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Around SBN: Drug Testing, Alistair Overeem & UFC 146's Potential Legacy

As the Broncos continue to make the unlikely climb from worst to first, and as Denver continues to supplant unbeaten Green Bay as the story of the 2011 season, the irony is the person who helped make it all possible no longer is a part of it. McDaniels is battling through a challenging season in St. Louis, but his legacy is on display in Denver.

5 months ago Milehighreport_tiny John Bena 125 comments 0 recs  | 

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What a soft ball article. Of course McJedi barely found a way to play Tebow as our season and his HC career went down the toilet.

Josh’s legacy was on display as we got our asses handed to us 59-14 vs Oakland and someone on his staff gladly ratted him out as a cheater.

Tim Tebow is Denver's 2012 starting QB. I'm not even kind of sorry that offends some of you.

by McGeorge on Dec 16, 2011 10:36 AM MST reply actions   2 recs

+1000

I’d also add this: Given McD’s huge ego, does anyone honestly believe that he would have tailored his offense to fit Tebow’s skill set? Josh would still be trying to shove the round peg that is TT through the square hole that was McD’s pass-happy offense.

Oh, and you can bet that Champ would have been let go in favor of drafting Patrick Peterson. Think our D would look like it does? This isn’t Josh’s legacy on display. This is what a franchise looks like when it escapes his legacy.

by OrangeTexan on Dec 16, 2011 10:58 AM MST via mobile up reply actions   1 recs

Yea, I do. All things being equal I’d take McD as an OC over McCoy. Look at what McD did with Cassel and Orton.

If you think McD is just pass happy, you aren’t paying attention. When he had Brady, Moss and Welker he was pass happy. When he had Cassel he used QB runs more and rushed more. With Orton, he fitted the system around play action passing because Orton’s in ability to handle pressure dictated a play action pass system to give him more time (he was so committed to it, we ran the ball ineffectively to keep the threat of the playaction in place). Seems to me he would tweek his offense to suit the talents of his players.

However, all things aren’t equal. McD as HC was not going to work after spygate 2 and after a year and half of McD temper tatantrums (both on the sideline and likely at practice).

by McJay on Dec 16, 2011 11:16 AM MST up reply actions   2 recs

All things being equal, No Effin' Way!

I say that based purely on how obvious it has become that Josh’s people skills were abhorrent. How many comments have come out that basically say something to the effect of “I hated coming to work under the prior coach”?

His football smarts couldn’t begin to overcome his obviously terrible people skills. I mean, just look at the defense – other than Von and Bunkley, that is basically the same defense as last year. What a difference! That to me says that the guys wouldn’t play for McD.

Also, did you see St. Louis vs. Seattle the other night? They had 7 plays Goal To Go from the 1. The first 6 plays, he didn’t even have Steven Jackson on the field! are you kidding me??? Not only is this stupid from a simple Xs and Os standpoint, it is incredibly stupid from a people skills standpoint. Steven Jackson has been an saint for St. Louis – never complained, always performed at a high level, played injured, rallied his team even when they sucked so hard. And in a tight game with 6 plays goal-to-go you have him standing on the sidelines while you try and fail over and over with cute Patriots passing plays? That is so demoralizing to the absolute heart and soul of that team. They finally put him in on the 7th play, handed him the ball and he steamrolled about 3 guys into the endzone. The look on his face before and after the play suggest that he was probably picturing himself hitting McDaniels when he rolled the defenders. He was pissed.

I was a McD believer for a while at the beginning, but I would NEVER take him back in any role now with hindsight.

by Bradoncadonc on Dec 16, 2011 11:38 AM MST up reply actions   1 recs

Elvis Von and Bunkley

Losing Elvis last year hurt big time.

of course I still agree with your post and am glad we’ve moved on.

by trumanj on Dec 16, 2011 2:16 PM MST up reply actions  

"tweek his offense to suit the talent of his players"

Really? I guess that’s why we ditched our zone blocking scheme in favor of power blocking. With our OL, that worked wonders for our running game. Scheffler? Nah. We couldn’t utilize our talented pass-catching TE. Nope. TEs are made for blocking only. Hillis? How exactly did we tweek the scheme to fit him? How about Larsen? We kept him on the bench in favor of a single back set. I could go on and on…..

by OrangeTexan on Dec 16, 2011 11:53 AM MST via mobile up reply actions   1 recs

Hillis showed this year how soft he is.

Good ridance.

" Blessed is the one who does not walk in step with the wicked" -Psalm 1
"God tolerates even our stammering, and pardons our ignorance whenever something inadvertently escapes us – as, indeed, without this mercy there would be no freedom to pray." -- John Calvin

by JohnCalvinKnox on Dec 16, 2011 11:41 PM MST up reply actions  

You would take McD over McC?

When McD is sporting the leagues worst offense with bradford at QB? So much for “offensive genius” and “QB guru”

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:07 PM MST up reply actions  

Chris Simms

Victory is sweet, even deep in the cheap seats.

by KoloradoKaos on Dec 16, 2011 12:08 PM MST up reply actions  

Lawernce Maroney

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:09 PM MST up reply actions  

Alphonso Smith

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:18 PM MST up reply actions  

Nope, he's a bust

oh and passing on matthews or orakpo for him

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:32 PM MST up reply actions  

Bust is such an ugly word.

"I'm going to be a Bronco forever" -Rahim Moore

by Pmoreno95 on Dec 16, 2011 4:13 PM MST up reply actions  

Though I will give him credit....

for ditching Nate Webster…..oh the pain of a name!

by OrangeTexan on Dec 16, 2011 12:18 PM MST via mobile up reply actions  

but replaced that Nate with nate jones

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:18 PM MST up reply actions  

doh!

The last few years were so damn rough!

by OrangeTexan on Dec 16, 2011 12:20 PM MST via mobile up reply actions  

Its been hard since 06...

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:22 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

at least with McCoy we win

and we don’t need secretly-planted cameras to do it

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 12:09 PM MST up reply actions  

He also seems to know how to have an effective running game

something McD thinks is a thing of the past

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:14 PM MST up reply actions  

that is true

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 12:45 PM MST up reply actions  

McDaniels gets too much credit for Cassel

So much so that two teams have mistakenly labelled him a genius and hired him to run their team/offense. Remember, he was installing Matt Cassel into an offense that had put up more points than any team in history the previous season and that continues to chug along WITHOUT Josh McDaniels.

How well has he done coaching up a replacement for Sam Bradford?

I think the Broncos are winning in spite of McDaniels, not thanks to him. Only two of his draft picks remain from his first draft, and Knowshon is probably done now. Alphonso Smith and Peyton Hillis excelled with other teams and were given up for a song.

www.rhunekincaid.com

by YouAreSignedIn on Dec 16, 2011 1:33 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

To be fair

alphonso smith HAD to go.

It was a HORRIBLE pick by McD and the pressure to remove that blemish was far too great on a crappy inexperienced coach.

by trumanj on Dec 16, 2011 2:26 PM MST up reply actions  

and ZO looks pretty good in Detroit!

he plays exactly as we thought he would

Davis and Smith to the Hall!

"Teamwork divides the task and double the success."
- Unknown

by Jon Tollerud on Dec 17, 2011 12:38 PM MST up reply actions  

wish i thought of that one

luckily im a bronco and a blazer fan

by chikndnnr on Dec 17, 2011 10:03 AM MST up reply actions  

Yes… yes.

Tim Tebow is Denver's 2012 starting QB. I'm not even kind of sorry that offends some of you (including you Elway).

by McGeorge on Dec 17, 2011 2:42 PM MST up reply actions  

so yes, Quiefs PLEASE draft

McDummy Savant

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 12:00 PM MST up reply actions  

absolutely McGeorge

while Tebow is a wholesome Christian person, McDaniels is for all intents and purposes Satan incarnate. He screwed us and if we ever cross paths, he’d better hope I am not carrying a firearm

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 11:58 AM MST up reply actions  

Easy there

Never provide motive and intent in writing anywhere.

by Broncologist on Dec 16, 2011 12:27 PM MST up reply actions  

sorry

that’s the Italian temper in me coming out, it needs to be harnessed more fully

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 12:35 PM MST up reply actions  

Thanks for some of the picks McD but

Dave Logan made a good point to a caller that was giving mcD credit for our teams success. Being a good talent evaluator and some good draft picks doesn’t equal him being a good coach. He didn’t use the talent of the team, he lost the locker room, he cheated, he acted like he was above dealing with the lowly fans and media, his record speaks for itself, and Oakland game. So thanks for SOME draftees, but you were a terrible coach.

by eastCOrange&Blue on Dec 16, 2011 10:52 AM MST reply actions  

McDaniels is a Rain Man savant

who cannot relate to people, no way in heck we have this sustained success with him

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 11:59 AM MST up reply actions  

McDaniel's fallacy was trying to be everything

Keep hating on him all you want, he did some very good things. I for one am hoping he doesn’t end up in KC…because they will make him do only a few things and he will be able to focus on them and do well. KC has talented guys on offense…he could make them very dangerous and he would have the QBs that know his system.

And as far as “didn’t use the talent of the team”…that is utter BS. He made Orton and our WRs look very VERY good (beyond their ceilings in my opinion).

"Bombs dropping down overhead. Underground. It's instilled to want to live." -EV

by sadaraine on Dec 16, 2011 11:03 AM MST reply actions   2 recs

I agree. There is too much of a McD sucks at everything attitude. His record is mixed. Did he miss on some draft picks or FAs? yes. But he hit on others. He wasn’t terrible in a Matt Millen sense. His game day coaching left something to be desired, but his clock management was good and his game plans generally were good.

I predicted when he was fired he would end up in KC, but I expected it to be in 2013 (didn’t think Haley would get booted this year). I hope he doesn’t end up there because he is still one of the better offensive coaches in the league.

I don’t know that McD is ready to get a HC job just yet. One of his big shortcomings was the ability to bring in a quality staff. He hadn’t worked with enough coaches so he got a lot of left overs and guys that no one else wanted. Maybe if Spags gets fired, he would follow McD to wherever and be his DC. But I think McD would be better served being an assistant a few more years and then take over for Belicheck. But I think he will end up in KC unless the fans revolt enough to prevent it.

McD’s other problem was his inability to be a leader as a coach. Lloyd basically said McD was too much like a player—he related great to the players because of the age. But as a coach you need to be above the players. Being as emotional as the players and yelling at everyone won’t work. Is McD mature enough now to be a better leader? I doubt it which is why he should stay as an OC for a few more years.

But if he is given a chance to succeed and is in a “Patriot way” system, I think he will be a good coach and have success.

by McJay on Dec 16, 2011 11:12 AM MST up reply actions   2 recs

Too true

I also wonder how much McCoy remembers/was informed of/ uses of what Josh was talking about when he was saying “We’re going to bring some things into the NFL that have never been seen before”?

A pessimist sees the difficulties in every opportunity.
An optimist sees the opportunities in every difficulty.
- Winston Churchill

First (and only, in our lifetimes) team to three consecutive SB wins (perhaps and then some)!!!! ( =

by PearlJamBroncoGFunk on Dec 16, 2011 12:53 PM MST up reply actions  

Considering his offense is the worst in the NFL, I say please, please, please be stupid enough to hire him KC.

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:10 PM MST up reply actions  

to be fair

they have no WR’s, their OL sucks, and Bradford’s clearly not ready to handle the complexity of McD’s system. Supposedly, according to this article, the Rams will be looking to keep McD even if they fire Spags, which I found interesting. It seems no one is blaming McD for the failure of the Rams O this year

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 16, 2011 12:22 PM MST up reply actions  

K.I.S.S

Victory is sweet, even deep in the cheap seats.

by KoloradoKaos on Dec 16, 2011 12:26 PM MST up reply actions  

McDaniels will never be simple

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 16, 2011 12:29 PM MST up reply actions  

if you mean keep it short and stupid

then this epitomizes McDaniels aptly

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 1:45 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

Can you imagine

if McD was made head coach in Stl? Or better yet, Kansas City, where he got scolded after humiliating them all game.

by RoxWS2014 on Dec 16, 2011 12:26 PM MST up reply actions  

Supposedly he really impressed Bowlen and Ellis

and if you remember, there was a nice crop of coaches that year, and he impressed them so much they made him the first hire over guys like Spags, Ryan, etc.

McD is a great kiss-ass is what I’m trying to say. I wouldn’t be surprised if he has STL and KC in a bidding war

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 16, 2011 12:31 PM MST up reply actions  

Fine by me if KC gets him

he’s a shittier version of haley

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:33 PM MST up reply actions  

I don't know...

with Cassel again, and not full authority over personnel decisions, it could work out. I’d like to see him as far away from this division as possible.

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 16, 2011 12:41 PM MST up reply actions  

Moeaki as well

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 16, 2011 12:46 PM MST up reply actions  

They will

but even with all of those pieces in place, we nearly beat the Chiefs at Arrowhead last year

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 1:53 PM MST up reply actions  

I dont see it. Not at all

McD is a terrible evaluator of talent, terrible game planner, terrible coach, and a terrible motivator. The Chiefs would be absolutely stupid to pick him up. And I for one would be a very happy fan

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:46 PM MST up reply actions  

McD had his faults

but to say he was a terrible coach is far off. Everyone knows once this guy matures he’ll be a good coach, and I don’t want that in our division

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 17, 2011 12:02 AM MST up reply actions  

lemme rephrase that

to say he’s a terrible coach, like he’ll always be a terrible coach, is pretty far off. He was clearly not ready for this job, but if he finally matures in KC it will make them a tough opponent for years

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 17, 2011 12:03 AM MST up reply actions  

McDaniels is going to be out of the NFL very soon

so no, not “everyone knows once he matures he’ll be a good coach.” Im not sure what potential you guys see in him other than just saying “he’s going to be a good coach” No he wont. At this point he’s pretty much fail at OC also

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 17, 2011 12:28 AM MST up reply actions  

Remember that Raider fans said the same thing about Shanahan.

" Blessed is the one who does not walk in step with the wicked" -Psalm 1
"God tolerates even our stammering, and pardons our ignorance whenever something inadvertently escapes us – as, indeed, without this mercy there would be no freedom to pray." -- John Calvin

by JohnCalvinKnox on Dec 16, 2011 11:45 PM MST up reply actions  

exactly

McD made some terrible choices but he’s got the potential to be a very good coach, like Shanny did in Oakland

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 17, 2011 12:04 AM MST up reply actions  

Shanahan was a very good OC with SF

his tenure with OAK wasnt horrible, just that Davis changes HCs like depends. McD is in no way, shape, or forn anywhere near the potential that Shanahan was.

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 17, 2011 12:26 AM MST up reply actions  

my co-worker is just like that

both he and McDaniels are the biggest turds ever, even bigger than Carlton Banks on the Fresh Prince

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 1:47 PM MST up reply actions  

Josh McDaniels is an ass kisser

and he wanted young, gifted, over paied football players to kiss his ass while in Denver. Those that refused to kiss his ass and saw the error of Pat Bowlens ways and saw the error of Josh McDaniels ways were sent on their way.

Victory is sweet, even deep in the cheap seats.

by KoloradoKaos on Dec 19, 2011 8:29 AM MST up reply actions  

Cough… brandon lloyd… cough

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:34 PM MST up reply actions  

have you seen who they have besides him?

all those guys likely wouldn’t make anyother NFL roster

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 16, 2011 12:42 PM MST up reply actions  

Does anyone outside of denver know who our own recievers are?

you make due with what you have, and Bradford seemed to have regressed under McD this year

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:49 PM MST up reply actions  

I don't agree with this at all

they have terrible WR’s, just because I’m not a fan of the Rams doesn’t mean I don’t know that. We don’t have great ones but we have young talented ones who are pretty good right now and will hopefully continue to develop. And yes, I know people know at least Eric Decker outside of here, and some others know Royal and Thomas as well

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 16, 2011 1:08 PM MST up reply actions  

I do agree though that Bradford has regressed though

but I think there are a lot of factors as to why the O is failing in STL

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 16, 2011 1:10 PM MST up reply actions  

He regressed because he wasn't ready for a bible of a playbook

Bradford is still a young QB and trying to learn\remember MCD’s plays probably caused him to triple think all of his throws etc.

again its adjusting your offense to your personnel, which isn’t one of McD’s strengths.

by trumanj on Dec 16, 2011 2:32 PM MST up reply actions  

Hmmm...statistic fallacies much?

You are lumping in the poor talent in St. Louis with McDaniel’s capabilities to coordinate and offence, though I am surprised he hasn’t done better with them honestly.

"Bombs dropping down overhead. Underground. It's instilled to want to live." -EV

by sadaraine on Dec 16, 2011 1:16 PM MST up reply actions  

statistic fallicies?

If by that you mean the worst scoring offense in the NFL, then yes. I think the excuses for McDaniels have been played out well enough over here

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 2:07 PM MST up reply actions  

The StL offense sucks this year. No doubt about it.

McDaniels was the OC for the 07 NE offense which was one of the greatest of all time.

Using one season to assess a coach or system isn’t a reasonable method. You have to look at a coach over several seasons—how much has got out of his players vs. other coaches. On the whole, McD has gotten more out of his players than other coaches. The exception is this year in St. L. You are trying to say that is the norm. It isn’t.

by McJay on Dec 16, 2011 3:12 PM MST up reply actions  

That offense hasnt skipped a beat since McD left

ours was mediocre under him. Nothing dazzling about it, except for those couple of times we blew out KC. So yeah, take into context his 1.5 years here, and the year in STL, and you can start to see a pattern forming. The MNF game they had against the giants was a mirror image of the offense under McD. Tons of yards through the air, then settles for 3.

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 4:26 PM MST up reply actions  

HAHA

McD did have football ADD

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 16, 2011 12:21 PM MST up reply actions  

One extra cool thing

about if McD does go to KC… ha ha or SD – is the autographed pic, I got where he wrote “Go Broncos!” and signed, will always bring me a chuckle.

A pessimist sees the difficulties in every opportunity.
An optimist sees the opportunities in every difficulty.
- Winston Churchill

First (and only, in our lifetimes) team to three consecutive SB wins (perhaps and then some)!!!! ( =

by PearlJamBroncoGFunk on Dec 16, 2011 12:50 PM MST up reply actions  

Think the second half of this season has been exciting?

Just imagine how excited you’d be if the 2008 core of talented young offensive players had been kept intact and Pat Bowlen would have done the right thing by hiring a mature Defensive minded HC and FO.

The Broncos would have won the weak ass west the past three years and at a minimum been to the AFC championship and superbowl. Not to mention been the 1st seed in the AFC this year on their way back to the superbowl for a rematch with the Packers.

Now that’s excitement.

Victory is sweet, even deep in the cheap seats.

by KoloradoKaos on Dec 16, 2011 11:15 AM MST reply actions  

Marshall was not going to last here long term. No matter the coach. BM basically got a teammate killed. You don’t think there were major issues in the Bronco’s locker room over that the past few years? BM had to go.

If you want Cutler over TT fine. Most of the football analysts will agree with you. Most Bronco fans would not.

And your boy Hillis has shown to be a bit of a primadona and who knows how long his career will last.

Regardless of the skill players, I think the 2008 OL was on the cusp of imploding. We needed to replace 3 positions on it quickly and I’m not sure how Shanny would have done that. Our young WR aside, our OL is still one of the biggest issues on our team right now. 2009 with Shanny may not have been as good as we all thought back in 2008.

by McJay on Dec 16, 2011 11:21 AM MST up reply actions  

2009 with Shanny? Where did that come from

unless Mike has all of a sudden turned into a mature Defensive minded HC. I was calling for Shannahans job several years ago.

With a FO, HC, coaching staff and defense similar to this 2011 group, what I stated is not at all far fetched at all.

Victory is sweet, even deep in the cheap seats.

by KoloradoKaos on Dec 16, 2011 11:39 AM MST up reply actions  

Shanny was part of that great 2008 team you like to refer to. The only way for it to have continued was if he stayed in 2009 (and to be frank, part of the success of the 08 team was his offense)

Most new coaches are going to bring in their players and coaches. That is the way it goes. When Shanny was fired, the entire 2008 team was put on notice. If it wasn’t McD it would have been another coach that would have come in to clean house.

The only reason Fox didn’t clean house on the offensive side is that McCoy happens to be one of his guys. If Fox came in and Jeremy Bates was the OC, Bates would have likely been canned. Just the way it is in the NFL with new coaches.

by McJay on Dec 16, 2011 3:16 PM MST up reply actions  

Speaking of the o-line from that era, we actually drafted some good guys, and then inexplicably let them go. Chris Myers, now anchoring the Texas O Line, comes to mind. I am sure there are others that I can’t think of at the moment.

by Bradoncadonc on Dec 16, 2011 11:53 AM MST up reply actions  

speaking of the o-line from that era

11 sacks given up in 2008.

Victory is sweet, even deep in the cheap seats.

by KoloradoKaos on Dec 16, 2011 12:00 PM MST up reply actions  

08 was a great OL. But it wasn’t going to last. We didn’t know it at the time but Harris was near the end of his career (injuries). Wiegman is old (still doing ok in KC but not a long term solution) and Hamilton was basically done.

The 08 line was not going to continue to play like it did even if it was kept in tact.

by McJay on Dec 16, 2011 3:18 PM MST up reply actions  

it's true Kaos

but credit Mr. Bowlen for being man enough to admit he made a colossal mistake and hiring the right coach, we will now dominate the AFC West for years because the Dolts and Faiders have no future and the Quiefs are adamant about hiring McDaniels!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 12:02 PM MST up reply actions  

learning from his mistake does say a lot about Pat Bowlen

then having the nerve to fire Josh McDaniels before more damage could be done was also a grown up decision. Then having the ability to hire the exact opposite of Josh McDaniels and an HC that was really the type that the 2009 Denver Broncos needed says more.

I’d like to know how involved John Elway has been in the decision making since just before Josh McDaniels was rightfully fired.

For some reason I get the feeling that John Elway was as disgusted as I was not only with the Josh McDaniels hire but also what Josh McDaniels did to our favorite organization, team, it’s players and fan base.

Victory is sweet, even deep in the cheap seats.

by KoloradoKaos on Dec 16, 2011 12:22 PM MST up reply actions  

absolutely

it was almost as if we were the Patriots (shudder)

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 12:23 PM MST up reply actions  

There is one corner office at Dove Valley. It used to belong to Shanny. The McD moved in.

Then Elway came into the picture. Connect the dots. There is only one big dog office and it is more than just a symbol. Elway wears the pants in the Bronco organization. As soon as he came into the fold officially, there was no chance McD could stay and there is likely no chance that a big name coach (e.g., like a Cower type) will coach here. Just not the way the league works.

I’m glad Elway is in charge though. I think Bowlen is/was losing it. He seemed to fire Shanny with no real plan. Then he hired McD without an effective structure to make him successful. Elway has brought some sanity to the organization until earlier this season when he refused to publically support Tebow.

I think Elway is in a corner now and has to keep Tebow but I’m not 100% certain he will. What is irnoic is that the organization has been looking for a franchise QB for over 12 years, finally finds one and can’t admit. Stupid really.

by McJay on Dec 16, 2011 3:23 PM MST up reply actions  

John Fox would have been the perfect hire 2 years ago

and he’s looking like the perfect guy to have hired this year as well

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:17 PM MST up reply actions  

Fox is ok, but we are winning because of our DC and Tebow. Period. There are several other coaches that could be in charge here and get similar results. Fox is not bringing anything special to the table other than not screwing things up. Good guy and with Tebow may be he is enough for us to get to the SB. But I’ve always seen him as a transitional coach.

by McJay on Dec 16, 2011 3:25 PM MST up reply actions  

Im not sure how many other coaches would have broken in Tebow the way Fox has

and Allen isnt the only reason for the defensive turnaround. Fox has a big hand in it, I would be shocked if it was all Allen in his first year. We are not winning because of Allen and Tebow period. I think some guy named Von Miller has a huge hand in this turnaround. Along with some other bums on defense

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 4:29 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

I agree with Calikula

it is John Fox for the most part, time to give him credit. Fox knows defense and should be congratulated for what he’s done with the offense and Tebow.

Victory is sweet, even deep in the cheap seats.

by KoloradoKaos on Dec 19, 2011 8:19 AM MST up reply actions  

Just imagine how excited you’d be if the 2008 core of talented young offensive players had been kept intact

I’ve successfully moved on. All those guys (Hillis, Cutler, Marshall, Scheffler) have not been as good as we all thought they would. I wouldn’t say our O is better off without them but I think we’re finding they were all individually overrated.

I’m cool with Tebow, Decker, Thomas and this OL for the future, and hopefully one more WR and a RB and I don’t think we’re far off from that offense

C'mon, join us, there's plenty of koolaid on the Broncos bandwagon for everyone!

by DBroncs1414 on Dec 16, 2011 12:25 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

rumor.

i heard a rumor that he wanted to play Tebow game one as a rookie and trade orton. I heard the FO stepped in and wouldn’t allow it. i didn’t think they stopped much of what he wanted to do so this would have been a surprise. but if its the case i kinda feel a tiny bit sorry for him.

by slicka007 on Dec 16, 2011 11:17 AM MST reply actions  

that's right

what a mistake Mr. Bowlen made that time

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 12:02 PM MST up reply actions  

Legacy???

A large number of the players we have on this team were here before McD or came after he left. Then of the guys he did bring in, many were brought to compensate for guys he let go (Brady Quinn, D Thomas, Beadles, Walton, etc.) So in the end, all he did was strip the team of talent.

by Triz06 on Dec 16, 2011 11:22 AM MST reply actions  

McDaniels has nothing to do with our resurgence

It has been as much about defense as Tebow, if not more, and Josh neglected our defense do bad, someone should have called CPS…

REVELATION 6:8
And I looked, and behold a pale [Bronco]: and his name that sat on him was [Tebow], and [a Ferocious Defense] followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth [Quarter of the Game], to kill with [the 1st ranked run attack], and with [clutch plays], and with [bone crunching sacks], and with the beasts of the [Mile HIgh City].

by Trapped in O.C. on Dec 16, 2011 11:27 AM MST via mobile reply actions  

If anything, the results this year speak to McDaniel’s lack of leadership ability.

He had the same players, but couldn’t get results to save his job.

Fox is taking the players and getting results from them.

What does that say?

by charlesnelsonreilly on Dec 16, 2011 11:31 AM MST reply actions  

That Pat Bowlen made the biggest mistake in Team history

and quite possible NFL history by hiring Josh McDaniels.

Victory is sweet, even deep in the cheap seats.

by KoloradoKaos on Dec 16, 2011 12:02 PM MST up reply actions  

that McDaniels and Orton both SUCK

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 12:03 PM MST up reply actions  

When Fox was playing Orton we were 1-4.

The key change was Orton to Tebow, not McD to Fox.

Really, our team has been basically the same the past 3 years. Good enough to be losing by 1 score or in the 4th Quarter each week.

The difference is our QB now can gut out wins. Under Orton, the QB and the team folded.

Statistically, our defense isn’t that great and can get torched by decent QBs. We really aren’t that different now than before.

by McJay on Dec 16, 2011 3:28 PM MST up reply actions  

Last year under McD, we were routinely blown out by teams like Oak, SD, allowed STL to score 36 at home, we would lose to some terrible teams. Fox’s losses have been close, except to teams like GB and DET, and those teams are vastly superior to the teams we got blown out by last year

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 4:31 PM MST up reply actions  

Josh

Unfortunately was in over his head. Did some good, alot of bad. Mike Nolan hire was pretty good

by Baghdad on Dec 16, 2011 11:35 AM MST reply actions  

Had Josh started Tebow earlier he might have gotten a pass for the rest of last season...

If that were the case, he would probably still be in charge here… Which would also probably mean that Champ Bailey would be playing somewhere else….

J

by Jezru on Dec 16, 2011 11:58 AM MST reply actions  

The 2009 draft was bull

Though Ayers does a very good job as a run-stuffing LDE, and Bruton one of our best special teamers (don’t know if Moreno is going to be here very longer, too inconsistent for a 1st round pick imo).. But will give McD a little credit for the first 5 picks of the 2010 draft:

D. Thomas, Tebow, Beadles, Walton, Decker

You could argue if Demaryius was worth a 1st round pick, but injuries have definitely derailed him. And there will still be doubters in the case of Tebow, but he hit bull’s eye with the 3 last-mentioned picks.

by Mad Mel on Dec 16, 2011 12:03 PM MST reply actions  

Bay Bay

was pretty ridiculous in college, and has made it count when he’s healthy (and trying) on the field. I know he’s an arguable first rounder. But I truly believe he was the most talented receiver in that draft (including Dez the headcase).

by RoxWS2014 on Dec 16, 2011 12:33 PM MST up reply actions  

he had a broken foot when we drafted him

A developmental injured player could have been had later in the 2nd and held onto the picks we needed to take Tebow

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:36 PM MST up reply actions  

He was a late first rounder on most draft boards according to the experts

But I like where your head’s at, and I hope I don’t get thrown out for saying this, but we probably could have held on to those picks we traded for Tebow and gotten him in the second round. But I’m happy with both those selections.

by RoxWS2014 on Dec 16, 2011 12:41 PM MST up reply actions  

Why would you get thrown our for that?

Oh nevermind, EXILE!!!

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson
"When John Elway is standing in lava with a football, he will stay there and sink until you're open"
-Seanbaby

by Calikula on Dec 16, 2011 12:49 PM MST up reply actions  

Retardation to its highest caliber

McDaniels couldn’t and wouldn’t develop talent. His draft picks and acquisitions are having success because they are playing in schemes that fit their skills.
Do I need to remind you of the horrid power scheme our o-line was forced to employ? Or the disgusting “3-4” that Josh orchestrated, ignoring the most important pieces in it, and paying no attention to the fact that our front 7 players were ill suited for that formation.

This guy had a strict plan that he didn’t deviate from. Problem is you have to adapt in any line of work. There is no “secret formula” to success.

by ShyandObese on Dec 16, 2011 12:11 PM MST reply actions   1 recs

M.I.G.

Victory is sweet, even deep in the cheap seats.

by KoloradoKaos on Dec 19, 2011 8:15 AM MST up reply actions  

I don't believe Tebow means anything in terms of McD as a coach.

Everyone knew he could identify and coach QBs, what made him an awful coach was the fact that he couldn’t draft or develop the other positions.

A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings. ~Earl Wilson

by Bloynoys on Dec 16, 2011 12:13 PM MST reply actions  

Josh McDaniels was classic case of Hubris

Came in blew up the O-Line scheme (Zone blocking here was working just fine)
Alienated Cutler (Who was a bitch about it I’ll admit)
Drafted poorly (Dick Quinn, Alphonso Smith, Seth Olsen)

Then on top of all that, the idiot hires the bigger idiot who got caught taping in NE and then gets caught taping while working for Denver.

Atheist for Tim Tebow!

by CombatChuk on Dec 16, 2011 12:34 PM MST reply actions  

Cutler wouldn't have gone well long-term I'm sure

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Dec 16, 2011 12:35 PM MST up reply actions  

Don't be so sure.

Victory is sweet, even deep in the cheap seats.

by KoloradoKaos on Dec 19, 2011 8:02 AM MST up reply actions  

Refuse to give McDumbass any credit for what is going on

A baseball park is the one place where a man's wife doesn't mind his getting excited over somebody else's curves

by waterboy31321 on Dec 16, 2011 1:09 PM MST reply actions  

Josh McDaniels spent five 1st-round draft picks in his two years here

Odds say that at least two of them work out well – in their first year, even. So hip, hop, hooray for McDaniels for being sub-par choosing draft prospects. I’m glad he chose Tim Tebow, but give me a break. The article might as well be called, “McDaniels made one good draft decision”.

As to the article saying ‘nobody would be surprised if McDaniels takes over Haley’s job’. Bullshit. I’d be shocked. Sports writers aren’t businessmen. McDaniels is, IMO, undesirable and is not hireable as a HC. He failed epically as HC in Denver and has now taken Steven Jackson, Brandon Lloyd, Sam Bradford and the STL offense backwards as OC for the Rams. McDaniels has now failed in this last two positions. He’ll not be given a new HC opportunity any time soon. In fact, if McDaniels gets fired from STL at the end of the year, I wouldn’t be surprised if he ends up having to take a demotion somewhere else.

In the end, McDaniels did bring us some of the guys we currently have. But he was also batting far below .500 in choosing talent for us that have actually lived up to their draft position. He cheated. He lost his team. And he’s since taken the Rams’ offense backwards. So thanks for Tebow, Josh. But you can still kiss my a*s. And anyone that thinks he’s a realistic option for Piolo in KC needs to put down the ganja. You’ll never hear an NFL personnel man say something like that. Somebody who’s actually been in charge of things before, like say Charlie Casserly, they would never say such a stupid thing, IMO.

Teams that want to bend it like Brady better be ready to get broken like Cassel. We hurt quarterbacks and we take picks to he house. It's what we do.

by Rodney A on Dec 16, 2011 1:39 PM MST reply actions   1 recs

It's funny to wander over on to AP

I’d say it’s about 65-35 in favor of having Josh. One of the arguments for is because he won’t be completely in charge with their power structure like he was here. The arguments against are the results the Broncos had with him.

They also seem to like Orton more or less, but I guess when you have Tyler Palko, Orton is a step up.

Funny times, they are in the exact position we were in last year. Hope the Chiefs don’t make the right decisions like we have this year

by Bronco Mike on Dec 16, 2011 1:55 PM MST up reply actions  

Haven’t been there is awhile but I thought they hated McD. At least they did when he coached here.

by McJay on Dec 16, 2011 3:30 PM MST up reply actions  

Had this type of conversation going on in another post

And John you’re 100% correct. We see some of the young talent he brought us AND his inept coaching going on in St. Louis at the same time. A neutered Stephen Jackson from an all pro? An up and coming young QB to a potential bust?

No doubt I give him props for some of the things he did as far as players INCLUDING ridding us of Cutler and Marshall, but other than that, he is responsible for some of our darkest days as a franchise. If the dude could coach he’d still be here. Getting into pissing matches with the guys you’re supposed to teach and inspire gets real old real fast. As I’ve said, he is an interesting blip in the history of our franchise.

by Bronco Mike on Dec 16, 2011 1:51 PM MST reply actions   1 recs

ultimate irony

playing TT sooner could have saved his job….

by Clompy on Dec 16, 2011 2:03 PM MST reply actions  

Screw McDaniels...

Elway is in, Zimm is in, Little is FINALLY in but don't forget: Randy Gradishar, Steve Atwater & Terrel Davis

by BlueNOrangeNIdaho on Dec 16, 2011 3:56 PM MST reply actions  

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