recs

The Denver Broncos 2010 Draft Class:

Demaryius Thomas – Looks like he’ll be good once he gets healthy.

Tim Tebow – He’s looking good, could be great.

Zane Beadles – Looking good and may start.

J.D. Walton – Will start and appears to have Pro-Bowl potential

Eric Decker – Looks good.

Parrish Cox – Looks good.

Eric Olsen – Jury is out, but made team

Syd’Quan Thompson – Looks good

Jammie Kirlew – Practice squad at best (at this point)

Undrafted Cassius Vaughn – shows potential, made team

"It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..."

by Alan_Smithee on Sep 5, 2010 7:38 AM MDT up reply actions 1 recs

more on the framing (The "CB Project")

It’s rare to see a draft crop that contains a 5th, 7th and UDFA ‘hit’ at CB. Smith’s pre-season statistics didn’t show a failure but he was in amongst a very promising crop of CBs. I won’t attempt to belittle Smith’s errors, which were mystifying, but we can speculate if the staff would have given him more time (like Moss) in a less competitive situation.

CB is one of the toughest positions to transition to from college, so we appear to have been successful — although it’s still quite early — in an area where many teams have tried but few have succeeded. Every team wants to develop a shut-down corner but there’s only a handful in the entire league. And there’s an impressive amount of CB talent that’s been collected league-wide, which is a testimony to the desire to meet the need. Still, despite the impressive accumulation of talent, most teams lack a shut-down CB.

We’ve been down this road before. Darrent Williams, Foxworth and Paymah were earlier attempts to find the CB of the future. We can’t fault Williams but neither Foxworth nor Paymah provided the answer, despite being relatively high picks. Moreover, they were not alone. An even more recent example is Jack Wiliams. Another example is Jeremy LeSueur, and if you had forgotten him then there’s a good reason why. The 2000 and 2001 drafts contained consecutive 1st round CB picks — O’Neal and Middlebrooks — and neither came close to becoming a shut-down CB. And I’m not setting the bar too high, since a solid CB would have been acceptable, too.

I’ve written about what I termed the “CB project” before, and it might have helped if I had written about it before the last draft, considering its relevance. I’m a little lazy right now so let me leave a few comments from Matt McGuire from his Drattology:

http://www.walterfootball.com/nfldraftology234.php

http://www.walterfootball.com/nfldraftology234tier2.php

Cornerback positional analysis: Darrelle Revis. Nnamdi Asomugha. Deion Sanders. Champ Bailey. Ronnie Lott. Darrell Green. I could just stop the positional analysis right here, but I won’t.

An elite cornerback simply takes half the field away. Once an elite corner can shut down the opponent’s best receiver, you take away more than just one player on offense – you take away quarterback’s best option to throw the football. Without Revis, there is simply no way the Jets make the playoffs and go to the AFC Championship game last season.

Corners play a vital role in run support not necessarily in terms of stopping teams to 2- and 3-yard gains, but by taking away the explosive chunks of yardage against the run whether it is shedding block or making an open-field tackle.

If you can find an elite corner, then quarterbacks simply stop throwing the ball at what usually is his best receiver, and this forces the offense to execute a passing game in a limited range of space as opposed of using the field sideline-to-sideline.

Scarcity – 3: It is really difficult to find No. 1 corners in the NFL Draft, and that’s why the Browns selected Joe Haden at No. 7 overall this year. Corners are rarely drafted in the top 10 not because it isn’t a valuable position teams value, but because it is very rare in which we see a corner with the skill set that evaluators feel is a definite No. 1 at the next level.

Effectiveness – 3: An elite corner infinitely improves his team’s pass defense, and because of this, it limits the opposing offense’s ability to put up points. Quarterbacks hate playing teams with great corners. It’s just that simple.

Money – 1: Elite corners get paid a lot of money. Darrell Revis is looking for a massive contract extension this offseason. Nnamdi Asomugha got $15 million per year when his contract was signed in 2009. In 2004, Champ Bailey signed a deal worth on average $9 million per year. I am going to start calling “show me the money” positions a “Rod Tidwell” position. It just sounds cooler. Unfortunately, this is the last Level 1 in the money category in the Pyramid so I can’t use it any more. Damn.

Durability – 3: We get some really talented corners like Charles Woodson and Darrell Green who have long careers, but because this position requires so much speed and explosion, corners can’t maintain that speed into their mid to late 30s in all practicality. However, on the other hand, corners stay very healthy because they don’t make a lot of contact on the field and their bodies don’t get banged up like safeties.

Summary: In a Draftology I wrote two years ago, which I recently revised, I wrote corners would get more and more valuable in the league because of the rarity of the position and the league has to evolve – corners seemed like a logical position to go with on the basis of a higher potential value. Darrell Revis is as well publicized as the top receivers in the NFL, and he deserves every bit of it. An elite corner can take away half the field and can make an average defense great.

In MM’s scaling of 1 – 3, the highest score, a 3, is the best. Therefore, high quality CBs are both rare and effective, which is why so many teams are in the ongoing hunt for a shutdown CB, which I’ve dubbed this the CB Project. And CBs aren’t cheap, thus MM gives them a 1 (the worst score). With the increased emphasis on passing in today’s game, CB has become one of the most important positions in today’s game. MM ranks CB as a tier 2 position (of 6 tiers), just below QBs and alongside LTs and rush LBs/R-DEs. This combination of high positional impact and scarce supply is the reason teams are continually looking for #1 CBs.

"the megalomaniac view of oneself as the Elect, wholly good, abominably persecuted, yet assured of ultimate triumph; the attribution of gigantic and demonic powers to the adversary; the refusal to accept the ineluctable limitations and imperfections of human existence, such as transience, dissention, conflict, fallibility whether intellectual or moral; the obsession with inerrable prophecies…systematized misinterpretations, always gross and often grotesque." – Norman Cohn - quoted in The Paranoid Style in American Politics

by Colinski on Sep 5, 2010 12:27 PM MDT up reply actions 2 recs

Smith did not fail as much as his development took longer than some expected and we upgraded with better players

Drafts are always on potential and are gambles in any way. But the same guy who pulled the trigger on selecting Smith also pulled the trigger on Cox and Squid, probably using the same decision process with more information available.

It just seems the fixation is only trading away the 1st round pick to get him in the second round. But I think McD was hoping that Smith could be a good kick or punt returner as that was a real need last year. That just did not work out,

by Kosty on Sep 5, 2010 8:34 AM MDT up reply actions

It is not what we lost, it is what we have that counts

Media and fan reports alike seem to come to the consensus that Denver has one of the deepest seconaries in the entire leauge. Phonze was one step in that direction. He was not pushed off the roster by lack of talent, rather it was an over abundance of tallent that gave him his walking papers. It might be fair to say that McD bombed on one high profile high round pick – yet those calling for his head should pause and give him credit for three steals that made the Phonze expendiable – Cox, Squid, and Vaughn. Judging any coach or player by one mistake is a mistake – a QB that throws a pick 6 in a game with 4 TD passes is considered to have had a very good game.

by Flunkie on Sep 5, 2010 9:17 AM MDT reply actions

McD doesn't have time to mess around

Because of his 4 year contract, he needs to win now, which is the force behind his aggressive moves. He may or may not be as much of a risk taker as he appears. But because he’ll already be half-way through his contract at the end of this season, he has to take risks in the draft (which we know can be a crap-shoot) and FA.

If you look at all of the good moves vs the mistakes he’s made so far, the good moves outweigh the bad. He’s jettisoned Kenny Peterson, Marquan Manuel, Andre Hall, Selvin Young, Ryan Torrain, Nate Webster, Dre Bly, Niko Koutivedes, Jaime Winborn, Dewayne Robertson, etc. The list goes on. Most if not all of these guys can’t even find a job in the league any more. Those that do, are TC fodder and are cut, (see Torrain and Bly) while the rest are seeing action in the UFL (see Peterson.)

The exceptions are players like Andra Davis, Ben Hamilton, and Casey Wiegmann, whose positions have all been upgraded in the off-season. Mario Haggan, Zane Beadles, and JD Walton appear to all be upgrades (in the long-run) over their predecessors. You also have to include Peyton Hillis, Tony Scheffler, Brandon Marshall, and Jay Cutler in this conversation. Since the impressions these players made on me were that they were less likely to get with the new program, I think it was best to replace them with guys who will buy in and execute the new schemes. It’s impossible to win in this league if some of the best players on the team are not committed to the new regime and play for themselves. (Hillis is the one exception.)

The guys that he’s kept have performed well, if not better than expected. I was convinced Marcus Thomas was going to be let go, but he’s proving himslef to be a valuable part of the D-line. Jarvis Moss? Who could’ve predicted that he’d have such a great TC this year?

And let’s not forget how McX have rewarded the best RFA players recently with contract extensions. None of us disagreed with compensating Chris Kuper, Elvis Dumervil, and Kyle Orton.

His mistakes are trading a future 1st to get a 2009 2nd and get Zo. He wasn’t progressing as expected, but who could’ve expected that both Squid and Cox will come on the way they did this preseason? He made a mistake on what appeared to be a proven commodity in Jarvis Green, but we have to assume the coaching staff saw something that they did not like. Whether it was lack of effort, loss of stamina or speed, he was not going to help the team as originally expected. And I doubt that Wink and Nunnely were not a part of the conversation before this move was finalized.

We should give credit to McX for admitting mistakes and cutting their losses. After all, it would be worse if they pulled an Al Davis and stubbornly remained married to a bad investment, at the team’s detriment. The best players stay to play and the ones who aren’t up to par are released – it’s not a hard concept.

We should also give them credit for being able to bring in depth at positions we all thought were a weakness last year: ILB and OLB. O-line and D-line were in the conversation as well, but were addressed in the draft and FA. The linebackers have me excited. Mays and Woodyard will do well on ST in addition to backing up Haggan and Williams. Despite Doom’s season-ending injury, who would’ve thought McX would bring in a guy like Jason Hunter? He’ll either be in rotation with Moss or take the job away completely. And how about Robert Ayers? What a difference a year makes.

Dead money hurts, but if we remember, Bowlen made his share of mistakes, giving a lifetime “gurantee” to Shanahan, so he knows he’s not perfect either. This year, he still had to pay $3.5M to a coach that was fired 2 years ago. To take McX to the woodshed now would make Bowlen look like a hypocrite, so I think he’ll continue to show patience with this young duo.

Under the circumstances, if we put things into proper perspective, the Broncos are an improved team from 2 years ago. Go Broncos!

"All credibility, all good conscience, all evidence of truth come only from the senses." Friedrich Nietzsche

by Horsepower on Sep 5, 2010 9:36 AM MDT reply actions 3 recs

The one thing that I dont understand is why people say that we missed out on so and so by losing the 14 pick

People suggest that we could have selected Earl Thomas or say trade up to select McClain. If these type of guys were so key wouldnt McD have drafted Thomas instead of trading back as he did or wouldnt he have traded up for McClain with the picks that he had.
I am not saying that the trade for a 1st round pick wasnt a mistake but I am not sure equating the trade to different players in this way gives a true reflection on what would have happened.

"The Holy Writ of Gloucester Rugby Club demands: first, that the forwards shall win the ball; second, that the forwards shall keep the ball; and third, the backs shall buy the beer." - Doug Ibbotson

by SteveUK on Sep 5, 2010 1:47 PM MDT reply actions