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The Age Of Transparency: John Elway Tweets On Champ Bailey

DENVER - OCTOBER 24:  Cornerback Champ Bailey #24 of the Denver Broncos runs onto the field before taking on the Oakland Raiders at INVESCO Field at Mile High on October 24 2010 in Denver Colorado. (Photo by Justin Edmonds/Getty Images)

Welcome to the new age of Denver Broncos football - off the field.  We saw it during the search for a new head coach, and now the transparency - the fan-friendly approach - that the Broncos were desperately looking for has been demonstrated during the most controversial contract situation facing the Broncos this off-season - the pending free agency of Champ Bailey.

By now, we all know there were contract talks during the season and reportedly there was a structure in place on a potential deal.  Four years/ $40 million were the numbers being bounced around before the offer was - allegedly - pulled off the table by the Broncos in November.  Not long after Josh McDaniels was fired and everything was put on hold while the regular season ended and the Broncos got their house in order.  John Elway was hired, then John Fox.

Now, a couple of days ago, word broke that the Broncos were once again talking to Bailey about a deal.  The sticking point, according to reports, is guaranteed money.  In the NFL it matters little what you hear a contract is worth.  What matters is the guaranteed money involved.  People have said that Bailey is now looking at the contract Richard Seymour signed - $22.5 million guaranteed - as a guide.  The Broncos, apparently, don't want to go there.

Star-divide

So it begins - the 'unnamed sources, random text-messages and back-alley handshakes'.  Bailey has now begun the process of selling his house.  Fans are organizing a rally this weekend. In the old days, we may not have gotten more than a press release from the Broncos saying they don't talk publicly about contract talks.  Those were the old days.  Now, the Broncos - and team Vice President John Elway - take to Twitter:

 

We've been working with Champ Bailey's representative this week on a new contract, which is an important priority for us...less than a minute ago via web

Our conversations have been constructive, and we'll continue those talks in the hopes that we can reach an agreement...less than a minute ago via web

Champ's an elite player who means a great deal to our entire organization and our fans...less than a minute ago via web

 

Where all this leads in the business of football is hard to tell.  Money talks, but so does a player's wants a needs.  Who could blame Champ Bailey if he wanted to go to a team closer to winning a Championship?  Who could really blame the Broncos if they feel, at the end of the day, that Bailey is a luxury that the team simply can't afford at this point in the team's rebuild? 

The important thing is, both sides appear to be working together in good-faith to see if a match can be made.  That doesn't mean there will be - due to no fault of the Broncos or Champ Bailey.  Right now, that's all we can ask for.

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Get-R-Done...

but dont kill the franchise for himk

the internet? that thing is still around?
~Homer Simpson

by ktown on Feb 17, 2011 10:45 AM MST reply actions  

Agreed

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson

by Calikula on Feb 17, 2011 4:27 PM MST up reply actions  

At...

12 to 14 mil per year?

There are discussions about this issue elsewhere, and suffice it to say, it is not an easy call…..

by Gulbrand on Feb 17, 2011 11:08 AM MST up reply actions  

He wont be asking for 12-14 million a year. Champ knows that wont be realistic. hes looking for more long term security than guaranteed money for only 1 year. Rightfully so IMO.

FIRE JOE ELLIS!

ANYONE ELSE INTERESTED IN SEEING WHAT WE HAVE IN TEBOW? Watching Kyle orton is like watching re-runs of the Brady Bunch...you always know whats going to happen and makes you feel sick at the end!

"I actually watched the World Cup. I HATE baseball. Hockey’s over. Hey, at least we have the WNBA. Oh, man. I’m making a noose. Want one?"

Harv Neptune.

by boydy2669 on Feb 17, 2011 11:49 AM MST up reply actions  

No offense but...most athletes combined with agents aren't realistic

Champs a good guy, but we don’t know him…he could be unrealistic and asking for a ton of money we don’t know….most players tend to believe that when they are older they are the same as they were when they were 28. They can’t get over the fact that they are older.

by waterboy31321 on Feb 17, 2011 12:53 PM MST up reply actions  

So you are saying that Champ and his agent dont know what market value is? That they dont know what deals have gone down with Nnamdi, Revis etc....they want a deal done!

FIRE JOE ELLIS!

ANYONE ELSE INTERESTED IN SEEING WHAT WE HAVE IN TEBOW? Watching Kyle orton is like watching re-runs of the Brady Bunch...you always know whats going to happen and makes you feel sick at the end!

"I actually watched the World Cup. I HATE baseball. Hockey’s over. Hey, at least we have the WNBA. Oh, man. I’m making a noose. Want one?"

Harv Neptune.

by boydy2669 on Feb 17, 2011 1:22 PM MST up reply actions  

Of course they know what the market value is

But do you think agents and players ask for market value? Each player and agent thinks that they are better than the other player that got that deal and have some sort of statistical analysis that they can twist one way or another to prove it. They always ask for a little bit more than market value…thats how negotiations work you ask for more so that way you might actually get what you want in the end.

Just like you lowball car dealers…ex: $10,000 Car ( you realistically think going in I will pay $8000 for that car) well you offer $7,000 because you know he won’t take it but in hopes of ending up somewhere around your desired price of $8,000. When really the car dealer already priced the car at $10,000 knowing that they would sell it for around $8,000.

This case is also different because Champ isn’t in his 20’s like Nnamdi and Revis. Champ probably more or less wants to win football games and get paid pretty good for it. And quite frankly he knows as good as anybody, that this team is not going to be winning for a couple of years so he wants to go see what is out there after the CBA gets worked out

by waterboy31321 on Feb 17, 2011 2:04 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

Precisely waterboy. Once an agent get's into an athletes head

it’s hard to get them to think realistically about quality of life things (enjoying the city you live in, the people, weather, etc) a guy like Champ who’s made a boat-load of $ over the years will not fully appreciate the extra $5mil total he may earn on a contract as much as he would have being able to play out a career and retire in (almost) only one organization and city. Guys like John Elway, Tom Jackson, Randy Gradishar, Floyd Little, Rod Smith, etc. who were able to stay in one place and retire, now are “Princes of the City” in Denver. There is something about this that is much more valuable than $. I think pro-athletes often overlook this advantage. At least the guys that have a certain measure of control over the possibility.

"I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany."

by rubincarterrocks on Feb 17, 2011 1:23 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

As a dire hard fan I agree with everything you wrote boydy.

Unfortunately I fear that he mat feel better in NE or Indy. AND the price tag may hamstring the franchise as it sits now. It’s not like he would be the last piece of the championship run puzzle. The first piece is front 7.

by Clompy on Feb 17, 2011 11:42 AM MST up reply actions  

Well Said

This put all my thoughts into a succinct comprehensive list. Rec’d!

Don't believe everything you read

by RockyMountainThunder on Feb 17, 2011 11:56 AM MST up reply actions  

+1

Fully agree boydy! But, if they are using Seymour’s contract as a guide, that is a problem. The Raiders overpaid for Seymour, as good as he is he not in that price range right now. When I saw Seymour’s $ numbers I thought, “good for him and bad for the Raiders”, just further evidence of Al’s continued poor management.

"I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany."

by rubincarterrocks on Feb 17, 2011 1:03 PM MST up reply actions  

Yep...but Al is known as a BIG and UNREALISTIC spender...and Seymour at a different position that makes his age not as big as a deal as what it is in the CB position.

FIRE JOE ELLIS!

ANYONE ELSE INTERESTED IN SEEING WHAT WE HAVE IN TEBOW? Watching Kyle orton is like watching re-runs of the Brady Bunch...you always know whats going to happen and makes you feel sick at the end!

"I actually watched the World Cup. I HATE baseball. Hockey’s over. Hey, at least we have the WNBA. Oh, man. I’m making a noose. Want one?"

Harv Neptune.

by boydy2669 on Feb 17, 2011 1:26 PM MST up reply actions  

Sure but remember

They Franchised Seymour last year and they paid the #17 pick in the draft for him. They pretty much had to keep him and at least they aren’t paying the Franchise dollar figure for those two years. He won’t rack up Julius Peppers stats, so they are overpaying, but that is the Al Davis Maverick style.

Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
My ship finally came in, but it was the Kobayashi Maru.
Follow me on Twitter @MHR_KaptainKirk

by KaptainKirk on Feb 17, 2011 1:32 PM MST up reply actions  

Well said, rec'd

I don’t know where people are getting this information from. Champ’s contract offer last year was reported to be around 40M/4yr. It’s reportedly in the same zone this time around. For the mathematically challenged… that’s not 12-14M per year. Raiders CB will apparently be seeking around $17M per year. I wish people would stop acting like he’s not worth the money and/or not realizing what great CBs are worth.

I never really thought of your first point, but I def agree and I agree with every word of the rest. Again, well said and great points.

by Rodney A on Feb 17, 2011 1:30 PM MST up reply actions  

Key part to build around?

How can you build around a part that will be gone by the time you’re done building? Champ will be retired or almost retired after 2-3 years Fox needs to rebuild.

by si_ice on Feb 17, 2011 2:56 PM MST via mobile up reply actions  

You dont know that....he is on record as saying as he would move to safety...a la Rod Woodson...who played until he was 38

At age 37, as a safety, Woodson led the NFL in interceptions. You are saying that Champ cant have a similar career. Remember also that Champs record of MAJOR injuries is very small. Woodson had a total knee reconstruction.
Champ could play for another 5-6 seasons easily….at an elite level. And yes, i do think he is that good. One of top 3 DB’s to ever play the game and some want to throw him out at 33.
Gees Louise, what are you guys thinking. This is the same player who thought he was faster this year than ever in his career.
Dont write off Champ, and simply, what team in their right mind would let a HOFer near the top of his game walk????

FIRE JOE ELLIS!

ANYONE ELSE INTERESTED IN SEEING WHAT WE HAVE IN TEBOW? Watching Kyle orton is like watching re-runs of the Brady Bunch...you always know whats going to happen and makes you feel sick at the end!

"I actually watched the World Cup. I HATE baseball. Hockey’s over. Hey, at least we have the WNBA. Oh, man. I’m making a noose. Want one?"

Harv Neptune.

by boydy2669 on Feb 17, 2011 3:16 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

Two words

Darrell Green.

Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
My ship finally came in, but it was the Kobayashi Maru.
Follow me on Twitter @MHR_KaptainKirk

by KaptainKirk on Feb 17, 2011 3:20 PM MST up reply actions  

There ya go KK...the voice of reason!

FIRE JOE ELLIS!

ANYONE ELSE INTERESTED IN SEEING WHAT WE HAVE IN TEBOW? Watching Kyle orton is like watching re-runs of the Brady Bunch...you always know whats going to happen and makes you feel sick at the end!

"I actually watched the World Cup. I HATE baseball. Hockey’s over. Hey, at least we have the WNBA. Oh, man. I’m making a noose. Want one?"

Harv Neptune.

by boydy2669 on Feb 17, 2011 3:22 PM MST up reply actions  

Young whipper-snappers don't know the whole breath of longivity...

Like the message stated and I feel the same way, Champ is in his prime and unless a career ending injury (which is possible) hits him he can play another 5 or 6 years easily. Getting Champ signed should be a priority of the Broncos at this point and time without breaking the bank, ala John Elway and TD, or was it Rod Smith? Monies can be adjusted any way they want to get this done imo.

by bfree2bronc on Feb 17, 2011 4:21 PM MST up reply actions  

No such thing as "rebuild" in the NFL today

a one year turnaround is very typical. It would not be unrealistic to think we could have a shot (remote as it is) at the playoffs this year.

"I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany."

by rubincarterrocks on Feb 18, 2011 8:16 AM MST up reply actions  

What difference does it make......

if you get the “feel good” bromides by tweet, facebook or coachspeak. The advantage here is that the “messages” appear more transpararnt but are just as unfulfilling as eating a meringue puff. I do appreciate that the Broncos are showing more awareness that the some fans are intensely interested – perhaps overly so – in the team, but frankly, it is unnecessary.

What ought to be tweeted or booked or whatever are the meaty things that would case the fandom to swoon. Not likely to happen because the need for confidentiatliy in several critical events is high. I would imagine fans would like to know the details of the communications going on in trade negotiations, for example. Or maybe Pat could do a tweet or three on the events taking place in the CBA negotiations.

My point is that the quaint use of tweet is good. but not necesssarily for hard core informaiton.

For that you need spys…..

by Gulbrand on Feb 17, 2011 11:07 AM MST reply actions  

I know of a camera guy we could hire

….. nevermind, that was done in Spygate II

daaayuuuuum! you gonna take that KB?!? lol -Broncs55
Absolutely not. KB is a function of aggression and rage, the derivative of which can be traced back to my childhood.-KentuckyBronco
PS3 ID: KoRnHo|ed

by Broncs55 on Feb 17, 2011 11:35 AM MST up reply actions  

My thoughts exactly

It’s nice for fans to see these tweets, but it doesn’t tell us anything we didn’t know before Elway joined. I don’t mind Elway using them, and if it makes some fans feel better, it’s working, but we were told things like this in the past with GM’s and HC’s about players who were being resigned or going into FA. Is it bad, no, does it help fans feel that Elway cares, yes, so it’s a good thing, but it doesn’t actually add anything.

I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.

by Topher Doll on Feb 17, 2011 11:12 AM MST up reply actions  

I like to hear rumors confirmed and two sides to the story

We heard 2nd hand from Champ’s agent yesterday. But hearing the other side directly from Elway allows for more accurate speculation.

And one point that’s being missed here is that it’s not always about what he confirms, it’s also about what he denies. Elway letting us know which rumors are true and which aren’t (which has also been done) is great to have. But I do agree that it down’t matter to me whether it’s on Twitter or ESPN. I assume twitter is just easier and eases the need for a full blown press conference.

by Rodney A on Feb 17, 2011 1:35 PM MST up reply actions  

party pooper

I like the feel good bromides! : )

Bringing you hopeful optimism and irreverent naivité, 24/7. GO BRONCOS!

by broncosmontana on Feb 17, 2011 4:30 PM MST up reply actions  

I wasn't too worried about the whole "house on the market thing"

I think this deal gets done, not this week, maybe the next or the one after that.

Changing my sig because of good advice from swg77. I still believe Bowers won't be the pick, but I do agree it is a possibility (small, but still possible). My top 4 (which is a combo of need and BPA) for the Broncos #2 overall pick: 1. Fairley 2. Peterson 3. Dareus 4. Bowers. Considering though that likely only one player will be taken from this top 4 I believe the pick is between Fairley and Peterson, with a small chance of Bowers or Dareus.

by DBroncs1414 on Feb 17, 2011 11:32 AM MST reply actions  

allegedly?

Maybe so. But I heard Champ on the Radio saying exactly that. “Pulled off the table”, his words.

by Clompy on Feb 17, 2011 11:38 AM MST reply actions  

Champ’s part of the game just the same as any other player or agent. That could have just meant that Champ and his agent refused to counter, and then walked when the Broncos didn’t chase them.

by tunesmith on Feb 17, 2011 1:19 PM MST up reply actions  

Understood but. His words:

" I was going to sign it, but 24 hrs later it was pulled off the table"

by Clompy on Feb 17, 2011 6:09 PM MST up reply actions  

Elway is smart enough to tweet all the right things

to keep the natives from getting so restless that they start cancelling their season tickets.

Sadly, I think Champ is still gone.

2011 Colorado Zombies-DeadWalking to the NL West crown
Todd and Troy: Because they ARE Rockies.
QPU #4, YHEG #4, Proud Member PR Gynocracy

by SDcat09 on Feb 17, 2011 11:40 AM MST reply actions  

A part of Elway's big message when he came in

Was reconnecting with the fans,and while that is a great way to get fans excited again, it also means his hands are tied. He couldn’t say that he didn’t want to pay Champ even if that’s what he was thinking because the fans would turn on Elway.

I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.

by Topher Doll on Feb 17, 2011 11:57 AM MST up reply actions  

I agree with your logic even though I disagree with your opinion on the outcome

Assume for a moment that talks weren’t going well and the Broncos have realized it’s unlikely they’ll come to terms. In such case, it would be wise for John to come out and say exactly what he just did… to let the fans know he’s connected and that the team is trying to re-sign their favorite corner.

So like I said, I can see your point. But I disagree on the outcome nevertheless. In fact, I just don’t even think it’s close. Champ is easily a top five corner and easily worth $10M per year. The only way we don’t pay him is if we can’t afford to. But that question has already been answered when the Broncos offered him this last contract. The sticking point now is guaranteed money. They’ll work it out. Replacing him with Peterson would make fans angry and it wouldn’t improve the team. That’s not a good start for the new regime in spending the highest draft pick in Broncos history. I don’t think they see that as a reasonable option. But we chall see…

by Rodney A on Feb 17, 2011 1:43 PM MST up reply actions  

Champ WAS a top 5 corner, but

going forward, no way! and he will not be a top safety either, his tackling style is not that good for a safety. Yes, he has been a great, great tackling CB, but look at his style – not very good for a safety that needs to make lots of run support tackles in the middle of the field, and sometimes take on blockers there..

Champ has been my favorite Bronco (my only Broncos jersey is his), but we should not overpay for an older player on the decline. He might be worth $10-12 million next season (he is still a very good CB (not top 5 though)), but beyond that he will be worth less than $10 million a year – declining each year.

by cohiker on Feb 17, 2011 2:13 PM MST up reply actions  

The comparisons don’t compute. I understand your point that he won’t be a top-five corner in a couple years. But his new contract won’t even be paying him a top-five wage today, let alone in a few years. A top-five corner today gets paid an average of $15M per year. That’s 50% more than Champ’s reported salary proposal. Those numbers go up every year. With a new rookie scale, more money will be alloted to veterans, also. By 2013, top-five corners will likely be making $17-20M will Champ will be making like $10M.

Champ has been a top-five corner. We have no reason to believe he won’t be a top-15 corner for the next three years. And that’s all we’re paying him as.

by Rodney A on Feb 17, 2011 2:29 PM MST up reply actions  

I have no problem paying Champ

top 11-15 CB average salary over the next three years. It is reasonable to offer him a three year deal in the average salary range for CBs below the top 10 paid CBs and above those below the top 15 range. I doubt that will exceed $33 million; so offer him a 3 year deal worth $33 million, with about $20MM guaranteed. Problem is Champ is probably looking for more than that. And I doubt he will really average being a top 11-15 CB over the next three years (age and injuries take a toll), but I would pay a small premium because he has been a great Bronco and he would add character and experience to a rebuilding team.

If the average now for a top 5 CB is $15-16MM; that means number five is making less than $15MM; so where is the average for the five CBs in the range below the top 10 CBs? I’m estimating $10-11MM, but if someone knows the correct number is higher, please provide data.

Regarding any fourth year, it could be included to make things look better for Champ, but it should be structured so the Broncos owe nothing more than stated above if they release Champ before year 4; and essentially it would be a three year deal, with the parties renegotiating if it makes sense for Champ to be a Bronco beyond a third additional year.

by cohiker on Feb 17, 2011 4:33 PM MST up reply actions  

Why on Earth would Champ agree to that

Right now he is one the 3 or 4 best CB’s. In 3 years, he is still likely to be comparable to what Charles Woodson is now — ie one of the top10-15.

What you are saying is champ should offer a multimillion discount — for three years — and then allow himself to get screwed even more by the broncos at that time.

by yibberat on Feb 17, 2011 4:47 PM MST up reply actions  

Where did I say that????

Don’t tell me what I am saying, when your words are different than mine.

You can say you think he is one of the best 3 or 4 CBs. I disagree – do not think he was in the top 5 last year – and certainly do not think he will be there next year – which would be the first year in his new contract.

He was great; he still should be very good, but will not be an average top 10 CB over the next 3 years; maybe for another year. We don’t want to believe his skills are in decline, but they clearly are – he is not close to where he was a few years ago.

by cohiker on Feb 18, 2011 12:08 AM MST up reply actions  

WHAT? Name 3 CB's better than him...let alone 9....

FIRE JOE ELLIS!

ANYONE ELSE INTERESTED IN SEEING WHAT WE HAVE IN TEBOW? Watching Kyle orton is like watching re-runs of the Brady Bunch...you always know whats going to happen and makes you feel sick at the end!

"I actually watched the World Cup. I HATE baseball. Hockey’s over. Hey, at least we have the WNBA. Oh, man. I’m making a noose. Want one?"

Harv Neptune.

by boydy2669 on Feb 18, 2011 5:39 AM MST up reply actions  

It seems we've reached compromise :D

If only negotiating the CBA were so easy lol

I agree with your last paragraph. It makes perfect sense for the team’s side. In fact, I actually think we may have switched sides here a little in that I think Champ is worth more and may want more guarantees. It’s very rare for a contract to have guaranteed money going into the fourth year. My guess is that the current sticking point is on how much (if any) will be guaranteed in the third year. But this proposal seems very fair.

Regarding the average of top-five salaries, I don’t have the figures off hand. The $15M figure that I used is roughly the 2011 franchise tag amount, which as we know, is the average of the top-five salaries for the position. If it helps, my understanding is that Raiders CB will reportedly be asking for north of $17M.

The transition tag for 2011 would be the average of the top-ten salaries, but I couldn’t find that number. For a rough guess, if the transition tag for 2011 raises at the same rate as the franchise tag did, then it would be about $12M. So my best guess is that the average of top-ten CB salaries for this year is $12M.

by Rodney A on Feb 17, 2011 4:54 PM MST up reply actions  

This somewhat seems like Elway's true first test in the FO

Some of you may see it different then me, but I feel this is the first big public test he has in being in the FO. I know the hiring of a HC was one of his first orders of business, but it wasn’t a tough situation like this one. Elway was new, people were very excited about him being there and a new HC and hopefully direction.

This is different to me because this is much harder than hiring a head coach in my head. You have a player that Denver fans have loved, that the majority of fans seem to want back, and they want the FO to get it done.

by wiebrod on Feb 17, 2011 11:53 AM MST reply actions  

100% agreed. this will sway the support the fans give this new team.

FIRE JOE ELLIS!

ANYONE ELSE INTERESTED IN SEEING WHAT WE HAVE IN TEBOW? Watching Kyle orton is like watching re-runs of the Brady Bunch...you always know whats going to happen and makes you feel sick at the end!

"I actually watched the World Cup. I HATE baseball. Hockey’s over. Hey, at least we have the WNBA. Oh, man. I’m making a noose. Want one?"

Harv Neptune.

by boydy2669 on Feb 17, 2011 11:57 AM MST up reply actions  

Love Champ

 Love Champ and want him to retire a bronco . My thoughts although I don’t know if they are realistic. Make Champ the best and most reasonable and fair contract offer the Broncos can make . If Champ does not sign franchise him and let him see if he can find a deal better than what Denver can offer . If so then you at least get a draft pick for him . He might find that a big contracts are hard to find at his age . My belief is he can still play corner at a high level for two or three more years before moving to safety . If Champ were to leave I would wish him the best and thank him for his time as a great Bronco .

by ultraclassic04 on Feb 17, 2011 12:11 PM MST reply actions   2 recs

If Broncos don't sign Champ

then I really have serious questions - again — about whether they actually want to win or know how to win.

There is a fine line between being a bad team with a good future - and being a dysfunctional joke with perpetual top-10 draft picks.

Granted I don’t know the real sticking points here. But from what I hear, it seems to me that the sticking point is some questions about what may or may not happen in 3-4 years – for a year or so. Talk about stuck on stupid.

by yibberat on Feb 17, 2011 12:11 PM MST reply actions  

Give him the money and let him retire a Bronco

Look this guy can still play, just like B. Dawk, he would be a great addition on the defense if we can retain him. Just give him the money and the long term contract. He has been a vital part of this team for years he deserves something. Champ has only shown professionalism and dedication since he has arrived in Denver.

Any movement in history which attempts to perpetuate itself, becomes reactionary.

- Marshal Broz Tito

by BosnianBronco on Feb 17, 2011 12:20 PM MST reply actions  

Bosnian, I love Champ as much as you do I think, but

I love the Bronco’s more. I don’t think we can just “give him the money” regardless of how it affects our team financially. He indeed has “only shown professionalism and dedication since he has arrived in Denver.” but the Bronco’s have also been very good to him financially and in showing how much they appreciate him. This should not be about making one or the other the bad guy. Nothing the Bronco’s have done show that they don’t want him here and nothing Champ has said or done indicates that he would prefer to be elsewhere. Sometimes you just can’t find the middle ground no matter how hard either side tries and you lose a player. Often it’s because some team out there is in love with a player and are willing to make a crazy offer to him.

"I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany."

by rubincarterrocks on Feb 17, 2011 1:15 PM MST up reply actions  

Transparency eh

it works for us and I"m glad for that. I just want a new CBA done on time. PLEASE. I’ve contacted both sides and I want them to listen to me. This is getting frustrating.

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Feb 17, 2011 12:38 PM MST reply actions  

It is a little sad, but I think the Champ era is over. And I hate to say it, but maybe it is time…

Kellen Moore >

by plainview88 on Feb 17, 2011 12:55 PM MST reply actions  

Just nice to see

That Elway understands the emotional stake fans have in their team. And that he can spell. I love the effort to keep in touch with fans. It is a small thing but it means a lot to fans and that’s really been missing for a long time.

W.W.T.T.D.?

by TheMastermind on Feb 17, 2011 1:03 PM MST reply actions  

This looks positive

I don’t think Elway would put out this info if he didn’t think that they were close to striking a deal. If they can’t make a deal work then it would be viewed as a failure by the public.

When Tim Tebow pissses into the wind, the wind changes direction.

by Albuquerque on Feb 17, 2011 1:08 PM MST reply actions  

To me this is why it’s Elway’s first true test with our fanbase. I’d like to believe that this is a positive and that he wouldn’t put this out if they were close to striking a deal, because if Champ isn’t signed there will a lot of peope that are going to wonder why he did this.

by wiebrod on Feb 17, 2011 1:20 PM MST up reply actions  

BTW John

Still waiting for the greatest #6. If you can’t find one at least we know who the most famous #6 is. Or he could be the worst #6 we’ve had.

Sorry about the topic change.

About this post. I think it all boils down to what the Broncos can afford to do. While we have quality people here at MHR who have alot of knowledge about the financial problems of the franchise nobody really knows except those on the inside. This will have an impact on whether or not he is signed. The Same goes for Harris. We need to sign both of them.

by papasteven on Feb 17, 2011 1:41 PM MST reply actions  

Has to be Bubby Brister. I am glad Cutler gave back his jersey!

FIRE JOE ELLIS!

ANYONE ELSE INTERESTED IN SEEING WHAT WE HAVE IN TEBOW? Watching Kyle orton is like watching re-runs of the Brady Bunch...you always know whats going to happen and makes you feel sick at the end!

"I actually watched the World Cup. I HATE baseball. Hockey’s over. Hey, at least we have the WNBA. Oh, man. I’m making a noose. Want one?"

Harv Neptune.

by boydy2669 on Feb 17, 2011 2:40 PM MST up reply actions  

I have to say, I'm surprised at how many seem to be OK with letting him walk..

I don’t mean to mock intelligent opinions and ideas here, but I’m really starting to think the ‘Let Champ Walk’ group consists of three groups.

Group one wants to draft Peterson. Letting Bailey leave means they’ll get their wish and their mocks and ideas will have been proved correct.

Group two doesn’t think he’s worth the money. I fear this group doesn’t understand the money. When the team submitted him an offer this week for the $10M per yearISH, they just said loud and clear that Champ is worth that much this year. With the guaranteed money being the sticking point, they’re basically questioning what he’ll be worth in three years. But that’s not your concern and it’s details we’re not debating here. The team has now had two contract on the table for him. In other words, they’ve now said TWICE that he’s worth $10M per year. 32 is not incredibly old for a CB. 35 isn’t even incredibly old.

Group three started thinking Champ would leave a long time ago and now they’re just hanging onto their hunch out of habit while accidentally ignoring new information. Champ and Asohmoa and Revis are in the same ballpark this year. Asohmoa will get around $17M. Champ will get $10. Not losing Champ means we wouldn’t have to replace him.

Gentlemen, we may be rebuilding but losing Champ would put us in slow motion. It’s time we support our longest tenured Super Star. It’s not your money. Nobody will care next week if you called it right or wrong. Jump on board and cheer this on. Fan pressure CAN make a difference if it’s ubber united and loud.

by Rodney A on Feb 17, 2011 1:58 PM MST reply actions  

Honestly I think there's a third group

Of fans who seem to be completely aligned with whatever Broncos ownership does to the team. If the Broncos don’t sign; then they will parrot whatever nonsense comes out of the press release.

Every mock draft I’ve seen with Peterson at #2 actually also says SIGN CHAMP.

Everyone I’ve seen who says “let Champ walk” also adds — “we have more important things to worry about so we must draft Fairley/Bowers/etc”

by yibberat on Feb 17, 2011 2:04 PM MST up reply actions  

Nick Cast's recent mock in the fan post section

advocates releasing Champ and replacing him with Peterson. To his credit, though, he thinks we should tag Champ and trade him for something. I don’t see a chance of it happening, though.

I agree with you on that last group, though. And often times, that’s the most annoying group.

by Rodney A on Feb 17, 2011 2:32 PM MST up reply actions  

I don't think things are that simple

For me personally, I want to draft Patrick Peterson regardless of what happens with Champ. Peterson is an elite talent and I believe he will be a shut down corner in this league. The only other options in my mind are Nick Fairley or trade down.

I disagree with your assessment of what the contract says. The Broncos have offered him 40 million twice, but the lack of guaranteed money is a big indication of how they feel. If they feel he is a “must sign” then they would throw guaranteed money at him. By not putting guaranteed money in the contract past the first year, they are essentially giving themselves the option of cutting him or trading him if his play declines.

So for me, I would love to keep Champ. I think he is a great guy and has been a great player for a long time. However, he is asking for a lot of guaranteed money and we have a lot of rebuilding to do. I don’t know if we can afford to throw so much money at him when we could essentially upgrade every position on the defensive side of the ball. If he didn’t want too much guaranteed money then sign the man.

Also, it really rubbed me the wrong way how his effort declined in certain games. He totally gave up in the Raider game. I can’t forget him jogging as Darren McFadden burst up the sideline and scored.

Follow me on Twitter: ballinnickcast
Xbox360 gamertag: SnipeMeHarder
"They said I couldn't be a high school quarterback, they said I couldn't get a D1 scholarship. You're not good enough, you're not skilled enough. They said I couldn't win a heisman. They said I couldn't win a national championship. They said I wouldn't be a first round draft pick. They said I couldn't play in the league. Appreciate that." - Tim Tebow.

by Nick Cast on Feb 17, 2011 2:33 PM MST up reply actions  

I hope this doesn't sound too critical, but I really think you're trying to make a lot of facts out of a lot of guesses..

The Broncos have offered him 40 million twice, but the lack of guaranteed money is a big indication of how they feel.

How so? You don’t know how big of a discrepancy do they have between the two sides? How far are they off? Is the sticking point in year two, or is it year three? You don’t know any of that. You don’t know how far apart they are. So you certainly don’t know if it’s a “big indication of how they feel”… or if it’s simply the start of a negotiation.

If they feel he is a "must sign" then they would throw guaranteed money at him.

No they wouldn’t. Champ Bailey can’t talk to another team until there’s a new CBA. There’s no reason to start throwing money around. If they feel they want him and/or that he’s a “must sign” then they’ll start negotiationg with him… as they’re doing currently. Rex Ryan called Harris one of “the core four” last year. He considered him a “must sign”. Yet, he didn’t take your advice of throwing money at him. Contracts take time. Don’t confuse them not having come to terms with the idea that they can’t or won’t just because there are details yet to be negotiated. Nobody is going to just start saying yes to every wish and demand.

By not putting guaranteed money in the contract past the first year, they are essentially giving themselves the option of cutting him or trading him if his play declines.

You don’t know that they’re not putting guaranteed money past the first year. You know that guaranteed money is still a sticking point and being negotiated, but you don’t know the details.

by Rodney A on Feb 17, 2011 2:43 PM MST up reply actions  

You can say that I am making a lot of facts out of guesses, but so are you.
How so? You don’t know how big of a discrepancy do they have between the two sides? How far are they off? Is the sticking point in year two, or is it year three? You don’t know any of that. You don’t know how far apart they are. So you certainly don’t know if it’s a "big indication of how they feel"… or if it’s simply the start of a negotiation.

This is not the start of negotiations. They were negotiating much earlier in the year when we pulled the deal. So it’s not like this is an opening offer. They have been negotiation for awhile.

No they wouldn’t. Champ Bailey can’t talk to another team until there’s a new CBA. There’s no reason to start throwing money around. If they feel they want him and/or that he’s a "must sign" then they’ll start negotiationg with him… as they’re doing currently. Rex Ryan called Harris one of "the core four" last year. He considered him a "must sign". Yet, he didn’t take your advice of throwing money at him. Contracts take time. Don’t confuse them not having come to terms with the idea that they can’t or won’t just because there are details yet to be negotiated. Nobody is going to just start saying yes to every wish and demand.

Part of this was my fault because I used a poor choice of words, but the facts lie in the pudding. The Broncos are not giving him any security in the later years of the contract. That is a known fact. You act as if this is the beginning of negotiations but it’s not. They restarted negotiations, but they have been talking for a long time. It’s the 4th quarter of the contract game. It’s not the start.

You don’t know that they’re not putting guaranteed money past the first year. You know that guaranteed money is still a sticking point and being negotiated, but you don’t know the details.

Actually, yes we do know that. That is why he is not signed. The Broncos are not giving him nearly enough security in the later years of his contract. That is why he has not signed the deal. I’m not making this up.

I’m not making facts out of anything. I’m reading all the news and making my conclusions. My conclusions tell me that the odds are not in our favor that he will return. I am not even sure if it is the best idea to sign him for 10 million a year. I don’t want to sound harsh, but it sounds like you just want Champ to return so badly because you don’t want us drafting Patrick Peterson.

Follow me on Twitter: ballinnickcast
Xbox360 gamertag: SnipeMeHarder
"They said I couldn't be a high school quarterback, they said I couldn't get a D1 scholarship. You're not good enough, you're not skilled enough. They said I couldn't win a heisman. They said I couldn't win a national championship. They said I wouldn't be a first round draft pick. They said I couldn't play in the league. Appreciate that." - Tim Tebow.

by Nick Cast on Feb 17, 2011 6:26 PM MST up reply actions  

How can we "upgrade every position"

on defense by not signing Champ? Are the Broncos just gonna hand out extra money to the existing remaining players on defense — and assume they buy some talent with that extra money? Are we instead gonna spend $7 million — this year — for a much worse CB to replace Champ — and then dribble out $3 million for a bag of balls?

I agree that the issue seems to be the guarantee. Presumably the guarantee in year 3 or 4 when Champ switches to safety. But that is really chump change — not Champ change. A safety, by then, will be paid — oh $6 million or so at least. So the Broncos “guarantee” is risking at most $4 million. Honestly that’s nothing compared to the proven easily-foreseeable mistakes the Broncos have made over the last half-dozen years. And Champ is precisely the sort of player who it is worth risking “guarantee” money on. Heck, the Broncos will blow a lot more than $4 million in guarantee money signing draft picks over the next 3 years.

by yibberat on Feb 17, 2011 2:56 PM MST up reply actions  

haha for what it's worth, I agree with that too

If we save money by not signing Champ it’s not like we’re going to be a kid in a candy store with the money burning a hole in our pocket. In fact, the store is currently closed.

I think Elway’s quote of us building through the draft is often mis-characterized. The bigger and more meaningful quote, IMO, is when we always hear management say things like we’re going to do whatever improves our team… we’re going to make decisions that improve our team… etc.. Releasing Champ wouldn’t improve our team. Spending the #2 overall pick so that we can replace him wouldn’t improve our team. And building through the draft means more this year, since as I said, the free agency store is currently closed. Building through the draft means you keep your core players then draft and develop the young ones through the draft…. because for the most part, they’re much, much cheaper.

The only players on contract next year that are due to make more than 2-3 million are DJ Williams, Chris Kuper and Elvis Dumervil. We have some big hits to take this year, but money should be much better next year. Keeping Champ will allow us to focus on current problems instead of making new ones.

by Rodney A on Feb 17, 2011 3:35 PM MST up reply actions   1 recs

I'm in the group of

let’s get a new CBA so all of this can be relevant. GO BRONCOS!!!

Brad James

Follow me on Twitter

With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!

by the new Bradfather on Feb 17, 2011 3:01 PM MST up reply actions  

Boy.......

O am sure glad you are not mocking my intelligent opinion, although the rat threw a bit of effluvium on the post. I do not parrot.

by Gulbrand on Feb 17, 2011 2:34 PM MST reply actions  

Why would a CBs contract be compared to a DE's?

People have said that Bailey is now looking at the contract Richard Seymour signed – $22.5 million guaranteed – as a guide. The Broncos, apparently, don’t want to go there.

Who said this? I haven’t been able to find it. I’ve found multiple places where people have echoed the quote above, but I’ve not seen anything to substantiate this original quote. Any help?

Either way, Seymour’s guaranteed money represents a year and a half of salary. That’s it. Somehow I don’t think that would be a problem to guarantee Champ the same… $15M

by Rodney A on Feb 17, 2011 3:38 PM MST reply actions  

In order to set this team in the right direction they must sign Champ long term...

The Broncos can’t possibly believe they can let him go and draft a corner anywhere near his abilities. It would set us back in getting the team in order and on it’s way to playoff contention. Are we anywhere near contention? There are some up sides and there are down sides on both sides of the ball, but it is possible for a team like the Broncos to get a couple of key players in the draft and FA and set sail. The offense is young and talent at every position and the defense with it’s lack of a pass rush failed to accomplish what they set out to do. Having to sign Peterson in the first could set us back a couple of years on building the defensive line imo.

by bfree2bronc on Feb 17, 2011 4:35 PM MST reply actions  

+1

Rebuilding is probably a fitting word for the defense, even if it’s an ugly word. The question becomes whether we rebuild like the Lions (for like ten years) or whether we rebuild like John Fox’s 2002 Panthers. We already have an offense that’s easily capable of what his offense did the year prior to taking over (they ranked 31st). We already have our own addition of elite pass rusher in Dumervil like Fox got in Peppers. We currently have an elite corner that Fox didn’t have there. And we’ve got two extra picks in the first two rounds that he didn’t have to use (I’m including the #2 overall since Doom and Peppers’ first year should be about a wash).

So I guess what I’m saying is yes, we’re rebuilding the defense. But we’ve got some great tools to do it with. There’s no reason to go in slow motion or backwards. And that’s exactly what we’d be doing by allowing Champ to leave.

by Rodney A on Feb 17, 2011 5:06 PM MST up reply actions  

Champ.

Not re-signing Champ would be a tougher pill for me to swallow than when we lost Cutler and Marshall.

I hate using this cliche but Champ is a true professional. He always says/has said the right things no matter the situation. He’s really has been treated unfairly by the Broncos in that every year he goes out and no doubt gives it everything he’s got every game and he’s NEVER had anyone close to his talent level on the defense with him.

Give the man what he wants even if it means overpaying and going into salary-cap hell. He’s sure as hell earned it in my eyes.

by himynameismatt on Feb 17, 2011 5:32 PM MST reply actions  

John

Great article but perhaps you could have used a picture that wasnt from 10/24/2010? Everyone that participated in that game failed on that awful day

"It's all over fat man!"
-Tom Jackson

by Calikula on Feb 17, 2011 5:51 PM MST reply actions  

YES

using that photo, from that day, makes a case that Champ (and everyone else associated with that game) should have their salary reduced greatly – to the Federal minimum wage at best.

by cohiker on Feb 18, 2011 12:22 AM MST up reply actions  

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