Denver Broncos News: Horse Tracks - 8/15/11
by John Bena on Aug 15, 2011 6:27 AM MDT
in Horse Tracks
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Denver Broncos defensive tackle Marcus Thomas trying to live up to expectations of "first-round talent" - The Denver Post
They were only three words, just four syllables. But they're always there for Broncos defensive tackle Marcus Thomas.
Kiszla: Coach John Fox brings right instincts back to Denver Broncos - The Denver Post
Anybody who thinks new Broncos coach John Fox knows X's and O's better than the departed Josh McDaniels is nuts.
Analysis: Broncos' number of interest — 500 rushing attempts this season - The Denver Post
The Broncos may have a magic number this season, or at least one well worth putting on the things-to-do list.
Undrafted safety Kyle McCarthy looks like a keeper for the Denver Broncos - The Denver Post
The Broncos drafted safeties in the second round (Darcel McBath) and fourth round (David Bruton) in 2009 and another pair of safeties this year in the second round (Rahim Moore) and fourth round (Quinton Carter).
Q&A: Broncos will consider taking a QB in first round of 2012 draft - The Denver Post
Q: The Broncos' situation at quarterback is a mess. John Elway inherited Kyle Orton, Tim Tebow and Brady Quinn, so do you think Elway will draft a quarterback in 2012? And will Stanford's Andrew Luck be a great NFL quarterback?
NFL.com news: Umenyiora set to practice, will play under current contract
A somewhat miffed Osi Umenyiora is returning to the New York Giants without a new contract.
NFL.com news: New kickoff rules are winning few fans among players, coaches
One of the most significant NFL rule changes in years is already provoking strong opinions after just one week of preseason games.
NFL.com news: Patriots to work out veterans Houshmandzadeh, Sharper
T.J. Houshmandzadeh won't be the only big-name veteran paying a visit to the New England Patriots this week. Free-agent safety Darren Sharper, a 14-year veteran and a key member of the New Orleans Saints' 2009 Super Bowl-winning squad, told NFL Network Sunday that he will work out for the Patriots on Monday.
NFL.com news: Cotchery says chance to 'win right now' led him to Steelers
Jerricho Cotchery went through his due diligence after the New York Jets granted the veteran wide receiver his release last week.
NFL.com news: Report: Pryor confident in eligibility for supplemental draft
With the NFL supplemental draft just days away, Terrelle Pryor is still in a holding pattern.
NFL.com news: Patriots DL coach Johnson: 'I expect a lot' from Haynesworth
Longtime position coach Pepper Johnson is the latest from within the Patriots organization who has had a positive first impression of Albert Haynesworth, whose reputation in the NFL preceded him in New England.
NFL.com news: Panthers' Newton, Browns' McCoy show flashes of brilliance
The third night of preseason football continued to provide answers to some of the looming questions that dominated the offseason. While one game will certainly not serve as a definitive evaluation on a player, it does provide an opportunity to make projections based on flashes of talent and potential.
NFL.com news: Young Browns showing promise behind McCoy's growth
Here are five things to take from the preseason opener between the Browns and Packers, with one team rebuilding, and the other defending a championship ...
Audibles " Posts No reason for Broncos to bail on Tim Tebow "
Tebow was in the spotlight again Thursday night as Denver opened its preseason schedule at Dallas. He took over for Broncos starter Kyle Orton late in the first quarter and played until halftime of Denver’s 24-23 loss.
On Guard: Mankins' Millions | National Football Post
The labor dispute between Logan Mankins and the Patriots-- which lasted longer than the labor dispute between the NFL and the NFLPA – is finally resolved.
Remember this guy? | National Football Post
Shawne Merriman’s production from Saturday night’s game in Chicago should be talked about: nine snaps, two sacks and another pressure that led to rookie Marcell Dareus making a play on the QB.
Lawrence Tynes angry with no call that put him on crutches | National Football Post
Carolina Panthers linebacker Sean Ware fell into Tynes’ left plant leg while blocking a field goal in the fourth quarter at Bank of America Stadium. Tynes was furious there was no penalty on the play.
Bears ignore new rule and kick off from the 30 | National Football Post
Toub wanted to find out about his new young players and how they would be on kick coverage. So in order to find that out he had his team kick off from the 30-yard line.
Guaranteed contracts come to the NFL: an analysis | National Football Post
As the Oklahoma Land Rush merry-go-round of player signings continues at its speed dating pace, the new contracts for NFL rookies indicate a historic shift has taken place.
Johnson would be a fool to trust Titans - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
When Finnegan expressed desire for a new contract before training camp, the Titans reportedly told him they would take care of him. Defensive coordinator Jerry Gray and defensive backs coach Marcus Robertson told him that if he reported, he would get his upgraded deal. Coach Mike Munchak reassured Finnegan, who is one of the top cornerbacks in the game, that he was an important player to the team.
49ers to bring in QB Culpepper for workout - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
Daunte Culpepper(notes) is the latest addition to the San Francisco 49ers’ stable of quarterbacks.
Smith miraculously still behind center for Niners - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
Of all the cutting-edge calls contained in the playbook Jim Harbaugh brought down the peninsula from Stanford to the head coach’s office at the San Francisco 49ers’ headquarters, none was more surprising than his decision to give Alex Smith a copy last April.
NFL: Rookie QBs look good in Week 1 of preseason - ESPN
Perhaps the biggest surprise of the first week of preseason was how well rookie quarterbacks played.
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McCarthy is making the safety battle interesting. Is Dawkins place on the roster in trouble?
Moore and Carter have to be locks. Although Carter’s lock is based more on his draft pick than what he has shown so far in current preseason/training camp. And Bruton’s special teams skills I would say give him the 3rd slot.
Now if there is to only 4 safety slots then suddenly Dawkins vs McCarthy looks interesting. Notes from the Preseason game from Styg indicated that McCarthy was a bit suspect in pass coverage. But last year Dawkins was flat out awful in pass coverage, and he’s a year older now so this is not going to improve. Last year Pro Football Focus rated McCarthy -1.3 vs Dawkins -2.6 and McCarthy has a year of experience under his belt now.
It would certainly be a shock and I’m not putting money on McCarthy taking Dawkins position. But its certainly made for a more interesting battle.
Of course all the above is mute if we have 5 slots. Either way I still think McBath is gone.
What would Blackie Lawless do?
Bruton and McBath were McD picks and mistakes. No reason for Fox and Co to throw either a bone unless they earn it.
I think one of both will be gone depending on ST work. Watching Bruton try to block kicks last year, I think he sticks. Bruton is a darn good ST player.
McBath is just another painful bad 2nd round pick in the mold of Terry Pierce or Darius Watts. Our drafters must stop swinging at pitches in the dirt.
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
Afraid you're right
McD’s drafts are looking worse and worse.
"Surprised to see you, Captain, though pleased." — from Star Trek episode Space Seed.
I wouldn’t go that far.
McD’s 2009 draft looked like a train wreck to a lot of us from May 2009 to today. If Moreno and Ayers continue to putter along, 2009 will be the worst draft in franchise history. But there is still some hope for those two. Already etched in stone, our 2nd round in 2009 was the worst 2nd round ANY team has had in a generation (three high picks with three being bad busts).
That said, I’m hoping that Walton, Beadles & Decker (maybe Squid too) make the 2010 draft a success. If Tebow figures out how to make a 2nd and 3rd read or DT EVER becomes healthy, we’ve got some NFL players to potentially sign to 2nd contracts. That, to me, is the very definition of a good draft, when you sign your picks to those expensive 2nd contracts (Elvis and Kuper in 2010).
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
Agree on Bruton
I don’t ever notice him on the field as part of the defense, but you sure as hell see him on ST. I think the collapse of the Dolts Special Teams unit after Osgood left proves the value of a hired gun on ST.
McBath is done.
"Nothing gives one person so much advantage over another as to remain always cool and unruffled under all circumstances." – Thomas Jefferson
by TheMorseFile on Aug 15, 2011 9:31 AM MDT up reply actions
Bruton is a core special teamer and McBath gets a bad wrap due to injuries, IMO
I don’t see us giving up on McBath already like you apparently have.
That 2nd round pick we gave for him is a sunk cost, as you said. It no longer matters. And Fox isn’t married to him since they didn’t pick him. But all that goes two ways.
Fox isn’t married to the player NOR the price tag. It no longer matters what McBath cost. He doesn’t have to live up to his 2nd round price tag to be kept. He’s still a player with upside locked in a vicious battle for positioning at a position that all the sudden has incredible depth, youth and upside.
McBath is still essentially battling back from injuries. If he can’t stay healthy again, then I agree, the decision becomes easier – we have no room for a guy that can’t stay healthy… not now… not at safety. But aside from injury, he’s shown enough already, IMO, to keep him off the bubble.
Bruton is more likely to be traded, IMO. I think we could get a late round pick out of him if we keep Dawkins.
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
Rodney… Something AJ Smith (yes I hate him) said that I often repeat.
“They are all players with upside”. So McBath’s upside makes him no different from any other player on the roster or NFL.
I can promise you Darcel McBath is currently ON the bubble regardless of our opinions.
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
Some more than others
That goes for upside as well as being on the bubble.
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
Darcel better show that upside in the next three games because we got to see the downside of keeping McBath on that 76 yard TD as well as the rest of the 4th quarter. He was one of those 3rd string fodder players getting lit up by the Dallas scrubs.
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
He's coming off three major injuries
Don’t you still think he’s got a higher ceiling than Bruton and Dawkins?
Keeping McBath as a backup for his higher upside/ceiling makes more sense to me, than to keep Dawkins or Bruton. There’s a higher chance, IMO, that McBath will get his groove back and that he’ll be more useful to the team long term than there is that Dawkins is effective this year or next or that Bruton ever becomes more than a special team guy.
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
I think McBath has a lower floor than Bruton and Dawkins and I’ve never seen McBath play remotely well enough over more than a half game or so to even consider his ceiling.
You have to flash and flash often to consider a player’s ceiling. As you can see, I’m not describing McBath. His long term value to Denver sounds like you’re trying to tap into oil under Manhattan. You might find some, but most will think you are wasting your time.
So I’ll take the ST ace and the HOF past his prime over the oil rights in Manhattan.
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
"Coming off three major injuries"
Does that not concern you? I don’t understand why that isn’t a factor. He’s been in the league for a few years now and he’s still hurt more often than not despite never being a starter. That’s phenomenally bad, and that alone should be enough to dismiss whatever upside he may have (which he has never really shown).
I never said it's not a factor... it just isn't a deal breaker
McBath has a chance to be a good safety. Bruton doesn’t and Dawkins no longer does. One has to go. There’s a bigger chance that McBath’s injuries are behind him than there is that Dawkins turns 30 or that Bruton becomes a real safety, IMO
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
I am pretty sure Dawk is safe
He was just elected team captain again. Having him around to mentor the young talent we just picked up makes him more valuable than his play on the field will dictate.
"You’re only great if you win something. I mean, Alexander wasn’t Alexander the Mediocre or Alexander the Average. He was Alexander the Great, and there’s a reason for it."-Shannon Sharpe
absolutely
I think Dawk stays for as long as he wants, he’s not a delta bravo unlike others I have to deal with on a daily basis
Brad James
Follow me on Twitter
With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!
by the new Bradfather on Aug 15, 2011 2:01 PM MDT up reply actions
I just cant see
Cutting a guy who you just restructured a deal with, like you restructure the deal so he can stay, agree on the money he is worth and then just cut him?
by Warren Todd on Aug 15, 2011 10:48 AM MDT via mobile up reply actions
Quinton Carter
I hear you on draft position, but Carter played terrrrribly against Dallas. He better show some positive signs in the next weeks.
by Bradoncadonc on Aug 15, 2011 4:10 PM MDT via mobile up reply actions
Kisla's article on Fox
was a good story. I like the picture it paints about Fox’s style. The style of writing, grammer, and puctuation were just painful to wade through however. Is this really from a working writer on a major publicaton?
The beauty of MHR! We vent, argue, and proclaim greatness and smartness to our fellow bloggers. Thank goodness because nobody else is listening. -
haha
please ignore by bad writing, spelling etc… I am not paid for this :(
The beauty of MHR! We vent, argue, and proclaim greatness and smartness to our fellow bloggers. Thank goodness because nobody else is listening. -
Hahaha...thanks for the laugh Sean. I write like I speak man....so my grammar can be terrible.
"I actually watched the World Cup. I HATE baseball. Hockey’s over. Hey, at least we have the WNBA. Oh, man. I’m making a noose. Want one?"
Harv Neptune.
Is it Free Agency yet? Wake me up when it starts!
Kiszla [note spelling] irritates more often than enlightens
but I thought he really nailed it with this piece. McDaniels was constant drama, to the point where he exhausted himself and his players. It’s possible the Broncos under McDaniels didn’t handle adversity well because McDaniels didn’t handle adversity well. Fox coaching Tebow on the sidelines after his three-penalties play was beautiful to watch. He talks, Tebow listens, then he ruffles his hair affectionately as if to say, Relax, kid, you’ll be okay. If it was McDaniels he’d have been screaming at Tebow. After all, the screamed at Tom Brady. McDaniels is brilliant. He just needs to get his emotions under control, stop intimidating his own players, and teach them to hunger for success rather than fear failure. Fox relates to people, including his players, and I think they’ll run through walls for him.
"Surprised to see you, Captain, though pleased." — from Star Trek episode Space Seed.
by spock on Aug 15, 2011 7:49 AM MDT up reply actions 3 recs
McD is a fantastic candidate for an OC job. Maybe to be one of the highest paid OCs. But Josh is missing so many of the characteristics of the CEO type.
He’s got upper management and strategy potential, but lacks far too much of what makes someone a good leader and figurehead.
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
by McGeorge on Aug 15, 2011 8:06 AM MDT up reply actions 2 recs
This
McDaniels may be the best passing mind in the entire NFL at the moment. St. Louis hiring him to basically coach Sam Bradford was a brilliant move, and I expect it to pay dividends for them. However, if a team offers McD another head coaching job in the next few years, that will likely be a mistake.
That's what I told Rams fans
on their game thread when they played Indy the other day. Most of them were smart and agreed but others thought I jumped ship and had no sense of loyalty. Some people really are not intelligent
Brad James
Follow me on Twitter
With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!
by the new Bradfather on Aug 15, 2011 2:24 PM MDT up reply actions
right.
hard to hate mcD as a person, but i really hated what he did to the denver broncos. it reeked of insecurity, from control-freakishness to the removing of classic bronco photos from dove valley. he was supposed to bring creativity and youth to the program—which he did in a way with Xs and Os—but ironically everything else he brought was as creative as a reheated swanson tv dinner (i.e. the entire patriots program, down to the hoodie). worst of all, he never embraced the denver broncos tradition like, for instance, rex ryan embraced the jets tradition.
i’m glad he’s gone but i wish him luck. the going assumption is that he just wasn’t ready to be an nfl head coach yet. i’d wager he never will be. wrong personality type. i’m glad fox is here and that an adult is running the show again.
Very well said
For the love of the animals. 24
ps3 handle KINGbaboon
by Earthtiger24 on Aug 15, 2011 12:10 PM MDT up reply actions
Great post Spock. Nice observations.
"I actually watched the World Cup. I HATE baseball. Hockey’s over. Hey, at least we have the WNBA. Oh, man. I’m making a noose. Want one?"
Harv Neptune.
Is it Free Agency yet? Wake me up when it starts!
"An adult is again in charge of the sideline."
This is true. Now if we could get a few DP sports writers to grow up we’d be in good shape :P
I’m interested to see how losing Harbaugh will affect Stanford, and Luck in particular. Can’t believe Legwold is even suggesting a 2012 1st round QB draft pick before the 2011 season even starts….see my point above…..
No matter who starts at QB, we will be 8-8 or better (8-2-11)
"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence."
John Adams
by Broncotodd on Aug 15, 2011 7:19 AM MDT reply actions 1 recs
If we could get a few DP sportswriters
and one Mid Utah Radio/Television delta bravo co-worker to grow up, and if the Broncos won, then everything would be right with the world!
Brad James
Follow me on Twitter
With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!
by the new Bradfather on Aug 15, 2011 3:07 PM MDT up reply actions
McCarthy does make that safety battle interesting
Things are shifting there like none of us saw coming. McBath is a little behind where I thought he’d be, McCarthy is way up – both Moore and Carter basically are who we thought they were and are looking like they each have the ability to start early.
The question now is Dawkins. Anybody that says this is an easy call to keep him or dismiss him is terribly misguided, IMO. Nothing easy about it. From a strictly cost-to-performance standpoint, we’d get rid of him in a heartbeat. But it’s not that easy.
We all the sudden have a ton of talent at the safety position, and quite honestly there are at least two players that could probably take Brian’s specific role. But the players are all incredibly young and inexperienced. Without Brian Dawkins, our safety depth would read: Moore, Carter, McCarthy, McBath and Bruton. That’s five guys that have never started. So that doesn’t sound like a good plan. But neither does keeping six safeties. And neither does letting go of David Bruton – the special teams ACE.
This is a good problem to have. But it is a problem.
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
Good points - I agree - the question then becomes is keeping Dawkins's leadership skills for one more year worth losing a promising young safety for?
Because none of those safeties are practice squad eligible except the two rookies and you wouldn’t risk losing a 2nd/4th round player to another team if you tried to put them on the PS.
Any argument for getting rid of Dawkins is based around roster slots and that alone. McCarthy I think still needs to show more in Preseason camp. And McBath right now has to improve drastically. Otherwise Dawkins probably stays.
What would Blackie Lawless do?
by British Bronco on Aug 15, 2011 7:59 AM MDT up reply actions
with Dawkins restructured contract
It is a win/win situation for the Broncos. If one of the younger players can step up, they can pay him to be a coach. If not, they have the insurance of having a veteran back there for one more season. Dawk is teaching Moore especially and I think the Broncos would love to be able to pay his salary as a coach. They get younger at the position and maintain a fine example of class for a coach. I’ve heard that Dawkins wants to coach anyway, so maybe he will stay with the team even after he retires.
Character may be manifested in the great moments but it is made in the small ones -- Philip Brooks
My ship finally came in, but it was the Kobayashi Maru.
Follow me on Twitter @MHR_KaptainKirk
I think the whole player being a coach aspect gets far overblown
Dawk is teaching Moore especially and I think the Broncos would love to be able to pay his salary as a coach.
Sure, at a coach’s salary. But the Broncos wouldn’t “love to be able to pay” Dawkins $3M-$4M to be a teacher or a coach.. They’d hate it, IMO.
Dawkins means a lot to the team and really has an ability to fire them up and make them accountable – he’s good for the locker room. But it’s on-field experience that gives him the bigger edge to being kept rather than his ability to teach. The two are similar, but different. It’s nice to have a guy that can teach young players the intricacies of a particular position. That’s why we have coaches.
But it’s much nicer to have a guy at your last level of defense that’s actually started an NFL game before.
If the deciding factor is Dawkins’ ability to be on an on-field coach/teacher… then he’s going to be dismissed, IMO. I think the bigger factor and the single greatest reason the team is more likely to keep him is because they don’t want to field a team whose starters and backups at the last line of defense have never started a game before.
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
Hate to say it, but I think I'm leaning towards answering that title question with a 'no'
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
McBath must play well, not terribly (see his major mistake on he 76 yard TD) in order to make Dawkins expendable.
I think EFX does the right and smart thing and cuts a suck cost like McBath. Who knows, with three games left, there is always time for McGlass to come up lame again and make the whole argument moot.
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
McBath has flashed some very real starting ability, IMO - backup at least
And he still has upside. I think it’s far too early to give up on him. But yes, another injury filled year like last year makes this decision easier.
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
Or like 2009
McGlass was injured for the majority of both 2009 and 2010. He is zero for two in getting thru an NFL season even remotely healthy.
I think he’s lived off that Payton Manning INT game past it’s due date. Ironically, McGlass broke his arm in his best NFL game. Kind of says it all.
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
We can talk badly about McBath all we want
I’m not saying he’s a starter. And I’m not saying he’s a future all-pro. I’m saying we’ll have to cut someone and that McBath has a higher ceiling at this point in his career than both Dawkins and Bruton.
I think it’s also fair to wonder if McBath is slow to deliver this year due to all the rust from all of last year’s injuries. But he showed talent once. It’s possible he gets better. That’s not the case with Dawkins. And it’s less likely with Bruton.
This isn’t a case of making the case for Darcel McBath to be the next favorite Bronco safety. I’m not campaigning for his pro-bowl trip. I’m just telling you I, personally, would cut Dawk or Bruton before I’d give up on McBath.
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
Last year, we had this debate over Nate Jones and Phonz Smith. As much as I hated the Phonz pick, I was campaigning to cut Nate Jones instead, whom looked just as awful in the 2010 preseason as he did vs Dallas last week. Nate Jones must have pictures of Bowlen in bed with something.
I don’t know what you see in Darcel, but hopefully we don’t make the same kind of mistake two years running because one of these guys will get axed and my guess is it’s not the starter.
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
49ers must be getting Randy Moss and Chris Carter out of retirement too.
That’s the only time Culpepper was worth anything—easy to do with two hall of famers. I’ll glady take the broncos QB situation over the 49ers any day.
by tiderfootball09 on Aug 15, 2011 8:25 AM MDT reply actions
"Broncos will consider taking a QB in first round of 2012 draft"
That’s the headline, so I looked for the EFX quote it was based on. No quote, just Legwold’s opinion: “Look for the Broncos to consider drafting a quarterback with their first-round pick next year.” But since when are truth-challenged sports pieces a surprise? Sigh.
"Surprised to see you, Captain, though pleased." — from Star Trek episode Space Seed.
I think it's a pretty safe guess
We “considered” taking like six guys this year and had them in for visits. I’m sure we’ll “consider” a bunch of guys next year, too.
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
Makes you wonder why the DP picked up writers of Legwold’s limited skills when the Rocky Mountain News folded.
The DP decided to shop & buy at Dollar Tree when they plucked thru the carcass of the Rocky Mountain News.
Adam Scheftler probably couldn’t wait to get out of that sh##hole
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
Rocky Mtn News
I loved that paper, in the 80’s…. The layout as much as anything. It was easier to read.
The beauty of MHR! We vent, argue, and proclaim greatness and smartness to our fellow bloggers. Thank goodness because nobody else is listening. -
by Sean in Pa. on Aug 15, 2011 11:19 AM MDT up reply actions
I remember
when John Elway did Rocky Mountain News commercials (we had a cool satellite system when I was little that got Colorado and Canadian channels) and exhorted kids to become good readers by reading about how well he did in the newspapers :)
Brad James
Follow me on Twitter
With Coach Zorro on our side, we will slice opponents to ribbons. Tim Tebow gives me hope and I already have faith and charity in my heart! I see a propitious future rife with Lombardis for our Broncos!
by the new Bradfather on Aug 15, 2011 3:19 PM MDT up reply actions
I guarantee the Broncos draft a QB next year
Will that be a 1st round QB, who knows but I guarantee the Broncos will draft one. I know I would.
Both Quinn and Orton are FA’s next year. Orton is gone for sure and Quinn will only return if he feels he’s gonna have a legitimate shot at being a starter with us next year. That leaves us with only Tebow (assuming Weber gets cut this year) who is not a sure thing.
The broncos will look heavily at every QB in next years draft (like they did with this years). I predict 5 QB’s will be taken in the 1st (Luck, Jones, Barkley, Cousins, Foles) and 3 in the 2nd (Lindley, Weeben, Moore). That’s 8 QB’s in the top 64 and there are still some good QB’s available by the names of Tannehill, Harnish, Kinne, Davis, etc.
As much as I like Tebow, if the Broncos don’t draft a QB in next years draft, I’ll be highly disappointed. He doesn’t have to be a guy who will be a surefire starter and future guy but a guy with legitimate NFL talent who could compete for the job with Tebow and be that franchise guy.
And now for something completely different
I like your post a lot, but we could still have major needs at ILB, DT, and CB. Even RT and interior O-line if the guys we have there now don’t pan out.
Since we don’t have Miami’s 2nd round pick again, we’ll need to use our fewer picks wisely. Makes since to take a QB, but it will also makes since to take players at the positions listed above esp DT and CB.
2012 TC would be fascinating if Tebow was going against a player like Jones (top 10 pick) for the starting job. If we were drafting in the Foles range (say 20th overall pick), I think that would mean our QB was found in the 2011 season based on good play (Orton or Tebow).
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
My guess right now is the Broncos take a CB with their 1st pick
unless they are sold on Barkley or Jones (I doubt we’ll be in contention for Luck but that could be the homer in me). I’d say the chances of each are 40% CB, 20% QB, 20% OL and 10% DT in the 1st.
In the 2nd I could see a DL or an OL as well as the 3rd which brings me to the point of my post. Unlike last year, there will still be a lot of good QB’s left worth taking a shot on. I understand how desperate we are for OL depth and to a lesser extent CB depth but not all our picks are gonna be at those positions. If a QB falls to them and he’s at the top of their board, I believe the Broncos will take him.
Orton only returns if the Broncos make the playoffs. If they don’t I think both team and player make a mutual agreement to part ways.
And now for something completely different
by AlbertaBronc on Aug 15, 2011 1:29 PM MDT up reply actions
If Matt Barkley plays as well as he is capable of, he may go #1 overall. All three of these guys could be top 5 picks and I doubt Denver has a Top 5 pick so it’s not really worth exploring. In this scenario, we are drafting 2012’s Andy Dalton and hoping for the best. I’d hate that since it rarely works with 2nd round QB talents.
Would also be a pretty wasted season to play Orton for 16 games only to let him walk. I’d see us pulling him much sooner if we’re not playoff material.
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
Dalton would've been a 5th or 6th round prospect this year
This is the best QB pool in a long time.
I agree on Orton and this is what will likely happen which would make it even less likely he’ll stay. I don’t see more than 6-10 for us with the schedule we have.
And now for something completely different
by AlbertaBronc on Aug 15, 2011 3:59 PM MDT up reply actions
See, I think Barkley is VERY over rated....and I am a HUGE USC fan....but hey, I am wrong more than I am right!
"I actually watched the World Cup. I HATE baseball. Hockey’s over. Hey, at least we have the WNBA. Oh, man. I’m making a noose. Want one?"
Harv Neptune.
Is it Free Agency yet? Wake me up when it starts!
I think there are a lot of ways we could keep Quinn or Orton
If Kyle ups his third down rating and we score more in the redzone, I could easily see him being given a five year deal. Fox won with Jake Delhomme. Kyle is far superior to that. And Elway will keep looking at his QBs in the draft. This move wouldn’t stop that, as Kyle would be more easily trade at that point (another very good year and a long-term deal already in place).
Extending Kyle doesn’t mean we’re married to him. It just means we don’t want to be in position this next March where we don’t have any QB but Tebow.
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
If you were Orton would you wanna stay with us
and spend the next few years of your career being the guy constantly involved in trade rumors and always being viewed as a stopgap player.
Orton is going to look for a contract with a team he feels wants him as their long term guy. He already knows we don’t see him as that so we’re probably at the bottom of his list of teams he want’s to play for. The only way I see Orton returning is if the Broncos make the playoffs next year and/or we see dramatic improvement. Otherwise I think both Orton and the Broncos will part ways at the end of the season.
And now for something completely different
by AlbertaBronc on Aug 15, 2011 1:42 PM MDT up reply actions
This post is exactly why I don’t see Orton having a good 2011 season under the current circumstances. EFX already tried to deal him so he knows he is not wanted here long term. So he’ll be playing for someone else and in doing so, playing in a way that isn’t in line with Denver’s goals for 2011.
If Fox starts pulling Orton in the red zone, I think all hell breaks loose.
Kyle Orton + red zone = FG
By most accounts, Orton already chose to stay with us over Miami
I think a long term contract would go a long way toward mending any damaged fences. And I don’t think there are any broken ones. Orton doesn’t feel wanted, that we agree on. But Orton has never felt wanted, IMO. And a lot can change in a year.
Anyway, there are too many variables at this point for me to really say who goes and who stays next year. I’m just saying I could easily envision multiple scenarios where two of our current guys are still with the team.
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
If Miami walking away from Orton's kolb-size contract demands is him choosing us over them
then sure I guess but i see it more like him and the broncos are now stuck with each other so they now gotta make the best of things. I don’t think Orton will be a cancer like some think but unless the broncos pull off some major upsets this year and make the playoffs, I just don’t see him being in our future. I do understand the scenarios that can happen but I don’t think they’re likely.
And now for something completely different
by AlbertaBronc on Aug 15, 2011 4:04 PM MDT up reply actions
You are debating assumptions
I can figure out if anyone talked to anyone at this point. There are so many stories out now saying so many different things.
All I know is Denvers FO said they would talk trade. KO is still a Bronco. Beyond that who knows what happened? Everyone has a different story.
The beauty of MHR! We vent, argue, and proclaim greatness and smartness to our fellow bloggers. Thank goodness because nobody else is listening. -
Does that Kolb contract demand pass your common sense test?
It doesn’t pass mine. And I don’t believe gossips that don’t make sense.
Big picture, we disagree. I think it’s more likely than not that the Broncos keep either Quinn or Orton into next year.
OK, so Brian and The Johns really did very well at the Defensive Tackle position, especially considering the limited cash budget they likely had to work with. I no longer hear laughter from opposing RBs in my nightmares!!!
