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Broncos Fans Get What They Want; Let The Growing Pains Begin!

DENVER, CO - OCTOBER 09:  Quarterback Tim Tebow #15 of the Denver Broncos runs into guard Zane Beadles #68 of the Denver Broncos and is tackled by defensive end Corey Liuget #94 of the San Diego Chargers at Sports Authority Field at Mile High on October 9, 2011 in Denver, Colorado. The Chargers defeated the Broncos 29-24.  (Photo by Doug Pensinger/Getty Images)

It happened much sooner than I ever thought would be possible considering how training camp and preseason went down, but Tim Tebow is now the starter for the Denver Broncos. It's no secret that I felt Tebow should have been the starter this year, until training camp that is. As good as Kyle Orton looked and how bad Tebow was, it just appeared obvious to me who gave us the best chance to win.

I never thought Orton would succumb to the pressure of Tebow sitting on the bench as badly as he did. Kyle Orton is a better quarterback than what we have witnessed over the past several weeks, however, he is no longer able to hold off the rising tide of The Tebow. A Foxism seems appropriate here, "It is what it is."

The thing that kills me is the expectation levels here. There is a group of people who are just chomping at the bit to hammer Tebow for every mistake he is about to make, while another group is anxious to proclaim him King of the World for being our football savior. Let's get real okay?

Star-divide

The fact about this team is that its not very good. Yet. The running game is hit or miss at times, as is the defense. This organization is still at least a draft or two away from emerging from the last four disastrous years. We just made a change at quarterback to a guy who is realistically 2-4 years from figuring the NFL out. I think he'll succeed, but its going to take time and my biggest fear is that the Broncos will end up Steve Young's Tampa Bay Buccaneers, with Tebow ending up taking the reins from Peyton Manning or Tom Brady a few years from now. 

With the way things are going, this is a distinct possibility. I am happy Tebow is playing, because one more game of playing for what was instead of what is would have been too much for me. I just hope it works out long term, because the next 11 weeks are going to be rough for Tebow and the Broncos.

You might disagree, but Tim Tebow isn't ready yet. He will have breath-taking ups and frustrating downs - it will be exciting for sure. Why? Because Tebow is a "gamer". I like "gamers", but he isn't going to be an elite quarterback until he learns how to be consistent in his throws, his reads, and his footwork. 

So that leads us back to the two groups of people, the attackers and the defenders. Get over yourselves. Try being objective about this situation. Tebow is a 3 game starter and Tebow is a 3 game starter. He isn't going to be Tom Brady and he isn't going to be Tom Brady. See how I did that? Both sides are digging in already, I could see it in the last couple of posts on MHR. It is okay for Tebow to make mistakes, he is supposed to. Why? Because he isn't ready. But that doesn't matter anymore, he is the best option we now have.

What we need to look for is improvement over the next 11 games. I'm not talking about the late game improvisation that we already know he can do. I am talking about the other 3 quarters of the football game. He needs to score points in the first quarter, in the second and in the third. If he can put up 14 points in the 4th quarter, then he needs to do it in other quarters too.

I have decided to be cautiously optimistic. No overreactions, no proclamations, no stats, just patience and fortitude. By Week 11, we should all know in our hearts if Tebow is improving and getting better. So if he makes a mistake, criticize. If he makes a great play, congratulate. However, let's save the noose and pitchforks for the 2012 offseason, because if Tebow doesn't play the team out of position of the quarterbacks in the 2012 draft, then he will not have secured himself a starting job. The ball is in his hands now, so its time to find out just how much of a "gamer" he is.

The Tebow has been Unleashed. 

GO BRONCOS!

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Thanks for being the voice of reason Tim!

Steady progression by the QB, coaches and team are what we should hope for!

No matter who starts at QB, we will be 8-8 or better (8-2-11) Official projection 10-6 (9-6-11)

"The team played harder when Tim came in....they should play him"
Tony Dungy

by Broncotodd on Oct 11, 2011 8:40 AM MDT reply actions  

Well said.

We can only look for improvement. Not linear improvement, mind you. He’s going to have a good game, then he’s going to have a bad game. All QBs do. That won’t mean that he’s failed at that point. But we would like to see him get more comfortable in the pocket, make reads, and learn how to properly bootleg so his linemen don’t get called for holding. Etc.

I’m excited. I hope we’ll see some exciting games. But I don’t expect much from Tebow. If he’s any better at the end of the year, I’ll be stoked.

by Orange Rush on Oct 11, 2011 8:42 AM MDT reply actions  

Oh.....and congrats on the new job Tim Tebow!

TY Kyle for giving it all you had. I wish nothing but the best for you in the future!

No matter who starts at QB, we will be 8-8 or better (8-2-11) Official projection 10-6 (9-6-11)

"The team played harder when Tim came in....they should play him"
Tony Dungy

by Broncotodd on Oct 11, 2011 8:43 AM MDT reply actions   1 recs

Ditto on all three

Well said Tim Lynch
Congrats Tim Tebow
Good Luck Kyle Orton
(two out of three named Tim not too bad)

If I can't have high expectations that succeed, I''d rather have high expectations and be disappointed than have low expectations and be resigned to losing.

by OrangeandBluesBros on Oct 11, 2011 9:11 AM MDT up reply actions  

I watched Kyle on Sunday and I have to admit I really felt bad for him.

Whereas we are Bronco fans first and foremost, this is the professional Kyle has and he has failed at a golden opportunity to land a bigger contract. I know he is going to earn $9M this year and that is fantasy money to most of us but inside I know he feels horrible.

I would hope you would support who we are. Not, who we are not. Coach Norman Dale "Hoosiers"

by dmitchell624 on Oct 11, 2011 9:59 AM MDT up reply actions  

I feel bad for him too...

But when your losing and a 1st round fan favorite QB is on the bench. You F$%^ed.

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 10:28 AM MDT up reply actions  

Yeah, at least he has that consolation prize...

his next contract will be less than half that….maybe even a third of that.

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 11:18 AM MDT up reply actions  

I am thinking a third

to be a backup somewhere. No way he gets a starting gig after the way he has collapsed lately.

Dude bet on himself and didn’t back it up (demanded too much money from Miami) and only has himself to blame.

Kyle Orton Sucks…except for practice

by LovedemBroncs on Oct 11, 2011 11:42 AM MDT up reply actions  

Na. Too much game tape with his upside for his agent to work with.

by jholm7 on Oct 11, 2011 12:27 PM MDT via mobile up reply actions  

come on

coaches know what Orton is like, please, people like Tom Coughlin, watch everything

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 12:29 PM MDT up reply actions  

He acted decently but I don't necessarily feel bad for him.

Peter Principle.

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 11:56 AM MDT up reply actions  

I feel bad for him Too...

Especially when an entire city is chanting the name of your less competent backup. Go some place where you have a chance Kyle.

by Kdo09 on Oct 11, 2011 1:03 PM MDT via mobile up reply actions  

It's hard to less cometent than Orton

34 yards of offense and an INT. Hard to get worst than that.

by FresnoKevin on Oct 11, 2011 3:35 PM MDT up reply actions  

I feel bad about Kyle's attitude

when things didn’t go his way, sometimes at work, others get a promotion if you suck, support the organization

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 12:29 PM MDT up reply actions  

Kyle was reviled the day he stepped off the plane at DIA...

Some were pissed because he was the result of trading our “franchise” QB. Some were pissed because he wasn’t John Elway and never could be. He never had a chance with the fans in Denver, most of them anyway. The only thing that could save him was success. When McD brought in Tebow, not even success could save him and the negative energy just grew. You could see how the pressure wore him down as his play just deteriorated geometrically it seemed.

Good luck to Kyle…
Let’s Go Tebow – Break’s over…it’s show time.

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 10:20 AM MDT up reply actions   3 recs

Most fans I said...

I was a supporter because I thought the way he managed to win games for Chicago in spite of everything said something about how he could play. He came to Denver with a better o-line, offense and, I thought, coach. But I’d say I was in the minority on that opinion. You probably were as well.

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 10:33 AM MDT up reply actions  

At the end

But that was because he had already sucked for a long time.

Kyle Orton Sucks…except for practice

by LovedemBroncs on Oct 11, 2011 11:43 AM MDT up reply actions  

Elway would never have accrued such hatred

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 12:32 PM MDT up reply actions  

This is for sure

Elway has heart and fans love that. Even if a guy fails to succeed, if he plays with heart, fans will not revile him (though they may chant for his backup). The reverse is also true. Truly gifted guys are hated and booed because they come off passionless and selfish (can you say LeBron). To me, Kyle made his bed last year when we got mopped up by Oakland and just took it passively. He then confirmed it this year with his ho-hum comments and performance in that game. It has been all downhill. I revile any Bronco that talks about the Raiders like it is just any other game. “Spilt milk” my arse. If Tebow wins only one game this year and we pummel the Raiders, he will have a lot of love from the fans!

by Da Bum on Oct 12, 2011 4:12 PM MDT up reply actions  

Sooner than I thought

Later than the needed.

It’s TEBOW time baby!

This signature was sacked by Von Miller.
I bleed Orange & Blue.

by Fabio Broncos on Oct 11, 2011 8:43 AM MDT reply actions   1 recs

Sorry, Fabio.

I promise that I hit “rec” but it logged it as a flag. Stupid website.

Excited to see Tebow play, and I’m a Bama fan! I just think he brings something electric to the game, and hope it helps the Broncos for the rest of the year.

What? A girl can't like AND understand football?
Shoot, I live in the South where that just comes with the territory!

by Titans_Girl on Oct 13, 2011 9:23 PM MDT up reply actions  

So it begins

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_gst-Ryh3g

"Have you ever heard of the emancipation proclamation?"
- "I don't listen to hip-hop"

by BroncoJoe311 on Oct 11, 2011 8:44 AM MDT reply actions  

"UNLEASH THE KRAKEN....! Wait...

that’s “Clash of the Titans”….never mind.

"I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany."

by rubincarterrocks on Oct 11, 2011 11:51 AM MDT up reply actions  

Thing is

Every person in the media is going to be criticizing every throw he makes, while us fans have high expectations but realize that development is going to take some time. Tebow has more talent than most players in this league, the sky is the limit for him, and we just have to be patient.

by Sayre Bedinger on Oct 11, 2011 8:49 AM MDT reply actions   2 recs

Tebow will be immediately compared to Cam Newton by the media

who left Florida as Tebow’s back-up.

If I can't have high expectations that succeed, I''d rather have high expectations and be disappointed than have low expectations and be resigned to losing.

by OrangeandBluesBros on Oct 11, 2011 9:13 AM MDT up reply actions   1 recs

Who cares about the MSM?? :)

I just hope the writers here set the bar for the rest of the media. ;)

Thanks Coach Fox!

Go BRONCOS!!

W-L record doesn't matter to me.... I just want to see a team on the rise at the end of the year!

by Broncotodd on Oct 11, 2011 9:18 AM MDT up reply actions  

THIS

I speak this as a member of the MSM :)

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 12:42 PM MDT up reply actions  

Lets just win in Miami

then move on

I would hope you would support who we are. Not, who we are not. Coach Norman Dale "Hoosiers"

by dmitchell624 on Oct 11, 2011 10:00 AM MDT up reply actions   2 recs

Every person in the media is going to be criticizing every throw he makes

The only thing that will change that is success. And even then, if all he can do is make plays with his feet, they’ll still criticize. Let them. He has support in the media too. Success will shut them up.

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 10:22 AM MDT up reply actions  

Fully agree BlueNOrange.... the commentators, for the most part, don't know

anymore than you and I do anyway about what it takes to win. They are simply parrots repeating what they have heard and they will say the same thing over and over, using different words and phrases, believing they are being more profound each time they repeat it. Case in point: Rich Gannon on Sunday against the Chargers. All he could talk about was Tebows mechanics on his throws, a couple that Tim missed were mechanics, but he had the deep throw that he just barely missed but only he was capable of escaping the rush and having a shot at even making the throw. His “fade” route to Lloyd was criticized by Gannon because he felt Tim did not set his feet, but the reality was that he hit Lloyd in the hands and the defender had to make a great play to deny the ball. I finally figured out what Tim is… he’s the Sundance Kid… he shoots much more accurately when he can move. He’s a great athlete that does not have to have perfect mechanics to make throws. Orton does because he’s not half the athlete that Tim is, neither is Manning for that matter, mechanics def. matter to them. (sorry to mention Orton and Manning in the same sentence…)

"I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany."

by rubincarterrocks on Oct 11, 2011 12:28 PM MDT up reply actions  

Mechanics are important...

but there are very few QBs in the NFL that have perfect mechanics. Phillip Rivers’ are terrible but he’s considered an elite. Drew Brees is very sound as is Peyton Manning. You know who had poster perfect mechanics? Ryan Leaf.

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 12:39 PM MDT up reply actions  

plus if you're reading

or have read Drew Brees’ autobiography (I’m in the process), after his injury, he had terrible mechanics. He speaks about how the Saints brought him in for training camp and Sean Payton was less than pleased, funny what working with a great coach like Malcolm in the Middle Sean Payton can do!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 12:44 PM MDT up reply actions  

My son read Brees' book and I'll get from him; But he won't read Tebow's book that I have.

 Yes about the coaching, and interestingly enough, Brees came from a spread offense at Purdue. (in the days they were decent……..before Kyle Orton…lol)

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 12:48 PM MDT up reply actions  

That is true

I don’t recall Orton leading the Boilers anywhere special, of course you’d know better than I would!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 1:42 PM MDT up reply actions  

yup, but fuzzy on the specs.

When Brees couldn’t wn the big one I blamed the coach. lol (for the Big Ten championship right to go to the Rose Bowl, I think)

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 1:48 PM MDT up reply actions  

I am indifferent myself on what one can accomplish

in college football. I mean, Tebow and Brees were great collegians and like Drew, Tebow will excel in the NFL, but there is so little a player can control. If you’re unbeaten, and the computer doesn’t like you, you’re not playing for the “national championship.” Of course, that’s a rant for another time, Brees was a winner from the beginning and so is Tebow!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 1:56 PM MDT up reply actions  

also Jeff George! coaches salivated when they saw him throw

in practice…

"I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany."

by rubincarterrocks on Oct 11, 2011 12:48 PM MDT up reply actions  

Steve Young was criticized for years

incidentally, Happy Birthday Steve!, anyway at the end of the day, no one could scorn him any longer

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 12:43 PM MDT up reply actions  

tnb...I'm always agreeing with you it seems!

It does make a good point also that lefties in general just look a bit funky dropping back. Also, I wonder how much of an issue it was in Tim being a lefty taking the exchange from center when Walton is used to a righty?

"I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany."

by rubincarterrocks on Oct 11, 2011 12:52 PM MDT up reply actions  

just turned it on

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 1:08 PM MDT up reply actions  

Most of those commentors sure bash the lefties

but they seem to be advertising TT HA!

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 1:36 PM MDT up reply actions  

Yeah

that was all over the place. Fun to watch though

Go Broncos!

by Sean in Pa. on Oct 11, 2011 4:08 PM MDT up reply actions  

Did they include

Cutlers left handed pass from last night ROFLMAO!!

".....Im the waiting beast....Im the twisted nerve..."

by Disturbed70 on Oct 11, 2011 4:42 PM MDT up reply actions  

I was wondering that myself...

I don’t think there is a difference in the technique, but just a difference in the hands. Each QB has a different comfort zone on receiving the snap. It looked to me like Tebow was just a bit anxious and closing his hands on the ball before it was there. It happens a lot. The first person to hear the snap count is the QB after all.

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 1:21 PM MDT up reply actions  

Thanks Ruben!

too bad your son Andre is a Patriot now :(

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 1:56 PM MDT up reply actions  

Sayre

remember that we in the MSM don’t know anything, Coach Fox has more football acumen in his little finger than I could have in 20 years of studying the sport. Tebow will progress because he refuses to fail. Perseverance, pass it on!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 12:42 PM MDT up reply actions  

Tebow now begins what should have already happen..How to be a week in and weeek out NFL QB

Love these sports guy who say Tebow cannot bring the Broncos to a Superbowl..lol..not with this team he can’t. The other side of this is Tebow has much to learn just like every other New QB who comes into the league. Love this move and I hope he can fill the giant hole us Bronco Fans have for the QB position.

" He conquers who endures."

by bloodwell on Oct 11, 2011 8:53 AM MDT reply actions  

Tom Brady

or Aaron Rogers wouldn’t be able to bring this Bronco team to the SB. Naysayers on Tebow are just parroting what so called “experts” say. And “experts” are wrong over 50% of the time. And 99% of statistics are made up on the spot.

If we can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people, under the pretence of taking care of them, they must become happy. - Thomas Jefferson

by Trogdoor on Oct 11, 2011 9:19 AM MDT up reply actions  

Can you please show me the evidence on that

I am not buying that 99% of stats are made up on the spot. That seems too high. Show me your stats on made up stats please…

by Da Bum on Oct 12, 2011 4:20 PM MDT up reply actions  

No one really thought

Peyton Manning or Drew Brrees would win a championship either, oops

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 1:57 PM MDT up reply actions  

I never said Tebow was King of the World

That honor belongs to me.

That play where Tebow scrambled around brilliantly only to overthrow Decker is where I think the difference between winning and losing this season will come. Tebow won’t learn the NFL QB game in the next 11. As effective as he was improvising against SD, he could have been better if he connected on those throwshe missed after he evaded the rush. Make more of those busted play throws and we finish the season 7-9 or 8-8.

Maya: "What are your first impressions of Denver?"
Mozgov: "I must break you..."

by margabelle on Oct 11, 2011 9:00 AM MDT reply actions  

The situation is more unfair to Tebow than fans were supposedly to Orton

Because Orton gave us a better chance to win, he took all the first team reps in training camp, preseason and the first 5 weeks of the season. Tebow was derping around with the second team. Despite what some want to say, defensive coordinators HAVE TAPE on Tebow. Three games last year and a half this year is plenty of game tape to build a game plan around. Defenses have plenty of ready made schemes to run against Tebow due to most teams having some version of “the wildcat”. The truth is, defenses will be far more prepared to STOP Tebow than the Broncos are prepared to play with him.

To play to his strengths an offense needs to be built around him. This bye week of preparation, due to the new collective bargaining agreement, amounts to ~2 extra practices. Good luck installing and working on executing a completely different offense with a week of practice plus two extra days.

Worse still, the thing Tebow will HAVE TO DO to play even decently, throwing from the pocket, is going to be hard considering he has had NO REPS with the receivers who will be playing. This is tough for someone who has a gifted arm, something we all know Tebow does not posses.

I think Fox knows all this and it is why he did not want to make the change. If you think I am being overly dramatic, go read the post articles that contain the charger’s reactions to Tebow’s performance. Nor Turner is basically talking smack, or as close as Norv has ever gotten to talking smack, about how they are going to be able to shut down Tebow next time because they wiill have a defensive scheme just for him.

Tebow faces a much bigger challenge than he did last year for the last three games. Defenses will be ready, the Broncos offense will not be and he has not had any reps with the receivers he will need to connect with if he is going to have any success.

Orton really forced this change with his play, not because Tebow was ready or the offense was ready to play with him.

by Keyworthpunch on Oct 11, 2011 9:05 AM MDT reply actions   3 recs

Your last sentence is the key here.

Orton forced the change, and that’s the way it should be….perfectly timed? Certainly not. However it is what it is.

Realistic expectations are needed by everyone. It’s not unfair to Tim if he’s shown patience by the coaches and fans alike. We already know the media doesn’t give a hoot about being fair, so they don’t count LOL

I’m more hopeful today than I’ve been in 2 years. But I’m also realistic in my hopes for the team this year.

GO BRONCOS!!!

W-L record doesn't matter to me.... I just want to see a team on the rise at the end of the year!

by Broncotodd on Oct 11, 2011 9:15 AM MDT up reply actions   1 recs

What Broncotodd said

agree

If we can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people, under the pretence of taking care of them, they must become happy. - Thomas Jefferson

by Trogdoor on Oct 11, 2011 9:17 AM MDT up reply actions  

Love your sig :)

W-L record doesn't matter to me.... I just want to see a team on the rise at the end of the year!

by Broncotodd on Oct 11, 2011 9:21 AM MDT up reply actions  

True, if he is shown patience :)

I just hear such negative things from the media, I hope people don’t turn on him too quickly.

by Keyworthpunch on Oct 11, 2011 9:22 AM MDT up reply actions  

I'm not so sure....

defenses were keyed to stop Orton fairly easily. They stacked the box, blitzed and dared Orton to beat them over the top. Orton couldn’t. Tebow’s bread and butter are screens and long balls…plus he can scramble. If you ask me, NFL defenses have to pick their poison with Tebow.

Either way, Tebow’s going to have many ups and downs in teh coming weeks.

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 9:45 AM MDT up reply actions  

Yeah, if I’m a DC I want to see Tebow can beat a base cover 2 with his arm before I’m making any adjustments like zone drops or overload blitzes.

i keep dancing on my own.

by atomiccafe on Oct 11, 2011 10:14 AM MDT up reply actions  

I am not totally sure about that

The absolute best way to beat a young QB is to confuse him and make him doubt what he is seeing on the field. I think we will have plenty of bumps and plenty of “what did he just do” plays. Should be exciting!

by Da Bum on Oct 12, 2011 4:26 PM MDT up reply actions  

+all I got

Even if Norv “face of a beaurocrat” Turner thinks he’s got 35 defensive tricks to pull (cut off routes, switching “spies”, etc.) one for each D snap of the game, to confuse a rook, I think he’s fooling himself.

"Aggression, discipline, accountability, effort" Brian Dawkins 9/29/2009
"Life is a daring adventure or nothing." Helen Keller
"He will always be a slave who does not know how to live upon a little" Horace

by PositivIntegral on Oct 11, 2011 11:07 AM MDT up reply actions  

"If McCoy can’t utilize some of Tim’s skills, Mike needs to go before 2012."

Could not agree more. Are he and Fox up to the task is my question.

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 12:11 PM MDT up reply actions  

McCoy needs to have as much fun as Tebow.

Why not add a red zone shovel pass to J Thomas or a option play with Moreno.

Coaching Tebow should be fun and creative. Much better than coaching Orton anyway.

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 12:47 PM MDT up reply actions  

Yes!

Carolina wasn’t afraid to use that option play with D. Williams, and also the shovel pass. They have taken a few of the plays out of Auburn’s spread and let Newton run them—and he gained big yards when they played the pitch man. No reason not to do the same with Tebow.

by bronco.fan on Oct 11, 2011 3:13 PM MDT up reply actions  

I live in Detroit and I am a Lions fan then a Denver fan.

We essentially run a college level spread offense and it seems to be working well for us this year. It is an offense that seems to be made to fit our mediocre running game and our mediocre offensive line. I think it is an OC job to make an offense that works best for his guys, not make his guys try to be the best at what he wants.

Here is a link talking about our spread
http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/post/_/id/32430/mnf-in-detroit-the-lions-spread-offense

by FrostyK on Oct 11, 2011 11:35 PM MDT up reply actions  

Woot!

How’s Titus Young working out for you? Detroit runs a spread very similar to Boise State’s. A lot of formation shifting in order to get the match-ups they want. I didn’t think the one block and release to the second level would work with the greater athletes of the NFL d-lines but it does seem to be helping with Detroit’s line.

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 12, 2011 8:20 AM MDT up reply actions  

agree. if I'm the DC I make Tebow pass it and contain him in the pocket.

 only problem is yeah we will have 3 good WRs.

Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent a new nation, conceived in liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that Tim Tebow should be the starting quarterback for the Denver Broncos. ~ Abe Lincoln

Friends are like potatoes. If you eat them, they die. ~ Aristotle

by Zac Man on Oct 11, 2011 12:17 PM MDT up reply actions  

And Tebow will have a lot of time in the pocket to let them work themselves open.

It’s a passing league and Denver is well stocked at WR & TE.

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 12:48 PM MDT up reply actions  

Miami is talked about as having a good D line though.

 still, if we can’t find a way to beat Miami, we deserve Andrew Luck

Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent a new nation, conceived in liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that Tim Tebow should be the starting quarterback for the Denver Broncos. ~ Abe Lincoln

Friends are like potatoes. If you eat them, they die. ~ Aristotle

by Zac Man on Oct 11, 2011 12:50 PM MDT up reply actions  

Andrew Luck is the best college QB I’ve ever watched.

Just sayin.

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 12:56 PM MDT up reply actions  

Luck is a special talent.

The kid will be well worth a 1st overall pick. I cant say he is the best college QB I have watched, that honor still goes to #7 :)

".....Im the waiting beast....Im the twisted nerve..."

by Disturbed70 on Oct 11, 2011 4:57 PM MDT up reply actions  

TE is key

Remember it was Aaron Hernandez who was the TE for Tebow. He’s lighting it up now in the pros — definitely utilize the receiving TE.

by bronco.fan on Oct 11, 2011 3:15 PM MDT up reply actions  

Julius Thomas should be back for the Miami game

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Oct 11, 2011 4:19 PM MDT up reply actions  

I keep wondering

what happened to Orton’s long ball this year? He made some crazy passes last year and we have seen nothing of it this season. Is this something other teams have learned about our route running? Was it Kyle regressing in his game? Or has the offense been more run and short pass oriented on purpose?
I miss the long passes.

Go Broncos!

by Sean in Pa. on Oct 11, 2011 10:21 AM MDT up reply actions  

Tebow tried for several and barely missed on Sunday.

The long ball is there, Orton just wasn’t throwing it. And so far, Tebow is just a little inaccurate. Either way, its part of Tebow’s game so we should see some big plays and more near misses. ;)

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 10:35 AM MDT up reply actions  

Denver Post photo of Lloyd

Brandon gives Tim a 4 sq yard strike zone. I just hope there aren’t too many DB’s lurking in the sweet spot.

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by PositivIntegral on Oct 11, 2011 11:09 AM MDT up reply actions  

we'll take just hitting him for now.

baby steps. baby steps.

Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent a new nation, conceived in liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that Tim Tebow should be the starting quarterback for the Denver Broncos. ~ Abe Lincoln

Friends are like potatoes. If you eat them, they die. ~ Aristotle

by Zac Man on Oct 11, 2011 12:18 PM MDT up reply actions  

He did hit him

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 12:19 PM MDT up reply actions  

But keep in mind Tim we were coming from behind and almost had no choice but to use the long ball,

What will be called for the first half of the game? That’s where it’s usually not pretty.

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 12:14 PM MDT up reply actions  

My feeling was Orton was simply trying to play it safe

this year. Perhaps Fox was more conservative in his passing philosophy also than what we had last year, asking Orton to manage the game more than make plays.

"I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany."

by rubincarterrocks on Oct 11, 2011 12:57 PM MDT up reply actions  

Doesn't explain the interceptions

Orton had a decent ratio then, but what happened this year? Pick 6 throw, ball falling out of his hand, leads the league in interceptions . . . if he was playing it safe, you’d think he wouldn’t have thrown so many picks . . .

by bronco.fan on Oct 11, 2011 3:19 PM MDT up reply actions  

Orton forced the change

and yet he had the audacity to golf clap when Tebow was having success, way to be there for your team, Kyle. Football is the ultimate team game!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 1:58 PM MDT up reply actions  

Yeah, that clap was totally forced.

But yet, he couldn’t be seen sulking on the bench could he? I’d rather the “golf clap” to that.

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 2:00 PM MDT up reply actions  

I guess so

his attitude sucked any way you slice it

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 3:56 PM MDT up reply actions  

Didn't Tebow start against the Chargers last year.

You would think the Chargers would have already been prepared for him.

by DemonB on Oct 11, 2011 3:13 PM MDT up reply actions  

Yes. SD had both game experience and film on Tebow from less than one season ago.

Tebow isn’t as easy to defend as some want to believe.

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 3:30 PM MDT up reply actions  

Begin?

As if the pains with Orton weren’t bad enough. At least I have a reason to watch. If it’s a train wreck, and least there’ll be a lot of exciting plays!

If we can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people, under the pretence of taking care of them, they must become happy. - Thomas Jefferson

by Trogdoor on Oct 11, 2011 9:16 AM MDT reply actions  

Four disastrous years?

Certainly last year was disastrous. McD’s firs year was as well, to start 6-0 and then only go win 2 of the last 10 games. Mike’s last year could be considered disastrous due to losing three in a row and missing the playoffs. The year before though, had a great draft class in Clady, Royal, Torain, Larsen and HIllis. Cutler was progressing as a quarterback and with the close of the season there seemed to be hope. I would hardly call that disastrous.

by Keyworthpunch on Oct 11, 2011 9:20 AM MDT reply actions  

It is a body of work.

The last four years all played a role in bringing us to this disaster that is the Broncos. Hopefully we’ve bottomed out and the only way is up!

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 9:46 AM MDT up reply actions  

i cant wait for this kid to be successful. then someone can ask meril hoge “Tell me again, why should the broncos cut Tebow?”

"the man who created a legend; the legend who resurrected a franchise."

by chaucer on Oct 11, 2011 9:20 AM MDT reply actions  

Merill Hoge

Admits to having too many concussions…

If we can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people, under the pretence of taking care of them, they must become happy. - Thomas Jefferson

by Trogdoor on Oct 11, 2011 9:28 AM MDT up reply actions  

Watching ESPN First Take right now

The hate from Kordell Stewart is maddening

by jayr67 on Oct 11, 2011 9:22 AM MDT reply actions  

Kordell Who?

If we can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people, under the pretence of taking care of them, they must become happy. - Thomas Jefferson

by Trogdoor on Oct 11, 2011 9:29 AM MDT up reply actions  

Kordell the “in the closet” Stewart.

Westbrook beat down Davis for a reason. Westbrook is more progressive.

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 9:34 AM MDT up reply actions   1 recs

Why are you

Pointing out his supposed sexuality like it’s even a thing? Homophobic bs like this is why people (especially athletes) stay in the closet

by oxsnard on Oct 11, 2011 10:49 AM MDT via mobile up reply actions   1 recs

that’s why I threw the “progressive” part in there. That he is gay doesn’t bother me in the least.

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 12:49 PM MDT up reply actions  

if Kordell is gay

I just hope he’s not attracted to me :(

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:01 PM MDT up reply actions  

If a football playing gay guy is attracted to you, it stands to reason that women would also find you attractive.

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 2:14 PM MDT up reply actions  

That's encouraging

McGeorge, just so long as she finds me attractive!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 3:56 PM MDT up reply actions  

Billy

We really need to talk.

Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
My ship finally came in, but it was the Kobayashi Maru.

KaptainKirk on FaceBook

by KaptainKirk on Oct 11, 2011 6:01 PM MDT up reply actions  

It's

cause Skip said Tebow was better then Kordell, every since then KS has been hating!

Release the Tebow!

by NewEraNugg on Oct 11, 2011 12:57 PM MDT up reply actions  

I just hope he takes us out of any qb hunt in the draft.

I would hate to watch tebow progress however only winning a couple games and then watch him succeed elsewhere.

"Vegetarians are cool. All I eat are vegetarians - except for the occasional mountain lion steak "

Ted Nugent

by Idaho Nate on Oct 11, 2011 9:22 AM MDT reply actions   1 recs

Idaho, I want to see Tim succeed here, I love the guy... I

love players like him period! They are guys that take teams to championships. That being said, as much as I love Tim, if we had a chance to draft Luck… do it. Nothing against Tim but Luck is special. He is Elway, Manning quality. You don’t pass on that.

"I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany."

by rubincarterrocks on Oct 11, 2011 1:02 PM MDT up reply actions  

"What we need to look for is improvement over the next 11 games"

 Agree completely. Tebow showed improvement trying to stay in the pocket and keeping his eyes down field against SD. I was definitely glad to see that. He did not show any improvement in his accuracy or footwork, however. Maybe that could be chalked up to nerves, we shall see. This is what I will be looking at for him to improve. Can he do it? He has more than half of a season to show it. If he can I will be happy to have him as our Franchise QB. If he cant, it will show in our record and we will have the opportunity to get that franchise QB.

The thing I worry about is that he shows no improvement in his fundamental skills, but keeps us in games with his legs providing grounds for a false evaluation of his performance. If this happens, and EFX draft a high pick QB or even trade Tebow, I would hate so see the gnashing of teeth.

by AttwaterForHOF on Oct 11, 2011 9:26 AM MDT reply actions  

My guess is that in your second scenario they wouldn’t draft a QB with a top 10 pick, but might go after someone like Foles, Tannehill or Griffin as a value selection and insurance policy.

i keep dancing on my own.

by atomiccafe on Oct 11, 2011 9:47 AM MDT up reply actions  

First of all, I want to see Merrill Hoge eat his words about Tebow.

He said Tebow is simply not a very good football player. If Tebow started the 2nd quarter, the Broncos would have won the game. Tebow will convert more third downs and keep the offense on the field longer. The defense will improve simply cuz they’re getting more rest. You’ll still have a top 5 pick, and I think drafting Richardson will be the best bet. Then trade Moreno for picks, get a solid DT, and use Orton’s money to sign some FAs. The Broncos could be playoff contenders next year. Tebow is worth 6 wins or so all by himself. It’s Tebow time, and I’m excited.

by usana_gaines on Oct 11, 2011 9:31 AM MDT reply actions  

Hoge is just jealous

because his Squealers lost to the Broncos in the 1989 playoffs

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:02 PM MDT up reply actions  

and the 97 AFC championships

although Im sure he was gone by then

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Oct 11, 2011 4:21 PM MDT up reply actions  

He was

he retired a Bear, that twit

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 9:30 PM MDT up reply actions  

It’s not our patience Tebow needs, but that of EFX. That 2012 draft is going to have three QBs taken in the top 5 picks.

Hopefully Tim plays us out of those selections. These next 11 games take on great importance for his future as a Bronco whether we like that or not. Hey, it’s better than 6 games or 3 games.

That game in Miami couldn’t be a better starting point BTW.

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 9:39 AM MDT reply actions  

I’m sure they’ll be upset at the Tebow cheers in their own stadium, but I’m going to disagree if you think it will make them play better.

by Tazzik on Oct 11, 2011 9:51 AM MDT up reply actions  

You haven’t watched Miami. They have already bailed on their coaching staff. They know they are all in with Suck for Luck. They’ve already lost the vets and BM keeps dropping passes at an alarming rate. He’s been bad this season.

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 9:57 AM MDT up reply actions  

that could have easily been said about the Chiefs two weeks ago. Players will always play for their contracts, and the Broncos aren’t good enough to say “that team is so bad….”

i keep dancing on my own.

by atomiccafe on Oct 11, 2011 10:03 AM MDT up reply actions  

I expect Miami to “do enough”. I don’t expect to see any extra ordinary efforts like you saw out of Moreno, Tebow, Lloyd or Ayers on Sunday.

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 12:50 PM MDT up reply actions  

And they don't even

Sell out their stadium. The Marlins had the worst attendance of any MLB team, the fans there are a thin skinned lot. Too much heat.

If we can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people, under the pretence of taking care of them, they must become happy. - Thomas Jefferson

by Trogdoor on Oct 11, 2011 10:00 AM MDT up reply actions  

Seriously

I can’t believe his first start is “Gator Day” in Miami. He could be getting more cheers than the Dolphins.

by Tazzik on Oct 11, 2011 9:49 AM MDT up reply actions   1 recs

can't wait

Is it Sunday 10/23 yet? Man, that’s a long way away…

If we can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people, under the pretence of taking care of them, they must become happy. - Thomas Jefferson

by Trogdoor on Oct 11, 2011 9:59 AM MDT up reply actions  

Ed Reed, Clinton Portis, Jonathan Vilma, Andre Johnson and Vince Wilfork are probably wondering when their team will be honored.

i keep dancing on my own.

by atomiccafe on Oct 11, 2011 12:55 PM MDT up reply actions  

I don't expect very many wins this year..

.. I didn’t even before the season started – I just think the roster is too thin.

However, I do expect them to be competitive. I expect 60 solid minutes of leaving it all on the field. THAT, I do believe we will get from TT. I am also hoping his youth and infectious enthusiasm ratchet up the rest of the team another notch or two.

"He who knows nothing is closer to the truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors." ~ Thomas Jefferson.

I don’t suffer from insanity – I enjoy every minute of it!

by Broncos 'n Scotch (BS) on Oct 11, 2011 10:05 AM MDT reply actions  

Good write up

I would agree, there needs to be some realistic expectations; however, this is the NFL, and the window to “develop” a QB has shrunk from 5 years to probably about 2 years. My guess is if Tebow doesn’t show some significant improvement on accuracy, timing, footwork, hell even the center qb exchange, then his run as the starter will end this year and we will be drafting either Luck, Barkley, Landry, Griifith or Foiles next year and Tebow will be trade bait.

As for your thoughts that Tebow ends up in New England, no way, they drafted the kid from Arkansas and he has looked awesome in preseason.

Indy would have no interest in trying to develop Tebow, doesn’t fit their system with quick, accurate passer. I could see maybe Houston looking at him or maybe WA, as a guy who can run bootlegs and works in a Shananan system for play action boots.

"Me fail english, that unpossible" - Ralph Wiggum
"Duffman is thrusting in the direction of the problem" - Duffman
"Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun" - Ash from Army of Darkness
"H.I., you're young and you got your health, what you want with a job?" - Evelle from Raising Arizona
"It happens sometimes. People just explode. Natural causes." - Agent Rogersz from Repoman

by Broncoman on Oct 11, 2011 10:08 AM MDT reply actions  

I'm just using those two organizations as examples.

You know, Steve Young going from Tampa to San Francisco and winning a Super Bowl.

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 10:42 AM MDT up reply actions  

Yes but how long...

did young sit at the feat of Montana before taking over for himself? He didn’t just leave Tampa and go win a ring in SF. Those two orgs are excellent examples to use. He could go sit back and learn how to be an NFL QB for a few years behind great coaching staffs.

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 11:01 AM MDT up reply actions  

back in the days

bereft of a salary cap, teams could play for organizations forever, that era’s never coming back

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:14 PM MDT up reply actions  

with a goofy beard

but not a porn stache, good Christians don’t condone porn in any way shape or form!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:14 PM MDT up reply actions  

Great read Tim

It’s hard to remember at a time like this that we’re going to have so many frustrations with Tebow. There’s just no way around it. Personally, I’m just looking forward to having some passion injected back into our game. Up until now, my wife has usually tried to stay away from me when the Broncos are on TV, but last Sunday, she was standing in front of the screen jumping up and down screaming with me for the team. Tebow did that. It’s like giving a shot of adreneline to our entire team and our fan base. And even when he loses games this year, which he will, we’ll still be able to say that he got experience and it might help us in the future. Viva el Tebow.

None of us go out and play for stats. You just do whatever you can to help the team out. -- Eddie Royal

by Poster_Formerly_Known_As_Royal_Fan on Oct 11, 2011 10:08 AM MDT reply actions  

The starting QBs for my two fav teams are now Tim Tebow and Taylor Martinez.

Both are guaranteed face plams waiting to happen as well as TD machines.

 Will I be able to hold it together on back to back days? Who knows.

Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent a new nation, conceived in liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that Tim Tebow should be the starting quarterback for the Denver Broncos. ~ Abe Lincoln

Friends are like potatoes. If you eat them, they die. ~ Aristotle

by Zac Man on Oct 11, 2011 10:15 AM MDT reply actions  

LOL

That was great! I had to double take ;D Face palms waiting to happen…. rotf

Go Broncos!

by Sean in Pa. on Oct 11, 2011 10:34 AM MDT up reply actions  

especially T-Magic. he loses his wand a lot.

Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent a new nation, conceived in liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that Tim Tebow should be the starting quarterback for the Denver Broncos. ~ Abe Lincoln

Friends are like potatoes. If you eat them, they die. ~ Aristotle

by Zac Man on Oct 11, 2011 10:41 AM MDT up reply actions  

Hello MHR people

Just want to say as an infrequent poster here that I am glad Tebow is now the starter.

I supported Orton throughout training camp and the beginning of the season, but I am convinced that this is the best possible outcome for the season to develop Tebow now that the season has gotten off to such a terrible start.

So yes, I am eating a little crow here. Enjoy.

"Such a strange predicament we find ourselves in / Baby, it's a long way to South America"

by Fly Agaric on Oct 11, 2011 10:16 AM MDT reply actions  

Orton did look like the better option all through TC and even in the preseason games.

But man he has regressed into a pretty terrible QB this year. I think the fans are more to blame than anything. Hard for anyone to play in front of a hostile home crowd….

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 10:44 AM MDT up reply actions  

He didn't care about the fans. so we thought he wouldn't mind.

Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent a new nation, conceived in liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that Tim Tebow should be the starting quarterback for the Denver Broncos. ~ Abe Lincoln

Friends are like potatoes. If you eat them, they die. ~ Aristotle

by Zac Man on Oct 11, 2011 10:50 AM MDT up reply actions  

Ya...he didn't care about the fans hating on him ...

the way a guy doesn’t care about his ex hooking up with another guy.

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 11:03 AM MDT up reply actions  

I wouldn't care about my ex

It’s a little creepy to be possessive after you are all split up and stuff, right?

Dunno. Never understood jealousy. Or making the home stadium a hostile place for one of your own players either.

"Such a strange predicament we find ourselves in / Baby, it's a long way to South America"

by Fly Agaric on Oct 11, 2011 11:09 AM MDT up reply actions  

He cared...but what fool would say that?

Winning would have cured all that ails, he just couldn’t pull it off.

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 11:17 AM MDT up reply actions  

it was more his attitude when we lost.

 I understand his quieter personality and demeanor, but he could of at least said more “we’ll watch film and practice”

 I want a QB that feels the pain when we lose.

Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent a new nation, conceived in liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that Tim Tebow should be the starting quarterback for the Denver Broncos. ~ Abe Lincoln

Friends are like potatoes. If you eat them, they die. ~ Aristotle

by Zac Man on Oct 11, 2011 11:27 AM MDT up reply actions  

I didn't like it either...but that's over and done now.

Tim Tebow is the starting QB for the Denver Broncos and Orton may not be a Bronco next week.

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 11:29 AM MDT up reply actions  

I know this is highly unlikely...

But how ironic would it be for Miami fans to finally get their Orton wish and have him become a Dolphin — then, during his first game there, having him have to listen to people once again chanting for Tebow.

None of us go out and play for stats. You just do whatever you can to help the team out. -- Eddie Royal

by Poster_Formerly_Known_As_Royal_Fan on Oct 11, 2011 12:02 PM MDT up reply actions  

LOL

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 12:03 PM MDT up reply actions  

Bite your tongue.

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 12:04 PM MDT up reply actions  

with dump offs to Reggie Bush

Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent a new nation, conceived in liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that Tim Tebow should be the starting quarterback for the Denver Broncos. ~ Abe Lincoln

Friends are like potatoes. If you eat them, they die. ~ Aristotle

by Zac Man on Oct 11, 2011 12:14 PM MDT up reply actions  

That's what I was thinking....

Orton knows the Bronco playbook probably better than anyone, except the OC.

by Puckhead1 on Oct 12, 2011 1:32 PM MDT up reply actions  

Why use “blame” like it’s a bad word.

As with the firing of Josh McDaneils, Orton’s benching is very good for the long term health of the organization.

The fans deserve thanks for doing this for John Fox.

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 12:53 PM MDT up reply actions  

no need to eat crow.....

just sit back and watch our team develop

Kyle Orton is the Tin Man....No heart, can't move and the oil can is too far away!

by mdierk on Oct 11, 2011 12:18 PM MDT up reply actions  

Fox needs to come up with 20 spread formation plays pronto . .

Coach the team you have; not the team you want. Tebow is much better in the shot-gun. Just let him play his game. The passing game should not be difficult for Tim from this formation so they need to concentrate on generating a ground game from the spread. Put Willis AND Knowshon on either side of Tebow, 2 or 3 wideouts and 1 or 2 TE. From that set they can run or throw it. Make sure there is always an outlet receiver, preferably Knowshon. There you have it. Just do it. Throw out much of the old offense. Simplify what you have and let Tebow be Tebow.

History is a collection of lies, agreed upon -- Napoleon Bonaparte

by Schwerepunkt on Oct 11, 2011 10:18 AM MDT reply actions   2 recs

Yes

A million times yes. What is the point of making Tebow take snaps under center when he clearly excels in the shotgun?

"Such a strange predicament we find ourselves in / Baby, it's a long way to South America"

by Fly Agaric on Oct 11, 2011 10:24 AM MDT up reply actions  

The Main Reason:

The shotgun limits the offense in the running game. It takes more time for run plays to develop because the back is taking the handoff further behind the LOS than a traditional running formation. It also takes the Fullback out of the equation as a lead blocker. Tebow’s talent can offset some of that, but he needs to be able to take a snap from center to be effective in all phases of the offense.

"You’re only great if you win something. I mean, Alexander wasn’t Alexander the Mediocre or Alexander the Average. He was Alexander the Great, and there’s a reason for it."-Shannon Sharpe

by CH74 on Oct 11, 2011 10:50 AM MDT up reply actions   1 recs

The could convert to the Pistol...

in two weeks right? Right?

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 11:04 AM MDT up reply actions  

This is a good answer

"Such a strange predicament we find ourselves in / Baby, it's a long way to South America"

by Fly Agaric on Oct 11, 2011 11:06 AM MDT up reply actions  

And...

I think it will be a lot easier to get Tebow used to taking snaps under center than to totally change his throwing mechanics.

"Such a strange predicament we find ourselves in / Baby, it's a long way to South America"

by Fly Agaric on Oct 11, 2011 11:07 AM MDT up reply actions  

Definitely

He’ll get more comfortable under center the more he does it. I am not as concerned with his mechanics at this point as I am with his footwork. Getting the footwork down will be a good foundation to work from and it will help his accuracy. One thing I would like to see him take from Orton’s game is the ability to sell the fake in play action. That all starts with footwork.

"You’re only great if you win something. I mean, Alexander wasn’t Alexander the Mediocre or Alexander the Average. He was Alexander the Great, and there’s a reason for it."-Shannon Sharpe

by CH74 on Oct 11, 2011 11:32 AM MDT up reply actions  

His feet are too big. :)

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 12:17 PM MDT up reply actions  

You know what they say

about guys with big feet? They need bigger shoes!

"You’re only great if you win something. I mean, Alexander wasn’t Alexander the Mediocre or Alexander the Average. He was Alexander the Great, and there’s a reason for it."-Shannon Sharpe

by CH74 on Oct 11, 2011 12:32 PM MDT up reply actions  

Sure I know........that's why the smiley.

But I really said it because of the footwork comment. I’m still laughing at myself.

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 12:34 PM MDT up reply actions  

Laughter is the best medicine

It’s good to see not everyone has lost their sense of humor!

"You’re only great if you win something. I mean, Alexander wasn’t Alexander the Mediocre or Alexander the Average. He was Alexander the Great, and there’s a reason for it."-Shannon Sharpe

by CH74 on Oct 11, 2011 12:38 PM MDT up reply actions  

+ 1

More spread and more shotgun.

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 12:16 PM MDT up reply actions  

Trent the DOUCHE

2 things that Trent Dilfer debated with Steve Young about last night before monday night football that just proves Dilfer is a douche. 1st. Stating that if the Broncos start Tim that our playbook instantly shrinks down to a quarter of its size. Well Trent if a quarter sized playbook with Tim playing is far more productive than a full size playbook with Orton playing then who gives a rats ass. 2nd. Trent asking Young excitedly " what do the top six QB’s in the league all possess? A quick release, Tebow doesn’t have it." Well Trent who in the hell said anything about Tim Tebow being a top 6 QB in the league? Its like all these analysts think that Tim has to be the next Joe Montana or for that matter the greatest QB of all time John Elway. Give me a F’n break already. Another thing, don’t everybody get their hopes up that Tim is going to miraculously improve his accuracy. Tebows been throwing the football his whole life and still looks like he does throwing it. His accuracy may improve a little but its not going to be overwhelming so lets all quit talking about what Tim isn’t and start talking about what he is and everybody living with it. The kid is never going to be the next Joe Montana, all he’s going to be is a player who gets this offense in the end zone and for me thats a breathe of fresh air.

by johnnyurrotten on Oct 11, 2011 10:21 AM MDT reply actions  

are you referring to his 67.1% college career passing accuracy over 985 attempts? The senior year where he was 70%? or just his limited reps from last season and this season when they are trying to change his mechanics?

by Todd Jewell on Oct 11, 2011 10:27 AM MDT up reply actions   1 recs

Ill quote Steve Young

" In college football every receiver is open all the time, in the NFL none of the receivers are open all of the time". Windows to throw the ball into in college are a whole lot bigger than in the NFL. If you can tell by my post I’m not hating on the guy, I’m freaked stoked.

by johnnyurrotten on Oct 11, 2011 10:34 AM MDT up reply actions  

it's all about decision making

Tebow makes the right choices. He had less than top-notch talent at Florida, and won big in the SEC. People like to say receivers are open so much more in college than in the pros, but if college is so easy, why doesn’t everyone have Tebow-like success in the best conference in football. Speaking of talent, the Broncos aren’t overly talented either, but Tebow got 14 points in the 4th quarter. Orton couldn’t do it. It’s on.

by usana_gaines on Oct 11, 2011 11:29 AM MDT up reply actions  

Agreed
In college football every receiver is open all the time, in the NFL none of the receivers are open all of the time.

This is just a gross oversimplification. If it were true, then why doesn’t every college QB complete 70% of their passes? Then why does college completion percentage have such a strong correlation with professional success?
It gets harder going from college to the NFL, but to completely discount college performance is just one of those sayings that makes a point with a kernal of truth in it, but cannot be taken seriously. Like saying you need an elite QB to win a Super Bowl. Sure, that’s true, except, you know, when it isn’t. Or that you need a balanced offense to win, also true, except when it isn’t.
I know I have sure seen a lot of wide open receivers in the NFL. A LOT. And I’ve seen a lot of well covered ones. And I’ve seen Tebow hit and miss both of them.

by asdqqq on Oct 11, 2011 12:43 PM MDT up reply actions   1 recs

Steve Young

is the one most qualified to speak on Tim Tebow, just as Dan Marino is the one most qualified to speak on Peyton Manning, comparable signal-callers, different generations

Brad James

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With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:07 PM MDT up reply actions  

But Steve Young has said nothing but great things about--and for--TT.

I’m pretty sure I read where he’d texted encouraging stuff to him.

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 2:11 PM MDT up reply actions  

I guess that's a good thing then!

Brad James

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With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:13 PM MDT up reply actions  

I think I remember that now!

Brad James

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With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:15 PM MDT up reply actions  

Would I lead you wrong?

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 2:16 PM MDT up reply actions  

Of course not!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 3:53 PM MDT up reply actions  

I turned on the TV this morning

ESPN happened to be on and before I even got the picture in, Hannah Storm was telling me the Broncos had made it official, Tim Tebow is the Broncos starting QB. She then brought on the “Expert” Merril Hoge who sounded like he was eating a little crow already. Priceless!

The first five games have been rough. I hope this change is the catalyst this team needs to put together some complete games and get some wins. The fans finally got what they wanted, I only hope that Tebow can live up to the expectations.

"You’re only great if you win something. I mean, Alexander wasn’t Alexander the Mediocre or Alexander the Average. He was Alexander the Great, and there’s a reason for it."-Shannon Sharpe

by CH74 on Oct 11, 2011 10:30 AM MDT reply actions  

I do as well

There has been a great deal of speculation that the QB of the future is not on the roster yet. I disagree with that. I look to what we know and that is the Broncos are one of the few teams to keep 3 QBs on the active roster with many apparent needs to be filled in other areas. The team would have cut ties with Tebow this year if he was not a factor in their future plans. After recent events, we can clearly see that Silver’s gossip about Tebow being the 4th best QB in camp was a bunch of crap to generate clicks.

"You’re only great if you win something. I mean, Alexander wasn’t Alexander the Mediocre or Alexander the Average. He was Alexander the Great, and there’s a reason for it."-Shannon Sharpe

by CH74 on Oct 11, 2011 1:05 PM MDT up reply actions   1 recs

Nice write up Tim

Orton just was not playing well. I don’t see how the team does not perform better with Tebow in. We have played some close games this season and defense has been a big reason. Whether it is a formation or offensive style, we are going to see some Wild Horses on the field this year. It should be fun ;)

Go Broncos!

by Sean in Pa. on Oct 11, 2011 10:39 AM MDT reply actions  

Fans should be Fans

I hope we can come together as Bronco fans! I am ashamed of the fans that have been hurt our team by making home games a horrible place for our own QB to play. It is time we applaud our team and support them ALL! I have not been a proponent of Tebow, but I am now… He is my QB!

by BroncoGirlTX on Oct 11, 2011 10:41 AM MDT reply actions   1 recs

I've seen two types of fans.

Broncos fans and Tebow fans.

The Tebow fans don’t care about the Broncos or their future (unless Tebow is the QB). If Tebow was traded they would jump ship and beat down the team he went to until they started Tebow.

Bronco fans want success for the team no matter who is on the team. I never liked Orton when he was a Bear and I was really pissed at McD for fucking up the deal with Cutler over Cassel (who has proved that he is a decent QB when playing for the Patriots). But I did support Orton after he was traded and I’ll support Tebow now. I don’t really like starting Tebow too soon before he is ready, as it is essentially setting him up for failure. I think Tebow needs a few more years of development and then who knows.

We had the 2nd best offense when McD came in and now we are lucky if we can score more than 20 points in a game. He traded our offensive stars and we got nothing be mediocrity or nothing in return. He set us back about 5 years, maybe more.

by Puckhead1 on Oct 11, 2011 1:02 PM MDT up reply actions  

I have a Tebow fan in my community

masquerading as a Broncos fan, it is annoying to hear him talk, he thinks he knows so much. Tebow is the quarterback now so I approve GO BRONCOS, that team name I capitalized is the operative term here

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:16 PM MDT up reply actions  

You forget the third type of fan “Orton fans”. They are uber defensive, whiny and want nothing more that to see the quiet, dorky, everyman seize the day!

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 2:16 PM MDT up reply actions   1 recs

quiet dorky everyman

with a neckbeard who is a gluttonous alcoholic, he’s got a LOT of Captain in him!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:17 PM MDT up reply actions  

Didn't know there were any....lol

Oh, wait I forgot….they were in Miami at the Dolphins practices.

by Puckhead1 on Oct 12, 2011 1:56 PM MDT up reply actions  

And since you are talking points, Denver only had the 16th ranked scoring offense in 2008 with Cutler as the QB. Back then we averaged 23 ppg.

In Tebow’s 3 and 1/2 starts, we average 25.75 points per game.

Tim Tebow > Kyle Orton

by McGeorge on Oct 11, 2011 2:19 PM MDT up reply actions  

we statisticians are supposed to round up

so I’ll say 25.8, ah heck, 26!

Brad James

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With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:23 PM MDT up reply actions  

I was talking yardage not points.....

We were 2nd to the Saints in offensive yards gained. (3rd in passing yards and 12th in rushing yards).

But points are more important. Although I think Tebow’s are skewed a little. Against the Chargers, they were pretty much sitting on their lead playing prevent defense and his starts at the end of the season teams are less motivated unless they are trying earn a playoff spot.

by Puckhead1 on Oct 12, 2011 2:07 PM MDT up reply actions  

Wow

I don’t think you were quoting yardage

We had the 2nd best offense when McD came in and now we are lucky if we can score more than 20 points in a game.

And as for that last one, do you believe that Orton would have scored those points on SD? There seems to be a LOT of evidence that he would not have.

As for the first premise… I think there are a lot of people that are Broncos fans who love watching what Tim brings to the table. I was a Broncos fan long before the world ever met Tim Tebow and I will be a fan (or dead) after he leaves this team (sooner or later). But I also love to watch talented, passionate football players. When a guy is a stand-up guy and displays the leadership and heart that Tebow does, I WANT TO ROOT FOR HIM and I certainly will regardless of where he dons the helmet (OK if he goes to the Raiders or Dallas, I will just be hoping he moves on). Most recently, I have been arguing on MHR that the path Fox has taken this year is very reasonable and was laid out for him and that he and Elway were not jerking the fans around and lying about their intentions and Tebow needs time.

So now that you are labelling people like so many out there, am I a Bronco fan or a Tebow fan?

Please quit spewing that kind of foolishness. I love the Broncos, but I also love many of the guys that don the uniform too. I just kept shaking my head when we let a guy like Hillis go. I never cared much for the Browns, but I watch them occasionally because I loved what he did for us. It is OK to love both the Team and some of the players.

by Da Bum on Oct 12, 2011 6:00 PM MDT up reply actions  

I havnt been this excited about the Broncos in a long time

I think this is a wise move on Fox’s part. Sticking to his Orton Guns all season could of earned him a lot of enemies amongst the fans and thats not what he needs right now.

What worries me with Tebow is the expectations and just the general position he’s in right now. He’s been handed a 1-4 team in the midst of rebuilding and asked, in only his second year (with a handful of starts under his belt), to go out and prove we shouldn’t draft another QB in the first round of what looks to be a historic QB draft. Hell, even Tom Brady couldn’t meet these expectations in his second year! I guess well have to cross that bridge when we get there but I’d hate to see Tebow not get a full chance while here in Denver, then flourish on another local.

Hyperboles kill.
There is no such thing as a "George Karl fan;" there are Karl apologists, and those who realize he should be fired.
Follow me on Twitter so that I may add a wolf to my wolf pack.
RMC

by GoldenNugget on Oct 11, 2011 10:44 AM MDT via mobile reply actions  

His loyalty is admirable

but there comes a time when loyalty cannot override what is in one’s best own interests. You have to watch out for yourself in this world and Fox’s best move was removing Orton from the starting lineup. In watching my DVR, I could come to no other conclusion than that Tebow’s mere presence galvanized the team remarkably. Everything worked much better, where’s this inspiration, Orton? I guess it’s something aloof from you

Brad James

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With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:30 PM MDT up reply actions  

I agree with you

I am optimistic that TT won’t be a bust but and will surprise the extreme naysayers with his passing ability. This is not saying he will be a great passer but he is not as bad as many would state. I am hoping to see a completion rate around 55%. What I also want to see, need to see really, is TT making planned throws in standard plays down the field. Not gimmicky plays or screens, I know he can do those well (yes he throws a great screen pass which is not as easy as it seems to do). I want to see 15 yard outs, sideline patterns, on target seam throws and some 3rd and long pass conversions where he looks like a QB wanting to throw to more than one receiver versus a guy whose hair is about to catch on fire. He had some close throws Sunday that could have been wonderful gains BUT they did not materialize including a behind the shoulder throw to B-Loyd (BUT was that planned as KO would do or a bad pass?). In pre-season he had some nice throws, especially some play action long balls. Last year (in the three games he played) he had an either super accurate or super lucky miraculous TD pass through 3 defenders to B-Loyd and some other decent throws (including some drops i.e. Lance Ball in the end zone). It will be fun to see him with some consecutive playing time and throws – to see what a larger body of work may bring in the passing game. IF TT can do some of the basics he has more than enough on the intangible and athlete side to make for an exciting several years to come. If he looks like he is more of a throw back to the 50’s then at least we know. Either way this will be fun to see and as stated by the poster this is not a good team anyhow. I for one will happily give TT a lot of leeway the remainder of the year to see what “it is”.

Kyle Orton as in Ortonairy... serviceable at best is what we hope for?

by turnman on Oct 11, 2011 10:54 AM MDT reply actions  

We're not going to see many advanced throwing from Tim this year....

they need an entire offseason to work on that part of his game. Right now, they should be focusing on getting Tebow to execute his bread and butter plays. Mid season is no place to expand his repertoire.

Maybe late in the year we’ll see more, but for now I’d settle for some simple execution from the QB position. Regardless of the play being called. lol

And you are right…either way it will be fun to see.

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 11:12 AM MDT up reply actions  

Tim has quite an autition period ahead of him

I hope he succeeds and turns into someone we can build this franchise around. I know he has quite a challenge in front of him, though. Given the crop of QBs in the 2012 draft and the position the broncos will likely be picking, Tim has to impress to keep the FO from going in another direction. It’s not fair as maybe he should get a couple years to show what he can and can’t do. However, this is the situation he faces and I’m sure he’s up to it.

Go Broncos!

by HBobbyT on Oct 11, 2011 11:17 AM MDT via mobile reply actions  

Speaking of which

Did anyone just hear Jim Rome talking about Tebow this morning? (I know Rome can sound arrogant and all but more often than not I find myself agreeing with him, despite myself.) Anyway, he was pretty candid both positive and negative about Tebow. Basically said Broncos are making the right move at the right time, it’s a "no brainer" to do it now, with the bye week, then Miami, and with Orton not playing well. Said he still has doubts Tebow can be a long term starting QB because of everything that’s already been said, about his flawed fundamentals, only 50% accuracy, etc. Also said he has no doubt TT will continue to do what he can to get better and will work hard and be exciting to watch. All those things are hard to disagree with imho. But basically said it’s the right move but he will believe it when sees it. And Tebow fans who emailed him to say "See?" about Sunday—he said, "See what? I saw all the good and the bad" on display. "I saw Moreno doing all the work on that screen and Lloyd making a circus catch on the sideline." And mentioned how Chargers were not prepared to play vs him so they had trouble stopping his run plays. BUT he did say, again it will be interesting to watch and he has no doubt Tebow will work his tail off to do the best he can.

Anyway, worth a listen if you can find it in the archives later or it’s repeated.

There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers/Lakers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants/Warriors country, and damned proud of it.

by underdog on Oct 11, 2011 11:26 AM MDT reply actions  

Sounds fair

But I think he discounted the effect Tim had on the rest of the team. The thing I love most about this move is that it will give us a more complete answer about Tebows prospects as the future QB of the Broncos. It’s going to be fun to watch.

by HBobbyT on Oct 11, 2011 11:30 AM MDT via mobile up reply actions  

That might be a one time effect...

When Tebow entered the game, the crowd was electric for the first time all game. Defense feeds off the crowd and the crowed was cheering because they finally got to see their man. The shine will wear off as the season goes on, unless Tebow starts winning games. His big play ability will help too but if those plays aren’t happening, the crowd’s energy will subside.

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 11:37 AM MDT up reply actions  

I agree, the defense was energized all game

had nothing to do with Tebow. the D wanted to win that game from the outset, they just couldn’t quite get it done enough times.

I loved seeing that intensity too. Defense is one year away from adding a few more key young players from being a top flight D but they are no doubt moving in the right direction finally!

There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers/Lakers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants/Warriors country, and damned proud of it.

by underdog on Oct 11, 2011 11:58 AM MDT up reply actions  

I know...FINALLY!

I’ve always preferred defense to offense anyway. :)

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 11:59 AM MDT up reply actions  

He did mention that was another reason to do it now

he said either way the coaching staff looks smart. If Tebow does well, it looks like the right move. If he fares poorly they can say, well, we tried/that’s why we were hesitant, etc. As far as effect on team he didn’t mention that but did mention how he fired up the crowd. (Obviously that’s nice but having team energized and on same page is more important.)

There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers/Lakers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants/Warriors country, and damned proud of it.

by underdog on Oct 11, 2011 11:55 AM MDT up reply actions  

Rome did discount

that effect, but I will go to bat for Rome anytime. He is a Broncos fan, and has admitted such through the years, but he is our advocate in the MSM. He is always fair and brings it, that’s why I respect him, even if I don’t agree with him per se. He also defended Jay Cutler today, why Rome why (clones would know I’m mocking the Nancy Kerrigan banged on the knee sound clip:)

Brad James

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With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:44 PM MDT up reply actions  

Underdog

I am a clone and a Broncos fan equally. Tebow didn’t say anything I disagree with on the surface, but deep down he really doesn’t like him. Tebow is tailor made to defy the skeptics, just like Steve Young!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:39 PM MDT up reply actions  

ESPN sure showed itself this morning, talking about the MSM.

New broke that Tebow is named starter and the FIRST person they bring in to comment was Merrill Hoge, the biggest TT hater on the planet. Yesterday he practically had to be restrained because Tim Hasselbach wouldn’t agree with him that TT is aweful. He was foaming at the mouth. PATHETIC!

Then, over on ESPN2, Bayless is having it out with Kordell Stewart, who really shows his hatred. All Stewart could say was he’s only won one game. When Bayless pointed out that so has Cam Newton, Stewart slammed the table and started pouting. CLASSIC.

TT is definately going to be scrutinized for every move he makes. I know there’s going to be growing pains, but I really hope he does enough to shut up the MSM. He’s actually kind of one over the DP gang, maybe he can do some nationally too.

"To err is human. To really screw things up requires a politician"

by Wyo Bronco on Oct 11, 2011 11:55 AM MDT reply actions  

NFL Primetime

has never been the same since NBC took the contract. Trey Wingo sucks at highlight narration and Hoge is just looking to bash, that’s real cool Merrill but Meryl Streep knows more about football than you do, heck so does Meryl Sheep!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:42 PM MDT up reply actions  

Anyone else kind of irritated that Urban Meyer is helping opposing defenses here?

or am I being silly?


PostBroncos Lindsay Jones
RT @wingoz: Urban Meyer joins us on @NFLLIVE today at 4:00 EST to talk about what Tebow can bring, and how to defend him

There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers/Lakers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants/Warriors country, and damned proud of it.

by underdog on Oct 11, 2011 11:57 AM MDT reply actions  

Urb is Tim's biggest fan...

Without Tim, Meyer really doesn’t get as much love as a coach, and I think he knows this. He’ll say something along the lines of “you can’t stop him, you can only hope to contain him.”

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 12:00 PM MDT up reply actions  

Are you KIDDING ME?

As much of a good person Tebow is……..he’d KILL anyone who said anything bad about Urban Meyer or planned against him. . I sure would hope the opposite would be true.

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 12:00 PM MDT up reply actions  

I think you kind of misunderstood me, was just saying I'd hate to have other teams given extra help or advice

even if unwittingly. I know Urban loves Tebow to death and Tebow loves Meyer, that is not in question. Anyway, just being paranoid, don’t mind me — teams will be able to do their own planning/plotting without any help, and it’s up to Broncos to be creative and surprising so they can counteract it.

There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers/Lakers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants/Warriors country, and damned proud of it.

by underdog on Oct 11, 2011 12:24 PM MDT up reply actions  

ah i gotcha!

yeah…

There's no need to fear, Underdog is here! / Broncos/Dodgers/Lakers fan in Niners/Raiders/Giants/Warriors country, and damned proud of it.

by underdog on Oct 11, 2011 12:33 PM MDT up reply actions  

Urban Meyer is my boy

if you did well in my beloved state of Utah and you don’t do anything to let me down, I’m your friend for life, this is true of Anthony Calvillo, the new CFL passing yardage king who matriculated at Utah State University in Logan!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:52 PM MDT up reply actions  

Go Boise State!

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 2:54 PM MDT up reply actions  

I love Broncos

so long as they’re orange and blue, the BC$ is of the devil, so heck yes, GO BOISE!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:55 PM MDT up reply actions  

And I doubt other teams are scouting TV shows,

for the low down on any other team.

If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!

by Trinidad Jack on Oct 11, 2011 1:09 PM MDT up reply actions  

nope

not when there are “geniuses” like Merril Hoge and Joe Theismann breaking down the film :)

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:52 PM MDT up reply actions  

lol

If this be Hell, let us make the most of it!

by Trinidad Jack on Oct 12, 2011 10:07 PM MDT up reply actions  

New beginning

I wasn’t hoping for Orton to fail. He couldn’t close the deal. I hope Tebow’s got it in him because we need a winner. Go Broncos!r

by Baghdad on Oct 11, 2011 12:01 PM MDT reply actions   1 recs

I'd like to add to your tempered analasys

That we all need to remember that it takes at least 500 reps at something in order to get good muscle memory. Tebow is not going to instantly learn to take a snap under center and do a perfect 3/5/7 drop back and pass. We need to be patient and cheer him on if we want some stability at the QB position.

I’m excited about his potential and believe that he has the mental faculty to learn how to be a great QB. I am not however putting him on a pedestal; he is not above failure.

Get well soon Juan.

by Thnikkaman on Oct 11, 2011 1:59 PM MDT up reply actions  

repetition practice et cetera

sounds like sound logic to me

Brad James

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With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 2:59 PM MDT up reply actions  

Video

How awkward is Tebows throwing motion? It would be cool to see videos of other QB’s flipped or tebow flipped so we could compare throwing motion. I don’t have a video editing tool so if someone has one may be they could flip and show. I’ve always thought that all left hand throwers look strange. Just curious.

by Fergenator on Oct 11, 2011 12:26 PM MDT reply actions  

Well...there have been many slo-mo breakdowns...

I’ve seen but if you watch those throws, early in the third quarter, you’ll see. If you want to compare, Elway’s delivery was very mechanically sound. He drops the ball, not as low as he used too, but well below his shoulder then has a looping delivery. He doesn’t so much step into the pass as he does lift his bag leg into it. The loop and the footwork causes the ball to float high. When he tries to overcompensate with a harder throw, he usually skips it into the turf. He is best on the run when his natural ability takes over.

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 12:34 PM MDT up reply actions  

You have have hit the nail on the head Tim.

Don’t go overboard with expectaions. Just be glad the past is the past and time to look foward.

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 12:28 PM MDT reply actions  

there is a propitious future

rife with Lombardis for our Broncos, gee what a poetic thing to say!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 3:00 PM MDT up reply actions  

Not sure

what I did to ruffle your feathers but I thought I was just summarizing Tim’s good article about expectations and being realistic. Not Lombadi trophys or anything poetic.

I thought we were laughing about my Purdue moniker and how I don’t know or remember squat other than liking Brees and not KO. And will easily admit I don’t know 1/10 the football that most do. And won’t intefere in your community.

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 3:32 PM MDT up reply actions  

I was joking!

no ill will intended on my part, forgive me!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 3:52 PM MDT up reply actions  

Nice post Tim

I agree with the overall tone we need to maintain as fans. He is a work in progress and to expect him to make some bad plays and some great plays. It seems to defend against him will require the defense to focus on the center of the field which should play well to the strengths of some of our key players. Lloyd loves to work the sidelines taking a flyer deep every now and then, Knowshon is awesome in space, and Eddie’s on the improv. There will be a tendency for safeties to cheat up and a need to help deep against Lloyd that will open the deep middle for Decker. And I think we have a couple of TEs that can post up against most any LB and hopefully learn spacing in those zones we’ll be seeing. The Koolaid tastes great right now, not sure how much of this we can actually take advantage of with 2 weeks preparation, but at 1-4 we should have some fun trying.

Fans just wanna have f fun

by HippoJohn on Oct 11, 2011 12:41 PM MDT reply actions  

I could care less...

About his footwork, mechanics, etc. I know what I’ve seen in the games that he got into last year and what he showed this past Sunday. The kid is a warrior. He wants to perform and he will drive himself and his teammates to do so every week. Given the the practice time with the 1’s and the familiarity that that will will breed I think his accuracy will improve as he and the receivers get on the same page. The constant reps ( with an emphasis on the intermediate routes I’m sure) will begin the process of ironing out the kinks. Most importantly, Sundays will be FUN again.

Iron Maiden's Gonna Get You

by OldSchoolOrange on Oct 11, 2011 12:49 PM MDT reply actions  

he has the spirit and the will to win

it is always a wise investment to develop skills quarterbacks need to consistently excel. His study and practice sessions will make him sufficiently adept to succeed at all times on the filed, his warrior-esque attributes, as you have justly lionized him with, will make him legendary, it’s up to him!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 3:32 PM MDT up reply actions  

THE AGE OF MEDIOCRITY COMES TO AN END !!

That was my biggest beaf on Orton. Not that he didn’t have talent, he just didn’t seem to have a heart to finish every play. He seemed to fold under the least amount of preasure. This year he looked like he was trying to finally extend some plays but the end result was a couple of mediocre runs and many more INTs. It was obvious that with Orton our choices were ‘Careful….decent stats…lots of losses’ OR ’Extend some plays…INTs…Mediocre runs…and lots of losses.

I’m not saying that Tebow is the final answer to this teams problems, he’s definitely not. I am saying this “Mediocrity is no longer at the helm of our offense.”

I don’t care what people think or say about Tebow, he is fun to watch. He is fun to watch on every play. His passion for the game is obvious.

 We may not win but MEDIOCRITY will no longer be a part of this teams MO.

Guardian of the Gate to La La Land!
Gonsoulin, Taylor, Wright, Gradishar, Atwater, and Davis.....
Why are they not in the Hall...I just don't understand.

by Mike Clark on Oct 11, 2011 1:00 PM MDT reply actions  

I agree with this

I see the same thing in Orton’s play this season. The changes did not work well for him. Different bounces, some calls going our way and we have a different conversation.
We are on our way to a new and very different offense. It will be interesting to watch.

Go Broncos!

by Sean in Pa. on Oct 11, 2011 1:29 PM MDT up reply actions  

My co-worker

said his son got tickets to the game last Sunday and from his catbird seat on the 20-yard line, he reported that Orton had numerous chances to run, (the line did a marvelous job all game long, rack them!) for first downs but was not only reticent but refusing to CAPITALIZE on opportunities. Tebow will give us no such concerns!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 3:34 PM MDT up reply actions  

From my perch on my couch...

with a PBR in my hand I could see Orton had several opportunities to run but didn’t.

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 3:41 PM MDT up reply actions  

as did I!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 3:52 PM MDT up reply actions  

My only big fear

           Will the coaching staff have the patience to stick with Tebow if he has a bad game or two in a row . Or will he get a quick hook and a return to Orton ? I still don’t trust EFX where it pertains to Tebow after all that has been said prior to now. I can only hope they go all in on Tebow for the remainder of the season to see if he can be an above average NFL quarterback . this is not a good team but has some real good pieces in place and the draft needs to be used for other positions of need more than a quarterback .

by ultraclassic04 on Oct 11, 2011 1:13 PM MDT reply actions  

without any pick or comp at all?

How would that make EFC seem

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 1:17 PM MDT up reply actions  

oops EFX

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 1:17 PM MDT up reply actions  

It will make them seem like they had no choice.

Orton has no trade value and having him on the bench will only hurt the team.

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 1:21 PM MDT up reply actions  

They could trade him for a conditional pick....

If Orton takes his new team to the playoffs…they get a 2nd round pick

If not they get a 6th or 7th round pick or maybe no compensation at all if he can’t deliver.

by Puckhead1 on Oct 11, 2011 1:27 PM MDT up reply actions  

Either way, Orton is better off being let go too.

He is still technically in a contract year with no prospects of playing again in 2011.

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 1:29 PM MDT up reply actions  

True...but

if they trade Orton to the Fins (most likely destination), they should wait until after we play them. I think if they just cut Orton loose, he’d end up in Miami and he obviously knows the playbook, audibles, etc. and would give an advantage to Miami.

by Puckhead1 on Oct 11, 2011 1:53 PM MDT up reply actions  

Isn't that throwing the baby out with the bath water?

Do we depend on Quinn? I still have nightmares about Simms and Quinn has shown that same tendency to lose focus. Kyle makes mistakes but he at least keeps his head in the game.

Go Broncos!

by Sean in Pa. on Oct 11, 2011 1:17 PM MDT up reply actions  

It does seem..

like McGahee still backs Orton. That’s what I took from his comment today about it being not enough to just keep it close. I agree, KO needs to be a FA. If TT gets hurt, well the season is a loss anyway so who cares.

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Oct 11, 2011 1:28 PM MDT up reply actions  

McGahee is a pro's pro

he will play well for whoever is at signal-caller, he didn’t run with any less alacrity than he had in the first half when Tebow was installed

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 3:36 PM MDT up reply actions  

@ ultraclass Same fear, and he's one of the reasons.

" Last season in Carolina F played four quarterbacks — Matt Moore, Jimmy Clausen, Brian St. Pierre and Tony Pike. He had four starters in 2007, three in 2002 and two in two other seasons." Ouch.

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 1:30 PM MDT up reply actions  

Understandable fear, but I don't think there's a quick hook (reply to ultraclassic04)

Remember how we all lauded EFX for developing a draft strategy and sticking to it? No panic on game day? Why do we find it so easy to believe there’s no strategy now, or that there hasn’t been one?

Fox is old-school: maybe that just means he wanted to develop a young QB on the bench, and not see him suffer the fate of a David Carr or Tim Couch. (Fortunately, I believe T2 (*) has the ability to work through bunches of adversity, and think he will improve the team around him – not suffer if they’re not all up to par.)

Does Elway still spend time with T2 after practice? Maybe. We don’t know, because practices are closed. Most of what’s been said “prior to now” has been said by everyone trying to fill the void in the non-statements by EFX. Most of the people who said “the QB of the future isn’t on the roster” were the same people who said T2 wouldn’t make it in the NFL. I’ve always been of the opinion that these guys would take a serious look at T2 – and that means game time – as there’s too much potential and too much investment to toss him aside because he doesn’t fit some mold of a QB.

So now the balance has shifted to where there’s more to gain by throwing T2 in the fire. I know Tim welcomes it, and so do I.

(*) I attribute the moniker T2 to Palehorse, and think it fitting.

by MakeCents on Oct 11, 2011 8:05 PM MDT up reply actions  

I think that you might be overlooking something.

Fox mentioned it, I think, last week. A more prototypical offense for Orton (and Quinn), and an offense geared specifically for Tebow. Aren’t you assuming that Tebow will now have to conform to the current offense when this might not necessarily even be the case? What if the current thinking now is for the coaches to design an offense that actually plays to the strengths of Tebow? Is it that far-fetched? (Actually, an A.P. sports writer, Arnie Stapleton, suggested the very same thing today.)

I’m not sure if you remember how John Elway began his career with the Broncos, but he wasn’t your prototypical quarterback, either. He, too, was dual-threat (arm and legs), often known to extend plays, and they ended up building the team around John’s particular talents, and I’m sure that Elway hasn’t forgotten this. Just another two-cents.

by 9798 on Oct 11, 2011 2:47 PM MDT reply actions   1 recs

I think Fox will do what works.

He proved me wrong in my assumption that he’s set in his ways and stubborn. I thought Tebow time was at least 5 weeks away…

by Tim Lynch on Oct 11, 2011 2:53 PM MDT up reply actions  

I never condemned

Coach Zorro this season, when you take a team to within a field goal of a world championship, you get the benefit of the doubt that McDelta Bravo never deserved

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Oct 11, 2011 3:37 PM MDT up reply actions  

organizational decision

Got to believe that there had been some lengthy discussions with Elway on Tebow by Fox and the X man—before Orton was pulled. One of the commenters on ESPN, prior coach and can’t remember who, said this was an “organizational decision” as both Orton and Quinn were in their last year. The team had to find out whether Tebow was going to be a long term answer or not, before the next draft. My feeling is that Elway had given Fox the green light to yank Orton and put in Tebow (obviously Quinn wasn’t 2nd string under these circumstances). Based on this, and the 1-4 record, the “best chance to win” was no longer a factor. This was a business decision. If Elway hadn’t previously given Fox the green light to pull Orton in the middle of a game if he was stinking it up, I’ll eat my hat and everyone elses.

by bronco.fan on Oct 11, 2011 3:38 PM MDT up reply actions  

Gamer? You say gamer!!!
if Tebow doesn’t play the team out of position of the quarterbacks in the 2012 draft, then he will not have secured himself a starting job. The ball is in his hands now, so its time to find out just how much of a “gamer” he is.

I do not even feel this is going out on a limb: Tebow has enough “gamer” in him to float a battle ship and, risking my scout’s eye rep, will do very well this year considering his supporting cast and his near rookie status. My read? We have our QB of the future. He is about to show how much of a gamer he is.

"Peace, a journey without distance to a place we have never left."

by BroncoCUbuffs on Oct 11, 2011 3:32 PM MDT reply actions  

hear

Earth to Fox: Let Tebow play his own game.

by Boiler etc on Oct 11, 2011 3:45 PM MDT up reply actions  

one thing fox and orton did

was to lower the bar. really, really lower it. thank god. now tebow can stink up the joint and still salvage a little something by running around and setting our hearts aflutter. if he had started the season he could have done nothing but disappoint. even if he played alone, one on eleven, won by ninety nine points and crocheted us all personalized tea cozies, we woulda been let down. nothing resets the gain quite like watching orton mediocre us into irrelevancy yet again, or to see the cold, dead fisheyes of the stunned, apathetic fans wishing they’d stayed home to watch a ‘murder she wrote’ re-run instead. anything is better than the half life of ortonification. now tim gets more reasonable expectations. may he prosper.

"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you different."
— Kurt Vonnegut

by orange cube on Oct 11, 2011 6:13 PM MDT reply actions  

"Let The Growing Pains Begin"

The mid-life crisis was painful too. I’ll gladly accept pain if I think I’m going somewhere.

by MakeCents on Oct 11, 2011 7:44 PM MDT reply actions  

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