Sources: NFL's owners balk at 50-50 split - ESPN

To simplify talks, a player source said the union told the owners' negotiating team that it will forgo its request to examine the league's financial books by simply taking the flat 50 percent cut of "all revenue," which would eliminate $1 billion to $2 billion credits off the top and erase the definition of "total revenue."

over 1 year ago John Bena 108 comments 0 recs |

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Weren't the players getting 60%?

If so, the owners should be down with 50-50

Verbose in style, dispersion of thought, procrastination in life.

The artist formerly known as ZAPPA

by Tim Lynch on Feb 10, 2011 11:33 AM MST reply actions

Nevermind

The NFLPA, according to Mortensen, proposed a 50-50 split on the $9 billion which, for all intents and purposes, is what they’re getting now.

Figures…Unions never give back — its always keep what you have or take more. This is why I have become so anti-Union.

Verbose in style, dispersion of thought, procrastination in life.

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by Tim Lynch on Feb 10, 2011 11:34 AM MST up reply actions 1 recs

yep, the union is a business too

and unions are in it to make money as well. That’s the problem.

Unions want more, the business that the union is in has to give more. They end up having to charge their customers more, and the cycle repeats itself until the customers finally say “we ain’t payin’!”. Then the company goes out of business as they lose their business and cant pay the union that works for them.

Its a vicious cycle, just look at the transportation world. No union company has stayed in business, and the ones that are, such as Yellow (Roadway) are sinking ships.

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by Broncs55 on Feb 10, 2011 11:40 AM MST up reply actions

Usually the first offer has some wiggle room. Maybe they were just throwing out a # to see what came back.

Clearly, the NFL didn’t want to play ball.

The ignorant redneck formerly known as kentuckybronco.

by Troy Hufford on Feb 10, 2011 11:41 AM MST up reply actions

I hear ya Tim

Im not a fan of Unions. They did a good service for people a long time ago, but they’re just greedy businesses just like everything else

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson

by Calikula on Feb 10, 2011 2:01 PM MST up reply actions

Lower Percentage, Higher Revenue Pool

The old one was 60% of Partial Revnues. They are asking for 50% of all revenues.

by ocbroncomaniac on Feb 10, 2011 1:51 PM MST up reply actions

Here's a breakdown of what the splits looked like before. All between 50 and 55% over the past few years.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/02/10/report-cba-talks-broke-down-after-union-proposed-50-50-split/

The ignorant redneck formerly known as kentuckybronco.

by Troy Hufford on Feb 10, 2011 11:40 AM MST reply actions

The NFLPA will eventually make concessions

Everyone knows that. Don’t expect major concessions with the initial offer. That would be stupid. It’s disheartening that the owners walked away so quickly, but then they have more financial cushion than the players. In the end they’ll still come away with more gains than the players. It’d help if they opened up their books though.

by Broncologist on Feb 10, 2011 12:12 PM MST reply actions

CAN WE ALL SHUT UP ABOUT OPENING THE BOOKS

I have no right to tell my employer to open the books and neither do they. Everyone shut up. That is a stupid thing to say

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 12:19 PM MST up reply actions

Wrong

You would have a right if your employer told you to just trust them on the fact they were giving you the percentage of the price you contractually agreed to.

Now you might not be in this position at your work, but last I checked most of us go to work so we can get what we earn and what is owed to us.

by Ontrade81 on Feb 10, 2011 12:24 PM MST up reply actions

No I am not

I don’t make a bleeping red cent so I REALLY want the players to shut up, I want DeMORON Smith to go to hell and I want the CBA done March 4.

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 12:26 PM MST up reply actions

So Wait...

Since you don’t make any money you want other people to not make any money? Just sounds bitter and immature to me.

by Ontrade81 on Feb 10, 2011 12:41 PM MST up reply actions

I want football

I know that horse’s rear end DeMoron is the problem, thanks for trolling

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 12:42 PM MST up reply actions

We all want football, but calling him DeMoron doesn't do anything to improve the conversation.

It’s like all those McD____ nicknames.

The ignorant redneck formerly known as kentuckybronco.

by Troy Hufford on Feb 10, 2011 12:46 PM MST up reply actions

but a lot of his moves did make him a McD_________.

If the shoe fits….

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by Nick Cast on Feb 10, 2011 12:47 PM MST up reply actions

I don't think anyone is arguing that. I just don't see the appeal in calling someone DeMoron.

The ignorant redneck formerly known as kentuckybronco.

by Troy Hufford on Feb 10, 2011 12:52 PM MST up reply actions

helps us release anger

it’s good for the soul.

Like chicken noodle soup.

by Nick Cast on Feb 10, 2011 1:04 PM MST up reply actions

There are other ways to release anger, though. Name calling is juvenile, imo.

The ignorant redneck formerly known as kentuckybronco.

by Troy Hufford on Feb 10, 2011 1:08 PM MST up reply actions

I agree

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson

by Calikula on Feb 10, 2011 2:04 PM MST up reply actions

He's not trolling Brad

The owners called this thing off, claiming they are losing money. With the TV deal and other indicators like the Green Bay Packers showing a profit, the Players are simply asking them in good faith, to prove they are losing money. The owners said No, so who do you trust?

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by KaptainKirk on Feb 10, 2011 12:46 PM MST up reply actions

I Work 10 Hours a Day

and don’t make a (beaver) dam cent. I love football so I want them to keep things going, players have no leverage so they need to eat it and admit it. If not, things are going to get pretty ugly with them. They’ll be making just as much money as me if they’re not careful

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 12:50 PM MST up reply actions

Also there's this from a Cowboys fan

Both sides will be at “fault” if there’s no football in the fall. If I were an owner I too would not “show” the books, how many business owners do? As a capitalist I would likely side with the owners, as a hard core fan I have mixed emotions. Just hoping the deal gets done, life without football would be crappy

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 12:55 PM MST up reply actions

You are right

they will both be at fault and we will be the ones to suffer. But when the Billionaires tell the millionaires they have to take a pay cut and the public is the one footing the bill for the Billionaires (stadiums), I don’t think it;s the little guys fault. As compared to us everyday Joe’s though, it is absolutely absurd.

Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
My ship finally came in, but it was the Kobayashi Maru.
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by KaptainKirk on Feb 10, 2011 3:01 PM MST up reply actions

Sorry for being a jerk Kirk

you have every right to be angry with me

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 3:15 PM MST up reply actions

I'm not mad at you buddy

You are as passionate about our team as I or anyone else here. =)

Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
My ship finally came in, but it was the Kobayashi Maru.
Follow me on Twitter @MHR_KaptainKirk

by KaptainKirk on Feb 10, 2011 7:33 PM MST up reply actions

Uhm

How was he “trolling”? You saying people are stupid for saying the owners should open up their books and the other day when you said you wanted to hang “Demoron” Smith from a tree and wishing he goes to hell sounds more like trolling to me. Chill out

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson

by Calikula on Feb 10, 2011 2:04 PM MST up reply actions

I don't want him

jerking around with my football. He doesn’t care about the players, he’s a scumbag politician seeking to get a name for himself. I am astonished at how many people have the players’ backs on this.

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 2:50 PM MST up reply actions

I dont see why

people wouldnt have the players backs. Theyre the ones suffering from the long term effects of playing in such a violent sport. I read in SI that many of them are coming down with things like parkinsons or dementia like boxers. And if its true that the owners are losing money like they claim, then why do they have an issue with opening their books and proving their point?

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson

by Calikula on Feb 11, 2011 11:58 AM MST up reply actions

the players are making A LOT of money

by Nick Cast on Feb 10, 2011 12:43 PM MST up reply actions

Thanks for not condemning me Nick

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 12:43 PM MST up reply actions

oh i agree with you

DeMaurice Smith is a joke.

I get the very strong feeling that he wants to force a lockout.

There has been no effort from his end to get anything done. They want to keep everything the way it is and are willing to lockout for it.

In the first bargaining meeting, he didn’t even make a legit offer. His first offer was to keep everything exactly the same.

Freaking stupid.

by Nick Cast on Feb 10, 2011 12:46 PM MST up reply actions

Smith.....

is an Attorney, nuff said.

"Failing to prepare is preparing to fail.''
-- John Wooden

"I've always joked about Joe Montana not appreciating his Super Bowls nearly as much as I do because he never lost one. We lost three before we got one."
--John Elway

by Broncanatic on Feb 10, 2011 1:51 PM MST up reply actions

So...

DeMaurice Smith is an idiot for fighting for the interest of the people who hired him????

De Smith opted out of the CBA???? No I think that was the owners.

What have the owners given up or offered? an 18 game schedule… more work for less pay????

Its funny listening to average people back billionaires who to this point have yet to prove they are losing money in a 9 billion dollar industry… But the guys that take all the physical risk…. should play more for less… with no other reason then the billionaires said….

by Mike Riley322 on Feb 10, 2011 2:05 PM MST up reply actions 4 recs

+1000

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson

by Calikula on Feb 10, 2011 2:06 PM MST up reply actions

+1

im with you.

Why trust a billionaire who wont open his books.

My ass the NFL losses money, and if it does its the owners fault for paying for stupid shit. We should ahve the foot the bill for their mistakes and neither should the players.

Plus the owners already get most of their stadiums paid for by the taxpayers. These guys have an amazing gig. There is no shortage of people buyin/investing in an NFL franchise, therefore it cant be as bad of a business as they keep trying to claim.

by nsink on Feb 10, 2011 2:14 PM MST up reply actions

That gets a rec Mike

I am squarely on the fence here. I grew up with a father in management and a Union “screwing” him. Add to that the whole Auto/Tractor industry with the unions getting more and more for less and less and we lost a whole manufacturing sector.
Now, take that and look at what we have now with companies always saying we have to do it for the stockholders (most of whom are company officers) and smaller packages for more money, etc…..
Unions are greedy, business is greedy, fans (US) are being priced out of stadium seats.

I Think ticket prices should go down, players pay should go down, let the percentages stay where they are. Profits are measured in millions these days, we need to lower the expectation of how much money is a lot!!!

Opinions are like......, Well anyway, this is mine.

by Sean in Pa. on Feb 10, 2011 2:22 PM MST up reply actions

That...

Was not the point at all, the point was that he has his own interests in mind, and not that of the players. How many attorneys actually give a rats behind about their clients? They are in it for the money, the more he can squeeze out of the owners the more HE will get in the end. The fact is, the teams that are publicly held have already opened their books to the union, they had to the are publicly traded. The other teams however are privately held and have no obligation whatsoever to show anybody what they are making, that is their business, nobody elses. My boss doesn’t tell me how much he makes, should he?

"Failing to prepare is preparing to fail.''
-- John Wooden

"I've always joked about Joe Montana not appreciating his Super Bowls nearly as much as I do because he never lost one. We lost three before we got one."
--John Elway

by Broncanatic on Feb 10, 2011 2:28 PM MST up reply actions

if your pay

is based on a % then yes u should know the number that % is coming from.

If its not % based then no it doesnt matter

by nsink on Feb 10, 2011 2:35 PM MST up reply actions

My question is this

Are you your companies product… The NFL isnt like your job or mine… Other can be trained to do what we do…. We cant train guys to throw the football like Tom Brady or run like Adrian Peterson. The players in the NFL are THE PRODUCT…. None of go to the game to see Pat Bowlen or any other owner. We go to watch our team battle it out in a game that is proven to take years off of these guys lives and leave most in a life of pain once they retire. Check out videos of Earl Campbell for proof. The current agreement is one that the OWNERS AGREED TO… It naive to believe that the players should simply accept and play more games for a smaller percentage when its there blood, sweat and broken bodies is what carries the game… I dont pay to Roger Goodell sashay to his plush owners suite… Both side need to sit down and work out a FAIR deal for both parties…

by Mike Riley322 on Feb 10, 2011 4:51 PM MST up reply actions

If my employer told me I had to work 4 additional hours a week and take a pay cut because our business was doing poorly, and all signs pointed to the business bringing in record profits, I’d probably want to see the books too. In the end I’d probably just threaten to find the same job at a different company if they wanted me to take a pay cut and work more hours.

Today's mock draft: 2. Da'Quan Bowers, DE, 36. Muhammad Wilkerson, DT 46. Bruce Carter, OLB, #67 Johnny Patrick, CB #69 Jaiquawn Jarrett, S, (Orton) #184 Charles Clay, FB #194 Willie Smith, OT
www.worthingtonjohn.com

by Worthington on Feb 10, 2011 1:03 PM MST up reply actions

Yes!

Worthington is right.

I don’t know what trolling is so I not sure if I am or am not doing it. I am simply saying that these guys who play in the NFL put their bodies and futures on the line, and have a right to get paid well.

I have no desire to take sides here, I am sure there is enough money to go around. But I don’t begrudge the players for wanting to keep the money split they have right now. I would not want to take a pay cut when I knew my employer was doing better than ever, and that was because of my hard work.

by Ontrade81 on Feb 10, 2011 1:29 PM MST up reply actions

I wish all of you

could trade jobs with me and make nothing. Then we’ll see how you feel

Brad James

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 1:36 PM MST up reply actions

Great thing about America

Is our ability to choose our own career path. I am assuming that there is a good reason why you work at a job that does not pay you instead of working for a paycheck, but right now it just sounds like you are stuck and bitter about it.

by relocated bronco in NC on Feb 10, 2011 2:01 PM MST up reply actions

No one is hiring

I’m definitely qualified, but media outlets would rather have bimbos like Erin Andrews and that skank on Sports Nation with Colin CowTURD. Thanks for caring though

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 2:03 PM MST up reply actions

beadles is pretty cute though, skank or no.

I'm not sugarcoating this.

by oxmouth on Feb 10, 2011 2:06 PM MST up reply actions

You got a thing for our left guard?

by relocated bronco in NC on Feb 10, 2011 2:08 PM MST up reply actions

carls jr :)

"I always believe there's a reason why you go through everything." - John Elway

by Pmoreno95 on Feb 10, 2011 2:18 PM MST via mobile up reply actions

havent had me some

Carls in a while

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson

by Calikula on Feb 10, 2011 2:21 PM MST up reply actions

:o your missing out lol

"I always believe there's a reason why you go through everything." - John Elway

by Pmoreno95 on Feb 10, 2011 2:24 PM MST via mobile up reply actions

Most of us won't

I know I won’t. I have flat out told people I do not work for free. It costs money to do anything!
I don’t know why you work for free, to this point I figured it is because you can and you want to do the job you are doing. If I am wrong about that then I suggest you find a good paying job somewhere and realize that this world requires money to live in and work has a value.

Opinions are like......, Well anyway, this is mine.

by Sean in Pa. on Feb 10, 2011 2:26 PM MST up reply actions 1 recs

Hear hear

I dont do things on a volunteer service. God bless all those who do, but Ive got bills to pay

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson

by Calikula on Feb 10, 2011 2:42 PM MST up reply actions

*volunteer basis

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson

by Calikula on Feb 10, 2011 2:43 PM MST up reply actions

I don't refute

work has a value and money is available. It’s just that the a-holes who get paid on commission net all the revenues. My employer isn’t the richest person in the world especially since he just broke his heel

Brad James

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 2:43 PM MST up reply actions

that’s the beauty of freedom— you can go find a better, more honest boss who pays twice as much and treats you exactly like you want to be treated.

this is exactly why i personally chose not to ply my talents in the NFL and went into a field that pays considerably less.

I'm not sugarcoating this.

by oxmouth on Feb 10, 2011 1:59 PM MST up reply actions

haha exactly

"I always believe there's a reason why you go through everything." - John Elway

by Pmoreno95 on Feb 10, 2011 2:19 PM MST via mobile up reply actions

Who exactly is taking a pay cut?

I think that is more inflammatory rhetoric than accurate portrayal of the situation.

Nobody’s contract is getting reduced. And most of the free agent are going to get raises on their previous contracts, that’s why they want to get to free agency. So it’s more like the owner’s are asking the players to take a 40% raise instead of a 50% raise. Still real money, but it doesn’t sound quite so outrageous when you phrase it that way, does it?

As for the extra work, it’s a revenue split system, so the extra revenue from the extra games means extra money for the players. So they are asking them to work more, but they are also going to pay them for the extra work. Also doesn’t sound that outrageous, does it? It’s all just business and squabbling about the marginal dollars.

by asdqqq on Feb 10, 2011 1:42 PM MST up reply actions

Squabbling

that can be rectified if you get DeMaurice (I did that to placate you Troy) to shut up and realize his union has no leverage. Seriously, once a new CBA is reached, and it will be on time, every player needs to treat DeMaurice like a blocking sled.

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 1:48 PM MST up reply actions

Brad

Why do you keep saying the NFLPA has no leverage? They have carried out strikes before, they have been able to bring in medical coverage and retirement packages that were never there before. Do you think these advances in medicine are because the owners wanted the fans to feel better?
The Union does have leverage and NEEDS to. As bad as unions are, look at what American working conditions were before we had unions. Think about it!

Opinions are like......, Well anyway, this is mine.

by Sean in Pa. on Feb 10, 2011 2:32 PM MST up reply actions

Well any leverage they do have

pales in comparison because generally contracts aren’t guaranteed (especially for veterans, yes that makes sense…) and the owners already have more money and will get paid through a lockout while the players won’t. I guess that’s what I’m basing on my statements on. I could be wrong though

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 2:42 PM MST up reply actions

The owners will lose money

There still bills to pay with stadiums, even if taxpayer money built them the owners are usually saddled with upkeep, training facilities, offices. During layoffs there is unemployment to be paid out. Then if/when a contract is signed, workers have to be recalled, new hiring done, training. New medical benefit contracts to be worked out for the cancelled ones.

There is a lot there for the owners to lose. I would suggest the owners take a look at professional American Hockey to see the effect of lost games.

I am sure there was no shortages of smart players that spent last year putting money away, they may not all be millionaires but make enough money to live well and put away that rainy day/lock out fund :D

Opinions are like......, Well anyway, this is mine.

by Sean in Pa. on Feb 10, 2011 2:54 PM MST up reply actions

Let's just have football please

I’d prefer the players cave and we go to that point

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 2:56 PM MST up reply actions

In the end I’d probably just threaten to find the same job at a different company if they wanted me to take a pay cut and work more hours.

but in the end you’d be faced with the prospects of going to going back to school, getting a mid-management job at comcast, or playing canadian football. (don’t do it man, don’t do it! :)

I'm not sugarcoating this.

by oxmouth on Feb 10, 2011 1:53 PM MST up reply actions

Haha

It was really a jab at the NFL monopoly. If players would hit free agency every year, this really wouldn’t be an issue.

by Worthington on Feb 10, 2011 2:09 PM MST up reply actions

If we're talking about football monopolies

please save your vitriol for the BCS thanks

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 2:12 PM MST up reply actions

Actually He Is Wrong

There is no evidence of record profits, only increasing revenues. However, the players’ share has increased much faster than the revenues have increased. The books are open for the Packers because they are publicly traded.

We have evidence that the Packers made only $20 million last year. This is an awful return for a company worth $1 billion.

by ocbroncomaniac on Feb 10, 2011 1:56 PM MST up reply actions

This is an awful return for a company worth $1 billion.

But isn’t this really the whole issue?

NFL teams are way overvalued.

And the Owners know it, and are doing everything they can to increase revenue.

by Worthington on Feb 10, 2011 2:06 PM MST up reply actions

Agreed Worthington

What makes a football team worth so much money? The Spotlight!!
Also, since when is making 20 millions dollars bad? That is all profit right? So, cut five bucks off every ticket and they lose what (60k seats X5 = 300,000 X18= 5.4 million) So now that only make a paultry 14.5 million dollars. Wow, that must suck!! Really?
Sorry, but anyone that says they have to raise my ticket price because they ONLY made 20 million dollars in ONE year is not going to get any simpathy from my 20 THOUSAND dollar income!!!!

Opinions are like......, Well anyway, this is mine.

by Sean in Pa. on Feb 10, 2011 2:38 PM MST up reply actions

OOPS

Quick math in my head is a bad idea…. 4.4 million leaving a 15.6 million dollar profit.

Opinions are like......, Well anyway, this is mine.

by Sean in Pa. on Feb 10, 2011 2:40 PM MST up reply actions

20 million on a billion dollar investment is freaking peanuts....

I get the class envy, but investing almost anywhere else they could get 5x that return (or better). If we’re conceding the owners are businessmen then why wouldn’t we expect them to act as such. The players are very well paid for what they bring, and the owners expect a decent return.

If I had a dollar for every Super Bowl San Diego has won, I'd go window shopping at the dollar store.

by Kgrone on Feb 10, 2011 8:55 PM MST up reply actions

Class envy

I keep hearing that one. Sure I play the lottery.

If 20 M on a 1B investment is peanuts then football is a bad investment! So don’t do it if that is what you are after. There is also fame, power, pride, and status. Also many of the current owners have much less invested in the teams and have “earned” value measured in the 100’s of Millions. Besides any of that I have seen one example where a publicly traded (the only one) team earned 20 M in one year. I am not going to take that as a fact across the board and none of us has any idea how much these owners are making.

Opinions are like......, Well anyway, this is mine.

by Sean in Pa. on Feb 11, 2011 6:02 AM MST up reply actions

Well...sir yes SIR.

W.W.T.T.D.?

by TheMastermind on Feb 10, 2011 1:38 PM MST up reply actions

Ridiculous

Bunch of 5 year olds trying to compromise. No one wants to compromise.

Lockout feels inevitable.

NBA must be REALLY happy.

by Nick Cast on Feb 10, 2011 12:20 PM MST reply actions

Very true Nick

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson

by Calikula on Feb 10, 2011 2:10 PM MST up reply actions

I like that this shows what this is all really about, the money split. Rookie cap, extra games, less OTAs, those are insignificant bargaining chips.

On the money issue:
The Players want what every employee wants, more money, as little work as possible. Pretty simple to understand

The owners want what every bussiness investor wants, a greater return on their investment. Harder to understand.
Let’s look at some real numbers from Green Bay to get a picture here.
2010:
Value/Investment: 1 billion
Change in value: 0
Revenue: 242 million
Income: 9.8 million.
One year return on investment: .98%
If you’re an NFL owner, you look at that number and say, man that’s not very good. I could have earned more on my 1 billion dollars investing it in bonds.
You also look at the product, and see that it is doing amazing, despite the bad economy. So you say, it’s not fair that I’ve got all this money tied up in a great business that is doing well, but I’m not getting a good return. If I’m investing in the best business out there, I should be getting the best return for my investment out there. That’s where they are coming from. It doesn’t matter that they are not losing money.

So, who’s right? No one is right. This is simply a business negotiation. It’s stupid to sympathize for one side or another or blame anyone for a deal not getting done. Either side could get a deal done tomorrow if they wanted. Both sides are being greedy, in the sense that they are just trying to get as much for their side as they can. It’s just business. It’s just human nature. Don’t hate the players, hate the game. We’re all just innocent bystanders caught in the crossfire.

PS, I probably screwed all the business terminology and numbers up, but the point is still valid.

by asdqqq on Feb 10, 2011 12:52 PM MST reply actions

This is what I was waiting for.

Absolutely, the owner’s have billions invested, and the players don’t. I gotta say I side mostly with the owners. No businessman in his right mind would open his books to the public, and the players are compensated very well for what they bring to the table.

If I had a dollar for every Super Bowl San Diego has won, I'd go window shopping at the dollar store.

by Kgrone on Feb 10, 2011 1:15 PM MST up reply actions

Agreed. I don’t think the owner’s should have to open their books. They are private, and not publicly funded or traded therefore they shouldn’t have to show their books.

I’m not saying that one side is right or wrong, but just like any business, if you don’t like the working conditions you are apart of you can either look for different work or try to fight for something different. However, that doesn’t mean they are entitled to see the books.

by wiebrod on Feb 10, 2011 1:22 PM MST up reply actions

its not

like you dont have to show the IRS your records so whats the big deal unless you have stuff to hide?

by nsink on Feb 10, 2011 2:21 PM MST up reply actions

So now the players are the IRS?

Brad James

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 2:35 PM MST up reply actions

yea thats what i meant

great argument.

by nsink on Feb 10, 2011 2:36 PM MST up reply actions

looks

like we got deleted

by nsink on Feb 10, 2011 3:12 PM MST up reply actions

Who got deleted?

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by the new Bradfather on Feb 10, 2011 3:13 PM MST up reply actions

i dunno

i cant see the posts we were replying to. Can you? maybe its just my computer

by nsink on Feb 10, 2011 3:15 PM MST up reply actions

his investment has been great
so the whole oh this year he had only a.1% income, how can he survive on so little is bullshit.

The owners should jsut be happy their investment didnt lose moeny liek 90% OF AMERICANS RETIREMENT accounts over the past 4 years

by nsink on Feb 10, 2011 2:23 PM MST up reply actions

Totally true

But it is a what have you done for me lately world, and those values haven’t gone up lately. Again, no one is on the right side here. It’s just you and your brother arguing over who gets the bigger piece of pie.

by asdqqq on Feb 10, 2011 2:24 PM MST up reply actions

Let's try to avoid oversimplifying things

Collective bargaining with billions of dollars and livelihoods at stake is high-stakes poker and way above our pay grades. It sucks that we as fans are held hostage to the process but compressing the legitimate financial issues into a profane bumper sticker does a disservice to the seriousness of it.

by Broncologist on Feb 10, 2011 1:22 PM MST reply actions