A Hall-of-Fame Travesty in Numbers - Revisited
On February 3, 2009 Studbucket posted this expanded look into the disparity between teams with less success than the Broncos having more Hall of Famers. Since then, Floyd Little (Class of 2010) and Shannon Sharpe (Class of 2011) have been elected to the hall effectively doubling our presence in Canton. Studbucket has graciously updated the numbers. So, after the jump, let's take a look at how things have changed over the last two years.
14 different NFL teams came into existence between 1960 and 1967. The 14 teams to enter the NFL between 1960 and 1967 are Atlanta, Buffalo, Cincinnati, Dallas, Denver, Kansas City, Miami, Minnesota, New England, New Orleans, New York Jets, Oakland, San Diego, and Houston/Tennessee. Combined they have 18 Super Bowl titles and 92 Hall-of-Famers.
Since that February 3rd post, one of these teams has won the Super Bowl (New Orleans, 2009). 11 Hall of Famers from these teams have been added honoring 7 teams (2009 - Bruce Smith - BUF, Bob Hayes - DAL, Derrick Thomas-KC, Ralph Wilson - BUF, Randall McDaniel - MIN, John Randle -MIN; 2010 - Rickey Jackson - NO, Floyd Little - DEN, Emmet Smith - AZ (I kid, I kid) ; 2011 - Dion Sanders - ATL/DAL, Shannon Sharpe - DEN).
New HOFers by Team:
- DAL - 3
- BUF - 2
- DEN - 2
- MIN - 2
- ATL - 1
- KC - 1
- NO - 1
Out of those 14 teams, only Dallas, Oakland, and Miami have a list of franchise accomplishments that can be considered better than Denver's. All three of those teams have multiple Super Bowl wins, a storied history, and a total of 35 Hall-of-Famers between them all. In fact, after Denver the next two most storied franchises on that list, Kansas City (9 HOFers) and Minnesota (10 HOFers), have only one Super Bowl win between them (and that came in a game where they played each other).
So given the context, let's revisit where Denver stacked up before Little and Sharpe were given their due in six important categories: Winning %, Super Bowls Titles, Conference Titles, Division TItles, Playoff Berths, and Hall-of-Famers.
| Statistic | Place | Value | Average |
|---|---|---|---|
| Winning % | 5th | .528 | .500 |
| SB Titles | 4th | 2 | 1.21 |
| Conference Titles | 2nd | 6 | 3.36 |
| Division Titles | 7th | 10 | 10.07 |
| Playoff Berths | 6th | 17 | 16.71 |
| Hall-of-Famers | 11th | 2 | 6.07 |
I don't have to tell you that the last couple years have taken a toll on a few of these categories but one.
This is how it looks at present:
| Statistic | Place | Value | Average |
|---|---|---|---|
| Winning % | 6th | .522 | .500 |
| SB Titles | 4th | 2 | 1.28 |
| Conference Titles | 3rd | 6 | 3.21 |
| Division Titles | 7th | 10 | 10.78 |
| Playoff Berths | 7th | 17 | 17.5 |
| Hall-of-Famers | 9th | 4 | 6.57 |
As can be seen in the tables above, Denver has dropped below average in Division Titles and Playoff Berths while remaining below average in Hall-of-Famers. The drops certainly don't bode well for current players getting into Canton, but considering our success previous to the last couple years the disparity in Hall of Famers is still unacceptable.
In the original post, Studbucket noted the reasons for the lack of Hall-of-Famers was because Denver was in the AFL, then they stunk (think 2010 all the time), and they were never on TV because of their lack of quality and time zone. However, by the mid-to-late 1970s NFL football was becoming more and more prominent on the airwaves. Denver was maturing as a good football team. Since then, the Broncos have been in the national spotlight, mustering a grand total of four hall-of-famers.
Some may chalk it up to much ballyhooed "East-Coast bias", but that argument can easily be shot down by pointing to San Francisco, Oakland, Kansas City, and Minnesota as Peter King did in a recent article. It's not so much an "East-Coast bias" as much as it is a "Mountain Time Zone Snub" (granted outside of the the Arizona Cardinals for some of the year - seriously guys get with the daylight savings program - Denver is the only team in that time zone. The Cardinals clearly get their players considered when observing PST).
Though we've had a little success with getting deserving players into the hall in the past couple years, we continue to have no logical justification for why Denver is still representationally deficient in Canton. Clearly Denver deserves, statistically speaking, two to three more hall-of-famers to simply be average.
So which four players should get in? Here's out updated master list of deserving candidates. Unfortunately some of these deserving players are going to face incredible difficulty, especially considering the back-log of players at the same position waiting to get in. Also included for your reference is the eligibility status of each player.
The Dark Ages (1960-1975)
Lionel Taylor, WR [Senior Committee]
Rich Jackson, DE [Senior Committee]
Austin "Goose" Gonsoulin, S [Senior Committee]
Floyd Little, RB [Inducted 2010]
The Orange Crush (1976-1980)
Randy Gradishar, ILB [Senior Committee]
Tom Jackson, OLB [Senior Committee]
Billy Thompson, S [Senior Committee]
Louis Wright, CB [Senior Committee]
The Reeves Era (1981-1994)
Dennis Smith, S [Eligible for Standard Selection until 2019]
Karl Mecklenberg, OLB/ILB [Eligible for Standard Selection until 2019]
Dan Reeves, Coach [Eligible for Standard Selection until 2028]
The Shanahan Age (1995-Present)
Steve Atwater, S [Eligible for Standard Selection until 2024]
Shannon Sharpe, TE [Inducted 2011]
Terrell Davis, RB [Eligible for Standard Selection until 2027]
On Deck (Soon to be Eligible)
Tom Nalen, C [Eligible for Standard Selection 2013-2033
Rod Smith, WR [Eligible for Standard Selection 2012-2032]
Jason Elam, K [Eligible for Standard Selection 2014-2034]
Future Targets (Still Playing)
Champ Bailey, CB [Not even close to being eligible]
Based on their merits, all of those players have some claim to the Hall of Fame, but some will undoubtedly have a harder path to travel than others.
How Far We've Come and Where We Are Going
We have come a long way since February 3, 2009. The MHR HOF Committee and Alumni have successfully lobbied (to what degree is certainly debatable, but we'll take the tiniest fraction of credit we can get) in getting two deserving Broncos into the hall-of-fame. Though we're hardly more forty-eight hours removed from the announcement of the most recent class, we're already looking toward next year.
Who are folks we are now targeting?
Randy Gradishar, ILB [Senior Committee]
Steve Atwater, S [Eligible until 2024]
Over the coming months we'll have more information on how we're progressing. Until then... Here's some interesting data that make you go hmmmm... hunh?
Go Broncos.
J
This is a Fan-Created Comment on MileHighReport.com. The opinion here is not necessarily shared by the editorial staff of MHR
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Grrr....
Okay, so the formatting is a little wonktastic. My attempts to make it prettier have been thwarted. You get the idea.
J
I fixed it a bit...
If there is anything specific, let me know
-TSG
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Formatting is a pain on SB Nation
One of my biggest peeves is you can’t create sortable tables without a staffers tools.
I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.
try this max
If you can’t figure it out or have any trouble, shoot me an e-mail.
Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
My ship finally came in, but it was the Kobayashi Maru.
Follow me on Twitter @MHR_KaptainKirk
Thank you so much
I have yet to try it, but I’ve talked with staffers on other sites, and most say that you need the staffer tools to get it to work. Here’s hoping it works, and thanks again.
I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.
sure thing
Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
My ship finally came in, but it was the Kobayashi Maru.
Follow me on Twitter @MHR_KaptainKirk
Looks good, man
My sentimental list is Gradishar, Atwater, Reeves, and (just because Randy shouldn’t be the lone Orange Crusher, and because this guy was such a bad ass) Tombstone.
Bringing you hopeful optimism and irreverent naivité, 24/7. GO BRONCOS!
love zappa's quote at the end of that article
Rich “Tombstone” Jackson went on to be a school administrator in his hometown of New Orleans. I am one to bet that the particular school he works at is full of well mannered and well behaved students, where even the “dumb” ones know better than to push his buttons!
Bringing you hopeful optimism and irreverent naivité, 24/7. GO BRONCOS!
by broncosmontana on Feb 7, 2011 11:10 PM MST up reply actions
I would add Tom Jackson too
People forget how good he was, but he did everything on that defense. Rushed the passer, dropped back in coverage,and was devastating getting into the backfield against the run.
Steve Atwater was great. If people watched his Super Bowl against Green Bay they would realize that he was a dominant defensive player.
Lindsey Vonn won a World Cup event on a sprained MCL. Take that Jay Cutler!
by RockyMountainThunder on Feb 8, 2011 8:30 AM MST up reply actions
Every team thinks they deserve more
Gradishar will likely get in during two heavy defensive classes the next two years, look for guys like Kennedy, Doleman or Haley to get in as well. Atwater has tough competition from Lester Hayes and Aeneas Williams though. The Senior Committee ones are tough because there are so many players and only two spots, much less compared to regular inductees. The next Bronco in will likely be Gradishar in my mind, next class or the one after that. Atwater will get in, but not for a few more years.
Nice article, I don’t believe in bias based on location, but I do believe in the ebb and flow of draft classes, as well as great players get in, and just because fans think a player is great doesn’t make a player great. I do think a guy like Dent could easily have waited a longer time because guys like Kennedy, Martin and Reed all had better careers in my opinion. Dent was a monster, and stats don’t compare to what he did on the field, but it was still a bit early for him. Then again, it’s not when you get in, it’s that you get in that matters.
I am a bear of very little brains and big words bother me.
Thanks!
I’m here and there, I just am busier in my personal life so I don’t post at places as much. You can find me on twitter though and I’m working with Jezru, Kentucky, and other folks behind the scenes on this stuff.
Tweeting via @jtkimbell
I'm only really active during work hours
I have a full personal life but need to do something at work to pass the time. haha
Per Request: My Top 25/Top 10 Candidates for Next Year
Here are my top 25 Modern Era guys for next year:
1. Dermontti Dawson, C, Pittsburgh Steelers
2. Chris Doleman, DE, Minnesota Vikings, San Francisco 49ers, Atlanta Falcons
3. Willie Roaf, T, New Orleans Saints, Kansas City Chiefs
4. Cortez Kennedy, DT, Seattle Seahawks
5. Cris Carter, WR, Minnesota Vikings, Philadelphia Eagles, Miami Dolphins
6. Tim Brown, WR, Oakland/Los Angeles Raiders, Tampa Bay Buccaneers
7. Aeneas Williams, CB, Arizona/Phoenix Cardinals, St. Louis Rams
8. Will Shields, G, Kansas City Chiefs
9. Tiki Barber, RB, New York Giants
10. Mike Kenn, T, Atlanta Falcons
11. Curtis Martin, RB, New England Patriots, New York Jets
12. Steve Atwater, S, Denver Broncos, New York Jets
13. Paul Tagliabue, Commissioner, NFL
14. LeRoy Butler, S, Green Bay Packers
15. Ed DeBartolo, Jr., Owner, San Francisco 49ers
16. Steve Wisniewski, G, Los Angeles/Oakland Raiders
17. Bill Parcells, Coach/GM/VP, New York Giants, New England Patriots, New York Jets, Dallas Cowboys, Miami Dolphins
18. Karl Mecklenburg, LB, Denver Broncos
19. Terrell Davis, RB, Denver Broncos
20. Jerome Bettis, RB, Los Angeles/St. Louis Rams, Pittsburgh Steelers
21. Kevin Greene, LB, Los Angeles Rams, Pittsburgh Steelers, Carolina Panthers, San Francisco 49ers
22. Joey Browner, S, Minnesota Vikings, Tampa Bay Buccaneers
23. Kenny Easley, S, Seattle Seahawks
24. Ricky Watters, RB, San Francisco 49ers, Philadelphia Eagles, Seattle Seahawks
25. Donnie Shell, S, Pittsburgh Steelers
*Notice that I have not included Andre Reed, Charles Haley, or others. I don’t think they are top 25 material.
Top 10 Seniors Candidates
1. Jim Tyrer, LT, Dallas Texans/Kansas City Chiefs, Washington Redskins (Yes, I understand the reasons why he is not in, but he’s deserving as a player).
2. Johnny Robinson, S/WR, Dallas Texans/Kansas City Chiefs
3. Mick Tinglehoff, C, Minnesota Vikings
4. Chuck Howley, LB, Dallas Cowboys, Chicago Bears
5. Maxie Baughan, LB, Philadelphia Eagles, Los Angeles Rams, Washington Redskins
6. Randy Gradishar, LB, Denver Broncos
7. Jerry Kramer, G/K, Green Bay Packers
8. Claude Humphrey, DE, Atlanta Falcons, Philadelphia Eagles
9. Louis Wright, CB, Denver Broncos
10. Dick Schafrath, G, Cleveland Browns
Tweeting via @jtkimbell
by studbucket on Feb 8, 2011 2:31 PM MST reply actions 6 recs
epic list
Broncos have some big time competition over the next five years.
Bringing you hopeful optimism and irreverent naivité, 24/7. GO BRONCOS!
by broncosmontana on Feb 8, 2011 3:50 PM MST up reply actions
very good list
but what is a list without people disagreeing?
Cortez should be at the top of the list. If that guy played anywhere but Seattle (as isolated as Denver) he would have been voted in along time ago. Second best interior lineman of my life outside of Reggie White without question.
Tiki Barber should not get into the hall of fame. fumbled his first several years and left in his prime, not enough great seasons to make it. Curtis Martin was not appreciated during his playing time and I love the fact HOF isn’t overlooking him.
Ricky Waters shouldn’t even be mentioned for the HOF. I still remember the Alligator Arm play, guy didn’t have heart. Couple very good years in SF, but Craig was the back of that dynsty. He just didn’t do it as well and did nothing in Philly and Seattle.
I would have to look at LeRoy Butlers numbers as I never remember thinking he was all world, but he might have been.
Bronco Learning Curve
My thoughts in return
For what it’s worth on my list: top 10 = I think they are locks. 11-21, somewhat reasonable candidates. 22-25, outside looking in, will likely never make it.
Cortez: He’s in the top 5, as in, I think he should go in next year. I don’t care if it’s 1,2,3, or 4, it’s the same. You won’t get any arguing from me. Dermontti Dawson was also the best center of the 90s. Both very deserving.
Tiki: I didn’t think he was deserving either, then I looked at his career. Wow. His last 5 years were really good, if we think TD possibly deserves it, then you better think Tiki does as well, just my opinion: http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BarbTi00.htm
Martin: Sure, under-appreciated, but really just the absolutely compiler. He managed to be good for a long time, but never great, maybe with the exception of 2-3 years. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MartCu00.htm
Ricky Watters: Just a better version of Roger Craig. He may not have had heart, which is why I’m not putting him in, but I do feel he was the 25th best player out of the 100+ candidates for next year.
LeRoy Butler: He and Atwater are the 2 candidates for best safeties of the 1990s. Butler had 4 All-Pros (pretty darn good) and 4 Pro Bowls (above average). I think he’s worth considering.
I study this stuff like crazy, so would love to have more discussions. Each year I take all 100+ candidates and narrow them all the way down, getting strong opinions, especially for guys who don’t deserve it (like Richard Dent, Andre Reed, and Charles Haley).
Tweeting via @jtkimbell
Excellent post man
rec’d.
"When Tim Tebow does pushups, he's not pushing himself up, he's pushing the world down."
"Gear down there big shifter This is the "No Bull" review man…" a total Lebowski-esque one liner from Sadaraine, whether he realizes it or not - comedic gold.
Gradishar is my #1 pick
but Tom Jackson, Billy Thompson and Louis Wright should be there, too.
Terrell D, D Smith, Atwater, and Mecklenberg.
I've been bleedin' orange and blue since Floyd Little in '71-'72 and will 'til the day I die!
Bring back the Orange Crush!
RANDY GRADISHAR in the HOF!!!!
Louis Wright never got the attention he deserved
Never heard his name during passing downs, because every team worked on the other cornerback. That also worked against his interception totals. Great tackler on running plays and not after 5+ yards, either. He would often stop a runner with a short gain or a loss.
Yeah, he's definitely under-appreciated, you're right about that.
Lester Hayes is getting more love, when Wright was at least his equal.
Tweeting via @jtkimbell

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